Listen to this homeowner manhandle these ATF Agents

candyx

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    I find used oil filters work well and there's nothing illegal having used oil filters around the house and the hole in the bottom of the filter was used to drain the oil out of it.
     
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    TurboTrout

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    Oh
    My
    God

    The
    Horror

    A “Solvent Trap” :eek:

    Creating criminals where crime doesn’t exist.

    And it’s us taxpayers that are footing the bill for these nitwit’s wages……

    Jeebuz, don’t they have anything better to do with their time ? Like shooting some dogs or something?

    Oh, and rhetorical question……..just how did they come by the “information” that the homeowner supposedly posessed said “solvent trap” ? Did they get a judge to sign off on a warrant ? Or, did they simply start rooting around on the many financial databases that they have illegal access to ?

    I like how one of the sheep dawgz says the homeowner doesn’t know what they do, then tries to make it out like he’s disarming roving gangs he’ll bent on murder 24/7…yet he’s saying this on the porch of a nice middle class law abiding guy, uhhh think the ghetto is like 30 miles that was you blue blooded hero! Go geter’ tiger!
     
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    ManUtdManiac

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    I'd have to assume that the ATF turning up to 'recover' the trap amounts to an unconstitutional assumption of guilt - right? I wonder if this would invalidate any further attempts to 'recover' in the future as it would support an allegation of harassment - no?

    And what the fuck do they mean 'recover'. Did they lose it?

    ATF = Ass to Face....
     
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    308pirate

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    right, wrong, or indifferent, thats where you either catch an ass beating or get shot or both.

    after that you might win in a long drawn out battle, but if you imply to the ATF you have a gun in your pocket, you are stupid as shit and are going to get dealt with.

    No reason to do anything like that.

    That's what the overwatch guy is for
     

    Bender

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    Hey feds that are reading this because your algorithm found the key words and automatically sent you a link for you browse while you have your tranny porn tabs open in the background and drinking your $7 Fair Trade coffee.

    Fuck you.

    Even you know deep down that the shit you pull is wrong. History will not be kind to your antics.
     

    Haney

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    Hey feds that are reading this because your algorithm found the key words and automatically sent you a link for you browse while you have your tranny porn tabs open in the background and drinking your $7 Fair Trade coffee.

    Fuck you.

    Even you know deep down that the shit you pull is wrong. History will not be kind to your antics.
    Oh my, you are so brave. What a fucking joke .
     

    308pirate

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    I'd have to assume that the ATF turning up to 'recover' the trap amounts to an unconstitutional assumption of guilt - right?
    Those assclowns rely on lies and intimidation to do what they do.

    IIRC one of them said something like "we know you're using the solvent trap as a suppressor". Lie. If they did they would have the evidence for an arrest and prosecution. It's too bad the guy on the video didn't call them out on that on the spot.
     

    Baron23

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    IMO the home owner was doing good with "I won't answer any questions" and "do you have a warrant".

    When he got a "no" to the second question, he should have just instructed them to get off of his property and closed the door on their face...without saying another fucking word.
     

    fpgt72

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    So many interesting replies.

    If you do some of the things suggested, and really piss people off, you are going to loose round 1 if they choose to press it. And really that is all they care about, if they win the next fine, if they loose all the others, no big deal to them, they are the .gov and have millions of others to "hit" and trillions of $$ to back them. What do you have? Even if you are found in the right, how much is that going to cost you.

    The safe thing is an easy out. Even have them ask for a card so the "gun owner" can call them back. This puts everyone at ease.

    When things go south is if they request entry, never ever let anyone into your house/car/shop/where ever without a warrant.

    There are times to be a "dick" and times to roll with the punches, this punch is not worth taking if you can side step it.
     
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    Jgunner

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    I am pretty sure the video is fake, or seems that way, but "you're on the radar now"? Uh, it sure seems like he was already on the radar, that's why the atf was there....
     

    lonegunman762x51

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    Honestly, has anyone ever been arrested for using a suppressor made from a "solvent trap" in an actual crime?

    Or was someone stupid making one into a suppressor and doing something stupid on Youtube?

    This is an utterly fake crime and they are using it to produce imaginary statistics and claim they stopped a crime.

    About 20 years ago I had to return an M1A/M-14 style receiver to the ATF because the asshole who built them got a "pre-approval" letter that said, "Yes, this can be approved. Please submit two samples for inspection and we will sign off on it." Asshole used that letter and sold about 400 of them. Three of us bought them and made rifles. When the ATF contacted us we talked to a lawyer friend, stripped them and returned the receivers as requested. We went to their office to meet them, it was unmarked and in a separate building from the rest of the Fed government and the agent had no idea what he was doing. He had never seen an M-14 or M1A and had no idea what a stripped receiver was. He was told to collect three guns.

    We could have fought to keep them since they were technically legal. BUT. You have to go to ATF court and fight an ATF appointed judge who promises to rule on their side and when you lose you have to pay ALL of their costs associated with the case. So we would have had to put $1,500 dollars down to show we were fighting, buy ourselves a lawyer for several thousand more and then after we lose pay the millions of dollars the ATF spent to push this case. BTW, the ATF straight up fucking lost in court and the asshole was fully acquitted of hundreds of counts of manufacturing illegal machine guns and mail fraud and the ATF stull fucking refused to return our property.

    This allowed them to claim they had taken between 400 and 500 illegal machineguns off the street, when in fact they had done nothing of the sort.

    Fuck them.................................get a warrant.
     

    MadDuner

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    Honestly, has anyone ever been arrested for using a suppressor made from a "solvent trap" in an actual crime?

    Or was someone stupid making one into a suppressor and doing something stupid on Youtube?

    This is an utterly fake crime and they are using it to produce imaginary statistics and claim they stopped a crime.

    About 20 years ago I had to return an M1A/M-14 style receiver to the ATF because the asshole who built them got a "pre-approval" letter that said, "Yes, this can be approved. Please submit two samples for inspection and we will sign off on it." Asshole used that letter and sold about 400 of them. Three of us bought them and made rifles. When the ATF contacted us we talked to a lawyer friend, stripped them and returned the receivers as requested. We went to their office to meet them, it was unmarked and in a separate building from the rest of the Fed government and the agent had no idea what he was doing. He had never seen an M-14 or M1A and had no idea what a stripped receiver was. He was told to collect three guns.

    We could have fought to keep them since they were technically legal. BUT. You have to go to ATF court and fight an ATF appointed judge who promises to rule on their side and when you lose you have to pay ALL of their costs associated with the case. So we would have had to put $1,500 dollars down to show we were fighting, buy ourselves a lawyer for several thousand more and then after we lose pay the millions of dollars the ATF spent to push this case. BTW, the ATF straight up fucking lost in court and the asshole was fully acquitted of hundreds of counts of manufacturing illegal machine guns and mail fraud and the ATF stull fucking refused to return our property.

    This allowed them to claim they had taken between 400 and 500 illegal machineguns off the street, when in fact they had done nothing of the sort.

    Fuck them.................................get a warrant.
    Hundreds of machine guns could be those little plastic pcs that they are worried about?
     

    lonegunman762x51

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    Hundreds of machine guns could be those little plastic pcs that they are worried about?


    Yep, they create an imaginary problem and solve it with draconian tactics against innocent, law abiding people who are easy to menace and threaten, abuse their power and publish it in leftist news outlets and create the imagine they are anything but the idiots they really are.

    If you listen to the audio, the ATF guys hears this guy call them "idiots" when he had said nothing of the sort and repeats it back to him. That was the ATF projecting their stupidity and they will report it as if the man said it, thus have an excuse for a "No knock" warrant when they return.
     
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    308pirate

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    So many interesting replies.

    If you do some of the things suggested, and really piss people off, you are going to loose round 1 if they choose to press it. And really that is all they care about, if they win the next fine, if they loose all the others, no big deal to them, they are the .gov and have millions of others to "hit" and trillions of $$ to back them. What do you have? Even if you are found in the right, how much is that going to cost you.

    The safe thing is an easy out. Even have them ask for a card so the "gun owner" can call them back. This puts everyone at ease.

    When things go south is if they request entry, never ever let anyone into your house/car/shop/where ever without a warrant.

    There are times to be a "dick" and times to roll with the punches, this punch is not worth taking if you can side step it.

    LOL OK
     

    fpgt72

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    By this reply you think that after you are rude, confrontational and whatever else these people are going to go away and not try to make your life difficult?

    Keep dreaming.
     

    308pirate

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    By this reply you think that after you are rude, confrontational and whatever else these people are going to go away and not try to make your life difficult?

    Keep dreaming.

    The only idiot is you, who thinks that some pleasantries are going to make them go away and leave you alone.
     

    clcustom1911

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    By this reply you think that after you are rude, confrontational and whatever else these people are going to go away and not try to make your life difficult?

    Keep dreaming.
    And answering questions, allowing them to build circumstantial evidence, or allowing them to be able to articulate possible "admissions" you made based on your "I'll think I'm smarter than them" statements/answers is going to make them go away?

    The sole job of any/every police officer during a criminal investigation is to obtain enough information to reach the Probable Cause standard to arrest the subject/suspect. Period.

    By placating them, answering their questions, going along with their program, you're inviting their creativity to articulate the circumstances which may lead to your arrest.

    Read the Fourth and Fifth Amendment to the Constitution of the United States and let us know what they say in reference to searching of places, effects, and seizing property, as well as the government compelling you to be a witness against yourself.
     

    TexPatriot

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    By this reply you think that after you are rude, confrontational and whatever else these people are going to go away and not try to make your life difficult?

    Keep dreaming.
    I actually thought the guy was quite courteous, given the fact the ATF didn't have cause to legally be on his property, causing them to resort to threats of gestapo type actions in the future.

    When they asked 'Are you calling us idiots?' I would have gone off on their asses and that would have been the least of my descriptors, to include "murderers, child burners, dog shooters, Biden's secret police, thieves, communists, liars, losers" and probably thrown in a "buttfucking faggots" for good measure.
     
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    JR_PRO77

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    Why disclose the existence of guns/safe on the property at all?
    Exactly!!! This video was originally posted by @SniperBro but it’s shortened down a bit.

    The video is directed toward a traffic stop however the underlying message is true in this instance as well.

    SHUT THE FU*K UP AND DON ‘T ANSWER ANY QUESTIONS ESPECIALLY ON DAYS THAT END IN “Y.”

     
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    2aBaCa

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    Honestly, has anyone ever been arrested for using a suppressor made from a "solvent trap" in an actual crime?

    Or was someone stupid making one into a suppressor and doing something stupid on Youtube?

    This is an utterly fake crime and they are using it to produce imaginary statistics and claim they stopped a crime.

    About 20 years ago I had to return an M1A/M-14 style receiver to the ATF because the asshole who built them got a "pre-approval" letter that said, "Yes, this can be approved. Please submit two samples for inspection and we will sign off on it." Asshole used that letter and sold about 400 of them. Three of us bought them and made rifles. When the ATF contacted us we talked to a lawyer friend, stripped them and returned the receivers as requested. We went to their office to meet them, it was unmarked and in a separate building from the rest of the Fed government and the agent had no idea what he was doing. He had never seen an M-14 or M1A and had no idea what a stripped receiver was. He was told to collect three guns.

    We could have fought to keep them since they were technically legal. BUT. You have to go to ATF court and fight an ATF appointed judge who promises to rule on their side and when you lose you have to pay ALL of their costs associated with the case. So we would have had to put $1,500 dollars down to show we were fighting, buy ourselves a lawyer for several thousand more and then after we lose pay the millions of dollars the ATF spent to push this case. BTW, the ATF straight up fucking lost in court and the asshole was fully acquitted of hundreds of counts of manufacturing illegal machine guns and mail fraud and the ATF stull fucking refused to return our property.

    This allowed them to claim they had taken between 400 and 500 illegal machineguns off the street, when in fact they had done nothing of the sort.

    Fuck them.................................get a warrant.
    no because suppressors allow you to shoot people in silence and not get caught. do you even watch TV?
     
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    JR_PRO77

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    And answering questions, allowing them to build circumstantial evidence, or allowing them to be able to articulate possible "admissions" you made based on your "I'll think I'm smarter than them" statements/answers is going to make them go away?

    The sole job of any/every police officer during a criminal investigation is to obtain enough information to reach the Probable Cause standard to arrest the subject/suspect. Period.

    By placating them, answering their questions, going along with their program, you're inviting their creativity to articulate the circumstances which may lead to your arrest.

    Read the Fourth and Fifth Amendment to the Constitution of the United States and let us know what they say in reference to searching of places, effects, and seizing property, as well as the government compelling you to be a witness against yourself.
    AMEN!
     

    Eli17L

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    Really? How are you defining “trespasser?”

    Do you mean everyone who knocks on your door? People walking across your lawn? Or, people trying to break/enter, burglarize, etc?
    At my office meth heads or schizophrenics....
    I ask them once to leave then its 911 for trespassing. I don't have the time to deal with them.
    At home they can tell I am much more crazy than they are so they just move along....
     
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    fpgt72

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    The only idiot is you, who thinks that some pleasantries are going to make them go away and leave you alone.

    And you are an idiot if you think being nasty to these people is going to help you in the long run. That is just flat fucking stupid.

    Try it and let me know how it works out for you from the homeless shelter after you win but have no money left.
     

    fpgt72

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    And answering questions, allowing them to build circumstantial evidence, or allowing them to be able to articulate possible "admissions" you made based on your "I'll think I'm smarter than them" statements/answers is going to make them go away?

    The sole job of any/every police officer during a criminal investigation is to obtain enough information to reach the Probable Cause standard to arrest the subject/suspect. Period.

    By placating them, answering their questions, going along with their program, you're inviting their creativity to articulate the circumstances which may lead to your arrest.

    Read the Fourth and Fifth Amendment to the Constitution of the United States and let us know what they say in reference to searching of places, effects, and seizing property, as well as the government compelling you to be a witness against yourself.

    Where did I say answer questions, I said be nice, tell your wife and kids to be nice but no entry.

    I hate to tell you this but if you act like a total fuck that is going to push them to the next step, and that next step is not good for you at all. Finding a judge that will sign something based on false info.....yea that never happens does it.

    You said it your self, probable cause, acting like you are hiding something, and then having the info in hand that you have a "solvent trap" is just that.

    You don't have to be a dick to not answer questions, you can be polite, you just need a brain between your ears, and keep your emotions out of it, something that very few are able to do.
     

    308pirate

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    And you are an idiot if you think being nasty to these people is going to help you in the long run. That is just flat fucking stupid.

    Try it and let me know how it works out for you from the homeless shelter after you win but have no money left.

    1664362195547.png
     
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    308pirate

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    Where did I say answer questions, I said be nice, tell your wife and kids to be nice but no entry.

    I hate to tell you this but if you act like a total fuck that is going to push them to the next step, and that next step is not good for you at all. Finding a judge that will sign something based on false info.....yea that never happens does it.

    You said it your self, probable cause, acting like you are hiding something, and then having the info in hand that you have a "solvent trap" is just that.

    You don't have to be a dick to not answer questions, you can be polite, you just need a brain between your ears, and keep your emotions out of it, something that very few are able to do.

    You do know that you're arguing with a former LEO, right? Someone who actually played the game you think you know for real.

    Who do you think we're listening to, him or you?

    LOL
     
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    fpgt72

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    I actually thought the guy was quite courteous, given the fact the ATF didn't have cause to legally be on his property, causing them to resort to threats of gestapo type actions in the future.

    When they asked 'Are you calling us idiots?' I would have gone off on their asses and that would have been the least of my descriptors, to include "murderers, child burners, dog shooters, Biden's secret police, thieves, communists, liars, losers" and probably thrown in a "buttfucking faggots" for good measure.

    He was, I would give him an 8 out of 10. And he did most things correctly. He let a little too much emotion come in, and that is about it.

    They are waiting, and fishing for him loosing it, they want you to come off hinge. That is a win for them and a loss for you.

    Sarcasm is your best ally here, and it can be quite thinly veiled.
     

    TexPatriot

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    He was, I would give him an 8 out of 10. And he did most things correctly. He let a little too much emotion come in, and that is about it.

    They are waiting, and fishing for him loosing it, they want you to come off hinge. That is a win for them and a loss for you.

    Sarcasm is your best ally here, and it can be quite thinly veiled.
    Their mantra about "If you let me finish (my bullshit lecture) and listen" aka "You need to be quiet and listen" is as canned as the "Do me favor and take your hands out of your pockets" line and should have been responded to by interrupting right in the middle of his gestapo presentation with "You need to shut the fuck up and get off my property."
     

    TurboTrout

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    And you are an idiot if you think being nasty to these people is going to help you in the long run. That is just flat fucking stupid.

    Try it and let me know how it works out for you from the homeless shelter after you win but have no money left.

    They hate you

    If you’re nice they’ll try to screw you if they see a chance

    If you’re mean to them they’ll try to screw you if they see a chance


    “He was such a nice guy, let’s toss XYZ evidence in the trash on the way to meet my wife’s new boyfriend, what do you think Carl?”

    Said no gov worker ever
     

    fpgt72

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    Keep those thoughts and I am sure your feelings will come through.
     

    fpgt72

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    Do you disagree with reality? Doing so doesn’t make it any less real.

    I agree that being an ass hat is going to make it worse. I also agree that if you are an ass something that someone would have let slide will not. It is human nature.
     

    GTOJOSH

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    Honest question-
    What if the guy said wait here, I'm building one to do a form 1 and since you are already here I'll have you help with my paperwork so I get it right.
    I only need maybe 3 hours of your time.
     

    hlee

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    Honest question-
    What if the guy said wait here, I'm building one to do a form 1 and since you are already here I'll have you help with my paperwork so I get it right.
    I only need maybe 3 hours of your time.
    I can see it now. [Wavy lines, like boiling mirage, transition the scene…]

    Knock, Knock

    “Sir, we’re from the the ATF and are here about an unregistered solvent trap silencer you recently acquired. We…”

    “Wow, when I called the customer service line and the recording said ‘we’ve recently implemented new service practices’ I never expected in-person service to show up at the door. Wait right here. I have the paperwork in the office.”

    “Sir, we’re not here from customer service. We need you to bring us your dog.”

    “Fluffy?”

    [Fade to black]

    Ok, the issue is that the ATF considers all ‘solvent trap kits’ to be unregistered silencers. They cannot be built on a form 1 because they should have been transferred on a form 4. In the ATFs’ eyes, these kits are contraband that cannot be made legal by any means once they left the manufacturer. Saying “hey, can you help me with the paperwork” is just admission that you have the contraband item in your possession and intend to make a functional illegal silencer from it.