Around WWII, US army conducted time consuming and exhausting tests on several brands of 22 LR ammo with MV=1050-1100 ft/s. In conditions close to standard atmosphere, at sea level, the maximum range obtained for 40 grainers was approximately 1400 yards with bore elevation 25-30°. This was a looong time ago. Have they repeated the tests in modern times of radars aviability with 22 LR ammo manufactured not so long ago?
- Thread starter bulletbluesky
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Have the laws of physics changed any since the original test?
its a 1 week old account...
It might be possible, would need to have someone put a Coke/soda/pop can at 1,400 yards and start taking pot shots with a Ruger 10/22 and iron sights.
LMAO, I got that reference.
The ammo projectiles are better
Even constant BC based on RA4 drag function doesn't fit real data at such extreme range, not to mention G1
Maybe questions about 22LR shots in artillery mode are funny to you, but I want to know that for another reason
I doubt there's another way to make a standard velocity 40 grain .22lr travel 1,400 yards without looking like an artillery round.
State your reason for asking and maybe you'll be taken seriously....maybe...not likely...but there is a minuscule possibility.
There isn't. And not just that, but it's more complicated for tiny 22LR round than for an artillery round.
I'll rather wait for somebody with actual test data, or at least with access to mighty Weibel radar testing site.
Or somebody adult at least
You're going to be waiting a long time. Good quest with your lucky.There isn't. And not just that, but it's more complicated for tiny 22LR round than for an artillery round.
I'll rather wait for somebody with actual test data, or at least with access to mighty Weibel radar testing site.
Or somebody adult at least
Tip for a new member. Ignore is your friend.
Go ahead and add something related to the thread and the OP's question...which is about as relevant today as the 1 1/2 mile warning that used to be printed on .22lr ammo boxes.
Call Aberdeen Proving Ground. The army will get right on it for you.
Just tell them who you are and demand answers.
Just tell them who you are and demand answers.
Ran it through gundata ballistic calculator
28 degrees inclination, 1500 yard zero, 100 yard interval
Peak of the trajectory is about 360 feet above muzzle
28 degrees inclination, 1500 yard zero, 100 yard interval
Peak of the trajectory is about 360 feet above muzzle
There goes my dream of shooting a mile with a .22LR…
Obx, ya' can still get 'er done.
Take y'er rifle up Mt. Baldy, Cimmaron, get to the top, hold level, let 'er rip.
With the peak elevation of 12,441 feet it'll work.
Slope distance counts too.
Take y'er rifle up Mt. Baldy, Cimmaron, get to the top, hold level, let 'er rip.
With the peak elevation of 12,441 feet it'll work.
Slope distance counts too.
…
I'll rather wait for somebody with actual test data, or at least with access to mighty Weibel radar testing site.
….
Why don’t you go out to a mile long range and try it out with some sheets setup out there. I don’t think anybody has actually tried this. You can be that provider of data from field research.
Oorrrrr, find the BC of some modern .22 bullets, their muzzle velocities from the barrel length you’re interested in and do some math. Yes, bullet design has advanced, but I doubt there has been much advancement in 22lr BCs. The WWII calculation is probably pretty close to correct today.
So, what is your reason? This is a very specific question.
Obx, ya' can still get 'er done.
Take y'er rifle up Mt. Baldy, Cimmaron, get to the top, hold level, let 'er rip.
With the peak elevation of 12,441 feet it'll work.
Slope distance counts too.
Waaay to windy!!!!
My last attempt at 600 yards at 24" wide and 48" paper target full size paper ended up with 2 shots on paper out of about 30 (2x15 round mags) I sent.
I could see impacts around the target just difficulty to adjust due to changing winds.
33.5 MILS
Dialed 22, held over rest
Held 3.5 left.
I can't imagine trying to yeet it at 1400.
How many shots would it take to actually hit something?
I could see impacts around the target just difficulty to adjust due to changing winds.
33.5 MILS
Dialed 22, held over rest
Held 3.5 left.
I can't imagine trying to yeet it at 1400.
How many shots would it take to actually hit something?
As already said, constant BC rarely works good for calculation of extreme range trajectories , no matter what drag function taken. Point mass trajectory models based on appropriate zero-yaw drag coefficent functions are better, but also can be sometimes quite off .
The "WWII calculation" was actually a real world firing test. Calculation based on 300 yards ballistic charts of a typical 22 LR in 1940. would yield ~1800 yards- G1, ~1600 yards- RA4. The reference says measured was 1350-1400 yards...I don't know anything else, what riffle or twist rates were used, what spread or if beaten zone was determined etc. But it's not 22LR that behaves in an odd way.
2 decades ago I got lucky and met a conference guy who worked for Weibel Company back then. Among other things relating performance of their Doppler radars I was kindly given Excel files containing extra long and extreme range trajectory data for some well known small arms military cartridges recorded by their radars. That was about time, radar technology become mature enough, to track small projectiles like 5.56 mm bullets at their 2 miles long trajectory during fair weather. But I don't have such data for 22 rimfire. I guess 22LR is not considered military cartridge (perhaps just "survival weapon"?) so no interest. This doesn't mean there were no appropriate radar test done.
Hey BigDaddy, nobody said ya' had to shoot into the wind, eh?
Even Jim Croce knew better than that.
Even Jim Croce knew better than that.
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Who said anything about constant BC? Applied Ballistics uses Doppler radar to obtain BCs across the bullet’s flight path for different velocities. Maybe they’ve done it for rimfire .22 bullets. Did you use a constant BC in your 1600/1800 yard calculations from extrapolated 300 yard data?
22lr has been used by the military. But it was for sentry/dog/light removal for covert operations. The ranges used were very short. Nobody was using it for plungin fire, and therefore there is no reason to spend money for the testing. It is definitely not a “military cartridge”. The fact that some guy got that test going officially back then is amazing. Probably good ol’ boy network with the guy who approved spending the money.
Don't lose your hope. Use hypervelocity ammo. Hunt in summer, in the mountains. T-Rex, 1 mile away, might become your trophy
- Nov 3, 2010
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Is that a visual representation of a 22 bullet flying over someone?
It can be anything you want it to be.
- Nov 3, 2010
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Was that before or during WWII?
I might be wrong, but I think machine gunners are not trained to use plunging fire anymore.
As of maximum range warning on the boxes 22 LR "Dangerous up to 1.5
miles", 22LR is dangerous at it's max range-it can poke your eye out!I never saw any range time setup for it, but the doctrine is still taught.
I’m sure some intrepid young officer could get range time for the task though, if a nearby range is big enough.
29 Palms. We did multiple FIREX up there for CAAT teams prior to DS/DS. A good chunk of it was defilade firing training
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