I'm just going to ask you guys @ArmyJerry @mijp5 @W54/XM-388 what should the role of the U.S. government be? The current way it works is government takes taxes and uses that for programs, some of which are socialistic in nature. Should we get rid of those programs because all socialism is bad?
Calling a spade a spade????
- Thread starter sirhrmechanic
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Are you even American? Have you read the Constitution? Look at the 10th amendment, it answers your question commie boy.
https://www.archives.gov/founding-docs
https://www.archives.gov/founding-docs
That is a long question that leads you down many paths and one that the founding fathers of this country tried their best to come up with a decent answer to & which has gotten totally corrupted in this country. So many examples throughout history mostly bad.
The Bigger and more powerful any "government" gets, usually the worse it is, more evil, more corrupt, more oppressive.
The more "Services" you want a "government" to provide, the inefficiency and costs go up exponentially with each new "feature".
There are however some inescapable issues for now while we are all on this single planet and it's pretty easy to get from place to place:
Some person or some group of people will always want to come take what you have so they don't have to mind their own and raise their own and will always be willing to use violence or death to get what they want and what they want usually includes either you dead, or you as their slaves.
No matter how rugged of an "individual" you think you are, if you wish to progress beyond primitive hunter/gatherer stage, you will probably eventually need help from others, either due to a disaster, emergency, medical issue, building/engineering project, resources, manufacturing, trading etc. The more highly skilled you choose to be in a specialized field, the more you will need the help of others.
In order to have enough population mass to have an advanced industrialized civilization, you eventually pass the tipping point where there is simply not enough room or natural resources for everybody to go play out their daydreams of being some "free" primitive hunter / gatherer, unless something happens to destroy most of the population and then you are back to being forced into basic primitive society only. Some people are happy to live that way but others like myself want to see Humanity become the dominant species of our universe & spread out across all of space, that's not going to happen with a small group running around in animal skins hunting with hand made weapons. In my opinion, if Humanity can't progress then humanity has no point, there is enough animals playing primitive hunter / gatherer to satisfy any need for that.
In order to have an advanced civilization capable of progressing you need at least a few basic things:
1. A method to defend the individual, the group and the land that the group or extended group claim, the planet you claim etc, from others, repel attacks, discourage attacks and be able to control exclusive use of it in an assigned orderly manner to preserve ownership rights.
2. You need to have some form of Fungible proxy for the fruits of human labour and intellect at the local level to enable seamless trade and production. It must be agreed upon and the value must be agreed upon and usually somebody needs to referee it.
3. You need an orderly system of behavior that people agree to in order to be part of the society or else be excluded from it and it's controlled area completely, usually this system of behavior / rules is called "laws". In addition, you need at least some basic structure for contracts between parties. Usually in both cases you need some person to play neutral (or "fair") referee that is respected by all parties, unless you wish all things eventually to be solved by bloodshed which can be inefficient and wasteful, not to mention time consuming.
4. There will always be "emergencies" and "Disasters" both on the micro level as well as the macro level, you need a plan in place and systems setup to handle such things in advance or plans of what to do when they happen.
5. Based on the land, planet, habitat, you need to decide which basic resources are available to everyone to use and what limits there are to each party using said resources and ensuring they don't block access for others, or degrade those resources for others, then if you are in an environment where basic life sustaining resources are not freely available, you might want to work out a system where they can be produced and sold in an organized and reasonably fair fashion for everyone to avoid endless bloodshed.
So back to your question....
The founding fathers actually did a pretty good job of trying to setup a very loose government that did the minimal amount needed while maintaining the maximum freedom. The problem is it got totally corrupted over time as people wanted "more" from the government.
For example, originally the Federal government was limited pretty much to National defense and territorial integrity and projections of power as needed to ensure the good of the country, along with being the final arbitrator of disputes across state lines as well as ensuring that government at all levels did not intrude on the innate, fundamental, natural/god given rights of the individual & that justice and politics followed agreed on guidelines. Pretty much nothing else.
Hand outs such as Disaster aid, refugee assistance or welfare were strictly prohibited and the main source of income for the Federal government was import / export duties, taxes on interstate commerce and lotteries.
Enforcement of peace and order internally took many forms, some places established voted in "public" sheriffs or other such entities, usually paid for either by some form of taxes or subscription. Other places had more privatized systems of law enforcement where you had several different "police" forces you could pay a subscription to in order to have them provide you security services (San Francisco had one like that for a time). Other places it was pretty much left for you to battle it out daily with anyone that wanted to kill you or rob you, by yourself or in your own groups unless in spilled over into something endangering the state / country and the military got called out, or the local citizenry had enough and decided to form a big enough vigilante mob to take care of business.
Urban emergency services also took many forms, for example fire departments, some cities had "public" ones paid for by subscription and others had private free enterprise fire departments where you could pay a subscription to your preferred fire service and in the event of an emergency they would show up, or if you didn't possibly several different departments might show up to a fire and offer services at different rates that you could negotiate depending on if you wanted your building saved.
Same thing with medical emergencies. Many places were strictly free enterprise, you paid for services as needed with your choice of places / people to go to, or prepaid them, or were part of a subscription based risk pool. Then if you had neither, hopefully when you needed medical help bad, you had some cash or valuables on your body that the medical establishment could hold as collateral against you paying for their services in saving your life.
I suggest you spend some serious time studying history as well as reading forward thinking scifi novels (such as Heinlien) and the writings of those that helped found our country and come to your own conclusion. There is no easy answers, each comes with it's own issues.
For example, you could be in a totally free society with nobody to tell you what to do... which means that if you wanted to go trade your cattle for some grain and iron, you need to drive a heavy weapons convoy and be ready to engage in open battles with people who wish to take your stuff. This is not actually far off the truth, where I once lived, the old villages had big stone keeps in the center and houses were built like forts because of raids by pirates, and the ferries that use to run between places about 50 years prior had barbed wire around them and machine gun nests to fight pirates... Interestingly enough, it was the Communists that finally put an end to all that and established themselves as the baddest most brutal ones that everybody settle down and serve them in an orderly fashion or else. In our country trade with Europe at the start of our Republic was dangerous, as ships had to be armed and fight off Muslim pirates (loosing meant death or slavery) or pay huge extortion fees to sail without being attacked. Eventually once the extortion fees started reaching 10% of our GDP, the public decided it was cheaper to build an navy, sail to those muslim savage countries, and put the boot to them once and for all. Which our fledgling nation getting done for all affected nations, when the rest of Europe was only each country doing something for themselves was the start of our country proving to itself that we could be the best military ever if needed.
It eventually came into fashion that what everyone preferred was to have some sort of standing common defense both nationally and locally and force everybody in some way to contribute to it. Much the same as with disaster services such as fire departments and such, the fashionable thing these days is to have single services with a guaranteed service radius paid for by mandatory subscription fees "taxes".
My suggestion for you is to sit and think what you want and work out the details & then flesh it out and discuss it. There is no easy answer and at the beginning of this country the best and brightest minds spent years studying all recorded history of humans trying to discuss and come up with a plan.
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I write strictly for a hobby, several other members of my family have a few things published, mostly there is little money to be made in serious books these days by non celebrities. A lot of writers simply do it for the love of writing, the comradery of groups of other writers and if you get much over travel and promotion expenses, it's a nice little bonus.
I also enjoy writing long posts, letters and discussions because these days it seems to overload the minds of the people with "twitter brains".
In my professional life, I constantly find it amusing that so many people can't get past the first paragraph of an e-mail even when asking for detailed technical help, nor can they read information clearly listed out for them past the first thing they are looking for.
So I write for fun and to see if I can get anyone else interested in long conversations about a wide range of issues because I find long friendly discussions about the way things were, are, will be, could be or should be lots of fun and I find the more I learn of different view points the more I find that the answers are much more involved than expected.
One other detail is that when you like to write, it's hard not to write.
I was just messing with you.
Im just the opposite...I try to compress and say it in as few as words as possible.
LOL @ commie boy. Yup that's me. Glad you found me out. /s
@W54/XM-388 I really appreciate your response. Well thought out and does give me some reference of where to start answering the questions I have.
When I was in college I fucked a commie girl once. It was ok but my buddies in ROTC were relentless. My buddies wanted me to get her in the sack again and talk her into letting me pee on her. I never did its just not my thing. She went to work for a bank after she graduated and tried to embezzle $$. Got caught and did time.
Too busy with harvest to help, so my Code Word is, Lipsticks, lips stuck to the cock they are after at that time.
Where is my T-shirt??? WWAJD? Regards, FM
Where is my T-shirt??? WWAJD? Regards, FM
Jefferson was a liberal. I am a liberal in his mold. The left have not been liberals for a long long time. They were called that for a time because they play word games and hold those power centers. It’s an abomination.
In any other country in the world those who are for less government and more liberty are called liberals. Only here are socialist/communist authoritarian/totalitarians called “liberals”.
In any other country in the world those who are for less government and more liberty are called liberals. Only here are socialist/communist authoritarian/totalitarians called “liberals”.
You know. If ten million non-voters all registered as democrats and republicans. They could change both parties by voting primaries. There are enough Gary Johnson voters out there to change one party or the other. Too bad people like that pretty much can't all get going the same direction at once.
the Parties should be subject to RICO statutes and no registerd party member should be allowed to work in Government as their allegiance is to party not the Constitution.
That could not be farther from the truth if that statement was your dick and the truth was pussy . There are numerous ass holes in this country who are quite wealthy and are calling for communism . And stop calling it Socialism or any other rebranded bullshit .
If you think I'm wrong let's start with hollywood . Then there's Bezos , Zukberg , and all of the Big Five conglomerates that control every fuckin thing you buy .
Funny I was behind an asshole in traffic driving Mercedes crossover SUV and he had a picture of Lenin and the hammer and sickle on it . They are told they want communism but don't realize that when it comes that the State gets their money , their house and the fuckin Mercedes . Just ask Bezos how well the new Amazon facility is going in , what was the name of that shithole . Your position is weak and your comments appear to drift from one side of the fence to the other . You are outing yourself as a Swamp Thing . In fact I would put money one it .
Edit: Fuck I forgot !!! Buy More Ammo .
Openly stating and working against the Constitution is technically a crime . Ask any cop that did effect an arrest and follow both procedure and common sense to a T only to be charged with violating the POS' Constitutional Rights because there were no statutes in this Universe violated . And sorry Jerry Rico was only used to bust up Family Businesses because they were in direct competition with City Councilmen , Mayors and Aldermen . Why should a Capo get ten or twenty grand to allow a building or road project . Lock that fuckin Capo up and now give me that fuckin money . If Rico were a real statute then Philadelphia's John and Milton Street would have been charged . They have both numerous Federal convictions yet no jail time . Everything they do is criminal enterprise . Shakkah Fattah in Philly just got greedy and fucked one of his own . That is the only way to get a conviction on any of these shitbags . Cuomo from New York just took a lateral promotion . Morphed into a politician . Don't think for one fuckin minute that if the Mob didn't get broken that he wouldn't be a quiet leader . I'll bet he is fuckin giddy out how much easier it is doing "Politics" as opposed to wackin people . Doesnt have to worry about getting killed by one of his own . Find one old inside Dego from NY NY that doesn't agree .
There is little hope for having any meaniful 3rd party or alternates in politics after the BS and public propaganda that produced the "Campaign Finance Reform" bill. That was specifically designed to make it near impossible for any 3rd party and 3rd party candidate due to excessive regulations and complaiance requirements. After the disasters for both parties of Nader and Perot, both parties agreed to work together to make sure it would only be the 2 of them.
So for now, pick a party and get involved heavily in the primaries and then in the elections. In the primaries you have a oversized amount of influence.
That is how the Communists took over the Democrat party and why the Republicans nowdays pay at least lip service to freedom and patriotism.
Then feel free to work to change the system to something better, but in the mean time at all costs pretty much keep the Communist Democraps at bay as they want to take away your ability to resist and to get yourself ready for times when you might have to protect yourself.
That's why I vote and support Republicans, not because I like them so much, but because the Democraps are determined to take all your guns and your money as fast as possible and the Republicans know they best not try to take your guns too openly or they will loose the elections to the Democrats for sure.
It's a matter of if you are forced into a binary choice, no sitting on the fence would you prefer to live under Hitler or Stalin, (Hint, if you say neither, you get Stalin) till you can get enough support to get rid of both.
Much like the last presidential elections, there were all these idiots saying how they didn't want to vote for trump or anyone because of some reason or another. My response to them was simply... You are going to get Hillary... If you don't want that, your only choice is to work hard and hope to God that Trump wins, you have NO other choices at this time. And while Trump has significant issues, I don't think anyone could make the case that the cause of freedom, liberty, 2nd Amendment or Patriotism would be doing better under Hillary. I'm sure by now if she had won and had enough democrats won in the house races, she would have already pushed a bunch of gun ban and grab bills trying to catch up with CA.
So for now, pick a party and get involved heavily in the primaries and then in the elections. In the primaries you have a oversized amount of influence.
That is how the Communists took over the Democrat party and why the Republicans nowdays pay at least lip service to freedom and patriotism.
Then feel free to work to change the system to something better, but in the mean time at all costs pretty much keep the Communist Democraps at bay as they want to take away your ability to resist and to get yourself ready for times when you might have to protect yourself.
That's why I vote and support Republicans, not because I like them so much, but because the Democraps are determined to take all your guns and your money as fast as possible and the Republicans know they best not try to take your guns too openly or they will loose the elections to the Democrats for sure.
It's a matter of if you are forced into a binary choice, no sitting on the fence would you prefer to live under Hitler or Stalin, (Hint, if you say neither, you get Stalin) till you can get enough support to get rid of both.
Much like the last presidential elections, there were all these idiots saying how they didn't want to vote for trump or anyone because of some reason or another. My response to them was simply... You are going to get Hillary... If you don't want that, your only choice is to work hard and hope to God that Trump wins, you have NO other choices at this time. And while Trump has significant issues, I don't think anyone could make the case that the cause of freedom, liberty, 2nd Amendment or Patriotism would be doing better under Hillary. I'm sure by now if she had won and had enough democrats won in the house races, she would have already pushed a bunch of gun ban and grab bills trying to catch up with CA.
No third party because the government has been weaponized against the citizenry from starting one, IRS does will and did caome after teh tea party at the behest of the two criminal parties we have now. They think they are smart but this was planting the seed of a Trump presidency. Without Tea Party Support Trump never gets elected and probably doesn't even run.
End of the day our unconstitutional government needs to be destroyed, its a full on existential threat to our Republic more than any threat we faced since the revolution.
End of the day our unconstitutional government needs to be destroyed, its a full on existential threat to our Republic more than any threat we faced since the revolution.
Why would people march for communism if they can enjoy more freedom under current conditions. Usually social unrest/political change happens because the majority are suffering. I do agree with @ArmyJerry in that both sides are whittling away rights of your everyday citizen. We need outsiders like Trump to show how much terrifying power the Gov't has on us and that the people should move towards getting rid of that power.
Because true "Freedom" is beyond the comprehension of the idiots that march for Communism, what they are deluded with are promises that the Communists will "Share the wealth" and "Make the Rich pay" and give them all free stuff so they don't have to work.
If you look at all Communist take overs, it's always a small group of truly evil, hateful core, that first delude the over educated "intelligent" smellers of their own farts in higher education, which then help them make grand promises to the stupid masses. Then eventually the stupid masses are mobilized, overthrow the government, then the core group takes over power and eliminates all the "educated" ones and begins their brutal totalitarian rule over the masses (who in my opinion deserve the chains they so wildly begged for).
Communists are all the same from the ghetto thugs to the professors in the university, none want to put in a hard days work day in and day out for years to get what they want. They want quick satisfaction and enjoy the evil of taking it from someone who worked for it. The ghetto thug at least is willing to put a bit of effort into stealing and killing, the university professor would like somebody else such as the Police and government to do it for it, so she can keep her little hands all clean as she comments how intelligent her farts are.
A thousand times yes except for 'none want to put in work'. I'm sure many would want to work but then they'd suddenly realize that the money they make is being taken from them by the "state" which would cause another cycle of revolts, violence, and death.
Once again... Snipers Hide and its denizens are ahead of the curve...
Has anyone else noticed that the term Communist has started to make a resurgence?
Progressive = Liberal = Democrat = Socialist = Leftist = COMMUNIST.
I see the term all over the place... haven't seen it so much since the '80s!
Love it!!!
Cheers,
Sirhr
Has anyone else noticed that the term Communist has started to make a resurgence?
Progressive = Liberal = Democrat = Socialist = Leftist = COMMUNIST.
I see the term all over the place... haven't seen it so much since the '80s!
Love it!!!
Cheers,
Sirhr
They are all supposed to be different terms, but today they are all one in the same
I dunno, when I call myself a liberal I'm pushing ideas of classical liberalism, not moral posturing or equality of outcome. It's like gender or autism, there's a spectrum that can go from one side to the other.
Just like "they" "redefined" standard capacity magazines to high capacity magazines, "they" have redefined liberalism away from its true meaning. The tea party/alt-right/evangelical groups have done the same to true Republicanism.
Just like "they" "redefined" standard capacity magazines to high capacity magazines, "they" have redefined liberalism away from its true meaning. The tea party/alt-right/evangelical groups have done the same to true Republicanism.
Personally I would not put Liberals and Leftists in the same category. We all like to shit on Liberals for whatever reason, but we tend to forget our Founding Fathers WERE Liberals and America was founded upon Liberalism. Granted Classic Liberalism from back then is quite different than the Progressive Liberalism we see nowadays. During the time when America was built it was quite easy to be Liberal all the while keeping wholesome Conservative values alive. Nowadays the mere thought of a Conservative Liberal is a major oxymoron. Getting back to why I feel Leftists and Liberals shouldn't be in the same category, I base my feeling on my own experience with Leftists, Liberals, and worst of all, SJWs. A true Liberal may disagree with you on certain things, but they are willing to listen and actually have a discussion over it. Leftists and SJWs have their opinions set in stone and believe no other opinions mater except their own and have no interest in having actual discussions. Leftists and SJWs will never learn that there's nothing to be gained from thinking they're always right all the time and everyone else is wrong. You don't learn things from being right, you learn them by being wrong. Hell, around the time when I first joined here I was still at that age where I thought I knew it all. It wasn't until I realized that I didn't know shit that I finally started learning.
In the end, discussions are a good thing. The more time we spend discussing things, the less time we spend fighting.
In one respect I agree with you... the good old-fashioned Tip O'Neill liberal would fight a good fight, try and advance their cause and at least recognize when the people were telling them 'no.'
Today's liberal is not cut from that cloth... they are indoctrinated useful idiots... running amok in ANTIFA masks and following a far-left playbook.
I had a lot of respect for guys like Tip O'Neill and Tom Daschle and even Jimmy Carter who I still think is a well-meaning twit with a toolbelt. They did want better conditions for workers... some safety nets for the downtrodden and lucky.. and a good national-defense backed up with law and order. By their definition... I'm a liberal. I think we are a rich country... and can afford to take care of the truly needy. That we should have a safety net for those who hit bad luck... that catastrophic healthcare for those who are in dire straits... is something we should do through charity, NGO's and, sometimes, government! But to steal a line from New Gingrich in the '90s. "Welfare should be a safety net, not a hammock."
That concept was over-run long ago by the far left of the Democratic party. In fact... the Far Left in America... who took over the traditional democratic Party... People like Schumer, Pelosi, Kennedy (mercifully deceased), Dean, Feinstein... too many to list. They hijacked the party... driven by Woodstock dreams of world Socialism... and funded by Comintern... which did not go away. It simply became the Green movement and re-branded itself "Progressive..."
Spade a spade, my friend.
Today's liberal is nothing that Websters would recognize... at least not Websters from 30 years ago.
Cheers,
Sirhr the dinosaur...
It isn't quite entirely representative of the intellectual squalor and philosophical miasma, although I *shudder* can see my Reeducation Camp barracks in the upper left quadrant of the photograph. Perhaps another 100' AGL might have taken it all in, but then it would have included the narrow band of slack-jawed, insipid peasantry living just in the pale of the castle walls. Nothing quite like a much-touted, near-Ivy League experience, where every afternoon brings a spray-fertilizer aroma rolling across the campus on the lake effect breeze. Hell, yes, that's for me.
Did that spray fertilizer smell like hemp or patchouli??? On the bright side... You freaked them out. And our FBI/pipehitter/kirpan dinner was good... Except for the poor exchange student who was in way over his head... Good times. Raw meat!
Cheers, sirhr
No, it smelled just like what it was, liquified waste products sprayed on the fields just about each and every day that I was there. The stench had a profound effect on the whole campus, such that it overpowered the patchouli and just about knocked the ivy off the walls. And yes, our fifth wheel, to whom I'll refer as Howard the Duck, was completely overwhelmed by the experience. There's nothing quite like the quivering face of a callow 21-year-old with rounded, cow eyes trying to formulate an ineffable question in a largely unknown language to a suddenly intimidating figure two feet from his elbow.
LOL that is the one for the win. You're clueless it was actually just the opposite. Tzarist Russia was extremely backwards country mostly farming society with big city centers where Nikolaj II and his predecesor Alexander III forced fucking headless reforms, managed to loose some wars (like complete destruction of the fleet) and managed to fuck up internal relations creating huge disparity (farmers ate but got their food forcibly redistributed into the cities where they tried to force some kind of industrialization - thats before WWI before you go all Stalin on me). While on the west especially Germans were very keen on fucking up Russia and managed to find enough idiots which were basically all jews to start a revolution by tapping into dissatisfied "industrial work force" in the cities. So intellectuals my ass!!! Anyone with a basic education and without major brain damage (in the form of jealosy) will see through socialism before you can say Marx. Farmers and ex royalty and most of army fought the reds and lost big time for a long time.
As to the original fucking WESTERN COMMUNISTS sent TO RUSSIA by WESTERN POWERS for all practical purposes most of them were Jews as were most of the top NKVD cadre. Stalin is demonized mostly because he was the first that started cleaning this shit house as he was more of a brute than na communist. As to the actions of NKVD they speak volumes on how they treated everyone including other expendable Jews.
What you in your blind rage cannot understand or won't is that devil does not come with the sign "I'm the fucking devil kill me before i do you" but it comes in complex camo pattern that is constantly changing and most of the time it comes with boobs, great ass and kisses and sweetness not with fire and guns... So if you're so dead set on nuking something i think US currently houses more reds than China or Russia do combined.
PS: And proper term is Globalists not some old chewed up term that basically means nothing anymore as Communists at least had a decency to kill you those fucks now want that you do that foryouself and at the same time thank them.
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