Hunting & Fishing 45-70 Cast Hunting Source

[Bluesop7]

I've been trying to find this information for days now and still no luck. I don't and won't be casting my own any time soon so I'm stuck with what I can buy. I'm new to the 45-70 and would very much like to take it white tail hunting with me in November. I already have a jacketed bullet picked out but would also like a cast bullet (or boolit if you prefer) that will be a good deer stopper (read: quick kill, minimal meat damage) that I can take as well just to be a little more traditional.

Would a hard cast 405gr work well? Or would a softer alloy work better? Any clear concise info regarding hardness/weight/maufacturer combination or better yet suggestions/links to specific bullets would be much appreciated.

 

[aj_brown]

Re: 45-70 Cast Hunting Source

BlackHills has 405gr 45-70 ammo. It is loaded to 1250 fps to match the orignal black power loading.

Alan

 

[bohem]

Re: 45-70 Cast Hunting Source

The 405 hard cast is going to be a decent load and the hard cast bullet won't expand a whole lot, but it will mushroom up and they penetrate EXTREMELY well.

Do you reload? A 405gr hard cast at 1500-1700fps will make for a "Thor's Hammer" kind of load on game.

 

[ArcticLight]

Re: 45-70 Cast Hunting Source

Let me ask my dad, he bought some casts, just not sure for which gun..

 

[HOGGHEAD]

Re: 45-70 Cast Hunting Source

My main bullet for my 45-70's is a 405 grain cast bullet. However I cast my own.

I do not particularly care for a hard cast bullet for deer. IMO WW alloy is more than hard enough for a great bullet. and I get mushrooming out to about 80 or 90 caliber, so that is pretty tough to beat. It does not do a tremendous amount of meat damage. But at 1600 fps or so it will hit them like a slegde hammer.

The load I use the most is 40.0 grains of RL-7. This load yields about 1600 fps in all my 45-70's. No need for a GC at those velocities.

You mentioned using a jacketed and a cast bullet?? Normally that is not a good idea. You need to be certain the barrel is 100% clean before you mix cast and jacketed in the same rifle. Actually is not really a good idea to mix the two. Accuracy will suffer.

If you're ever close to WV, stop by. We will cast you a couple of hundred. Tom.

 

[KHOOKS]

Re: 45-70 Cast Hunting Source

TAG

 

[ArcticLight]

Re: 45-70 Cast Hunting Source

My dad says:

nah. but he might try Montana Bullets. they have some. they have some super penetrator for a .475 too. i was looking at the Ruger No. 1 in a pistol cartridge, .475 Linebaugh. also takes .480 Ruger. very efficient close range cartridge. very powerful. Montana Bullets has cast with or without gas checks for those and i've bought some from my .458. they got em from 300gr to 555gr. http://www.montanabulletworks.com/BB_45_caliber.html

 

[Powder_Burns]

Re: 45-70 Cast Hunting Source

http://www.grizzlycartridge.com/store/index.php?app=ecom&ns=prodshow&ref=CP458/405B

I run 320gr .430's in my .44 mag, very satisfied with the alloy they are using. Their .458 stuff should be just as good. I might run some through my .458 socom, been hesitant since its a gas-op rifle and I don't want to deposit any lube or lead in the gas system.

 

[Bluesop7]

Re: 45-70 Cast Hunting Source

Thanks for the help so far. I do reload and will not be buying factory ammo whatsoever (seeing as how its ridiculously expensive). My rifle is a Marlin 1895GBL (guide gun).

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: ArcticLight</div><div class="ubbcode-body">My dad says:

nah. but he might try Montana Bullets. they have some. they have some super penetrator for a .475 too. i was looking at the Ruger No. 1 in a pistol cartridge, .475 Linebaugh. also takes .480 Ruger. very efficient close range cartridge. very powerful. Montana Bullets has cast with or without gas checks for those and i've bought some from my .458. they got em from 300gr to 555gr. http://www.montanabulletworks.com/BB_45_caliber.html </div></div>

So should I be looking at the bullets with a BHN of 15? I saw one thats 400gr with a nice wide meplat that has a BHN of 15. Would that be similar to a WW alloy bullet? I've never shot cast bullets before and am trying to learn as much about them as I can and really only have a vauge idea of what im talking about. Where might I find wheel weight bullets? Like I said, I dont cast and really dont have a desire to (at least at this point in my life) so I need to find a good source.

I know a hard cast bullet will kill a deer, I just really want it to be DRT so I'm thinking a bullet that will expand slightly should do quite well yet not destroy the meat. I'm trying to stay away from say a 300gr jacketed hp that I would imagine would be akin to setting a grenade off inside a deer.

I'm kind of leaning towards trying out the 15 BHN 400gr FP from Montana Bullet Works.


I've also never heard about not mixing jacketed and cast bullets. Thanks for the tip, I'll have to look into that.

 

[HOGGHEAD]

Re: 45-70 Cast Hunting Source

Don't get hung up so much on the hardness of the lead. You can overthink it.

What is more important than the hardness is that the bullet be properly sized to your rifle.

If you are serious about getting cast bulets to shoot well then you need to slug your barrel and get the exact size. Then order your bullets from someone who will size them for you. Normally a bullet shoots most accurate when it runs .001 to .002 over your slugged diameter.

Leading has more to do with proper sizing and lubing. However alot of people think the harder lead will not give as much barrel leading. But that is a false premise. An improperly sized bullet is going to leave the most leading in the barrel.

Also the hardness of the lead will change over time. Lead will get harder over time. As well as you can heat treat your softer lead bullets, or you can water quench them to increase the Bhn. However that is only afecting the surface Bhn.

The guys at Montana will treat you right. Just make sure you have your bullets properly sized. Tom.

 

[Bluesop7]

Re: 45-70 Cast Hunting Source

That makes sense. Do you think its necessary to slug a brand new marlin 1895? I should think with modern standards things would be rock solid consisten, especially with barrel diameters.

 

[HOGGHEAD]

Re: 45-70 Cast Hunting Source

If you want to do it right then yes it is necessary. It will probably work out just fine. And many tmies the standard ordered bullet will work perfectly. But it is best to know. And if you are buying bullets that will be sized, then they will ask you what size you want. Tom.

 

[Bluesop7]

Re: 45-70 Cast Hunting Source

Dang your right, just trying to get away with being lazy. Will fishing weights still be the best way to slug a ~0.458 bore? Thats how I did it with my 30 cal mosin nagant but I havent checked into if they have uber big fishing weights for the larger caliber.

 

[Bluesop7]

Re: 45-70 Cast Hunting Source

But really...I dont care all that much about accuracy. This is primarily a hunting rifle, secondary purpose is plinking. So as long as I get hunting accuracy I'll be just fine.

 

[noahmercy]

Re: 45-70 Cast Hunting Source

If you can find some 335 grain Gould design hollowpoints cast from 10-1 alloy, you'll have the finest whitetail medicine on the planet. They slap down deer like nothing I've ever seen and do zero meat damage.

Might look around and see if anyone sells them...

 

[Bluesop7]

Re: 45-70 Cast Hunting Source

Thanks for the tip, I'll try and see if I can find some.

 

[Old Coach]

Re: 45-70 Cast Hunting Source

Check out Beartooth Bullets.

 

[RyeDaddy]

Re: 45-70 Cast Hunting Source

Beartooth Bullets. Marshall Stanton is an awesome guy, very nice and will talk to you on the phone for as long as you need about reloading his bullets. His bullets are superb. You don't need a super heavy bullet in a 45-70, 350 grain hardcast will penetrate 5 feet of ballistic gel. 405's work fine as well if you're inclined toward them. I tried a bunch of different bullets in my Marlin 1895SBL before I tried Beartooth. I settled on their 350 grain Pile Driver Lite. Marshall's web site states that they have yet to recover one from game, and that they've had one of their 350's go lengthwise through a moose unrecovered. He's an honest man and I believe him. They feed flawlessly and the meplat is wider than anything else out there. I load them to 1900 FPS as that's all the velocity I need and they've killed a couple deer so far, BANG-flop! I slugged my bore with the fishing weights you can order from Beartooth and my barrel is .457" but I shoot their .460" sized bullets anyway, and the Marlin will do 1" groups at 100 yards with ghost ring sights. Can't ask any more of a 45-70, can you?