Ok, I've looked at the FAQ posts tried the search option and still can't find any information to satisify me. At this point I have a basic understanding between the two. Aside from personal preference which reticle is better / user friendly? I'm currently considering a vortex viper pst 6x24x50 ffp. I have a Remington 700 tactical SPS AAC SD .308.
Rifle Scopes MOA reticle vs. MRAD reticle
- Thread starter TXpopo
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Re: MOA reticle vs. MRAD reticle
As long as the turrets match the knobs they work the same as far as dialing and holding it is just a different angular measurement. When it comes to actually using them I find Mils to be easier.
As long as the turrets match the knobs they work the same as far as dialing and holding it is just a different angular measurement. When it comes to actually using them I find Mils to be easier.
Re: MOA reticle vs. MRAD reticle
Personal preference. Both will work fine when combined with knobs in the same system. Use what you like and what will work with anyone you will be shooting with. No reason to use mils if all your shooting partners use MOA and vice versa.
Sorry no super answer.
Personal preference. Both will work fine when combined with knobs in the same system. Use what you like and what will work with anyone you will be shooting with. No reason to use mils if all your shooting partners use MOA and vice versa.
Sorry no super answer.
Re: MOA reticle vs. MRAD reticle
Rob hit it on the head. Look to see who you are shooting with so that you are all talking the same language. Other than that....6 to one way....half a dozen to the other
Rob hit it on the head. Look to see who you are shooting with so that you are all talking the same language. Other than that....6 to one way....half a dozen to the other
Re: MOA reticle vs. MRAD reticle
I took to the converting of the MIL/MOA system pretty easily. I have always just made the calculations, checked my data cards, dialed, and shot. I was getting pretty good with my conversions, but was never completely comfortable. The biggest problem with this system, is the time that it takes to do all the math just to make a shot. LOTS OF TIME.
I have now switched over to a MIL/MIL scope, and I couldn't be happier with it!! Now having worked with it quite a bit, it is becoming more and more second nature to me. I wish I would have gone this route a LONG time ago.
I have not spent alot of time behind a MOA/MOA scope, but I am sure that it is comparable to MIL/MIL is most aspects. But I definitely like my MIL/MIL setup.
MIL/MIL gets my vote!!
DK
I took to the converting of the MIL/MOA system pretty easily. I have always just made the calculations, checked my data cards, dialed, and shot. I was getting pretty good with my conversions, but was never completely comfortable. The biggest problem with this system, is the time that it takes to do all the math just to make a shot. LOTS OF TIME.
I have now switched over to a MIL/MIL scope, and I couldn't be happier with it!! Now having worked with it quite a bit, it is becoming more and more second nature to me. I wish I would have gone this route a LONG time ago.
I have not spent alot of time behind a MOA/MOA scope, but I am sure that it is comparable to MIL/MIL is most aspects. But I definitely like my MIL/MIL setup.
MIL/MIL gets my vote!!
DK
Re: MOA reticle vs. MRAD reticle
Like everyone has said, it's a personal preference. I chose MOA/MOA because it initially seemed easier. Now that I understand both systems, they are about the same, but I would still choose MOA again. Either way, the Vortex PST is an awesome scope and you be fine.
Like everyone has said, it's a personal preference. I chose MOA/MOA because it initially seemed easier. Now that I understand both systems, they are about the same, but I would still choose MOA again. Either way, the Vortex PST is an awesome scope and you be fine.
Re: MOA reticle vs. MRAD reticle
I like moa/moa. But it is very Ford/Chevy. I started out on moa so see no need to switch. It is.handy to know both and use the one that seems natural to you
I like moa/moa. But it is very Ford/Chevy. I started out on moa so see no need to switch. It is.handy to know both and use the one that seems natural to you
Re: MOA reticle vs. MRAD reticle
If you have little to no experience with either, it's not going to matter which one you choose. Just pick one and stick with it. The concept is the same with both. Every time a poll is conducted on here, more people choose mil/mil though.
If you have little to no experience with either, it's not going to matter which one you choose. Just pick one and stick with it. The concept is the same with both. Every time a poll is conducted on here, more people choose mil/mil though.
Re: MOA reticle vs. MRAD reticle
For static shooting like F Class I prefer MOA reticle with MOA knobs, but I find MOA reticles from any manufacture too fine for shooting movers or multiple targets at varying distances, Mils are perfect for this type of shooting, if you think of shooting in precision rifle comps definitely go Mils, it's what the winners all use.
For static shooting like F Class I prefer MOA reticle with MOA knobs, but I find MOA reticles from any manufacture too fine for shooting movers or multiple targets at varying distances, Mils are perfect for this type of shooting, if you think of shooting in precision rifle comps definitely go Mils, it's what the winners all use.
Re: MOA reticle vs. MRAD reticle
From a shooter/spotter point of view, I prefer to give and recieve corrections in mils vs MOA. Mils being decimals vs fractions, it just seems easier, no system is more accurate than the other.
Kirk R
From a shooter/spotter point of view, I prefer to give and recieve corrections in mils vs MOA. Mils being decimals vs fractions, it just seems easier, no system is more accurate than the other.
Kirk R
Re: MOA reticle vs. MRAD reticle
I agree with most of the aforementioned. mil/mil or moa/moa is the way to go if you can get them. It's also really handy to know the conversions in case you get a mixed scope. Most of them in fact are still made that way {mil/moa}.
One trap I always suggest you avoid is BDC. These are scopes that have your ballistic drops in the reticle. The problem with them is if you change altitude or temperature, they are off. And, since they aren't regulated distances like mil or moa you then have to try and convert from you don't know what.
FFP is nice in that you never have to worry that your scope might be on the wrong setting for your reticle to work. However, in extreme ranges, SFP is nice in that you can increase the intervals of stadia and compute a longer shot. That's only when you run out of dial and reticle.
I agree with most of the aforementioned. mil/mil or moa/moa is the way to go if you can get them. It's also really handy to know the conversions in case you get a mixed scope. Most of them in fact are still made that way {mil/moa}.
One trap I always suggest you avoid is BDC. These are scopes that have your ballistic drops in the reticle. The problem with them is if you change altitude or temperature, they are off. And, since they aren't regulated distances like mil or moa you then have to try and convert from you don't know what.
FFP is nice in that you never have to worry that your scope might be on the wrong setting for your reticle to work. However, in extreme ranges, SFP is nice in that you can increase the intervals of stadia and compute a longer shot. That's only when you run out of dial and reticle.
Re: MOA reticle vs. MRAD reticle
A scope with 1/4 MOA clicks will provide a slightly finer adjustment than one with 1/10 mil clicks (.262 IPHY vs .36 IPHY) but the most important thing besides comfort with your chosen system is reticle matching the turrets IMHO. I know how to do the conversion in my head and am quite good with math, but why complicate things unnecessarily?
Also, a reticle graduated in MOA is a little less prone to errors based on estimating fractions of the unit than Mils... what I mean is a reticle graduated in MOA, even if there are only hash marks every MOA, is still graduated finer than a reticle with full and half Mil hash marks. A full MOA is only 1.047 IPHY while half a Mil is 1.8 IPHY.
Personally I latched onto the Mil system because some of the first scopes I bought with ranging reticles were Mil-dot.
Joe
A scope with 1/4 MOA clicks will provide a slightly finer adjustment than one with 1/10 mil clicks (.262 IPHY vs .36 IPHY) but the most important thing besides comfort with your chosen system is reticle matching the turrets IMHO. I know how to do the conversion in my head and am quite good with math, but why complicate things unnecessarily?
Also, a reticle graduated in MOA is a little less prone to errors based on estimating fractions of the unit than Mils... what I mean is a reticle graduated in MOA, even if there are only hash marks every MOA, is still graduated finer than a reticle with full and half Mil hash marks. A full MOA is only 1.047 IPHY while half a Mil is 1.8 IPHY.
Personally I latched onto the Mil system because some of the first scopes I bought with ranging reticles were Mil-dot.
Joe
Re: MOA reticle vs. MRAD reticle
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: scudzuki</div><div class="ubbcode-body">A scope with 1/4 MOA clicks will provide a slightly finer adjustment than one with 1/10 mil clicks (.262 IPHY vs .36 IPHY) </div></div>
This has been brought up hundreds of times and it's a non issue. The difference is 1" at 1000 yards. If you can shoot inside that then you are on a whole different level.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: scudzuki</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
Also, a reticle graduated in MOA is a little less prone to errors based on estimating fractions of the unit than Mils... what I mean is a reticle graduated in MOA, even if there are only hash marks every MOA, is still graduated finer than a reticle with full and half Mil hash marks. A full MOA is only 1.047 IPHY while half a Mil is 1.8 IPHY.
</div></div>
Knowing how to break down a reticle, any reticle, is what comes with practice. I can break my mil reticle down to .05 mils. Most anyone can break a mil reticle down to .1 mil. The above isn't a reason to pick one over the other.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: scudzuki</div><div class="ubbcode-body">A scope with 1/4 MOA clicks will provide a slightly finer adjustment than one with 1/10 mil clicks (.262 IPHY vs .36 IPHY) </div></div>
This has been brought up hundreds of times and it's a non issue. The difference is 1" at 1000 yards. If you can shoot inside that then you are on a whole different level.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: scudzuki</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
Also, a reticle graduated in MOA is a little less prone to errors based on estimating fractions of the unit than Mils... what I mean is a reticle graduated in MOA, even if there are only hash marks every MOA, is still graduated finer than a reticle with full and half Mil hash marks. A full MOA is only 1.047 IPHY while half a Mil is 1.8 IPHY.
</div></div>
Knowing how to break down a reticle, any reticle, is what comes with practice. I can break my mil reticle down to .05 mils. Most anyone can break a mil reticle down to .1 mil. The above isn't a reason to pick one over the other.
Re: MOA reticle vs. MRAD reticle
I was just wondering this same question when I sold the same rifle you have to get the exact same scope you're looking at for a new rifle. I went with the mil/mil because I already know how to range with mils and now if I miss a shot the correction will be very simple. I am waiting for my mount though so I haven't actually used the scope yet.
I was just wondering this same question when I sold the same rifle you have to get the exact same scope you're looking at for a new rifle. I went with the mil/mil because I already know how to range with mils and now if I miss a shot the correction will be very simple. I am waiting for my mount though so I haven't actually used the scope yet.
Re: MOA reticle vs. MRAD reticle
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Rob01</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: scudzuki</div><div class="ubbcode-body">A scope with 1/4 MOA clicks will provide a slightly finer adjustment than one with 1/10 mil clicks (.262 IPHY vs .36 IPHY) </div></div>
This has been brought up hundreds of times and it's a non issue. The difference is 1" at 1000 yards. If you can shoot inside that then you are on a whole different level.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: scudzuki</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
Also, a reticle graduated in MOA is a little less prone to errors based on estimating fractions of the unit than Mils... what I mean is a reticle graduated in MOA, even if there are only hash marks every MOA, is still graduated finer than a reticle with full and half Mil hash marks. A full MOA is only 1.047 IPHY while half a Mil is 1.8 IPHY.
</div></div>
Knowing how to break down a reticle, any reticle, is what comes with practice. I can break my mil reticle down to .05 mils. Most anyone can break a mil reticle down to .1 mil. The above isn't a reason to pick one over the other. </div></div>
You will notice I did not provide an opinion as to which was better, just facts.
I just threw the facts out there for the OP to digest and make his own decision.
Since they are both units of angular measure, neither has an advantage in my mind, but the OP should have all the facts to make a proper decision. Also, it is possible that by breaking it down the way I did, the OP can draw some conclusions of his own that will affect his decision.
Maybe it's not for you to say whether they are important enough distinctions for the OP to consider since you are not him.
Joe
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Rob01</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: scudzuki</div><div class="ubbcode-body">A scope with 1/4 MOA clicks will provide a slightly finer adjustment than one with 1/10 mil clicks (.262 IPHY vs .36 IPHY) </div></div>
This has been brought up hundreds of times and it's a non issue. The difference is 1" at 1000 yards. If you can shoot inside that then you are on a whole different level.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: scudzuki</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
Also, a reticle graduated in MOA is a little less prone to errors based on estimating fractions of the unit than Mils... what I mean is a reticle graduated in MOA, even if there are only hash marks every MOA, is still graduated finer than a reticle with full and half Mil hash marks. A full MOA is only 1.047 IPHY while half a Mil is 1.8 IPHY.
</div></div>
Knowing how to break down a reticle, any reticle, is what comes with practice. I can break my mil reticle down to .05 mils. Most anyone can break a mil reticle down to .1 mil. The above isn't a reason to pick one over the other. </div></div>
You will notice I did not provide an opinion as to which was better, just facts.
I just threw the facts out there for the OP to digest and make his own decision.
Since they are both units of angular measure, neither has an advantage in my mind, but the OP should have all the facts to make a proper decision. Also, it is possible that by breaking it down the way I did, the OP can draw some conclusions of his own that will affect his decision.
Maybe it's not for you to say whether they are important enough distinctions for the OP to consider since you are not him.
Joe
Re: MOA reticle vs. MRAD reticle
Sorry your first statement was misleading in the amount it matters in real world use. The second statement was wrong saying mils were more prome to mistakes and needed clarifying.
Sorry your first statement was misleading in the amount it matters in real world use. The second statement was wrong saying mils were more prome to mistakes and needed clarifying.
Re: MOA reticle vs. MRAD reticle
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Rob01</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Sorry your first statement was misleading in the amount it matters in real world use. The second statement was wrong saying mils were more prome to mistakes and needed clarifying. </div></div>
You are entitled to your opinion and I am entitled to mine.
Myself, I choose a scale graduated in sixty-fourths of an inch over a scale graduated in sixteenths of an inch when I am trying to measure more accurately. 20 years in the machine shop reinforces my experience that I can more precisely measure with a higher degree of confidence with a scale that has finer graduations, and you will never convince me otherwise.
Joe
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Rob01</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Sorry your first statement was misleading in the amount it matters in real world use. The second statement was wrong saying mils were more prome to mistakes and needed clarifying. </div></div>
You are entitled to your opinion and I am entitled to mine.
Myself, I choose a scale graduated in sixty-fourths of an inch over a scale graduated in sixteenths of an inch when I am trying to measure more accurately. 20 years in the machine shop reinforces my experience that I can more precisely measure with a higher degree of confidence with a scale that has finer graduations, and you will never convince me otherwise.
Joe
Re: MOA reticle vs. MRAD reticle
Honestly I don't care what you choose but 20 years of shooting precision tactical rifles and looking through scopes is where my posts are coming from. If you notice I didn't give my opinion on if one is better than the other but just info to help the OP by clarifying your post.
Honestly I don't care what you choose but 20 years of shooting precision tactical rifles and looking through scopes is where my posts are coming from. If you notice I didn't give my opinion on if one is better than the other but just info to help the OP by clarifying your post.
Re: MOA reticle vs. MRAD reticle
MOA, I have both and choose MOA myself. I find it easier. I realy don;t understand how people say it's easier. I have no trouble using either system but MOA is what I choose. Fixing to buy 2 more Nighforce scopes and guess what. MOA all the way (hey, that rhymes) another reason to use MOA. The ONLY reason I can see that one get the big upper hand has already been stated. If all your friends use mils then go mils. Both do the same exact thing so if one makes starting the learning curve easier. Thats what I would choose. When I started LR shooting. My friend Tom Sarver used MOA and he told me to get MOA from mils. I did and the people calling my shots were MOA so it made it very easy to correct. Hope I made sense. Good luck.
MOA, I have both and choose MOA myself. I find it easier. I realy don;t understand how people say it's easier. I have no trouble using either system but MOA is what I choose. Fixing to buy 2 more Nighforce scopes and guess what. MOA all the way (hey, that rhymes) another reason to use MOA. The ONLY reason I can see that one get the big upper hand has already been stated. If all your friends use mils then go mils. Both do the same exact thing so if one makes starting the learning curve easier. Thats what I would choose. When I started LR shooting. My friend Tom Sarver used MOA and he told me to get MOA from mils. I did and the people calling my shots were MOA so it made it very easy to correct. Hope I made sense. Good luck.
Re: MOA reticle vs. MRAD reticle
There are ample fantastic shooters who are successful with either system. The point to take away is go with on mode and become very proficient at it. Real world experience has proven it doesn't matter...the difference between one vs. the other.
There are ample fantastic shooters who are successful with either system. The point to take away is go with on mode and become very proficient at it. Real world experience has proven it doesn't matter...the difference between one vs. the other.
Re: MOA reticle vs. MRAD reticle
It seems Bench Rest and F class shooters like MOA. It is a finer adjustment, and you can get 1/8 MOA turrets for even finer adjustment. This could be useful for dialing in on a 1/2 MOA target at distance.
However, in a tactical application, it would be a big pain in the ass to have to dial more clicks with 1/8 MOA turrets when the application doesn't require the finer adjustment.
For ranging the math is probably easier with Mil, but if you already are familiar with MOA, that may not hold true for you.
It seems Bench Rest and F class shooters like MOA. It is a finer adjustment, and you can get 1/8 MOA turrets for even finer adjustment. This could be useful for dialing in on a 1/2 MOA target at distance.
However, in a tactical application, it would be a big pain in the ass to have to dial more clicks with 1/8 MOA turrets when the application doesn't require the finer adjustment.
For ranging the math is probably easier with Mil, but if you already are familiar with MOA, that may not hold true for you.
Re: MOA reticle vs. MRAD reticle
As mentioned above, I see no difference in mil or MOA for LR shooting. Just be sure your reticle and knobs match !
As mentioned above, I see no difference in mil or MOA for LR shooting. Just be sure your reticle and knobs match !
Re: MOA reticle vs. MRAD reticle
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Rob01</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Personal preference. Both will work fine when combined with knobs in the same system. Use what you like and what will work with anyone you will be shooting with. No reason to use mils if all your shooting partners use MOA and vice versa.
Sorry no super answer. </div></div>
^ What he said ^, I like the NF NXS w/ MOAR reticle
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Rob01</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Personal preference. Both will work fine when combined with knobs in the same system. Use what you like and what will work with anyone you will be shooting with. No reason to use mils if all your shooting partners use MOA and vice versa.
Sorry no super answer. </div></div>
^ What he said ^, I like the NF NXS w/ MOAR reticle
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