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Let's talk about precision reloading

SWThomas

Sergeant
Full Member
Minuteman
Jan 23, 2013
486
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Fort Lee, VA
I've been posting a lot lately but my brain is a sponge right now and you guys always provide the knowledge. I wanna talk about all the different things folks do when reloading for maximum precision accuracy. What I'm gonna do is list some things I've seen folks do and ask for your input on the topic. What I would like is some sort of proof/data that a certain step has made a measurable difference in accuracy. Right now I'm chasing the accuracy goal with my GAP-10 but I will be having a precision bolt gun built soon. Here goes...

- Turning case necks

- Using bench rest primers VS standard primers

- Using competition seating dies over standard dies

- Crimping and not crimping

- Loading to be just off the lands or kissing the lands

- Uniforming primer pockets

- Deburring flash holes

- Bumping shoulders VS resizing to factory specs

- Checking run out with a concentricity gage

Please provide input on any or all of these steps and if you've personally observed increases in accuracy by performing them. If you would like to add something I didn't list, feel free to do so.
 
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I've been posting a lot lately but my brain is a sponge right now and you guys always provide the knowledge. I wanna talk about all the different things folks do when reloading for maximum precision accuracy. What I'm gonna do is list some things I've seen folks do and ask for your input on the topic. What I would like is some sort of proof/data that a certain step has made a measurable difference in accuracy. Right now I'm chasing the accuracy goal with my GAP-10 but I will be having a precision bolt gun built soon. Here goes...

- Turning case necks-Don't waste your time.

- Using bench rest primers VS standard primers-In the 308, WLRs work good, BR2s, 210ms, pretty much anything

- Using competition seating dies over standard dies-Dont need Comp seating dies but I sure like my Forster Ultra micro top.

- Crimping and not crimping-NOOOOOOOOO crimp!

- Loading to be just off the lands or kissing the lands-have to experiment with that, usually off a bit.

- Uniforming primer pockets-If you're using good brass like Lapua and even if you use REM or WIN you probably wont get any shavings out of the pocket in the first place.

- Deburring flash holes-Wasting your time, again.

- Bumping shoulders VS resizing to factory specs- Bump the shoulder back about .003' and that should be good.

Please provide input on any or all of these steps and if you've personally observed increases in accuracy by performing them. If you would like to add something I didn't list, feel free to do so.
Hope this helps, get good components and you'll have to do less case prep.
 
Some stuff to think about from an OCD tinkerer. I'm a read about it, try it for myself, measure results then either keep doing it or dump it.

Turning case necks - not worth it for standard calibers but sometimes necessary on converting calibers like .308 to .260.

Primers. 99 out of 100 shooters would never know the difference. If you weigh your loads and get good ES's and SD's with standard primers then you will get good consistency. Bench rest primers were fine when they were $35 vs $25. Not so much at $50 vs $35 and usually not in stock.

Dies - IMHO one of the most important thing. Sure you can make good ammo with cheap Lee Dies but for Precision you will see better results with good bench rest Dies. Especially in a seater. I use both Redding and Forster and love them equally.

Jam vs Jump - all depends on the rifle and your goals. On my AR's it's mag length so a no brainer. On my bolt guns it depends on the bullet and what the rifle likes. Sometimes a little change will make a big difference. YMMV

Primer pockets and flash holes. Again not many can tell the difference but if you have OCD (and most hand loaders do) you do it. For sure I do new to me once fired military brass. Since I have to remove the crimp anyway.

I use a Hornady gauge to move the shoulder .002-.003 or just till it fits my Wilson case gauge IR in my bolt guns chambers perfectly.

Good Luck.
 
I've been posting a lot lately but my brain is a sponge right now and you guys always provide the knowledge. I wanna talk about all the different things folks do when reloading for maximum precision accuracy. What I'm gonna do is list some things I've seen folks do and ask for your input on the topic. What I would like is some sort of proof/data that a certain step has made a measurable difference in accuracy. Right now I'm chasing the accuracy goal with my GAP-10 but I will be having a precision bolt gun built soon. Here goes...

- Turning case necks • I don't bother any more. I never saw an accuracy increase.

- Using bench rest primers VS standard primers • Haven't found a difference, I use Fed. 210 / Tula / CCI 200

- Using competition seating dies over standard dies • I like the Redding Competition seater

- Crimping and not crimping • No,No,No

- Loading to be just off the lands or kissing the lands • I Don't bother because of loading to under magazine length.

- Uniforming primer pockets • I do this, I like to have my primers seated squarely.

- Deburring flash holes • Don't do it on my gas gun loads, doesn't seem to matter.

- Bumping shoulders VS resizing to factory specs • I bump the shoulders back .002"-.003", that's all, loads work fine. I do measure shoulder bump.

Please provide input on any or all of these steps and if you've personally observed increases in accuracy by performing them. If you would like to add something I didn't list, feel free to do so.

I kind of shadowed JGorski's reply. I received a new GAP 10 about 6 weeks ago and the darn thing just shoots well. I use Redding S bushing dies and also have experimented using a redding F/L body die and a Lee N/O Collet die. The results were they both work well. When using the S bushings, I do double neck sizing when using brass that has to be necked to under .337" rather than sizing down in one pass to .333" (Hornady brass) or .331" (Winchester brass).
 
I see a few of you use comp seating dies. Have you measured accuracy with them VS standard dies? I'm not opposed to getting one if it makes a difference.
 
I see a few of you use comp seating dies. Have you measured accuracy with them VS standard dies? I'm not opposed to getting one if it makes a difference.

I only have a Forster Ultra micro top for my 6 Creed, for my 308s I use a Hornady new Dimension seater with AMAX seater plug, I get very little runout with it. I'd only get another Forster Ultra if the Hornady didn't work so good, but if you like the micro top, go for it, they rock.
ULTRA? MICROMETER SEATER DIES | Brownells
Forster Ultra Micrometer Seater Die 308 Winchester
 
- Turning case necks

I do it, want to eliminate run out, make your necks a uniform thickness, BUT in a Semi Auto turning necks is a complete waste of time.

- Using bench rest primers VS standard primers

My targets and Chronograph tell me there is no difference between Fed 210m/210 and CCi BR2/200, only my wallet knows the difference.

- Using competition seating dies over standard dies

Not required but does make life easier.

- Crimping and not crimping

I recommend crimping for Semi Autos, it's cheap insurance, I use a Lee Factory Crimp Die, trim length must be consistent to achieve a consistent crimp.

- Loading to be just off the lands or kissing the lands

In a Semi Auto you can only load to mag length, choose a bullet like a SMK that is very jump tolerant. Once you get your bolt action seat all bullets by Ojive and not COAL.

- Uniforming primer pockets

It's only a one time operation, I recommend not using the uniformer to clean pockets, use a brush.

- Deburring flash holes

Again it's a one time operation, I recommend using a tool that the stop is directly above the cutter like a Sinclair.

- Bumping shoulders VS resizing to factory specs

Full Length EVERYTIME, set up your FL dies with a Headspace Gauge, I use a Hornady, bump the shoulder .003 for semi'a and .0015 for bolt guns, when measuring fired cases decap the brass, try and measure as many fired cases from the same chamber as possible, use the longest one as your reference to set up your die.

Maxium accuracy comes from a flexible but consistent reloading process, when I say flexible if the end result is crappy ammo refine your technique at each stage to fix the issue, a good repeatable case run out gauge will identify were run out is being introduced, it's your money but maximum consistency in powder charges comes from balance beam scales, electronic scales may be hip, faster, and easier to use, but in the long run a balance beam will last a lifetime, get a Chronograph, use it, and use it a lot, record your data on paper, DO NOT buy a Chrony brand anything.
 
ImageUploadedByTapatalk1386648422.491674.jpg


PSE EVO 60 Lbs.
Blacked out
 
Don't waste time turning necks unless you are forming brass to a smaller caliber.

I use competition dies because they are easy to adjust, and they do seat the bullets very straight.

I have primer pocket uniformers, but I honestly don't know if they are really all that necessary unless you can see the difference. For example, I got a lot of 50 pieces of nosler 300wm brass where the primers seated high, so the uniformer worked well.

Only crimp pistol rounds.

Best primers I have used are the soviet ones, evidenced by a measured record ES of 8 for 10 shots. Fuck the BR primers; they are just an added expense.

Loading to the lands: you need to try it yourself to see where to seat your bullets. Some bullets like a jump, like the 155 palmas
 
I've been posting a lot lately but my brain is a sponge right now and you guys always provide the knowledge. I wanna talk about all the different things folks do when reloading for maximum precision accuracy. What I'm gonna do is list some things I've seen folks do and ask for your input on the topic. What I would like is some sort of proof/data that a certain step has made a measurable difference in accuracy. Right now I'm chasing the accuracy goal with my GAP-10 but I will be having a precision bolt gun built soon. Here goes...

- Turning case necks

- Using bench rest primers VS standard primers

- Using competition seating dies over standard dies

- Crimping and not crimping

- Loading to be just off the lands or kissing the lands

- Uniforming primer pockets

- Deburring flash holes

- Bumping shoulders VS resizing to factory specs

Please provide input on any or all of these steps and if you've personally observed increases in accuracy by performing them. If you would like to add something I didn't list, feel free to do so.

You have only spoken about case prep. Some of these things i don't do. Other important factors are making sure powder charge is exactly the same, some weight sort bullets, i do not. I use rcbs standard dies. no crimp, no neck turning, case trim only when needed usually first time and about 5 firings later. I use fed 210m primers exclusively.

My biggest find in accuracy is "ME" my ability to shoot and a steady rest, powder charge, seating depth, and a rifle capable of one hole groups. once my die is set it never moves more than a .001. I do not check concentricity. I do debur (first time brass is prepped) and clean flash hole, I do full length resize every time, and i use standard rcbs dies.

My first time out with a rifle new to me an Accuracy ordinance, i shot loads that i had already loaded for my stock savage. My berger 155.5 fullbore load i was able to shoot a 1 hole group with 3 rounds at 100 yds. Outside dia was barely larger than one hole. These bullets like to be seated close, apparently my savage and my AO are close. Best group in my savage was around .5 in with this load.
 
I've been experimenting with the seating depth variable in a couple of bolt rifles with a couple of different bullets in each. I like to run the same tests several times, just to satisfy myself that no shooter error is skewing my results. In my opinion, seating depth is definitely something that has given me some control in tightening up my groups. Having performed the same tests numerous times, I'm convinced that the results are significant and repeatable.
 
Only comment I have is on the seating die.

Use either Redding or Forester. I prefer the Forester dies due to them using a nardened seating stem. You can use either the micrometer seating adjustment or not but either type will produce the least runnout in seated bullets. RCBS precision seating dies are crap. I got less runout with the RCBS standard seating die than with their precision seater.
 
I've been posting a lot lately but my brain is a sponge right now and you guys always provide the knowledge. I wanna talk about all the different things folks do when reloading for maximum precision accuracy. What I'm gonna do is list some things I've seen folks do and ask for your input on the topic. What I would like is some sort of proof/data that a certain step has made a measurable difference in accuracy. Right now I'm chasing the accuracy goal with my GAP-10 but I will be having a precision bolt gun built soon. Here goes...

- Turning case necks...

Best if done in conjunction with a tight neck chamber otherwise you'll likely get split necks from being over expanded. A full clean up of the neck is recommended so the neck is the same thickness all the way around. The most overlooked benefit from neck turning is more consistent neck tension. Which is at the top of my list for producing consistency.

- Using bench rest primers VS standard primers...

I can't tell a difference between them. On occasion one brand or type of primer, like magnum or regular primer, will tighten up groups.

- Using competition seating dies over standard dies...

The convenience of micrometer tops helps you to dial depth for different bullets or chase the throat more easily with seating depth as the throat wears forward.

- Crimping and not crimping...

Don't crimp for a bolt rifle, doing so distorts the bullet slightly.

- Loading to be just off the lands or kissing the lands...

Your rifle will show the best accuracy at whatever seating depth "in or out of the lands" produces the smallest groups. Testing is required to find that depth but I begin that test kissing the lands.

- Uniforming primer pockets...

Waist of time! Find the article "Tails of the old Houston Warehouse" and read it. They were shooting .035" groups every time without uniforming and could not tell a difference.

- Deburring flash holes

Most brands of brass have punched flash holes, like all the US Co's, those have burrs on the inside, I deburr them for precision rifle. If possible I shoot Lapua brass which are drilled and are nearly perfect to begin with. Recently I bought some Norma 300 SAUM brass, they appear to deburred already.

- Bumping shoulders VS resizing to factory specs...

For my AR-15 I FL size. All the precision bolt rifles I size only enough to bump the shoulder back .001 or a little less for slight crush fit on the last bit of bolt closing.

Please provide input on any or all of these steps and if you've personally observed increases in accuracy by performing them. If you would like to add something I didn't list, feel free to do so.

For the American brass I ream flash holes.

Weight sorted into bins of 50.

Proper annealing really helps provide consistent neck tension.

Weighing each charge keeps extreme spreads down. Course extruded grain powders do something called "Bridging" when thrown from a powder measure. For instance there would be a .6 grain difference in weight with H-4831 when throw from my Harrels for 50 rounds, which to me is totally unacceptable.

All any of these brass prep steps do is provide a small amount of consistency compared to doing nothing. Basically they help to eliminate the flyers or I should say how far away a flyer is from center. I do believe all these steps added together produce really tight ammo.

There's much more to hitting stuff at distance than having good ammo but it's one of the parts we have control over.
 
OK I'm sold on the competition seating dies.

If I were to buy a Redding seating micrometer, would it fit in my Dillon seating die?

Also, what's the difference between the VLD micrometer and the Standard?
 
This will keep you busy for a while!
Reloading within AccurateShooter.com

Make sure you check this one out:
Complete Precision Case Prep within AccurateShooter.com

If you sort through it, you will find the answers to what you are looking for and more.

Kind of hard to respond to your questions, as there are a lot of variables that can come into play:
- Are you running a bolt gun or autoloader, per above what makes sense for one, does not for the other.
- Are you starting with top quality brass like Lapua or a lower quality brass. If it is Lapua, then much of what you listed is not necessary, if it is lower quality brass then things like deburring or uniforming flash holes may make sense.
- Are you shooting for fun or trying to win a Benchrest Match, average shooters would probably not notice any difference if they did or did not do much of what you listed, Benchrest Shooter on the other hand would easily see an impact if they did not utilize much of what you had listed.

Sorry for the round about answer, but if you have a specific question, or can give more specific details, then it would be easier to respond.
 
OK I'm sold on the competition seating dies.

If I were to buy a Redding seating micrometer, would it fit in my Dillon seating die?

Also, what's the difference between the VLD micrometer and the Standard?

After trying the Redding Micrometer top seater I bought from Tubb, I'd have to say definitely get the Forster, the Redding didn't have any course adjustment, the Forster does, the Redding made dents in my bullets, sent the Redding back to Tubb, Im very happy with the Forster, now. The difference between the VLD and regular is the shape of the inside part of the seater plug.
 
Redding copied Forster's sliding bullet seater sleeve design once the patent expired. The Redding's seater also is more fragile compared to the Forster and will crack if you load a lot of compressed-charge rounds.

I have two Redding presses but do not prefer their dies -- I've cracked a number of their sizing dies and bullet seaters.
 
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this is for precision rifle - not tactical rifle, that is what you asked and as usual a lot of the replies show a lack of reading comprehension for what was asked -



- Turning case necks

yes

- Using bench rest primers VS standard primers

test both types

- Using competition seating dies over standard dies

yes

- Crimping and not crimping

not

- Loading to be just off the lands or kissing the lands

in, kissing and various off are all viable

I start with in if the mag etc allows

- Uniforming primer pockets

I use a lot of military brass, so yes - swage then uniform

- Deburring flash holes

1 in 20 may have a burr - why not

- Bumping shoulders VS resizing to factory specs

all combinations, depends on what it is for

-weigh sort / water volume testing

the 1st is far less effort, but when you do the 2nd you will find the 1st can let some puzzling odd balls in the batch

Please provide input on any or all of these steps and if you've personally observed increases in accuracy by performing them. If you would like to add something I didn't list, feel free to do so.[/QUOTE]
 
Lots of good input here, every shooter needs to critique his load process, they vary by type of action,
s/a or bolt, mag length limit on OAL, you can just make every round like a bench rest cartridge, but
even that won't work in everything.
You have to balance the the time and money with the accuracy expected for that outlay.
 
For the American brass I ream flash holes.

Weight sorted into bins of 50.

Proper annealing really helps provide consistent neck tension.

Weighing each charge keeps extreme spreads down. Course extruded grain powders do something called "Bridging" when thrown from a powder measure. For instance there would be a .6 grain difference in weight with H-4831 when throw from my Harrels for 50 rounds, which to me is totally unacceptable.

All any of these brass prep steps do is provide a small amount of consistency compared to doing nothing. Basically they help to eliminate the flyers or I should say how far away a flyer is from center. I do believe all these steps added together produce really tight ammo.

There's much more to hitting stuff at distance than having good ammo but it's one of the parts we have control over.

I anneal necks

I weight sort. One rifle I worked up a load for my buddy called it the one hole wonder. After a few times out I got lazy and just loaded a few hundred rounds to the spec I came up with during development.
Well, the one hole wonder wasn't. I scrubbed the crap out of the barrel, no change, I thought oh no it must be me, so after about 3-4 times out I loaded up some more rounds decided to be the uber OCD me, part of which is weight sorting the rounds.

Ric
 
If you're going to buy a separate micrometer seater, I would also recommend the Forster. The Forster is less expensive than the Redding and there is no advantage to the Redding over the Forster.

Here's a short review: Bullet Seating Dies - Redding vs. Forster

That was a great read. I'll definitely pick up a Forster seating die when I can actually find one in stock.
 
Lots of really great information in this thread. I greatly appreciate all the information fellas. This thread will definitely make me a better reloader and save me a lot of time and money.
 
if you want to call yourself this - you need to be water volume sorting to .1 gr on a GD503

Ok just OCD. I don't always weight sort. I aspire to uber! The rifle returned to expected accuracy levels with the weight sort steps added.
 
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I anneal necks

I weight sort. One rifle I worked up a load for my buddy called it the one hole wonder. After a few times out I got lazy and just loaded a few hundred rounds to the spec I came up with during development.
Well, the one hole wonder wasn't. I scrubbed the crap out of the barrel, no change, I thought oh no it must be me, so after about 3-4 times out I loaded up some more rounds decided to be the uber OCD me, part of which is weight sorting the rounds.

Ric

The most revealing experiment I've done was with a Olympic Arms 243WSSM upper.

A 20 round box of Factory Winny ammo shot 2.5 moa - pissed me off but I just wanted to shoot my new upper and use the brass to reload.

Worked up load with reloaded brass. Best it would do was 1.25 moa but 1.5 moa average, still discouraging.

Batch of new brass came in the mail. This brass was a abortion, the worse I've ever seen! Some of the necks were .0025" thicker one side compared to the other. Flash holes not centered, oblong and puckered in with large gnarly burrs on the inside. 5 grains difference between the heaviest and lightest case. Half the cases wouldn't even fit in the shell holder properly, had to force them in! So I did every benchrest case prep step known to man and threw away the bad cases.

Long story short I finally found a load with the prepped brass that shot 1 moa, which is the best that upper would do.
 
this is for precision rifle - not tactical rifle, that is what you asked and as usual a lot of the replies show a lack of reading comprehension for what was asked -

. . . . . Right now I'm chasing the accuracy goal with my GAP-10 but I will be having a precision bolt gun built soon. . . . . .

Sorry, but I was not sure if the OP was asking for the Autoloader, Bolt Gun, or Both? Hence my reply that more details are needed.

Reloading for an Autoloader and a Bolt Gun are typically 2 completely different things, so in order to give the most accurate response, that information needs to be specified.

YMMV!
 
On December 11th, Grafs has them in stock w/o a low inventory warning

I got one too. Unfortunately, when I placed my order with Brownells it was in stock but when I checked out it showed as backordered. I got one from Grafs and canceled the Brownells order.
 
If you're going to buy a separate micrometer seater, I would also recommend the Forster. The Forster is less expensive than the Redding and there is no advantage to the Redding over the Forster.

Here's a short review: Bullet Seating Dies - Redding vs. Forster

I would add a caveat. Redding makes a VLD shaped stem... handy for those of us seating VLD's or (in my case) Berger Hybrids. Otherwise, yeah, Forster is just as good.
 
- Turning case necks
I do it because I am anal. Many great shooters have done it without.

- Using bench rest primers VS standard primers
I use bench rest, but many have tried both and seen no difference. The bigger factor will be which manufacturer. German Salazar theorized you want less charge and found that Federal Large rifles met this criterion.

- Using competition seating dies over standard dies
Already answered above.

- Crimping and not crimping
Don't do it.

- Loading to be just off the lands or kissing the lands
You will need to try both. I shoot jammed (into the lands) because it works better in my rifle. I know people who have the same caliber, reamer, and barrel make, model, and length who this is not true for.

- Uniforming primer pockets
Get Lapua brass and you won't need to. If you want to use Winchester, you will get extra powder space in 308, but you will need to perform this operation.

- Deburring flash holes
See above.

- Bumping shoulders VS resizing to factory specs
You mean Neck Only Sizing vs FL Sizing. FL Sizing generally yields better accuracy. NO sizing is less wear and tear on your brass. The main issue is knowing when to bump the shoulder since you won't be doing it every time. The bigger debate is how much headspace to leave yourself. I like to size to a crush fit... this is too tight for people who like to run their bolt fast... tactical shooters. I do it for the extra smidgen of accuracy of having the brass firmly in place during firing.

- Checking run out with a concentricity gage
I do it every time. BTW... I have a Forster Co-ax and a Dillon 650. I have been running a 308 on my Co-ax for a while. I spent about $500 rigging my Dillon to load progressively and runout when though the roof despite all my precautions.... worse, after several firings and resizing with the Co-ax, runout has not come back under control. I don't understand why not, but until I find another source of runout, I am blaming the Dillon for ruining my brass. This is why you should check runout. If you are doing something that is messing up your loads, you need to figure out what. One time, I got a little piece of wood under the shell holder in my Co-ax that was inducing runout. No concentricity gauge and I could have run it like that for a year without knowing.
 
- Checking run out with a concentricity gage
I do it every time. BTW... I have a Forster Co-ax and a Dillon 650. I have been running a 308 on my Co-ax for a while. I spent about $500 rigging my Dillon to load progressively and runout when though the roof despite all my precautions.... worse, after several firings and resizing with the Co-ax, runout has not come back under control. I don't understand why not, but until I find another source of runout, I am blaming the Dillon for ruining my brass. This is why you should check runout. If you are doing something that is messing up your loads, you need to figure out what. One time, I got a little piece of wood under the shell holder in my Co-ax that was inducing runout. No concentricity gauge and I could have run it like that for a year without knowing.

Do you think that maybe applying the rubber o-rings to the dies would help on the Dillon? (like part 5 of the long range reloading sticky)
 
Once I have settled on a powder weight and proven its accuracy a second go-round, I pull one bullet from the loaded rounds and use that powder charge as my check weight for future batches.

Before measuring powder for a batch of ammo, I use that saved powder charge, which is stored in a dry container, to set up my beam scale.

Consistency is the key to repeatability.

------------------

I seat EACH round long by a little over .005, measure base-to-ogive, then dial the correction and seat again to proper length using Redding Competition Dies. You simply CANNOT set and go due to the difference in bullet concentricity.
 
Once I have settled on a powder weight and proven its accuracy a second go-round, I pull one bullet from the loaded rounds and use that powder charge as my check weight for future batches.

Before measuring powder for a batch of ammo, I use that saved powder charge, which is stored in a dry container, to set up my beam scale.

Consistency is the key to repeatability.

------------------

I seat EACH round long by a little over .005, measure base-to-ogive, then dial the correction and seat again to proper length using Redding Competition Dies. You simply CANNOT set and go due to the difference in bullet concentricity.

Not sure I'm tracking... Why would you not know how much powder was in that case before you found your accuracy node? I'm not seeing a need to pull a bullet and keep a charge if you were the one who weighed the charge that went into it.
 
Do you think that maybe applying the rubber o-rings to the dies would help on the Dillon? (like part 5 of the long range reloading sticky)

I one-upped that. I got the Whidden free-floating die toolhead. This allows the die to float, which should offer maximum concentricity. I also used the Uniquetek "clamps" to clamp the toolhead in there. Regardless, concentricity average over .004". I was willing to accept going up to .002" or .0025" from the .001" average I was getting, but my numbers were over the top bad. And I have done it on two sets of brass. I have no idea why concentricity is not coming back. Probably because the brass is old and is not springing back.
 
What I have found as "most" important for precision LR shooting(F-class)

Buy Lapua brass (all the same lot #)
Neck turn if you are using a bushing die or had your chamber reamed tight
Buy a scale that will measure to .00 of a grain
Weight sort brass and bullets
Anneal at least after 3 firings (I anneal after every firing). Neck tension will be more consistent with a bushing die and brass lasts longer
Try several primers to see how they perform initially. Primers with the hardest cup usually are best if you are pushing the load.
Only change one component at a time when doing load testing.
Document everything from load info to weather conditions, to how hung over you were from the night before!!
 
What I would like is some sort of proof/data that a certain step has made a measurable difference in accuracy. Right now I'm chasing the accuracy goal with my GAP-10 but I will be having a precision bolt gun built soon. Here goes...

I have been wondering the same thing for years, and have "chased the accuracy goal" in many ways with many reloading methods in many rifles. Here's my story. I started shooting service rifle matches with a buddy in 1990. The "accuracy goal" there is 1 MOA, or the size of the x-ring. My buddy did lots of case prep and weighed every charge by hand. I had very little time to practice or reload, so I bought a Dillon 550, set it up with Lee dies, and loaded everything progressive style. The only case prep I did was to remove primer crimps from LC brass, and trim it to correct length with the Lee trim tool in an electric hand drill. After awhile, my buddy and I were both shooting expert scores in matches. A couple of times, emergencies arose and I either had to borrow some of his ammo, or he had to borrow some of mine. On those occasions, we saw no obvious changes in our scores.

Derrick Martin of Accuracy Speaks built and test-shot my service rifle using my progressively-loaded ammo. In his hands, it reliably shot 1 MOA or better. Later, I got seduced by the idea of itty-bitty groups in bolt rifles. I started with a Savage Model 10, with a heavy barrel. With my mediocre abilities, I could reliably get it to shoot better than 1 MOA using Federal Gold Medal Match and my service rifle loads. But I wasn't getting those itty-bitty groups I wanted. So I sold the Savage, and bought a lightly-used Remington 700 built for Palma competition that had a good reputation for accuracy. My groups were a little better, but not much. So I started experimenting with each of the precision reloading steps you have identified, except turning case necks. I also experimented with different bullets, OAL and cases - except Lapua. My groups did not improve. So I sold the Palma rifle and bought an FN SPR with a 24" Obermeyer barrel from a 'Hide member who had been using it in tactical matches and reported that it shot 1/3 MOA with M118 ammo. The barrel had about 1200 rounds through it at the time, I think. I was excited to try it out, but in my hands, it shot about the same as the Palma rifle. I was a little frustrated.

Because it was what I had at the time, I took the FN to a wind-reading class in October. I used 200 rounds of an M118 clone handload consisting of 175 gr. Sierra MK bullets (pulled from surplus ammo), LC 63 brass, and 41.3 gr. of RL 15 over a Remington 91/2 primer. The handload was assembled full-progressive style on the Dillon, using a Lee FL sizing die, the stock Dillon powder measure, an RCBS competition seating die, and the Lee factory crimp die. I weighed powder charges 10 random times during the loading sequence, and found that the charges did not vary more than .1 grain from the nominal charge. At the class, we shot paper targets at 500 meters on one day, then shot steel targets the next day out to about 1200 meters. We had shooters on the line that were way better than I was, but we had some that were about the same as I or worse. Equipment-wise, the FN was the cheapest setup there, with possibly one or two exceptions. But I had no problem hitting the steel targets at all ranges, and my paper targets were middle-of-the-pack in size.

Still, I wanted smaller groups. So I signed up for the 'Hide marksmanship training, wondering if a change in technique might help. Along the way, I bought two more .308's, on the off-chance that maybe my problem was equipment-related. One is a Sako TRG-22 with a 20" factory barrel; the other is an M24 clone with a 24" Krieger barrel that was said to have been built by a military armorer. After trying a couple of things from Frank's training video (chiefly dealing with trigger manipulation and recoil management), I started getting what I call itty-bitty groups from the FN -- using my M118 clone progressive handload! I was intrigued, so I tried the same ammunition in the TRG-22. I got more itty-bitty groups. I took the M24 clone out last Saturday, but for reasons not important here, I had a less-than steady position. I still got what I call pretty good groups, using the same ammunition.

Not all my groups have been itty-bitty, and I have not shot for group size beyond 100 yards. Moreover, my itty-bitty groups may be huge by others' standards. But the fact that I could repeatedly shoot what I consider small groups indicates to me that larger groups were not likely due to the rifle or ammunition. For each rifle, the groups pictured below were the first two groups I shot. I typically struggle a bit after the first two groups, but with both the FN and the TRG-22, I have shot similar groups after firing strings of 20 or more rounds. Maybe altering my reloading methods or materials will result in better groups at distance. My next project will be to fire groups at longer distances to see how much improvement in ammunition is needed. But so far, but I have not been able to produce any measurable difference in my practical accuracy by using any of the reloading techniques you mentioned. My greatest advances have come from improving my shooting technique.

Here are the targets from the three rifles:

FN Target 1 (3 shots)
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FN Target 2 (5 shots)
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TRG Target 1 (3 shots)
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TRG Target 2 (3 shots)
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M24 Target 1 (3 shots)
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M24 Target 2 (3 shots)
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Not sure I'm tracking... Why would you not know how much powder was in that case before you found your accuracy node? I'm not seeing a need to pull a bullet and keep a charge if you were the one who weighed the charge that went into it.

Because time has passed since the last time you loaded this load. Maybe you loaded some others in that time, changing your setting, or your beam scale has just been sitting idle. Truth is, your scale over time will begin to lie to you. All that is important is matching the powder load that works to the powder loads you are making. Pour the load into the pan and TELL your beam scale that this is 92.0. Not ask it if it is 92.0. Level the beam to the powder charge that shoots, then make identical powder charges.

Your powder load that works becomes your "check weight". One of the reasons a beam scale is more accurate is because it can be leveled.
 
Because time has passed since the last time you loaded this load. Maybe you loaded some others in that time, changing your setting, or your beam scale has just been sitting idle. Truth is, your scale over time will begin to lie to you. All that is important is matching the powder load that works to the powder loads you are making. Pour the load into the pan and TELL your beam scale that this is 92.0. Not ask it if it is 92.0. Level the beam to the powder charge that shoots, then make identical powder charges.

Your powder load that works becomes your "check weight". One of the reasons a beam scale is more accurate is because it can be leveled.

I see what you mean. Thanks for a explanation.
 
For the most part I see case prep is one main part for consistency, I pretty much do it all except annealing which I'd like to start doin to saving brass money, one question aat which step do you anneal? I've see that a lot of ppl anneal after cleaning brass but before resizing, here's my delima is that I deprime and resize then clean my brass so that steel media will clean the primer pocket. Would it find to a anneal after that?

Great read for the rest though
 
For the most part I see case prep is one main part for consistency, I pretty much do it all except annealing which I'd like to start doin to saving brass money, one question aat which step do you anneal? I've see that a lot of ppl anneal after cleaning brass but before resizing, here's my delima is that I deprime and resize then clean my brass so that steel media will clean the primer pocket. Would it find to a anneal after that?

Great read for the rest though

I would say annealing before sizing would be the best bet.

That's weird that you size before cleaning... Do you just wipe off the brass or do you size it dirty?
 
We'll you say dirty I try to wash it after each shooting so it's not like nasty, just wipe it down then take a brush to the inside of the neck. I mean I know it's good to have clean primer pockets and with washing it with stainless steel that takes care of it in one step, so and I ghave the type a bushing die so decap and resize in one, unless I should be doing something else