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Range Report LabRadar battery issues

NamibHunter

Desert hunter
Full Member
Minuteman
Dec 26, 2018
1,146
569
Just a heads-up for those that use the superb LabRadar chronograph: Be careful what external battery pack you connect to the LR. Only some of them work well, and the latest high-tech batteries that automatically adjust between 5 Volt, 9 V and 12 V can actually damage your LR. [Best bet is probably to buy their battery and cable, listed on their web site.]

Backstory: Wanted a bigger battery pack to avoid being at the range and the battery runs out (because somebody forgot to charge it the night before....). Also did not like the older generation of Lithium Ion batteries that took many many hours to fully charge. You really had to charge them for a full day, or at least overnight. So did the research and found that the new generation of Graphene Batteries can be charged in under an hour, have long life (1000 plus charge/discharge cycles) and can handle high load devices that pull more power (more on this remarkable feature later on), and can do wireless charging of cell phones or tablets. All very convenient. Or so i thought!

Bought an Athors Graphene battery from Amazonia rated at 13,000 mAh. Big mistake! Plugged it in for one range seasion and it worked just fine, remaining battery charge barely came down by 15%, so probably enough capacity for 5 or 6 range sessions. Then got home, plugged it in and the mini USB power plug on the LR immediately started smoking, badly, smelling like burning PVC isolation. Pulled it out quickly, but the device was dead, it would not work with the old battery. Note that the fancy new Graphene battery worked fine for several hours and then promptly murdered my LR when it was sitting in my lap.

Contacted Labradar Canada who was very quick and very friendly, they sent a packing slip immediately, and i shipped it off their US distributor/repair center. First question from them was “what battery and cable were you using sir?” So i explained and sent a photo of the port specs (amps and voltages, see below). They came back within days saying “we have concluded that the battery you used damaged the Labradar” and they strongly recommended i stop using it and buy their battery, listed on their web site, which i did.

Best i can figure out (and i hope LabRadar will correct me if this is wrong): The new generation of fancy high power Lion batteries has the ability to supply more amps than the prior USB 1.0 and USB 2.0 standards (which were limited to 5 Volt), by raising the voltage to either 9V or 12V. The USB battery pack circuitry is supposed to autodetect what is needed, but when this goes wrong, it switches up the voltage from 5V to 9V (almost doubling it), and then you see a lot of smoke! [USB was supposed to be a universal standard, but it seems that has now been badly bastardized...]

My advice is to avoid batteries that display things like this:

A955BD3A-03C2-4C6D-9D20-E1FC0BA1FDF0.jpeg


Note the reference to 9 V and 12 V. My understanding is that these batteries are NOT compatible with the LabRadar. It should look like this (their battery):


7E6E326E-D741-4C2D-A41A-36E44C692A26.jpeg


Important part is “Output: 5 V / 2.1A”. Note there is no reference to 9 V or 12 V. Even with these specs, there is no guarantee that any random made in China battery will work properly (too weak, too much volt drop, bad or dirty contacts, long thin cable). Manual is also explicitly calling for 5 Volt:

659FC0D2-F17C-4F9C-9095-23B7BBF1F8B6.jpeg


They also supply a short thick cable (0.105”OD), and a way to mount the battery on the side of the LR with a special high grip Velcro-like strip. Their email also suggested staying away from inferior cables (presumably long thin cables that cause a high voltage drop). The battery manual also explicitly states that you should not attach the battery to the front panel where the AA battery panel and screen is. Not sure why, maybe they worry about heat generation. [Edit: Folks also report that the blast wave from an aggressive muzzle brake can blow the battery door off, and it is not good for the less than robustly designed mini USB female plug to have a heavy battery dangling from it.]

AFED00B6-0819-411D-8A34-D75A0923BD82.jpeg


Best bet: Buy their battery and cable, and mount it the way they tell you to do it. Not sure why i resisted doing that originally.... 🙈
 

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BTW: The ability of the Labradar app to connect with your tablet or phone is also affected by the quality of the external battery and cable. Bad cables and bad batteries can make the connection unreliable, and then you constantly have to reconnect.

And no i don’t work for LR!
 
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Great timing for this information! I used my external battery pack for the first time because my AA Alkaline's were dead and I started having connection and communication issues immediately! Thought it was an app issue so I un-installed the app, reinstalled, cleaned and cleared out the cache and still had the same problems. I was using a small APC battery pack and will have to check it's output capabilities. IMO the Labradar is not advanced enough to handle today's latest and greatest lithium battery packs that have features to self adjust it's output.
 
I had my battery pack Velcroed to the battery door too and my muzzle brake's concussion blast would knock the door off the unit.

Yep had the same issue. They want you to mount the battery as far away from the muzzle blast as possible, on the opposite (narrow) side of the LR. See pic above. Velcro tape is probably your best bet.
 
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This is good information, I recently bought a battery pack to use with my LR and had plans on testing it this weekend. I'll be sure to double check to make sure its within the acceptable parameters.
 
BTW: If you have any issues, try to get a high quality aftermarket cable. Short and thick works best.
 
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Question: I am on my second LabRadar (a reconditioned unit sent out after the previous one got fried by an incompatible battery), and just like the first one, something (maybe a screw?) is rattling around inside. Do you guys have the same experience?? I try to look after mine. Can that cause a short or interfere with the electronics?

Sounds like we all need to buy a Pelican case with a foam cutout for our precious Labradar. That orange plastic housing feels a bit flimsy to me.
 
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Question: I am on my second LabRadar (a reconditioned unit sent out after the previous one got fried by an incompatible battery), and just like the first one, something (maybe a screw?) is rattling around inside. Do you guys have the same experience?? I try to look after mine. Can that cause a short or interfere with the electronics?

Sounds like we all need to buy a Pelican case with a foam cutout for our precious Labradar. That orange plastic housing feels a bit flimsy to me.
They're really easy to take apart and check the insides. In the link below someone had taken theirs apart and it made me realize for $550+ you don't get much. https://fccid.io/PDG-LABRADAR/Internal-Photos/Int-Photos-2503420
 
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They're really easy to take apart and check the insides. In the link below someone had taken theirs apart and it made me realize for $550+ you don't get much. https://fccid.io/PDG-LABRADAR/Internal-Photos/Int-Photos-2503420
Thanks for that link, is also a PDF version that was lower on the page if anyone wants to save a local copy:

Actually is a lot going on in there, but it dispelled one myth for me. I had been told the surrounding black plastic was part of the antenna system, it clearly isn't. A design improvement would be for them to make that a bit thicker front to back and out of a high durometer rubber to act as a shock absorber if the unit falls over.
 
Useful info, thanks much.

Have taken the screws out, but it won’t come apart yet. Do you have to wedge a flat screwdriver in somewhere to pry the two halves apart (without breaking anything 😊)?

Useful enough device, and it seems to be accurate, but I think it was made a little flimsy. Really think they can do better...
 
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Try running an old credit card or gift card around the seam to spread it.
 
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Useful info, thanks much.

Have taken the screws out, but it won’t come apart yet. Do you have to wedge a flat screwdriver in somewhere to pry the two halves apart (without breaking anything 😊)?

Useful enough device, and it seems to be accurate, but I think it was made a little flimsy. Really think they can do better...
My buddy used some plastic prying tools (see them in the body shops to pry open body panels) to split it open.
 
A design improvement would be for them to make that a bit thicker front to back and out of a high durometer rubber to act as a shock absorber if the unit falls over.
If Otter Box made a case for Labradar I would so buy one. A few years ago a fellow shooter 6-8 benches down from me had his Labradar tip over into the grass due to strong winds using Labradar's tabletop tripod. I have a FotoPro Max tripod and even hang weights on the bottom hook to prevent it from ever tipping over.
 
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If Otter Box made a case for Labradar I would so buy one. A few years ago a fellow shooter 6-8 benches down from me had his Labradar tip over into the grass due to strong winds using Labradar's tabletop tripod. I have a FotoPro Max tripod and even hang weights on the bottom hook to prevent it from ever tipping over.

Got a “Pelican Large Piston Vault” case for my LabRadar today, as i don’t trust the canvas bag to protect it. On my second (replacement) Labradar and for the second time i can hear spare parts rolling around inside. Really try to look after it, but i think that orange plastic case is just a little too flimsy.

As close to a giant Otterbox as you can get?


98BFF20A-4C45-4BA2-BCB5-6385C957523A.jpeg


86CF942C-3463-4933-AF5B-9DC69F38F1BF.jpeg
 
And i guess the next step is to cut a window in the lid and install a Lexan transparent window so i can see the display screen with the entire case mounted on a sturdy tripod with a weight to keep it all from toppling over. Run it from the phone app (still buggy - last time i tried it).... this is turning into a project! 😀🙈
 
So on the "rattling around" bit. I thought mine was as well...

It was the the swivel loop on the Arca rail screw I was hearing.
 
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So on the "rattling around" bit. I thought mine was as well...

It was the the swivel loop on the Arca rail screw I was hearing.
Checked real carefully and there is definitely some loose screw or component inside... Have tried to split the box open, but it seems i need some tools to do this without doing damage.
 
Nambi,

You can use a voltage regulator with the Graphene battery and it will limit the output voltage to exactly 5V. Put the regulator in between the battery and the radar like this.
voltage regulator.jpg


There are a few different sizes and designs of voltage regulators on EBay but something like this will work for $5, Voltage Regulator

I use 6x18650 laptop Li-ion rechargeable batteries in a pack. It lasts several shooting trips and with so much power you can set the auto cut-out timings in the radar to max and not feel hurried to take the shot. When fully charged a 2S Li-ion is 8.2V, down to 6V when empty. To lower this to 5V which is the international standard for USB ports I use a regulator. The regulator limits the voltage to whatever you dial set it at (5V) and the radar draws the amps it needs.

I agree, those micro USB sockets are a pain as they come loose after a while. I've put a dedicated power socket in above the Micro SD card slot (see photo). You have to open the radar to do this and slave the socket to the internal battery compartment cables.

Getting the radar open is easy when you know where the hidden 8th screw is. It is under the 'VOID WARRANTY' sticker in the battery compartment (see photo). If you are worried about losing your warranty it is only valid for one-year anyway. Once the 8th screw is out it comes apart easily.

8th screw - Copy.jpg


I use the internal battery compartment to stow a kinetic trigger. With the kinetic trigger you can push the muzzle further forward and not worry about muzzle blast. Plus it's a must with suppressors.
Settup.jpg


No need to buy an after-market kinetic trigger; you can make them for $5. Buy a 3.5mm DIY socket (photo) and solder an SW-18010P vibration switch ($1 on EBay) to it. Plus a 1 metre Male-to-male cable and you're good to go.
Socket.jpg
socket test.jpg




I don't recommend using a tripod on a shooting bench, because as Azn's friend found out it only takes one leg to go over the edge and it all goes over the edge. We use a planks of wood with rubber feet and attach them to the radar with an 8-32 screw. The radar's base socket takes a standard 8-32 screw found in tripods. It gets the radar closer to the bench and is more stable. In the photo we had two radars going and they were both giving exactly the same velocities so that's pretty cool for precision.

wood base.jpg


Hope this helps - all the best.

Klem
 
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Nambi,

You can use a voltage regulator with the Graphene battery and it will limit the output voltage to exactly 5V. Put the regulator in between the battery and the radar like this.
View attachment 7901659

There are a few different sizes and designs of voltage regulators on EBay but something like this will work for $5, Voltage Regulator

I use 6x18650 laptop Li-ion rechargeable batteries in a pack. It lasts several shooting trips and with so much power you can set the auto cut-out timings in the radar to max and not feel hurried to take the shot. When fully charged a 2S Li-ion is 8.2V, down to 6V when empty. To lower this to 5V which is the international standard for USB ports I use a regulator. The regulator limits the voltage to whatever you dial set it at (5V) and the radar draws the amps it needs.

I agree, those micro USB sockets are a pain as they come loose after a while. I've put a dedicated power socket in above the Micro SD card slot (see photo). You have to open the radar to do this and slave the socket to the internal battery compartment cables.

Getting the radar open is easy when you know where the hidden 8th screw is. It is under the 'VOID WARRANTY' sticker in the battery compartment (see photo). If you are worried about losing your warranty it is only valid for one-year anyway. Once the 8th screw is out it comes apart easily.

View attachment 7901670

I use the internal battery compartment to stow a kinetic trigger. With the kinetic trigger you can push the muzzle further forward and not worry about muzzle blast. Plus it's a must with suppressors.
View attachment 7901686

No need to buy an after-market kinetic trigger; you can make them for $5. Buy a 3.5mm DIY socket (photo) and solder an SW-18010P vibration switch ($1 on EBay) to it. Plus a 1 metre Male-to-male cable and you're good to go.
View attachment 7901688View attachment 7901689



I don't recommend using a tripod on a shooting bench, because as Azn's friend found out it only takes one leg to go over the edge and it all goes over the edge. We use a planks of wood with rubber feet and attach them to the radar with an 8-32 screw. The radar's base socket takes a standard 8-32 screw found in tripods. It gets the radar closer to the bench and is more stable. In the photo we had two radars going and they were both giving exactly the same velocities so that's pretty cool for precision.

View attachment 7901699

Hope this helps - all the best.

Klem

Klem,

This is a really superb post, very detailed, with LOTS of pics. Cannot ask for more!

Love the mods you have made, and I’m going to give it a go. It’s been years since i fired up a soldering iron, but kinda looking forward to it…

The Velcro tape they supply is not secure: New battery with new velcro strip tore off within 30 minutes and the battery tumbled to the ground and promptly died on me. Had to order a new battery. Also, the mini USB cable will often not survive being jerked from the female socket…. And the mini USB plug opens up so easily. Not a particularly robust design on their part.

I really wish i could put a smaller USB battery inside the AA battery compartment, plug it it right there, and close the compartment lid/door and have no cables outside the device ready to snag…. But the lid closes the wrong way, and will just drop down and open up the compartment…

They really can do a lot better me thinks… Maybe there will be a V2 in due time with some improvements.
 
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Good to see there are now a few viable competitive solutions out there. That can only help to stimulate new innovations, and maybe maybe one day drive down prices.

“F-class John” (search his youtube channel) also tested a Euro based prototype some months ago.

This tiny radar device can be mounted permanently to the rifle, since it is so small you can just leave it on all the time. Or you can remove and attach to a different rifle as needed. I like the small size, and the fact that it is always perfectly aimed. But more expensive right now than LR…..

 
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I don't recommend using a tripod on a shooting bench, because as Azn's friend found out it only takes one leg to go over the edge and it all goes over the edge. We use a planks of wood with rubber feet and attach them to the radar with an 8-32 screw. The radar's base socket takes a standard 8-32 screw found in tripods. It gets the radar closer to the bench and is more stable. In the photo we had two radars going and they were both giving exactly the same velocities so that's pretty cool for precision.

View attachment 7901699

This was the first thing I did with mine, much more stable than the tripod.
 
Guys,

I'll look into F-Class John, thanks for that. I have heard of the European radar, I think it is a bit smaller but the Labradar is working fine.

If you are interested in opening up the radar I recommend installing a dedicated power socket - it's not hard. Here are some notes that will help save time,

The AA battery compartment has been split electrically in half so it is actually two inputs of 3xAA's (4.5V) in parallel. This makes sense because the USB power input is very similar at 5V. The power coming in from a new socket therefore cannot be more than 5V. Just use your existing external USB battery or a Li-ion rechargeable battery with a voltage regulator set to 5V (as in my post above).

Once open, if you want to carefully strip the insulation off the battery compartment leads you won't need to cut them like I did. I was just lazy and took the quick and dirty approach, cutting the leads mid-way between terminals.I had to divide the yellow and purple leads into two forks because there was not enough cable slack on the compartment leads to scrunch them back up as one soldered join.

Note the 12-way flat ribbon connecting the two halves of the Labradar, at the top of the photo. You can unplug the ribbon and separate the two halves if you want but there is no need. Just have plenty of flat space on the bench so you can work on the motherboard side while the other half is still connected. If you do want to separate the halves the white flat ribbon socket has a small plastic bar that comes out to free the ribbon - don't lose it or it will be an expensive ... up.

Also note the two black microphones half way down each side for normal use.

Internals - Copy.jpg


On the wooden plank base for bench shooting. I often leave the plank connected in the Pelican case so when you get out to the range the settup time is about 10 seconds. Another other good thing about a rectangular plank is aiming the radar. If you sit the plank down square with the front of the bench, benches will always be at right angles to their corresponding target at 100. So, you don't have to aim the radar through the notch at the top. I've been a bit cheeky and drawn a line on my favorite bench at the range with a marker pen - I'll deny it of course. The four rubber feet came from the local hardware store. There is a higher level of foam under the radar so there is no stress on the screw socket while in the Pelican case.

Note how the plank is offset with most of the wood on the shooters side. You can push it to the front edge of the bench while having the centre of gravity on the shooters side. With a kinetic trigger you can have the radar well back from the edge if you're worried about it going over the front - easier to push the buttons too without breaking shooting position (I have the app on my phone but it drops out sometimes and frankly is of no benefit. I can push buttons on my phone, or extend my elbow and push buttons on the radar - no difference to me).

case - Copy.jpg
dimensions - Copy.jpg


Up to you guys but this works for us.

Klem
 
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Guys,

I'll look into F-Class John, thanks for that. I have heard of the European radar, I think it is a bit smaller but the Labradar is working fine.

If you are interested in opening up the radar I recommend installing a dedicated power socket - it's not hard. Here are some notes that will help save time,

The AA battery compartment has been split electrically in half so it is actually two inputs of 3xAA's (4.5V) in parallel. This makes sense because the USB power input is very similar at 5V. The power coming in from a new socket therefore cannot be more than 5V. Just use your existing external USB battery or a Li-ion rechargeable battery with a voltage regulator set to 5V (as in my post above).

Once open, if you want to carefully strip the insulation off the battery compartment leads you won't need to cut them like I did. I was just lazy and took the quick and dirty approach, cutting the leads mid-way between terminals.I had to divide the yellow and purple leads into two forks because there was not enough cable slack on the compartment leads to scrunch them back up as one soldered join.

Note the 12-way flat ribbon connecting the two halves of the Labradar, at the top of the photo. You can unplug the ribbon and separate the two halves if you want but there is no need. Just have plenty of flat space on the bench so you can work on the motherboard side while the other half is still connected. If you do want to separate the halves the white flat ribbon socket has a small plastic bar that comes out to free the ribbon - don't lose it or it will be an expensive ... up.

Also note the two black microphones half way down each side for normal use.

View attachment 7905450

On the wooden plank base for bench shooting. I often leave the plank connected in the Pelican case so when you get out to the range the settup time is about 10 seconds. Another other good thing about a rectangular plank is aiming the radar. If you sit the plank down square with the front of the bench, benches will always be at right angles to their corresponding target at 100. So, you don't have to aim the radar through the notch at the top. I've been a bit cheeky and drawn a line on my favorite bench at the range with a marker pen - I'll deny it of course. The four rubber feet came from the local hardware store. There is a higher level of foam under the radar so there is no stress on the screw socket while in the Pelican case.

Note how the plank is offset with most of the wood on the shooters side. You can push it to the front edge of the bench while having the centre of gravity on the shooters side. With a kinetic trigger you can have the radar well back from the edge if you're worried about it going over the front - easier to push the buttons too without breaking shooting position (I have the app on my phone but it drops out sometimes and frankly is of no benefit. I can push buttons on my phone, or extend my elbow and push buttons on the radar - no difference to me).

View attachment 7905482View attachment 7905483

Up to you guys but this works for us.

Klem

Very generous of you to post this much detail sir. Much appreciated.

Will try it soon.