First attempt to anneal, tried the stand them in water and hold them in my bare hand techniques. don't have any temprilaq. They are supposed to get pink around the neck? About how long does that take with a small handheld propane torch? How hot can the case get in my hand before I have to worry about heating the head too much? thanks!
How long to anneal each case?
- Thread starter targaflorio
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Re: How long to anneal each case?
Do a search on YouTube for annealing brass, that's where I learned from. I do it with a cordless drill to rotate the cases in the torch's flame with the brass being held by an appropriate size deep socket. I hold it in the flame until the neck turns blue on the outside. 7-8 seconds maybe. I do this over a bucket of water and when I see the blue I dump the brass in the water so induction through the brass doesnt allow the heat to reach the case head.
Edit: here's a helpful video - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kgD5D0Wzu-c&feature=youtube_gdata_player
I copied the link from my iPhone so if it doesn't play the title of the video is "Annealing brass in HD"
Do a search on YouTube for annealing brass, that's where I learned from. I do it with a cordless drill to rotate the cases in the torch's flame with the brass being held by an appropriate size deep socket. I hold it in the flame until the neck turns blue on the outside. 7-8 seconds maybe. I do this over a bucket of water and when I see the blue I dump the brass in the water so induction through the brass doesnt allow the heat to reach the case head.
Edit: here's a helpful video - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kgD5D0Wzu-c&feature=youtube_gdata_player
I copied the link from my iPhone so if it doesn't play the title of the video is "Annealing brass in HD"
Re: How long to anneal each case?
I did the same, do it in a low light room and put the rotating brass into the flame, when you see the neck turn like burgandy stop and cool. I don't believe glowing cherry red is good, you can over heat them. Practice is everything!
I did the same, do it in a low light room and put the rotating brass into the flame, when you see the neck turn like burgandy stop and cool. I don't believe glowing cherry red is good, you can over heat them. Practice is everything!
Re: How long to anneal each case?
I get my cases clean on the outside. Not a single trace of gunk on the outside.
I use one of those little case holder tools sold by Hornady that sits in the drill.
I use the very outside of the INNER blue flame and let it just touch the neck of the case. I spin the case with the drill and watch very carefully.
You will actually see the surface of the brass begin to change color slightly and creep its way down the case as it heats. Once the color change creeps its was past the shoulder I stop and dump the cases into a metal container. No need to dump into water.
The color change, I would describe as a change from the golden brass color, to a silvery/gray color. Once the cases are dump and allowed to cool this color change exhibits signs of blues and red/gold.
Does this make sense?
It can take a fair amount of sacrificial case annealing until you start to see the signs. Once you do it becomes plainly obvious what to look for... but this may take a few tries before your notice the subtle changes.
I get my cases clean on the outside. Not a single trace of gunk on the outside.
I use one of those little case holder tools sold by Hornady that sits in the drill.
I use the very outside of the INNER blue flame and let it just touch the neck of the case. I spin the case with the drill and watch very carefully.
You will actually see the surface of the brass begin to change color slightly and creep its way down the case as it heats. Once the color change creeps its was past the shoulder I stop and dump the cases into a metal container. No need to dump into water.
The color change, I would describe as a change from the golden brass color, to a silvery/gray color. Once the cases are dump and allowed to cool this color change exhibits signs of blues and red/gold.
Does this make sense?
It can take a fair amount of sacrificial case annealing until you start to see the signs. Once you do it becomes plainly obvious what to look for... but this may take a few tries before your notice the subtle changes.
Re: How long to anneal each case?
I would advise you to get something to indicate temp. as not all brass will do a distinct color change on you.
If you anneal for not long enough, you do pretty much nothing and your split necks and inconsistant neck tension will continue.
If you anneal for too long (any kind of glowing, reguardless of how faint) and your brass is going to be too soft.
Read this article a few times over, you can get a benchtop annealer for a few hundred $, and it will pay for itself in a year or 2 when you on you 20th+ load on your cases
www.6mmbr.com/annealing.html
I would advise you to get something to indicate temp. as not all brass will do a distinct color change on you.
If you anneal for not long enough, you do pretty much nothing and your split necks and inconsistant neck tension will continue.
If you anneal for too long (any kind of glowing, reguardless of how faint) and your brass is going to be too soft.
Read this article a few times over, you can get a benchtop annealer for a few hundred $, and it will pay for itself in a year or 2 when you on you 20th+ load on your cases
www.6mmbr.com/annealing.html
Re: How long to anneal each case?
I saw a bunch of videos on youtube. Thanks for the gouge. I'm thinking the desktop machines will be much more consistent than a handheld socket and electric drill combo. Biggest variation I saw in recommendations was in temp. From 400 degrees F to 750 degrees F. Of course, if I anneal, I will have to start neck turning... Yikes!
I saw a bunch of videos on youtube. Thanks for the gouge. I'm thinking the desktop machines will be much more consistent than a handheld socket and electric drill combo. Biggest variation I saw in recommendations was in temp. From 400 degrees F to 750 degrees F. Of course, if I anneal, I will have to start neck turning... Yikes!
Re: How long to anneal each case?
Yeah, annealing is a MUST. You can't maintain accuracy unless you do it.
It's a touchy feely process of learning and, you already have some good advice here. I also use the Hornady tool that fits on a drill but, you could probably just use an appropriately sized socket and achieve the same result.
I usually make the blue flame about 1" long, turn the case and get it about 1/8" from the case neck and, watch for the color change.... usually takes about 6-7 seconds then I drop the cases on a wet towel.
The only other thing I'd add is, don't be scared to anneal your cases. If you don't overheat the head of the case, there is no danger. It's possible to get the neck too soft but, that won't affect the ability of the case to do it's job. If you overheat a neck, you can feel it in the seating process.
Anyway, it's not that hard and, if you're not already annealing, you should just bite the bullet, so to speak and, just learn how.
Yeah, annealing is a MUST. You can't maintain accuracy unless you do it.
It's a touchy feely process of learning and, you already have some good advice here. I also use the Hornady tool that fits on a drill but, you could probably just use an appropriately sized socket and achieve the same result.
I usually make the blue flame about 1" long, turn the case and get it about 1/8" from the case neck and, watch for the color change.... usually takes about 6-7 seconds then I drop the cases on a wet towel.
The only other thing I'd add is, don't be scared to anneal your cases. If you don't overheat the head of the case, there is no danger. It's possible to get the neck too soft but, that won't affect the ability of the case to do it's job. If you overheat a neck, you can feel it in the seating process.
Anyway, it's not that hard and, if you're not already annealing, you should just bite the bullet, so to speak and, just learn how.
Re: How long to anneal each case?
My method, which works great for 308, is to hold the casehead between my bare fingertips, and slowly rotate the case for 1 revolution.
The "right" time to stop is the instant before the casehead gets uncomfortable to hold onto. My cases go into a stainless steel bowl, and NOT into water. The water is NOT needed, and only serves to complicate things, because you now have to dry cases.
My $0.02
My method, which works great for 308, is to hold the casehead between my bare fingertips, and slowly rotate the case for 1 revolution.
The "right" time to stop is the instant before the casehead gets uncomfortable to hold onto. My cases go into a stainless steel bowl, and NOT into water. The water is NOT needed, and only serves to complicate things, because you now have to dry cases.
My $0.02
Re: How long to anneal each case?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: turbo54</div><div class="ubbcode-body">My method, which works great for 308, is to hold the casehead between my bare fingertips, and slowly rotate the case for 1 revolution.
The "right" time to stop is the instant before the casehead gets uncomfortable to hold onto. My cases go into a stainless steel bowl, and NOT into water. The water is NOT needed, and only serves to complicate things, because you now have to dry cases.
My $0.02</div></div> Got it. And do you aim the flame right below where the shoulder meets the neck?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: turbo54</div><div class="ubbcode-body">My method, which works great for 308, is to hold the casehead between my bare fingertips, and slowly rotate the case for 1 revolution.
The "right" time to stop is the instant before the casehead gets uncomfortable to hold onto. My cases go into a stainless steel bowl, and NOT into water. The water is NOT needed, and only serves to complicate things, because you now have to dry cases.
My $0.02</div></div> Got it. And do you aim the flame right below where the shoulder meets the neck?
Re: How long to anneal each case?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: targaflorio</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I saw a bunch of videos on youtube. Thanks for the gouge</div></div>
If you mean me it wasn't a gouge or a "Do a search n00b!" like we used to see on every fuckin' post around here. I just figured you hadn't seen the particular shade of blue that comes with annealing since you asked if the neck should turn pink(I assume you meant glowing hot), and that one video I linked to shows it pretty clear. Seems like you've got the info you needed, and you may not have meant me, I just wanted to clarify the intent of my post, sorry if it came across wrong.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: targaflorio</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I saw a bunch of videos on youtube. Thanks for the gouge</div></div>
If you mean me it wasn't a gouge or a "Do a search n00b!" like we used to see on every fuckin' post around here. I just figured you hadn't seen the particular shade of blue that comes with annealing since you asked if the neck should turn pink(I assume you meant glowing hot), and that one video I linked to shows it pretty clear. Seems like you've got the info you needed, and you may not have meant me, I just wanted to clarify the intent of my post, sorry if it came across wrong.
Re: How long to anneal each case?
Watch the videos on the automated annealers.. count how long they are in the flame. Now do this with a drill or by hand while turning. As long as the temps of the flames are the same.. so should the time... approx to brass being done (some thinner.. some thicker).
Watch the videos on the automated annealers.. count how long they are in the flame. Now do this with a drill or by hand while turning. As long as the temps of the flames are the same.. so should the time... approx to brass being done (some thinner.. some thicker).
Re: How long to anneal each case?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: vman</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I get my cases clean on the outside. Not a single trace of gunk on the outside.
I use one of those little case holder tools sold by Hornady that sits in the drill.
I use the very outside of the INNER blue flame and let it just touch the neck of the case. I spin the case with the drill and watch very carefully.
You will actually see the surface of the brass begin to change color slightly and creep its way down the case as it heats. Once the color change creeps its was past the shoulder I stop and dump the cases into a metal container. No need to dump into water.
The color change, I would describe as a change from the golden brass color, to a silvery/gray color. Once the cases are dump and allowed to cool this color change exhibits signs of blues and red/gold.
Does this make sense?
It can take a fair amount of sacrificial case annealing until you start to see the signs. Once you do it becomes plainly obvious what to look for... but this may take a few tries before your notice the subtle changes. </div></div>
You NAILED it, isn't rocket science. Only folks like Stevie Wonder will have a problem following that.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: vman</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I get my cases clean on the outside. Not a single trace of gunk on the outside.
I use one of those little case holder tools sold by Hornady that sits in the drill.
I use the very outside of the INNER blue flame and let it just touch the neck of the case. I spin the case with the drill and watch very carefully.
You will actually see the surface of the brass begin to change color slightly and creep its way down the case as it heats. Once the color change creeps its was past the shoulder I stop and dump the cases into a metal container. No need to dump into water.
The color change, I would describe as a change from the golden brass color, to a silvery/gray color. Once the cases are dump and allowed to cool this color change exhibits signs of blues and red/gold.
Does this make sense?
It can take a fair amount of sacrificial case annealing until you start to see the signs. Once you do it becomes plainly obvious what to look for... but this may take a few tries before your notice the subtle changes. </div></div>
You NAILED it, isn't rocket science. Only folks like Stevie Wonder will have a problem following that.
Re: How long to anneal each case?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: longrange30</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Do you HAVE to turn the necks if you anneal? </div></div>
Heavens no!
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: longrange30</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Do you HAVE to turn the necks if you anneal? </div></div>
Heavens no!
Re: How long to anneal each case?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: targaflorio</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: turbo54</div><div class="ubbcode-body">My method, which works great for 308, is to hold the casehead between my bare fingertips, and slowly rotate the case for 1 revolution.
The "right" time to stop is the instant before the casehead gets uncomfortable to hold onto. My cases go into a stainless steel bowl, and NOT into water. The water is NOT needed, and only serves to complicate things, because you now have to dry cases.
My $0.02</div></div> Got it. And do you aim the flame right below where the shoulder meets the neck? </div></div>
The point of the blue cone is on the axial centerline of the case, andon the shoulder itself.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: targaflorio</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: turbo54</div><div class="ubbcode-body">My method, which works great for 308, is to hold the casehead between my bare fingertips, and slowly rotate the case for 1 revolution.
The "right" time to stop is the instant before the casehead gets uncomfortable to hold onto. My cases go into a stainless steel bowl, and NOT into water. The water is NOT needed, and only serves to complicate things, because you now have to dry cases.
My $0.02</div></div> Got it. And do you aim the flame right below where the shoulder meets the neck? </div></div>
The point of the blue cone is on the axial centerline of the case, andon the shoulder itself.
Re: How long to anneal each case?
http://www.bench-source.com/id81.html
I strongly recommend the annealer in the link above. With the bench source machine you can do 200 pieces in 15-17 minutes.
http://www.bench-source.com/id81.html
I strongly recommend the annealer in the link above. With the bench source machine you can do 200 pieces in 15-17 minutes.
Re: How long to anneal each case?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: RyeDaddy</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: targaflorio</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I saw a bunch of videos on youtube. Thanks for the gouge</div></div>
If you mean me it wasn't a gouge or a "Do a search n00b!" like we used to see on every fuckin' post around here. I just figured you hadn't seen the particular shade of blue that comes with annealing since you asked if the neck should turn pink(I assume you meant glowing hot), and that one video I linked to shows it pretty clear. Seems like you've got the info you needed, and you may not have meant me, I just wanted to clarify the intent of my post, sorry if it came across wrong. </div></div>RyeDaddy: I was being sincere. Gouge is a navy term meaning good info not necessarily easy to find. I tried both the handheld and rotating the case in a socket on a drill method. Did it outside at dusk, about 7 seconds and the neck started turning orange and the case head got uncomfortable, color change looked right. Is there anyway to check the success or failure of a good annnealing job?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: RyeDaddy</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: targaflorio</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I saw a bunch of videos on youtube. Thanks for the gouge</div></div>
If you mean me it wasn't a gouge or a "Do a search n00b!" like we used to see on every fuckin' post around here. I just figured you hadn't seen the particular shade of blue that comes with annealing since you asked if the neck should turn pink(I assume you meant glowing hot), and that one video I linked to shows it pretty clear. Seems like you've got the info you needed, and you may not have meant me, I just wanted to clarify the intent of my post, sorry if it came across wrong. </div></div>RyeDaddy: I was being sincere. Gouge is a navy term meaning good info not necessarily easy to find. I tried both the handheld and rotating the case in a socket on a drill method. Did it outside at dusk, about 7 seconds and the neck started turning orange and the case head got uncomfortable, color change looked right. Is there anyway to check the success or failure of a good annnealing job?
Re: How long to anneal each case?
You can buy a temp sensitive annealing past that melts when the case gets to the correct temp which will make the whole process more consistent the Hornady annealing kit supplies a bottle of the paste for this reason
You can buy a temp sensitive annealing past that melts when the case gets to the correct temp which will make the whole process more consistent the Hornady annealing kit supplies a bottle of the paste for this reason
Re: How long to anneal each case?
http://coppercreekammo.com/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=33&products_id=96
Problem solved....
http://coppercreekammo.com/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=33&products_id=96
Problem solved....
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