It’s not like proof doesn’t have a machine shop that could spin some up or contract someone to spec Sigs dimensions.
- Thread starter oda175365
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Sure, if they could get the full part specs, prints and license to produce it. The barrel extension isn't terribly beefy and it's made to contain the bolt thrust on a tapered lug bearing surface from some large number of 80ksi .277 Fury loads. I'd guess it's made of somewhat nonstandard material, probably with important processing requirements. More to it than spin up something close in 416 barrel steel, sounds like they are working through the details.... Or getting the Heisman from Sig. Honestly if I was the cognizant Sig engineer I don't know if I would want barrel shops producing the extensions, I think I'd rather supply them if I had enough.
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Sig will warranty this for sure.
Rails and barrels need to be made an assembled straight to be fit for purpose.
Maybe good $20 spent on laser bore sighter.
That could tell you if chamber points crooked without using the optical base / rail etc.
Two unique optics showing similar (or dis-similar) alignment problems can help to isolate issues with rail/mount.
Of course it’s not as easy as just spinning it up, but if they can figure out how to make Apache barrels, I’m pretty sure they can figure out the Cross. They are in the business of steel, so they should have metallurgy knowledge to handle whatever pressure would stand a Fury load.
Maybe they could, doesn't change the fact that they would still need full part/process specs, prints and license to produce it. The discussion was on why companies can't get Cross extensions, I'm guessing lack of supply and unwillingness from Sig to share the above is why.
That's probably one of the simplest parts of an Apache, but still interesting that Proof makes some widgets for the bigs, beyond basic small arms.
Thanks for the advise! I have used several quality mounts and a variety of optics. Consistent 13 mils off. I used SIG’s contact option on their website. Hopefully they have an easy fix or maybe this has showed up in other rifles.
To “Ride West”, thanks for the advise too. Nothing touching the barrel. Only used the provided SIG thread protector and the barrel “looks” relatively strait. I’m going to save the money and bypass a Smith as this rifle is less than 2 weeks old. I just can’t pay, or shouldn’t have to pay for a problem I’m confident at this time is something with the rifle.
I did take the picatinny rail off and there is no adjustment, as the screw to rail interface assures alignment.
I’m in the waiting game for SIG to respond. The rifle shoots for sure, but I’m currently forced to use a 34mm tube optic for what was primarily a hunting rifle.
I just moved to CO and was hoping for something light with good ergonomics for hinting mule deer.
Blessings all and thanks!
Just curious. This was a new scope that is 13mil off of center? If so that sucks. I swapped scopes to my cross and think I needed to adjust between 4 and 5mil left. Since it was already zeroed on another Rifle I'm not sure where that 4-5mil shift lands in relation to centered.
Yes, new. I bought it last week on Bass Pro’s clearance sale. I’m assuming it hasn’t been in their inventory long. It is post trigger issue for sure.
BTW, I tried three proven scopes. LHT 3-15, EOTECH VUDU 5-25, and a LHT 4.5-22. The 4.5-22 was relatively new, and I initially blamed it. After trying the other two and a variety of mounts, Seekins x2, badger, larue and accutac, I get consistent results.
I would almost think I could “see” 13 mils of difference as I can easily recognize various bases, but everything looks strait.
I would almost think I could “see” 13 mils of difference as I can easily recognize various bases, but everything looks strait.
I recall needed to dial a fair amount of windage to obtain a zero with both scopes I've had mounted to my Cross - can't recall how much, but it was a least a few mils in each case. Each one has been mounted in a different unimount of decent quality and so I'm pretty sure that narrows down the issue to the alignment between the rail and barrel bore.
I'm about to try yet another scope on the rifle and will pay better attention this time.
I'm about to try yet another scope on the rifle and will pay better attention this time.
13 mils is off on windage is crazy, mine did not require much adjustment with either barrel, and a few different scopes. Sending it back is probably the best thing to do, but I'd personally be curious to pull the barrel and rail, since it's pretty easy, inspect and re-seat/torque everything and see if that made any difference.
How much were they on sale at Bass Pro BTW? I've been keeping an eye out for another short, light, adjustable .308 and, at least given the luck I've had on my first Cross, haven't seen anything that really compares at the price point. I'm thinking about just getting another Cross in .308.
How much were they on sale at Bass Pro BTW? I've been keeping an eye out for another short, light, adjustable .308 and, at least given the luck I've had on my first Cross, haven't seen anything that really compares at the price point. I'm thinking about just getting another Cross in .308.
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The 6.5CM was $1349.00 w/ 5% off coupon, so around $1282.00. I don’t think the .308 was on sale.
The Cross is unique and I’m liking the weight and fitment. Trigger is surprising good too. If it wasn’t for the alignment issue, the rifle would’ve hard to beat for what I’m intending it for.
I’ll probably will take it apart tonight. I’m curious to it’s design anyway.
Thanks
The Cross is unique and I’m liking the weight and fitment. Trigger is surprising good too. If it wasn’t for the alignment issue, the rifle would’ve hard to beat for what I’m intending it for.
I’ll probably will take it apart tonight. I’m curious to it’s design anyway.
Thanks
Be forewarned, the spring for the bolt release is just floating loose under the top rail...it will fall right out when you take the rail off.
Got the new scope mounted, and my recollection was wrong - about half a mil was all it took to get a rough zero (might be another tenth or two required to refine it on a nicer day).
So now I'm left wondering what other rifle it was that required so much windage
Damnit, I have a notebook in my tool box for a reason, but it doesn't work if I don't write down anything.
This in a .223 with actually being accurate (which sounds hard right now) would be amazing. Id be all over it.
50/50? Lol, looking back through the thread it seems like most folks who have one are pretty happy, with a few lemons, hardly 50/50.
I guess it depends on what your accuracy expectations are. Maybe I should keep them in check since it isnt my AI and its not AI price either.
Lol, not nearly. And the loudest guy complaining admitted that his rifle was just fine all along.
However yes. You need to keep in mind that this rifle is cheaper then some chassis' alone.
Yep, got to keep expectations realistic, if you're looking for a PRS custom rig or AI replacement for 1/4 the price, you're going to be disappointed. If you're looking for a short, light, adjustable, suppressed factory hunting rifle that's plenty accurate to whack game at any halfway reasonable ranges in the field, after having hiked several miles in... well that's where I think the Cross looks pretty good.
Does a new match grade barrel solve all of my concerns or is it more than just the barrel if I do have an issue?
Buy it and shoot it first. Then if you have accuracy issues, more than likely Sig would either fix it or a match grade, custom barrel would be the ticket.
So is 1/2 to 3/4 moa not good enough for a lightweight hunting rifle? Mine and many others in this thread shoot right at that with factory ammo.
Cross is not a target rifle. It weighs 7 pounds. All up.
If your not going to fold it and hike with it, your missing out on its value proposition.
EG a tikka light is half its price.
Having just finished the second hunting season with the Cross, I’m of the opinion that it is a damn good hunting rifle for the type of hunting I do. Which is west Texas, deer, hogs and turkey, mostly from a box blind at 100-150 yards, with hand loaded ammo, suppressed. All I have is a 500 yard range so long range is not a required capability, but the Cross is light, compact, fits well and is the most accurate rifle I have. It’s also the only bolt action I own. That said, it is not the rifle I would choose for long range, tactical applications or if the goal was to shoot single hole groups from a bench. There are much better tools for those jobs.
It has been said that accuracy means different things to different people, but this is what it means to me. I have two .308 loads for the Cross, 165 grain Sierra Game Kings over Varget and 168 grain Sierra Match Kings over Ramshot TAC. Fiddled around with some Berger bullets and other powders, but this what I have on hand and will last me for the foreseeable future or until the supply situation improves. I typically zero for the match rounds and the game rounds are close enough. Before this rifle season started I checked 100 yard zero and decided to adjust for the game load. This target has three groups, the three round group was first, adjusted windage and shot two, then backed off the windage, moved the elevation, fired one and called it good. I should mention that my brother was also shooting his custom built Creedmore at the target next to mine. He has around two and a half times the investment in his weapon and was getting around two and a half times larger group sizes, with factory ammo. However, we were both happy with accuracy of our guns and either will get the job done.
It has been said that accuracy means different things to different people, but this is what it means to me. I have two .308 loads for the Cross, 165 grain Sierra Game Kings over Varget and 168 grain Sierra Match Kings over Ramshot TAC. Fiddled around with some Berger bullets and other powders, but this what I have on hand and will last me for the foreseeable future or until the supply situation improves. I typically zero for the match rounds and the game rounds are close enough. Before this rifle season started I checked 100 yard zero and decided to adjust for the game load. This target has three groups, the three round group was first, adjusted windage and shot two, then backed off the windage, moved the elevation, fired one and called it good. I should mention that my brother was also shooting his custom built Creedmore at the target next to mine. He has around two and a half times the investment in his weapon and was getting around two and a half times larger group sizes, with factory ammo. However, we were both happy with accuracy of our guns and either will get the job done.
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You will spend more and currently have a harder time finding the 6. 5CM. .308 is a heavier round in general and not affected by wind as much.
Probably addressed already on prefits, but same as SSG-3000, Blaser R8, Blaser R93 or anything else where the bolt locks into an extension.
The extension has to be hard and tough "as fuck" to deal with it.
SIG Sauer had done this before with the SSG-3000, and maybe the Amerikaner Engineers don't know what the Deutche Meisterbuchsenmachers know about this.
Big fan of SIG SSG-3000, and R8. Owned a slug of R93's before someone had their face ripped off by using pistol powder in their reloads and everyone freaked out.
The extension has to be hard and tough "as fuck" to deal with it.
SIG Sauer had done this before with the SSG-3000, and maybe the Amerikaner Engineers don't know what the Deutche Meisterbuchsenmachers know about this.
Big fan of SIG SSG-3000, and R8. Owned a slug of R93's before someone had their face ripped off by using pistol powder in their reloads and everyone freaked out.
308 Winchester is generally more affected by wind than 6.5 creedmoor, at least with typical factory hunting loads for each cartridge.
BC is more more of a factor in wind drift than how much a projectile weighs.
This. Within 400ish yards there isn’t a massive difference. After that the 6.5 really starts to buck the wind way better than a 308 round
Kay.
Update: Sig contacted me, and I’ll be working via telephone today to start the “discovery” process. My word not theirs. At this point, I’m impressed with the Sig CS. Contact was within 3 days over the holidays with a personal email. That is a good start.
Blessings,
Blessings,
I don’t know how I missed this. I guess I’m getting old. The Barrel is obviously not in alignment. See pics. Sig sent me a label and the rifle is going back. I plan to track the actual turn around and real repair outcome. Too bad an accurate rifle is limited by a barrel that is so out of alignment that many scopes can’t be used.
Blessings,
Blessings,
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Had the same seeming misalignment on my Cross also, but mine shoots straight.
Took off the handguard and retorqued the screws incrementally, and it put everything back into center. In my case it was the handguard, not the barrel that was just not quite torqued in properly.
I finally got to put my hands on a Sig Cross 6.5 at a local store. I was impressed by the trigger, smoothness of the bolt, and ergonomics. Folding the stock turned into a goat rope at the store. The guy showing me the rifle said the same about folding the stock. But he explained he had the same rifle and just hit a coyote at 320 yards this past weekend. He did say the stock does get easier to fold once you figure it out, lol.
I have a Bergara B-14 HMR (Hunting & Match Rifle) 6.5 Creedmoor Molded MiniChassis Stock that I'm going to sell to save up for the Sig Cross. I should really stop going into this local store, lol.
I have a Bergara B-14 HMR (Hunting & Match Rifle) 6.5 Creedmoor Molded MiniChassis Stock that I'm going to sell to save up for the Sig Cross. I should really stop going into this local store, lol.
Thats the only one I've ever seen have a hard time.
No issue on my bolt. Not many rounds through the rifle, but smooth manipulation with positive feeding and extraction. I’ve only used various commercial “match” ammo selections, and the chamber and rifle are clean with no real debris to cause issues either.
As to my barrel issue, disassembly and reassembly still fails to produce alignment. I’ll let Sig figure it out as it seems barrel to extension or extension to receiver interface is not “true.”
BC
As to my barrel issue, disassembly and reassembly still fails to produce alignment. I’ll let Sig figure it out as it seems barrel to extension or extension to receiver interface is not “true.”
BC
Mine has ~0.050" cock on close, but I think that's just how the action is designed. When working the action slow I can feel it, but working it normally, not so much. Can't remember if it had that before the trigger recall or not, it's not the silky smoothest bolt I have had for sure, but it doesn't bind (something I cannot abide) and is perfectly serviceable. Having to smash the bolt handle down sounds like an ammo/chamber size issue. I have occasionally had a hard close on various rifles after a few firings with minimum sizing, and the fix has always been to size another thou or two.
Ya I know what you mean. On the MAC video he legit is smashing it with his palm on every single round. Something was certainly way off with his
Mine was tough to close at the beginning until all 3 lugs galled. Knocked the highs off with a stone and it's been smooth since. Had to do something because Sig CS has ghosted me and I had to take it with me on a hunt. Not the best feeling.
How did you like it for the hunt? I am probably going to pick one up soon.
It was awesome. 10/10 would use it again. It has less of the nostalgia of taking a high end custom or fancy wood stocked rifle and more of the use it like a tool vibe for me.
My hunting rifle last year was an old savage 110 I got as a kid and that I had spruced up a bit, and I gotta say it felt different this year. Not a bad thing, but this Sig Cross didnt make the photos and I won't hesitate to sell it off when the next best lightweight tool/cross Gen2 comes out.
I went 6.5 because I had components and found one available. I also wanted it to double as a packable varmint rifle and the lighter weight bullets like the 90gr Varmageddon just sound like fun.
Either will work within 400 yards. Id go with whatever is most available in your area. More than likely ammo will continue to be a struggle for atleast another year I bet.
I guess it really depends on how you intend to use the rifle. I would let that dictate your choice of caliber, more than the current ammo availability.
My LGS is getting in more factory 6.5 CM ammo, and I have been able to buy the reloading supplies I need, although at an increased cost.
At close to midrange distances and for hunting, nothing wrong with a .308 and chances are you can find that cartridge pretty much anywhere.
If you want to stretch the distances, value high BC projectiles, prefer less felt recoil. Then maybe the 6.5 CM makes more sense.
I sent an email to Sig customer service asking about different bolt heads and barrel extensions. Figured it can't hurt that they know people are interested. Will update if I hear anything.
