You're suggesting a military trained police officer is a better grade of applicant? How so?
- Thread starter 7.62willdo
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So what are you doing about it?
Are you running for election to stop this corruption?
Are you doing anything besides bitching on a forum?
Are you actively seeking to defund your local police so they can't commit these heinous, hypothetical crimes?
Let’s take Portland Oregon for example, surely there must be some good cops on the force, yet they stand by as good people are hurt and property of good people is damaged and destroyed all because their masters wish it……..but they don’t hesitate to jump in and arrest a proud boy or “far right winger” when their masters snap their fingers……
they will always follow orders to get that next paycheck so little sally can have braces or momma can have a new car.
history bears this out……….
they will always follow orders to get that next paycheck so little sally can have braces or momma can have a new car.
history bears this out……….
This^^^
Born/raised in NY. Moved to NC about eight years ago. NYPD, SCPD and NCPD were pretty disgusting. Their collective bargaining essentially amounted to mob style extortion from the public, with some officers making $200k+ per year with a 50% pension after 20 something years. In my experience, many were bullies, criminals and assholes to boot. Ever ask a cop for subway directions in Manhattan? Odds are the response was “do I look like a fuckin’ map?”
In NC I offer to buy officer lunch or coffee when the opportunity presents itself. They’re a totally different breed and I’m genuinely grateful for what they do. Moving was a real eye opener. If you’re one of the good ones, thanks and keep doing what you’re doing.
We already have the answer to that via mask mandates. No mask…told to leave… cause an issue and arrested for trespassing. Vaccination mandate looks to be heading done the road to bring upheld.
Aside from all the arguments are there any points in US history you can point to that shows a branch of enforcement that stood up and refused to enforce laws passed by government?
Now I get an individual officer can choose not to write a ticket or make and arrest on an individual basis. Just like a prosecutor can choose not to charge and prosecute someone. I’m talking wholesale refusal for what is “right”. Keep in mind “ right “ is subjective.
Now look back through history and look for instances where enforcement branches clearly abused people’s right. Not as individuals but on a wholesale basis.
Now look at more current events and decided which direction they are trending.
One last question/statement. At some point even if there are “good” people on the other side of the line they will not be judged as individuals rather they will be assumed to be “ guilt by association “ or complicit in them.
Maybe I’m looking at it all wrong.
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If youre not doing these things, youre not allowed to bitch? Im pretty sure that the last two years have shown us the power of words and bitching.
The problem I have with this is that it is so corrupt and skewed in one direction that there is no longer checks and balances left.
Do you think, on average, the billionaire and the working man are equally treated by courts, laws or the government or do we have a multi-tiered system based on who you know, what party you are in and how much money you have?
Btw,
This is an interesting discussion/debate.
I hope it’s not deleted and no one gets banned.
IMO, it’s worthwhile to have.
This is an interesting discussion/debate.
I hope it’s not deleted and no one gets banned.
IMO, it’s worthwhile to have.
Bitching on a niche forum has never achieved anything.
I began to look at LE in a different light when I was almost shot and treated like a criminal on the side of the road for an hour all for just handing over my CHL with my drivers license.
I was stopped for speeding, got me for 59 in a 45. I had stopped at a stop sign and crossed a main road and on the other side of this road the speed limit on the road I was traveling dropped from 65 to 45. Absent minded I was rowing through the gears (man trans) and hit resume on the cruise which was set to 65. Just about the time I hit the button I saw the 45mph sign. I tapped the brakes and was coasting my way down to the 45mph limit when an unrecognizable white car came around the curve. Turns out it was a local deputy which was just pointing for me to pull over when I went by him. So I pulled over and down in the ditch because it was a narrow two lane with no shoulder.
Sheriff pulls up behind me, lights flashing, gets out and walks up to the truck, hand on his weapon, I had rolled down both windows on the driver's side and my wrists were resting on the steering wheel, fingers spread wide awaiting further instructions.
He asked for the usual, DL and insurance, so I produced my DL with my CHL and insurance card. At this point he's pretty calm and then he asked if I was carrying today. I told him not on my person but in a soft case in the map pocket in the driver's door I had a Taurus judge. Now it gets exciting. The dude freaks, jumps a good six feet backwards out into the road and clears leather. If a car had been coming he'd have gotten himself smoked right there. Then he begins shouting for me to show him my hands which had gone back to there spread eagle fashion on the steering wheel in plain view. Then he begins repeatedly telling me to keep my hands on the wheel and that he is going to open my door. His gun is back in his holster at this point but his hand was still on it. He opens the door, tucks the pistol down into the case and grabs it with his thumb and index finger like it's got poison on it or something and removes it from my truck, shuts the door and heads back to his car. An hour later I get my gun back zipped up in the case separate from the ammunition and a speech on how he had unloaded it not only for his safety but my own and a citation for 59 in a 45.
My wife worked for a well known gas station chain here in Texas usually on the morning shift. When I worked nights I would stop by and see her on my way home. Local and state LEO's love to frequent this place in the mornings for coffee. I had some interesting conversations with several of them and while they weren't all bad there was more than a couple bad apples in the bunch. The thing that struck me was that the good cops never would confront the ones of questionable character. Usually they just got quiet, would kind of shuffle around a little bit or maybe try to change the topic.
I'm good friends with my LGS owner and he had an interesting convo with a local LEO a while back. He and the local LEO were discussing gun confiscation. The LEO informed him that if the order came down to take the guns he was going to follow them because, in his own words, "they were the ones signing his check"
The LGS owner informed him that if that was the case and the day was to come, if he saw him coming, one of them was going to die.
I'll be generous and say that it's probably 60/40 when it comes to who will follow orders and who will quit or be fired before turning on their oaths. Probably more like 80/20.
I was stopped for speeding, got me for 59 in a 45. I had stopped at a stop sign and crossed a main road and on the other side of this road the speed limit on the road I was traveling dropped from 65 to 45. Absent minded I was rowing through the gears (man trans) and hit resume on the cruise which was set to 65. Just about the time I hit the button I saw the 45mph sign. I tapped the brakes and was coasting my way down to the 45mph limit when an unrecognizable white car came around the curve. Turns out it was a local deputy which was just pointing for me to pull over when I went by him. So I pulled over and down in the ditch because it was a narrow two lane with no shoulder.
Sheriff pulls up behind me, lights flashing, gets out and walks up to the truck, hand on his weapon, I had rolled down both windows on the driver's side and my wrists were resting on the steering wheel, fingers spread wide awaiting further instructions.
He asked for the usual, DL and insurance, so I produced my DL with my CHL and insurance card. At this point he's pretty calm and then he asked if I was carrying today. I told him not on my person but in a soft case in the map pocket in the driver's door I had a Taurus judge. Now it gets exciting. The dude freaks, jumps a good six feet backwards out into the road and clears leather. If a car had been coming he'd have gotten himself smoked right there. Then he begins shouting for me to show him my hands which had gone back to there spread eagle fashion on the steering wheel in plain view. Then he begins repeatedly telling me to keep my hands on the wheel and that he is going to open my door. His gun is back in his holster at this point but his hand was still on it. He opens the door, tucks the pistol down into the case and grabs it with his thumb and index finger like it's got poison on it or something and removes it from my truck, shuts the door and heads back to his car. An hour later I get my gun back zipped up in the case separate from the ammunition and a speech on how he had unloaded it not only for his safety but my own and a citation for 59 in a 45.
My wife worked for a well known gas station chain here in Texas usually on the morning shift. When I worked nights I would stop by and see her on my way home. Local and state LEO's love to frequent this place in the mornings for coffee. I had some interesting conversations with several of them and while they weren't all bad there was more than a couple bad apples in the bunch. The thing that struck me was that the good cops never would confront the ones of questionable character. Usually they just got quiet, would kind of shuffle around a little bit or maybe try to change the topic.
I'm good friends with my LGS owner and he had an interesting convo with a local LEO a while back. He and the local LEO were discussing gun confiscation. The LEO informed him that if the order came down to take the guns he was going to follow them because, in his own words, "they were the ones signing his check"
The LGS owner informed him that if that was the case and the day was to come, if he saw him coming, one of them was going to die.
I'll be generous and say that it's probably 60/40 when it comes to who will follow orders and who will quit or be fired before turning on their oaths. Probably more like 80/20.
They were the ones signing my pay check = I was just following orders….
didn’t work at Nuremberg and it didn’t work at My Lai………
did work at ruby ridge and did work at Waco……..
so it doesnt work for military but does work for police…….
I believe you 80/20 is being generous.
didn’t work at Nuremberg and it didn’t work at My Lai………
did work at ruby ridge and did work at Waco……..
so it doesnt work for military but does work for police…….
I believe you 80/20 is being generous.
Since permits were issued in FL (87-88?), I've always handed mine over when stopped. To date, I haven't been hassled or received a citation. Usually a verbal warning, sometimes written and sometimes questions about what I'm carrying. This is limited to the SE and I've never had a chance to test in a large city...not sure I would unless the state has a must notify law.
My CHL instructor when I got mine said it wasn't required but it was usually a good idea to hand it over with the DL. He said it usually put the officers at ease to know up front. I could see that and I always did it. And I was usually just asked where I was carrying it, what it was and it usually turned into a gun geek conversation. Not that time though. Now I don't volunteer any info.
I agree as far as the inequality, but not that it is one sided. I see the same shameful behavior from both parties. Yet when it is time to vote, we electing highly corrupt politicians believing every thing they are accused of is BS and everything they say about the other side is true. We have been fools, intelligent fools, but we changed the political landscape with our votes.
Getting on soap box for all to hear...
The people who stopped thinking for themselves, who don't understand the issues, who let biased non-experts tell them what to believe about the issues and who blindly attack and defend this propaganda are at fault.There are just as many of them who vote Republican as vote Democrat.
Long ago we sat on our porches with neighbors of varied opinions and debated, we tested our beliefs and evolved. We stood together, even when we voted apart.
Social Media is being used by foreign powers to create distrust in our political system and divide our great nation. If you don't believe each side is being fed messaging to create discourse, you should do some seriously research before jumping on the next bus to a protest.
The biggest change I see in our politics is, politicians willing to embrace propaganda that they know to be untrue and harmful to the United States to get elected.
I wasn’t referring to a democratic or republican skew. More of a conservative/traditional/libertarian view vs a liberal/progressive/all must accept even if it intrudes on your values/morales. Not matter the costs view.
The powers at play are much bigger than our old two party system of the days of old.
Your current political parties ( in general ) are both going the same direction. One is just hitting the gas harder.
The whole thing is corrupt.
My very best firend is a cop. A Sergeant. To me he is family. My brother. He is on my trusts and if anything happens to me, he takes care of things local for my daughter in Maine. We text every day.
I am also a civil libertarian. I could lie and say that I don’t see cops as the greatest threat to civil liberties. That said I have at least 15 ride-alongs with cops and I do support them. There are many good ones and my best friend is one.
Recently, the shooting of the hero John Hurley has shaken me. The juxtaposition of how the APD Officer killed was canonized verses the guy that APD said “[is a hero that saved countless lives]” was a stark contrast. APD had processions and wore black bands for the officer. None for John.
The transparency of the cop‘s fatal shooting came within days. To my knowledge there has been no real information or video released about the wrongful shooting of John Hurley by APD.
There were folks who criticized John for getting involved. For his lack of training. Of the three respondents to the shooter, only one was unpaid, and untrained. That was John. Out of the three, he was the one who shot the correct person and immediately stopped the threat to the public.
My biggest gripe is the lack of transparency. Shit happens and the shooting of John may well have to be chocked up to a variety of unfortunate realities.
That said, WE ALL KNOW, that if a civilian had shot John by mistake, we would likely have most of what APD knows and that person would likely have been charged in many jurisdictions.
I support cops. But I am also really torn........
I am also a civil libertarian. I could lie and say that I don’t see cops as the greatest threat to civil liberties. That said I have at least 15 ride-alongs with cops and I do support them. There are many good ones and my best friend is one.
Recently, the shooting of the hero John Hurley has shaken me. The juxtaposition of how the APD Officer killed was canonized verses the guy that APD said “[is a hero that saved countless lives]” was a stark contrast. APD had processions and wore black bands for the officer. None for John.
The transparency of the cop‘s fatal shooting came within days. To my knowledge there has been no real information or video released about the wrongful shooting of John Hurley by APD.
There were folks who criticized John for getting involved. For his lack of training. Of the three respondents to the shooter, only one was unpaid, and untrained. That was John. Out of the three, he was the one who shot the correct person and immediately stopped the threat to the public.
My biggest gripe is the lack of transparency. Shit happens and the shooting of John may well have to be chocked up to a variety of unfortunate realities.
That said, WE ALL KNOW, that if a civilian had shot John by mistake, we would likely have most of what APD knows and that person would likely have been charged in many jurisdictions.
I support cops. But I am also really torn........
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Thats exactly what they do.
I was going to say 85/15. The thought of working at Home Depot or becoming an OTR trucker to keep your self respect would be a stretch for many.
My WWI veteran grandfather said, "Dogs fight in the pack, but are one against the wolf."
This is a great summary of the conversation... Are all cops bad? No. Are all cops good? No. We get who we vote for and the cops will generally reflect that as well. The longer this goes on, the more I think we are a generation (10-15 years) away from something actually happening unless we keep having elections like 2020. There are still enough "good cops" to keep people thinking their government truly represents them in many ways.
"The change was in the minds of the people, and this was effected, from 1760 to 1775, on the course of fifteen years before a drop of blood was drawn at Lexington." - John Adams
I personally think 2020 was our 1760.
In Texas, it is required, that, if carrying and you have a LTC, you MUST inform the Officer that you are armed.
Oddly enough, Texas has allowed the concealed carry of firearms in your vehicle for years, you are not mandated to tell the officer if you are not licensed, but are carrying in your car. Constitutional carry is going to be another issue, they screwed the pooch when they wrote that statute
FWIW, when I learn someone is carrying, I have an absolute rule that I apply. I tell them "thanks for letting me know, if you don't show me yours, I won't show you mine."
Hasn't been an issue yet.
While travelling on 71 west of Austin I came over a blind hill and a DPS had a car pulled over on the right shoulder. There was no way for me to move over into the passing lane. He caught up and pulled me over and a sawed-off Banty rooster ginger got out and informed me I was supposed to move to the inside lane. I explained to him I couldn't.
As I handed him my license I also informed him I had a .45 in the truck to which he responded "Is it loaded?" I said yes (I should have told him 'Of course. Isn't yours?') He then informed me that the 'clip' and ammunition were supposed to be stored in a separate location.
There happened to be second unit that had rolled up behind his. I sighed and rubbed my eyes wearily and then looked up and told him 'Not here in Texas. Can you go check with that other trooper what the law is?'
He told me to 'Sit tight' and he'd be right back. After a brief discussion with the other officer and running me for warrants he returned and handed me license back and told me to have a nice day.
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I once asked a captain running a citizens police academy class (mostly an informational experience) if I should volunteer my CCW possession. His answer was "I treat everyone I approach as if they may be armed."
I am surprised by some of the statements here.
No, you don't get what you voted for. Only a couple of those elected have stood up against the party and the money. You can read her tweets when she's not banned from twitfuck. You get someone that starts out of the box as a good candidate. Then they get to DC and the party explains how things are going to be. Money beyond their dreams is placed before them, power and other materialistic junkets are laid out before them. So, no you don't get what you voted for. Take a good hard look at the pirate from Texas, the bartender from New York and the Somali tramp that married her brother. They couldn't afford an apartment in DC and now they are worth millions of dollars.
Good cop bad cop?
Where are you going? Where did you come from? Do you have anything in your car I should know about? Can I search your car? Do you know why I pulled you over? And a few others. Go ahead and tell them none of your business and see what happens. We are going to have a drug dog walk around your car if you don't let us search. Tell them fine and roll up your windows and lock your door and see what happens.
No, you don't get what you voted for. Only a couple of those elected have stood up against the party and the money. You can read her tweets when she's not banned from twitfuck. You get someone that starts out of the box as a good candidate. Then they get to DC and the party explains how things are going to be. Money beyond their dreams is placed before them, power and other materialistic junkets are laid out before them. So, no you don't get what you voted for. Take a good hard look at the pirate from Texas, the bartender from New York and the Somali tramp that married her brother. They couldn't afford an apartment in DC and now they are worth millions of dollars.
Good cop bad cop?
Where are you going? Where did you come from? Do you have anything in your car I should know about? Can I search your car? Do you know why I pulled you over? And a few others. Go ahead and tell them none of your business and see what happens. We are going to have a drug dog walk around your car if you don't let us search. Tell them fine and roll up your windows and lock your door and see what happens.
Moa
I am as well, and agree!! Well stated!
When those cops are still copping when blue igloo time hits, all bets are off.
I'm not gonna walk. For 10 years I've been arresting pedophiles and rescuing child victims and I plan to do it another 10 years. But to 7.62willdo, I'm a bad cop that needs to quit apparently. You're right, we don't need any cops doing the kind of work I do, huh?
7.62Willdo don't know talking good like me and you, so his vocabulistics is limited to 'chirp' and 'chirp' and 'chirp. ' Exclusively, in that order."
People hate child pedo’s. And rightfully so.
We ALL agree.
However, what if a dude was pulled over off the side of a highway to take a piss and someone who drove by kid see’s this dudes pee pee, and tells their parents, who then put a complaint in to your department.
THEN to make things worst the fathers brother is a state senator who calls the head of your department and makes some threats to make a big deal about this.
So you get assigned a case to go arrest a “predator offender.” Knowing the circumstances, do you step down or do you “keep doing your job for 10 years” arresting “pedophiles.”
Things aren’t always black and white, and if you don’t think my example hasn’t happened more than once…
…you’re the problem.
There’s a reason why even cops say not to talk to cops. Law is not about who’s right or wrong, or WHO’s right or wrong. It’s about what narrative sticks. Some people get justice, some people get fucked by the long blue dick of the law.
Wow, where do you get these off the wall, preposterous hypotheticals from?
LOL I have so much discretion in my cases we would never work that nor would a prosecutor here take a case like that. Nice try looping us all in to some dumb shit like that....
Skipping all the extreme examples, we live in one of the safest times and places in all of history because of this imperfect system. And, because of these people willing to confront the worst of humanity. I have known a lot of LE and as a whole, they are exceptionally good people, trying to make the world better, despite a system easily exploited by criminals.
I respect anyone who believes strong enough about something to quite their career over it.
But, I was a soldier, and I know how often my brothers went afield injured or having great misgivings over the mission at hand. They did it because you can't send your brothers into the fight and stay behind.
I have a great appreciation for our LE and know there are many that will get the vaccine rather than turn their backs on their fellow officers and communities. They have my respect as well.
I respect anyone who believes strong enough about something to quite their career over it.
But, I was a soldier, and I know how often my brothers went afield injured or having great misgivings over the mission at hand. They did it because you can't send your brothers into the fight and stay behind.
I have a great appreciation for our LE and know there are many that will get the vaccine rather than turn their backs on their fellow officers and communities. They have my respect as well.
It's not as hypothetical as you might think.
I know someone that came home from work, hit the shower then went strolling through the house in his boxers. Unbeknownst to him his high school age daughter had a friend over that night. She was bee bopping through the house and saw him. Her dad was a cop. She goes home tells daddy what had happened over at her friend's house and bam, sex offender. He's branded with it to this day.
Yea that's a bad prosecutor deciding to even charge on something in that. Still this is not something happening everyday.
So he is on the sex offender registry and was likely in the news. What is the name, I'd like to look up the court case? Seems there had to be more to it than that.
What the fuck does that have to do with the scenario you postulated?
You are also making the assumption that your acquaintance is telling you the truth.
This thread is a bigger stinky turd than Bono. For some reason I can't look away though.
Somone says something and the next guy rips him apart. Then the next guy says something supporting the first guy and he's gets ripped up.
No one here is going to change anyone's mind on anything. This is a gun forum for miserable old men. We already know everything, don't you know that?!
If the Sargent (or whatever he's called) tells the rookie to shoot you in the face and take your eleven round magazine, your dead, It's that simple. We don't mean shit to that cop. We can just hope our wives and kids get some money out of it.
Somone says something and the next guy rips him apart. Then the next guy says something supporting the first guy and he's gets ripped up.
No one here is going to change anyone's mind on anything. This is a gun forum for miserable old men. We already know everything, don't you know that?!
If the Sargent (or whatever he's called) tells the rookie to shoot you in the face and take your eleven round magazine, your dead, It's that simple. We don't mean shit to that cop. We can just hope our wives and kids get some money out of it.
Back in the day there were some indecent exposures registered as sex offenders whose crime was basically urinating in public. Those guys were removed. These days if you expose yourself for the purpose of sexual gratification then you’ll make the list. Understand that most sex offenders are indecent exposures. There aren’t that many predatory child molesters and rapists as people think. In any case, sex offenders are crybabies and arresting them is no big accomplishment.
Lt Byrd capital police officer a fine example of the police community……..
“Most Sex offenders are indecent exposures.” Interesting as in 10 years I have never once arrested some one for that. See we arrest people exploiting young kids on the internet and threatening them unless they keep doing XYZ….next up are the groomers, often a known individual to the child that is grooming them to sexually abuse them. Next up are the perps raping little babies and toddlers and sharing those files on the dark net that we try to catch through undercover work.
You obviously have no clue or live in a podunk town with one deputy that told you that…..
all joe needs is the strings and he could be singing this song
No you’re the one who doesn’t have a clue you drama queen. Most registered sex offenders are the there for indecent exposure. Sorry to burst your tiny bubble.
No idea what the majority of sex-offenders did, but I have retired homicide detective friend who never arrested anyone for breaking and entering.
There are also a lot of seniors that dated freshmen, which quickly turned into a 19 year old banging a 15 year old. My ex-neighbor's son was one of those after the breakup ended badly. He is on the list for life.
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