MD Red Flag Law Enforcement Leads to Death

[Cheyenne Bodie]

Nov. 5 "A 61-year-old man is dead after he was shot by an officer trying to enforce Maryland’s new ‘red flag’ law in Ferndale Monday morning. "
https://baltimore.cbslocal.com/2018...kMngREy8ffT3ESZqYzFfWBqNL9o6DCFyNVc00SMt59RBA

Unsettling to say the least.

 

[2ndamendfan]

I am going to say that this will happen about 75% of the time when enforcing "red flag" laws.
The gun owner is an unwilling participant in the situation, the gun owner has been deemed to be a "rabid dog", so LEO will go in with itchy trigger fingers. Very few of these will end well. The guy should be made a martyr for the Bill of Rights and due process. But alas even the news report linked by the OP paints the victim as a loose cannon.
Each one of these is a little micro Waco, Ruby Ridge

 

[Cheyenne Bodie]

Yup, it's the government going around kicking sleeping dogs on the suspicion that they really don't like being kicked. Hearsay from a doctor or whoever is not proof, it's conjecture and nothing more. The fact that the state is giving other people direct leverage over the legality of your gun rights is the most drastic misappropriation of democracy that I can imagine. You can thank our fearless leader, President Due-Process-Second, for all this shit.

This happened about 1.5 hours away from me, I used to go to summer daycare in the same county. I don't know exactly why the guy was red flagged, but let's face the fact that the legislation isn't exactly fucking Minority Report. A man is dead because of tyranny.

 

[Hookturnr]

These laws will either be the unravelling of the constitution or they will bring about true and solid reaffirmation of it.....I'm afraid to see which way it goes

 

[Rthur]

R

 

[ArmyJerry]

Well there is only one proper way to handle this situation.

 

[Cheyenne Bodie]

Excerpt from the Baltimore Sun, Nov. 5:

The “red flag” protective orders are officially known as emergency risk protection orders, and may be sought by family members, police or others to temporarily prohibit people’s access to firearms when they show signs that they are a danger to themselves or others. The law took effect Oct. 1.

A spokeswoman for the Maryland Judiciary denied a request to see any and all requests for protection orders made at the residence on Linwood Avenue, citing the law, which states that anything related to an order is confidential unless the court rules otherwise.

Police had (also) come to the house Sunday night to speak with Willis, a longtime resident of the neighborhood, said Michele Willis, who was on the scene Monday morning and identified herself as his niece. She attributed that visit by police to “family being family” but declined to elaborate.

She said one of her aunts requested the protective order to temporarily remove Willis’ guns. Michele Willis said she had grown up in the house and had been there Sunday night to move out her son, who had been helping to care for her grandmother.

Her uncle, Gary Willis, lived in an apartment above the garage; she said other family members, including her grandmother, another uncle, two aunts and Gary Willis’ girlfriend were also at the home Sunday night. She said her uncle “likes to speak his mind,” but she described him as harmless. “I’m just dumbfounded right now,” she said. “My uncle wouldn’t hurt anybody."

https://www.baltimoresun.com/news/maryland/crime/bs-md-aa-shooting-20181105-story.html

Makes me sick.

 

[Dewey7271]

Well, that’s two they’ve snuffed in MD with Red Flag.
That law is all bad.
Wonder how many innocent people that happen to own a gun they’ll kill under this flim flam law? Oh, that’s right, they own a gun so they aren’t worthy of the same legal protection as other people.

 

[Veer_G]

I am going to say that this will happen about 75% of the time when enforcing "red flag" laws.
The gun owner is an unwilling participant in the situation, the gun owner has been deemed to be a "rabid dog", so LEO will go in with itchy trigger fingers. Very few of these will end well. The guy should be made a martyr for the Bill of Rights and due process. But alas even the news report linked by the OP paints the victim as a loose cannon.
Each one of these is a little micro Waco, Ruby Ridge

This is simply the working model for what they hope will be a relatively bloodless (on their side) war of attrition.

Dear Mr. 2ndamendfan:

In working closely with our commercial partners, we have become aware that you have made a high number of firearm and ammunition transactions in the recent past. Your 3.12 mile proximity to a Catholic primary school, St. Obama's, has red-flagged you in the new Commonwealth Firearms and Ammunition Threat Removal Activities Task-force (FATRAT) database, created as part of our Commonwealth's new, sweeping "common sense" laws designed to create a safer and more just society.

Please be advised that you have been scheduled for an on-site relinquishment of all items in your control related to both powder-actuated and compressed air discharge of metallic/ceramic projectiles. As we are unable to precisely provide a time and date due to the overwhelming number of such procedures, rest assured that we will make every effort to come at a time when you are sure to be at home. Generally, this is in a pre-dawn time frame.

Your signal for compliance will be a telephone call to your residence upon our arrival. If you do not answer the phone, we will use five blasts of a siren from a suitable distance to your front door, along with the various emergency signal lights on the responding vehicles. Please assure that all residents leave the home promptly, by the front door, with hands raised and empty. We would ask that you place any pets in one given room and explain their disposition to us while enjoying our piping hot, complimentary continental breakfast for participants as we implement FATRAT procedures and secure potentially harmful material from possible misuse.

Please be advised that non-compliance with the FATRAT procedures would be futile, and while we recognize that this event may cause initial stress, officer safety is everyone's duty in promoting a safer and more just society.

Respectfully ...

 

[THEIS]

Hi,

So I will ask this again.

Being the Supreme Court has ruled that LEO have absolutely no duty to protect me, my family, my neighbors, my friends, etc...then how can any judge sign off on an Emergency Risk "PROTECTION" Order? LEO is not in the business of protection.

You do not get to be held NOT accountable if someone robs me aka you protecting me AND get to PROTECT me, my family, my neighbors, my friends, etc in this type of event.....

Sincerely,
Theis

 

[Cheyenne Bodie]

This is simply the working model for what they hope will be a relatively bloodless (on their side) war of attrition.

Dear Mr. 2ndamendfan:

In working closely with our commercial partners, we have become aware that you have made a high number of firearm and ammunition transactions in the recent past. Your 3.12 mile proximity to a Catholic primary school, St. Obama's, has red-flagged you in the new Commonwealth Firearms and Ammunition Threat Removal Activities Task-force (FATRAT) database, created as part of our Commonwealth's new, sweeping "common sense" laws designed to create a safer and more just society.

Please be advised that you have been scheduled for an on-site relinquishment of all items in your control related to both powder-actuated and compressed air discharge of metallic/ceramic projectiles. As we are unable to precisely provide a time and date due to the overwhelming number of such procedures, rest assured that we will make every effort to come at a time when you are sure to be at home. Generally, this is in a pre-dawn time frame.

Your signal for compliance will be a telephone call to your residence upon our arrival. If you do not answer the phone, we will use five blasts of a siren from a suitable distance to your front door, along with the various emergency signal lights on the responding vehicles. Please assure that all residents leave the home promptly, by the front door, with hands raised and empty. We would ask that you place any pets in one given room and explain their disposition to us while enjoying our piping hot, complimentary continental breakfast for participants as we implement FATRAT procedures and secure potentially harmful material from possible misuse.

Please be advised that non-compliance with the FATRAT procedures would be futile, and while we recognize that this event may cause initial stress, officer safety is everyone's duty in promoting a safer and more just society.

Respectfully ...

This can't be real.

 

[2ndamendfan]

Hi,

So I will ask this again.

Being the Supreme Court has ruled that LEO have absolutely no duty to protect me, my family, my neighbors, my friends, etc...then how can any judge sign off on an Emergency Risk "PROTECTION" Order? LEO is not in the business of protection.

You do not get to be held NOT accountable if someone robs me aka you protecting me AND get to PROTECT me. my family, my neighbors, my friends, etc in this type of event.....

Sincerely,
Theis

You sir will be next. You think to much.

 

[SilentStalkr]

Blah blah. Like I have been saying, this is how they will bring it. Picking gun owners off one at a time while making them the bad guy. Nothing going to change. Slowly everyone will give in until there is nothing left.

 

[2ndamendfan]

This can't be real.

could be, the possibility exists.

 

[2ndamendfan]

This is simply the working model for what they hope will be a relatively bloodless (on their side) war of attrition.

Dear Mr. 2ndamendfan:
Your 3.12 mile proximity to a Catholic primary school.

That is pretty exact distance, makes me wonder if you know something about my local that I don't.
Nice font by the way.

 

[SilentStalkr]

So, 25% of the red flag deals they’ve enforced so far this year in Maryland have resulted in the death of the owner. Who wants to bet that’s up passed 50% in the next quarter?

 

[Cheyenne Bodie]

It'll certainly be abused, that's a given with any government power in my opinion. It's an inevitability. Absolute power corrupts absolutely.

There was another man that got killed because of the same shit, gimme a minute to look it up. Edit: Maybe not, can't seem to find it.

 

[Veer_G]

That is pretty exact distance, makes me wonder if you know something about my local that I don't.
Nice font by the way.

Luck of the draw, and trying to mimic an old field-fill on a computer-generated mass mailing form.

 

[Veer_G]

This can't be real.

You say that now ...

 

[SilentStalkr]

It'll certainly be abused, that's a given with any government power in my opinion. It's an inevitability. Absolute power corrupts absolutely.

There was another man that got killed because of the same shit, gimme a minute to look it up. Edit: Maybe not, can't seem to find it.

Maybe it was scrubbed? ??‍

 

[Cheyenne Bodie]

Or I was reading some shit from Australia and got turned around. I can't even find any more recent details about this incident, though.

I don't mean to be a fear monger but these laws are grade AAA bullshit. Planning to do the crimes that the red flag laws are predicated to work against is already illegal. These are things that require investigations, a home check, counseling— not wanton jackbooted searching and seizure. It's downright pathetic the common level and accuracy of security that the state provides if you ask me, and this law makes it even worse. Lady Justice getting drunk on that grapevine wine now, remember not to cuss your lefty sister out loud at Thanksgiving anymore.

 

[Rthur]

The anonymous factor will be abused greatly in the future I'll wager.
This is/will be the avenue to go wholesale on confiscation.
They are "dipping" their toe into the water atm.

R

 

[ArmyJerry]

This is why you unfriend communist relatives and friends, you cant have it both ways.

 

[BillOH]

It'll certainly be abused, that's a given with any government power in my opinion. It's an inevitability. Absolute power corrupts absolutely.

There was another man that got killed because of the same shit, gimme a minute to look it up. Edit: Maybe not, can't seem to find it.

The date on this incident is Nov 5, 2018. Maybe this is the one you are thinking about.

 

[Cheyenne Bodie]

Story in the OP was from Nov. 5, I thought there was another event like it but was probably mistaken.

Seriously, though. What crimes have been stopped by this law that were not able to be reasonably handled before? I don't really think you can argue that in and of itself the red flag laws have prevented shit at all.

 

[SilentStalkr]

Yeah, this is an old case from a couple months back. I thought this was a new one, as in another.

 

[Spblademaker]

Story in the OP was from Nov. 5, I thought there was another event like it but was probably mistaken.

Seriously, though. What crimes have been stopped by this law that were not able to be reasonably handled before? I don't really think you can argue that in and of itself the red flag laws have prevented shit at all.

“Cruelty to animals”. Well the police aren’t being looked down upon by the ASPCA. Now they get to shoot people instead of their dogs.

 

[Blue Sky Country]

Or I was reading some shit from Australia and got turned around. I can't even find any more recent details about this incident, though.

I don't mean to be a fear monger but these laws are grade AAA bullshit. Planning to do the crimes that the red flag laws are predicated to work against is already illegal. These are things that require investigations, a home check, counseling— not wanton jackbooted searching and seizure. It's downright pathetic the common level and accuracy of security that the state provides if you ask me, and this law makes it even worse. Lady Justice getting drunk on that grapevine wine now, remember not to cuss your lefty sister out loud at Thanksgiving anymore.

Having seen The Crucible not too long ago again, I just cannot help but see how serious of a problem and potentially disastrous the red flag legislations are going to be. Take a minute and think about the activities of the Renaissance era Inquisition and the New World colonial witch hunts. Just exactly how many people have died, were imprisoned, and lost their entire fortunes and livelihoods because they were targeted for having conflicting opinions we will never find out. I have a feeling though, that number would be quite high, if not nearing the majority.

Before red flag laws, if someone didn't like you because of your beliefs or your attitude towards certain things, they just had to accept it. Now, red flag laws WILL be used as a new form of swatting, like I had mentioned already some time ago. And unlike swatting version 1.0, the person doing the 'hit' cannot even be prosecuted for giving a bad or misleading tip, because the entire system acts upon 'suspicions' and 'he said, she said'.

NOTHING good can come out of red flag laws, and A LOT of families and friendships will be destroyed. As if there is not enough suspicion, paranoia, and distrust already...This will cause it to increase hundred-fold.

 

[wilson1911]

Did anyone come to his aide ? Or did we all just carry on as usual ? We must have all been yelling "molan labe" from our keyboards I guess. No cops or judges were hanged that I recall...

 

[Cheyenne Bodie]

Nah, nobody knew to even really expect it I bet. Sounds like he got into an argument with his sister the night before over their father's medical situation, and his sister either called the cops and they instituted the red flag, or his sister did it directly herself. I can't find any details on that aspect because, "A spokeswoman for the Maryland Judiciary denied a request to see any and all requests for protection orders made at the residence on Linwood Avenue, citing the law, which states that anything related to an order is confidential unless the court rules otherwise."

This shit is greasier than a family bucket of KFC either way.