Feeling down, how about euthanasia as meds?

[pmclaine]

Just doesnt seem to be the human spirit we want to promote...

Girl, 17, who was sexually abused at 11 is legally allowed to die

Noa Pothoven from Arnhem, the Netherlands, died in her living room last Sunday. She had suffered from post-traumatic stress disorder, depression and anorexia.

www.dailymail.co.uk

I dont now how any of the involved can sleep.

 

[powdahound76]

Wow. Just wow.

I believe there is a book written about this starting to happen.
Looking forward to when this part is over. Its gonna get WAY worse.

 

[Blue Sky Country]

Even more important now is just who the fuck allowed the bill to be used in that fashion??? When it was first started, it was exclusively meant for terminally ill persons who had been suffering intolerable and incurable physical pain due to their ailments. Who the fuck expanded it into this clown show?

 

[powdahound76]

It was the plan all along. They just never told anyone.

 

[armorpl8chikn]

Lots of folks predicted this.
It'll happen here too.

I'm getting a bit desensitized to it all. Legal this, legal that, legal murder, legal suicide.
Before it all comes to an abrupt halt, and it will my friend oh make no mistake it will, it's gonna be Logan's Run and Soylent Green all wrapped up in a pretty package.

 

[Blue Sky Country]

It was the plan all along. They just never told anyone.

Buy more ammo. LOTS MORE.

Because forced "euthanasia" of certain people that the powers that be do not like will be the ultimate goal. The only thing is, by the time that happens, the ones really being "euthanized" ain't gonna be the victims. Hopefully a lot more folks gonna be ready to boogie. Unlike the people living under the Nazis and the Soviets...

 

[Maggot]

Ill play devil's advocate on this one.

She was a beautiful young woman and should have had so much to live for, but the effects of depression can be absolutely overwhelming. Ive dealt with them most of my life. If you havent you dont know what horror is. Its not like a Viet Cong, or Taliban you can see and fight, its insidious, its inside of you. Drugs, even prescribed ones, only dull the pain. It never stops. Fortunately, with age Ive dealt with mine relatively positively.

Bottom line is, who has the right to decide that for you? Its your life and really its the only thing you have that is absolutely yours. I think that every other option should be explored, and that at 17 you dont have enough life experience to make that choice, but I do support the 'RIGHT OF THE INDIVIDUAL' to make his or her own choice. No one else can know what you go through.

I do think that her rapist should have to join her.

Dont anyone go turning me in because personally, I have no intent to do that, Im just commenting on the story.

 

[M8541Reaper]

Who are we to decide if another person is allowed to end their life? Everyone has the right to choose how they live their life and they have to live/accept the consequences.

She explains why she wanted to do it and what her suffering entailed and no one, especially not anyone on here, has the right to judge her.

That’s what she wanted and I’m glad she was able to have some sort of control in her life. Good for her.

 

[M8541Reaper]

Also being that we are commenting random comments on this article, I guess I’ll mention that a tree fell in the forest yesterday. Time to [insert witty anti establishment phrase that signifies the labing of the molons without stepping on bootstrap snakes because this is exactly what happened after that one dude was denied entry into the arts and crafts daycare] because this is how it starts and we need to make sure to set our alarms so we are woke and not asleep in the hen’s rooster house crib castle for the start of #WokeAFSheep (TM pending).

 

[Mwalex]

As long as you can freely chose then you should be able to do with your life what you want. Mental illness and depression can be crippling and last for a lifetime. She decided to deal with her pain the best way for her. Was that the only option? For people looking from the outside the answer is no BUT for her the answer was yes.

There have been multiple threads on this board about posters and their critters. People on this board love their animals, try to give them the best life possible and will do anything to make sure they are healthy and happy and make sure they are not suffering. Why do we have an issue when that same compassion applies to a person? I AM NOT discussing "forced" euthanasia, only this case and cases like this.

 

[armorpl8chikn]

Also being that we are commenting random comments on this article, I guess I’ll mention that a tree fell in the forest yesterday. Time to [insert witty anti establishment phrase that signifies the labing of the molons without stepping on bootstrap snakes because this is exactly what happened after that one dude was denied entry into the arts and crafts daycare] because this is how it starts and we need to make sure to set our alarms so we are woke and not asleep in the hen’s rooster house crib castle for the start of #WokeAFSheep (TM pending).

Oh for fucks sake.

 

[Blue Sky Country]

As long as you can freely chose then you should be able to do with your life what you want. Mental illness and depression can be crippling and last for a lifetime. She decided to deal with her pain the best way for her. Was that the only option? For people looking from the outside the answer is no BUT for her the answer was yes.

There have been multiple threads on this board about posters and their critters. People on this board love their animals, try to give them the best life possible and will do anything to make sure they are healthy and happy and make sure they are not suffering. Why do we have an issue when that same compassion applies to a person? I AM NOT discussing "forced" euthanasia, only this case and cases like this.

I only wish that this poor girl could have requested that her rapist be brought in front of her, forced to get on his knees and apologize to her before the scumbag is dragged back outside, tied to a tree, given a .45 blast right to the intestines and left to die nice and slow. And to have the request actually be granted. In a perfect world, that would have been far more fitting. There is one person in this case that really should not be breathing oxygen anymore. It should not have been her. I understand her right to choose but it is an agonizing conclusion...

 

[brianf]

keeping my opinion out of it:

people curse big pharma for creating a self sufficient pill popping culture

whats better...letting this person kill themselves or quality of life/addiction to meds?

core questions

 

[MK20]

Buy more ammo. LOTS MORE.

Because forced "euthanasia" of certain people that the powers that be do not like will be the ultimate goal. The only thing is, by the time that happens, the ones really being "euthanized" ain't gonna be the victims. Hopefully a lot more folks gonna be ready to boogie. Unlike the people living under the Nazis and the Soviets...

It’s already happening. In the Netherlands you can make an “advanced directive” about when you want to die. Well, this one lady changed her mind and found out that life was worth living in spite of the pain of the disease she had. Her whole family had to hold her down while the doc killed her as she was pleading for her life. It was a news story a while ago.

Evil is coming again to this generation the likes of which we haven’t seen in about 80 years.
Fascism, socialism, Islam, euthanasia, both with and against your will, mass abortion (60,000,000), the complete murder of almost all Down Syndrome kids in Iceland before they are born, gun confiscation, massive debt, aggressive nations on the march from without, moral rot from within.

Keep your good friends close, buy more ammo, buy your kids a Bible and teach them some old fashioned morals, and let’s just do our best to be good folks so that when it all comes apart some of us remember what it means to truly be Americans.

 

[M8541Reaper]

Oh for fucks sake.

What? Are we not reading the same comments?

 

[Lapuapalooza]

Who are we to decide if another person is allowed to end their life? Everyone has the right to choose how they live their life and they have to live/accept the consequences.

She explains why she wanted to do it and what her suffering entailed and no one, especially not anyone on here, has the right to judge her.

That’s what she wanted and I’m glad she was able to have some sort of control in her life. Good for her.

It is supposed to be God’s choice when we leave this earth.

This is not judgement. This is a broken heart for a 17 year old girl.

 

[MK20]

@M8541Reaper , May I remind you that some things are indeed said over and over for a very good reason.
They may just happen to be timeless truths. Not all, but some.
Have a good day and take some time to enjoy something today.

 

[pmclaine]

As a strong libertarian the right of the individual to choose is non negotiable.

I dont think it needs to be celebrated or promoted.

 

[M8541Reaper]

It is supposed to be God’s choice when we leave this earth.

Unless the person isn’t religious, then it’s their decision.

Poor fuckin kid got dealt a shit hand but at least the law gave her the ability to gain some sort of control in her life.

 

[pmclaine]

It’s already happening. In the Netherlands you can make an “advanced directive” about when you want to die. Well, this one lady changed her mind and found out that life was worth living in spite of the pain of the disease she had. Her whole family had to hold her down while the doc killed her as she was pleading for her life. It was a news story a while ago.

Evil is coming again to this generation the likes of which we haven’t seen in about 80 years.
Fascism, socialism, Islam, euthanasia, both with and against your will, mass abortion (60,000,000), the complete murder of almost all Down Syndrome kids in Iceland before they are born, gun confiscation, massive debt, aggressive nations on the march from without, moral rot from within.

Keep your good friends close, buy more ammo, buy your kids a Bible and teach them some old fashioned morals, and let’s just do our best to be good folks so that when it all comes apart some of us remember what it means to truly be Americans.

I tell you what meeting someone with Downs is about the greatest part of that day.

Their seeming lack of any barriers and desire for friendship is great.

World would get along much better if we all had a touch of Downs.

 

[Blue Sky Country]

It’s already happening. In the Netherlands you can make an “advanced directive” about when you want to die. Well, this one lady changed her mind and found out that life was worth living in spite of the pain of the disease she had. Her whole family had to hold her down while the doc killed her as she was pleading for her life. It was a news story a while ago.

Evil is coming again to this generation the likes of which we haven’t seen in about 80 years.
Fascism, socialism, Islam, euthanasia, both with and against your will, mass abortion (60,000,000), the complete murder of almost all Down Syndrome kids in Iceland before they are born, gun confiscation, massive debt, aggressive nations on the march from without, moral rot from within.

Keep your good friends close, buy more ammo, buy your kids a Bible and teach them some old fashioned morals, and let’s just do our best to be good folks so that when it all comes apart some of us remember what it means to truly be Americans.

----------
Keep your good friends close, buy more ammo, buy your kids a Bible and teach them some old fashioned morals, and let’s just do our best to be good folks so that when it all comes apart some of us remember what it means to truly be Americans.
----------

Amen to that, man. Written perfectly.


----------
Well, this one lady changed her mind and found out that life was worth living in spite of the pain of the disease she had. Her whole family had to hold her down while the doc killed her as she was pleading for her life. It was a news story a while ago.
----------

What a greedy bunch of scumbag sonsofbitches...I guess a small, easily concealable fighting blade or a derringer style pistol is a good thing to invest in and carry with you at any and all times. If I was in that situation above, any fuckstain trying to 'hold me down' or bring out a needle is going to be given an instant dirt nap. Terminal illness sucks like all hell but it ain't gonna take much effort to slam several inches of cold steel through some fucker's chest cavity and twist it back and forth...

 

[M8541Reaper]

@M8541Reaper , May I remind you that some things are indeed said over and over for a very good reason.
They may just happen to be timeless truths. Not all, but some.
Have a good day and take some time to enjoy something today.

I get it man. What I don’t get is how it’s on every damn post. It’s like the weird homeless old guy at the end of the bar that keeps yelling random shit to people engaged in conversation. We get it, the sky is falling and I should have worn GORE-TEX boots, non-white pants, and underwear.

Thanks, enjoy your day as well.

 

[armorpl8chikn]

I get it man. What I don’t get is how it’s on every damn post. It’s like the weird homeless old guy at the end of the bar that keeps yelling random shit to people engaged in conversation. We get it, the sky is falling and I should have worn GORE-TEX boots, non-white pants, and underwear.

Thanks, enjoy your day as well.

I'd comment but I'm in a bar right now. I'll get back to you as soon as I find my shopping cart and get back to my box.
Now where the hell did I park that thing....

 

[Inifinty]

Unless the person isn’t religious, then it’s their decision.

Poor fuckin kid got dealt a shit hand but at least the law gave her the ability to gain some sort of control in her life.

Instead of enabling them in thier sickness to just give up we should be lifting them up and showing then how to carry thier pack to thier own capacity in the midst of the obstacles this world presents.

 

[diverdon]

It was the plan all along. They just never told anyone.

The plan is the same here, in America. God help us.

 

[Maggot]

It is supposed to be God’s choice when we leave this earth.

This is not judgement. This is a broken heart for a 17 year old girl.

Broken hearted indeed, but the God you speak of gave us 'Freewill'.

 

[Maggot]

Instead of enabling them in thier sickness to just give up we should be lifting them up and showing then how to carry thier pack to thier own capacity in the midst of the obstacles this world presents.

In an ideal world, yes, but this world is far from ideal.

They have been making some good progress with the use of psychoactives like psilocyben, MDMA, and others. LSD was used with great success until Timothy Leary fucked it up for everybody with his irresponsible bullshit.

 

[Inifinty]

Broken hearted indeed, but the God you speak of gave us 'Freewill'.

I’d argue that freewill does not make the wrong answer right. There is always a door open, sometimes out of view or unwanted but it is there should we choose to change our perspective.

There is no guarantee that all stones will be cleared from our paths though and we may have to work to break them up and push them out of the way. That is just reality.

There was a time where social services did real service to the downtrodden. It’s seems now it’s being increasingly weaponized against them. Those of us that care should no longer rely on our taxes to cover the gap, but get involved more directly to lift people up in our respective neighborhoods.

 

[Maggot]

1-I’d argue that freewill does not make the wrong answer right. There is always a door open, sometimes out of view or unwanted but it is there should we choose to change our perspective.



2- Those of us that care should no longer rely on our taxes to cover the gap, but get involved more directly to lift people up in our respective neighborhoods.

1-Who are you or anyone else to say it was a WRONG choice. thats arrogance, though I well agree there are often doors that can be opened (See my next post). Not always though.

2-Agreed. That should be the job of the 'Body of Christ' but the church today is a failed institution that does little more than parrot words they dont comprehend. There is no power in the churches thats why I wont set foot in one.

 

[Inifinty]

In an ideal world, yes, but this world is far from ideal.

They have been making some good progress with the use of psychoactives like psilocyben, MDMA, and others. LSD was used with great success until Timothy Leary fucked it up for everybody with his irresponsible bullshit.

We become what we intake. Pharmacia isn’t the long term answer. Better food is a start. Better mental food heals the soul. Starts by putting value in love for one another and less love on physical crap that rusts, weathers, and pines away.

 

[pmclaine]

Its a tough topic.

Id err to the side of more life rather than less life.

With all our instant cures we have today I wonder how much we have lost.

What if S Hawking decided to just quit when diagnosed. what if Einsteins parents decided on post birth abortion. What present Einstein will never be Einstein because he is medicated to mediocrity?

The flip side is all these people seriously pained or dysfunctional despite something available to help.

I guess the default code of two incompatible resolutions is individual choice.

I say that deeply personal decision should be kept deeply personal to prevent others following along without truly reflecting on the matter.

Someone saw that article today and wont be coming down to breakfast tomorrow because they were "inspired".

 

[Rthur]

17 year olds don't know shit.
As proven by the decision to kill herself.
World is full of people who've experienced hardships.
All this does is lessen the value of the lives of the living.
Selfish act and no consideration what this will do to those who love her.
R

 

[Inifinty]

1-Who are you or anyone else to say it was a WRONG choice. thats arrogance, though I well agree there are often doors that can be opened (See my next post). Not always though.

2-Agreed. That should be the job of the 'Body of Christ' but the church today is a failed institution that does little more than parrot words they dont comprehend. There is no power in the churches thats why I wont set foot in one.

Did anyone choose the cards they were dealt when born? When we don’t like our cards is the right answer to throw them back in the dealers face, quit, and sulk over into what we think is the corner of oblivion?

And we don’t need a Church house built by the hands of men to care for and tend to those around us.

 

[Maggot]

We become what we intake. Pharmacia isn’t the long term answer. Better food is a start. Better mental food heals the soul. Starts by putting value in love for one another and less love on physical crap that rusts, weathers, and pines away.

Well said, better food never hurt anyone. The garbage eaten today is a travesty. SuperSize me. ...right to obesity. Same for the mental food.

Im not suggesting psychoactives as 'long term' but do some reading. They are helping many vets deal with PTSD. The literal meaning of 'psychedelic' is mind loosening. Often trauma is buried so deeply in the psyche/subconscious it cant be reached by normal means. Some of the substances, in concert with traditional therapy, allow the control of the conscious mind to relax and the memories to float to the surface so they can be dealt with. "You shall know the Truth and the truth will set you free'.

 

[Maggot]

17 year olds don't know shit.
As proven by the decision to kill herself.
World is full of people who've experienced hardships.
All this does is lessen the value of the lives of the living.
Selfish act and no consideration what this will do to those who love her.
R

Other than your first line, youre wrong.

 

[pmclaine]

17 year olds don't know shit.
As proven by the decision to kill herself.
World is full of people who've experienced hardships.
All this does is lessen the value of the lives of the living.

R

Dude I found out that next year when my son turns 13 Dr wont be able to discuss some things with us, privileged law protected info between him and my kid.

The left wants 5 year olds making these decisions.

Its all about feelings not rational logic.

Still trying to figure how Dr plans to get me out of earshot - SCIF? Cone of Silence?

 

[Maggot]

Did anyone choose the cards they were dealt when born? When we don’t like our cards is the right answer to throw them back in the dealers face, quit, and sulk over into what we think is the corner of oblivion?

And we don’t need a Church house built by the hands of men to care for and tend to those around us.

That is just pure arrogance. What youre suggesting, taking away ones right to choose, is absolute tyranny.

 

[Maggot]

Dude I found out that next year when my son turns 13 Dr wont be able to discuss some things with us, privileged law protected info between him and my kid.

The left wants 5 year olds making these decisions.

Its all about feelings not rational logic.

Still trying to figure how Dr plans to get me out of earshot - SCIF? Cone of Silence?

Time for a new Dr.

 

[Inifinty]

That is just pure arrogance. What youre suggesting, taking away ones right to choose, is absolute tyranny.

Never said take away thier right to choose. Just said not our place to encourage and enable them to make the wrong choice.

 

[pmclaine]

We become what we intake. Pharmacia isn’t the long term answer. Better food is a start. Better mental food heals the soul. Starts by putting value in love for one another and less love on physical crap that rusts, weathers, and pines away.

“Let food be thy medicine and medicine be thy food.”
― Hippocrates

True 2,000 plus years ago, true today.

Everything we need to know about the world was written by the Greeks.

Read Aesop and you know exactly who the person is you are talking to - either an ant, fox, snake, grasshopper etc.

Our founding Fathers had this shit drilled in to their heads and they knew it all to great detail - read it, studied it and talked of it in the original languages - yet our present leaders are so smart.

 

[Rthur]

Dude I found out that next year when my son turns 13 Dr wont be able to discuss some things with us, privileged law protected info between him and my kid.

The left wants 5 year olds making these decisions.

Its all about feelings not rational logic.

Still trying to figure how Dr plans to get me out of earshot - SCIF? Cone of Silence?

No fucking way that'd fly with me...
Doc would be trying to find his consciousness.
Unfucking believable.

R

 

[Rthur]

Other than your first line, youre wrong.

How many kids do you have?

R

 

[pmclaine]

Time for a new Dr.

State law.

Most docs dreading the predicament this puts them in


Stand by for it........

5,4,3,2,1

"Time for a new state"

 

[Dewey7271]

This is just a crying shame imo.
I think of the immense quantity of stuff I didn’t know at 17. I also think of how relatively limited my list of things I actually did know was at that point.
I just do not see how a person that age is equipped to make an end of life decision. I just feel this opens a Pandora’s box of possibilities and many of those are bad.
While I understand some enlist and serve and are put into some very difficult decisions at this age, they have some training and support available. To make this type of decision alone at 17 is all bad.

 

[pmclaine]

This is just a crying shame imo.
I think of the immense quantity of stuff I didn’t know at 17. I also think of how relatively limited my list of things I actually did know was at that point.
I just do not see how a person that age is equipped to make an end of life decision. I just feel this opens a Pandora’s box of possibilities and many of those are bad.
While I understand some enlist and serve and are put into some very difficult decisions at this age, they have some training and support available. To make this type of decision alone at 17 is all bad.

The reason the state law Im dealing with is because the law as tailored was for "banning" conversion therapy of LBGTQXYLMNOP people.

Any one with the opinion such matters may be mental health related is prevented from offering counseling by law.

Its to be taken at face value from the person that they identify and are X.

So a thirteen year older wants to transition thats between them and the doc - no parents allowed.

 

[Maggot]

“Let food be thy medicine and medicine be thy food.”
― Hippocrates

True 2,000 plus years ago, true today.

Everything we need to know about the world was written by the Greeks.

Read Aesop and you know exactly who the person is you are talking to - either an ant, fox, snake, grasshopper etc.

Our founding Fathers had this shit drilled in to their heads and they knew it all to great detail - read it, studied it and talked of it in the original languages - yet our present leaders are so smart.

I studied the Greeks in great detail and 'generally' agree but they didnt have it all down pat. Homosexuality was practiced openly, though it had a somewhat different context....'Mentoring the youth'. Still makes my skin crawl.

If youre not familiar with the Eleusenian Mysteries, do a bit of reading. Most of the Greeks would sometime in their life go to the Temple at Eleuesis (The Temple to Demeter, the Goddess of the Grains) drink a special brew (likely) consisting of wine, magic mushrooms and the benign form of ergot. While under the influence they would behold the passion play of Persephone's capture by Hades and her return to the world of the living. Socrates, Plato, and Aristotle all went and said it something that every ones should do once in their lifetime.

https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct...-of-demeter/&usg=AOvVaw2brdmwvfe4sm66nOMUjB0e

 

[powdahound76]

The plan is the same here, in America. God help us.

Oh I am aware. They just started it in another country that was completely gone to the throws of amorality and communism lite (socialism). Then all the “genius and enlightened” residents of our republic want to be just like them.....

 

[pmclaine]

I studied the Greeks in great detail and 'generally' agree but they didnt have it all down pat. Homosexuality was practiced openly, though it had a somewhat different context....'Mentoring the youth'. Still makes my skin crawl.

If youre not familiar with the Eleusenian Mysteries, do a bit of reading. Most of the Greeks would sometime in their life go to the Temple at Eleuesis (The Temple to Demeter, the Goddess of the Grains) drink a special brew (likely) consisting of wine, magic mushrooms and the benign form of ergot. While under the influence they would behold the passion play of Persephone's capture by Hades and her return to the world of the living. Socrates, Plato, and Aristotle all went and said it something that every ones should do once in their lifetime.

https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=3&cad=rja&uact=8&ved=2ahUKEwiq6aWhmNDiAhXuY98KHc3wCUAQFjACegQIBRAB&url=https://www.ancient.eu/article/32/the-eleusinian-mysteries-the-rites-of-demeter/&usg=AOvVaw2brdmwvfe4sm66nOMUjB0e

Seems like the only place "being Greek" is being promoted is in our military.

"Dont worry man, I got you covered. Ill be in your rear."

 

[pmclaine]

I studied the Greeks in great detail and 'generally' agree but they didnt have it all down pat. Homosexuality was practiced openly, though it had a somewhat different context....'Mentoring the youth'. Still makes my skin crawl.

If youre not familiar with the Eleusenian Mysteries, do a bit of reading. Most of the Greeks would sometime in their life go to the Temple at Eleuesis (The Temple to Demeter, the Goddess of the Grains) drink a special brew (likely) consisting of wine, magic mushrooms and the benign form of ergot. While under the influence they would behold the passion play of Persephone's capture by Hades and her return to the world of the living. Socrates, Plato, and Aristotle all went and said it something that every ones should do once in their lifetime.

https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=3&cad=rja&uact=8&ved=2ahUKEwiq6aWhmNDiAhXuY98KHc3wCUAQFjACegQIBRAB&url=https://www.ancient.eu/article/32/the-eleusinian-mysteries-the-rites-of-demeter/&usg=AOvVaw2brdmwvfe4sm66nOMUjB0e

Also interesting that they think the "Oracle at Delphi" was influenced by subterranean gases that caused the hallucinations and wild visions.

Eh what harm can a little natural poison do?

A little ergot only resulted in a few innocent dead at Salem.

 

[cornhusker86]

People that suffer from long term depression have a distorted view of reality. They simply can't see an alternative to the worst case scenario. The longer it goes untreated, the worse it becomes until suicidal thoughts take over. This is an absolutely heart breaking situation. The fact that she felt death was her only option tells me that she didn't receive the type of care she desperately needed. I've been told by folks in the mental health field that as many as 1 in 6 people suffer from depression and go untreated.