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PVA Status Updates: Hancock Rifle & NUCLEUS Barreled Action

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Did some testing with 130gr Berger hybrids in the Hancock today (6.5cm)

It’s safe it’s say the rifle loves these. The accuracy was extremely good across charge weights.

Keenin mind I’m a jittery fucker on my best day so these are exceptional groups for my ability.
CB3F950E-F20A-4F3C-9F82-4E4992B321CB.jpeg62EF3C50-B44F-4186-B361-F60ACE70B8F4.jpeg2ABA16E2-5C0B-40EB-9AE4-A39B97F135C4.jpeg

Everything I shoot in this gun shoots well but these were particularly good, and their consistent accuracy across all charge weights makes me favor these.

Very happy with the gun.
 
Did some testing with 130gr Berger hybrids in the Hancock today (6.5cm)

It’s safe it’s say the rifle loves these. The accuracy was extremely good across charge weights.

Keenin mind I’m a jittery fucker on my best day so these are exceptional groups for my ability.
View attachment 7033132View attachment 7033133View attachment 7033134

Everything I shoot in this gun shoots well but these were particularly good, and their consistent accuracy across all charge weights makes me favor these.

Very happy with the gun.

Dammit! Nice shooting.

?
 
Did some testing with 130gr Berger hybrids in the Hancock today (6.5cm)

It’s safe it’s say the rifle loves these. The accuracy was extremely good across charge weights.

Keenin mind I’m a jittery fucker on my best day so these are exceptional groups for my ability.
View attachment 7033132View attachment 7033133View attachment 7033134

Everything I shoot in this gun shoots well but these were particularly good, and their consistent accuracy across all charge weights makes me favor these.

Very happy with the gun.
Exceptional shooting! I wish I was that "jittery".

What is your load for the 130 Hybrids, if you don't mind me askin?

I am about to begin handloading for mine, I just wanted to put a few rounds through it first. But all the factory stuff I have put through mine has been great. I have shot Prime, 140gr ELD Match, and some old 140gr A-Max, all factory ammo.

The JHR is a tack-driving hammer!!! I am so dang happy I waited "patiently".
 
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Exceptional shooting! I wish I was that "jittery".

What is your load for the 130 Hybrids, if you don't mind me askin?

I am about to begin handloading for mine, I just wanted to put a few rounds through it first. But all the factory stuff I have put through mine has been great. I have shot Prime, 140gr ELD Match, and some old 140gr A-Max, all factory ammo.

The JHR is a tack-driving hammer!!! I am so dang happy I waited "patiently".

Obligatory “don’t copy or blow your face off please”

Lapua small primer brass with FGMM primers

H4350 42.4 gr @ 2865 SD 5-8

20 from lands. I need to play more with seating depth but 20 seems great. These really don’t seem to like being jammed or even really close to lands.

RL17 also worked very well with 42.2 gr but my magnetospeed starter refusing to return speeds and I think it may be dead.

An oddity is that my Lapua brass has heavy bolt lift even on low charges with zero pressure signs. I am full length resizing with a Redding bushing die. I need to size a batch with another die and see if the issue persists.

All the groups I have shot looking for optimal charge weight have been so good I’ve just settled on something decent speed wise with low SD and ES and called it good. I’d like to do some actual ladder testing when I find the time at to be home for more than a day.


Also, trust me, you can be just as jittery as me ?
I constantly harp on what a bad shooter I am because I can never seem to naturally flow into shooting well. I have to actively, constantly, and persistently remind myself to pay attention to what I’m doing or I will absolutely butcher a perfectly good mag of ammo. A ton of dry fire has helped but I still shake like crazy and I don’t know if anything will ever fix that.

I swear to god I’m going to break my own finger one day when I get sick of catching myself slapping the trigger when I’m excited. Lol
 
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I have the 19lb spring from the beginning and have cleaned the bolt assembly. Running a Jewel trigger in my Nucleus. Have had 2 light primer strikes in my first 60 rounds. Running Peterson Palma small primer brass. CCI mag SRP primers. Put both of the unfired rounds in my other build which a Savage target action was used and they fired. Frustrated. 6.5 Creedmoor
 
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I have the 19lb spring from the beginning and have cleaned the bolt assembly. Running a Jewel trigger in my Nucleus. Have had 2 light primer strikes in my first 60 rounds. Running Peterson Palma small primer brass. CCI mag SRP primers. Put both of the unfired rounds in my other build which a Savage target action was used and they fired. Frustrated.

From my readings, I'm not surprised to hear your experience. I would be frustrated as well. Strange that the Nucleus is advertised as being such a reliable and robust design, yet I doubt there has ever been a custom action that was ever as picky when it comes to trigger compatibility, sear engagement, FP protrusion, fire-control maintenance/cleaning, etc.
 
From my readings, I'm not surprised to hear your experience. I would be frustrated as well. Strange that the Nucleus is advertised as being such a reliable and robust design, yet I doubt there has ever been a custom action that was ever as picky when it comes to trigger compatibility, sear engagement, FP protrusion, fire-control maintenance/cleaning, etc.
It’s frustrating but I’ll figure it out.
 
Obligatory “don’t copy or blow your face off please”

Lapua small primer brass with FGMM primers

H4350 42.4 gr @ 2865 SD 5-8

20 from lands. I need to play more with seating depth but 20 seems great. These really don’t seem to like being jammed or even really close to lands.

RL17 also worked very well with 42.2 gr but my magnetospeed starter refusing to return speeds and I think it may be dead.

An oddity is that my Lapua brass has heavy bolt lift even on low charges with zero pressure signs. I am full length resizing with a Redding bushing die. I need to size a batch with another die and see if the issue persists.

All the groups I have shot looking for optimal charge weight have been so good I’ve just settled on something decent speed wise with low SD and ES and called it good. I’d like to do some actual ladder testing when I find the time at to be home for more than a day.


Also, trust me, you can be just as jittery as me ?
I constantly harp on what a bad shooter I am because I can never seem to naturally flow into shooting well. I have to actively, constantly, and persistently remind myself to pay attention to what I’m doing or I will absolutely butcher a perfectly good mag of ammo. A ton of dry fire has helped but I still shake like crazy and I don’t know if anything will ever fix that.

I swear to god I’m going to break my own finger one day when I get sick of catching myself slapping the trigger when I’m excited. Lol

I wouldn’t even bother to continue burning barrel life on load development with those results, unless you just get a kick out of the scientific nature of the process.
 
I wouldn’t even bother to continue burning barrel life on load development with those results, unless you just get a kick out of the scientific nature of the process.

Yeah, I know I should stop but I just absolutely love playing with different loads and bullets/powders.

Im going to focus on other guns and shoot the barrels out of those, though, I think.

I’m going to find a load for 147 eld-m and then that’ll be it for this gun, I’ll just be down to shooting it and trying to find time for that.
 
Yeah, I know I should stop but I just absolutely love playing with different loads and bullets/powders.

Im going to focus on other guns and shoot the barrels out of those, though, I think.

I’m going to find a load for 147 eld-m and then that’ll be it for this gun, I’ll just be down to shooting it and trying to find time for that.
RL26 give it a go. I’ve had great results.

I just talked with ARC and they’re sending me a 25lb spring. I’ll report back when I get it in and test fire again.
 
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RL26 give it a go. I’ve had great results.

I just talked with ARC and they’re sending me a 25lb spring. I’ll report back when I get it in and test fire again.
These things have adjustable firing pin protrusion. Would adding a few thousandths help?
 
These things have adjustable firing pin protrusion. Would adding a few thousandths help?
Not trying to be harsh here, but fiddling with protrusion on a pin is the last thing people should be doing when they experience light strikes.

I've had over 2 dozen guns of various actions show up at my shop with "light strike problems, they keep getting worse no matter how much pin protrusion I give it"

Here's what to check and why screwing with a pin protrusion is a bad idea:

Step 1: Measure your pin protrusion. If it is anywhere in 0.030-0.050" leave it alone. There is PLENTY. You only need about 0.025" for extremely reliable ignition IF you have everything else right.

Step 2: Check your ammo to see if you have any primers that aren't seated to the base of the pocket. Typically the issues brought to us are from folks that use hand primers and somewhere in the marathon batch of priming brass while watching TV their hand got tired and some primers slipped through not quite fully seated.

The reason Step 2 is critical is because if the pin has proper protrusion and the primer isn't set properly the energy from the strike is robbed to push the primer to the base of the cup.

"I checked this, all the duds were seated all the way"
Correct, they are seated all the way because the firing pin impact finished the seating process.
It also didn't have enough strike left to set off the primer.

Had they been checked before being a dud it is highly likely that it would be discovered that they were just a little bit proud. Even dead flush isn't enough. Modern brass has relatively tight constraints for primer pocket depth and that sets up so that the primers (arguably one of the most consistent parts of modern ammo) is going to be a couple thousandths sub flush.

Step 3: After having some duds, go back and check the rest of that batch and see if you find any others that are not sub flush. Sometimes it's just enough that they go off; sometimes not.

Step 4: Take anything you find that is a proud primer and separate into 2 piles, split it in half. Take half and reseat the primers in a press so that they're properly seated in the case. Take those half and the half that is suspect and go to the range. Note which is which and shoot them.

If the ones you reseated go off (mind you, once a poorly seated primer is struck it isn't likely to go off on a second time hitting it) and the ones that are still suspect have fail to fires you found the culprit.




I've been around and around on this with several prototype actions that I've had from companies where I worked to help develop from a prototype to a production model.

I stopped hand priming because of this.



So, I didn't yet address why pin protrusion is the wrong avenue to mess with.
When the bolt is in battery in the action the bolt face is the line of reference.
It can be assumed that the primer is sitting against that face. We've discussed that a properly seated primer should be slightly subflush so therefore this is a conservative estimate of impact energy. Nevertheless it makes the discussion easier to digest if we ignore that complication for the time being.

A spring has a given amount of potential energy in it while assembled in the gun.
It has PE when it is decocked because there is preload in it.

The PE is defined as 1/2 * mass (spring and pin together) * compression distance ^2 * springrate

compression distance is defined as "X"
PE = 1/2 * X^2 * k

PE when it's assembled and uncocked is PE0
PE when it's cocked and ready to fire is PE1

PE1-PE0 = PE of the system to impart on a primer.
Ignoring outside losses and inefficiencies (I'm going to assume energy is conserved, which we know it isn't but it works for this discussion)

The kinetic energy at the instant the pin crosses the bolt face plane cannot be larger than PE1-PE0 aka PEstrike

Now:

The cocking piece and cocking cams have a given lift imparted to the firing pin no matter what happens.
In a Bighorn this value is approximately 0.2"
In a Nucleus it's very similar.
In a Remington 700 it's closer to 0.28"

If the pin is adjusted further out at decocking then the amount of distance that the pin is retracted behind the bolt face during cocking is reduced.
Remember, the cocking lift is a fixed value and cannot change. Therefore if the pin used to be pulled from 0.05" forward of the bolt face and it's retracted by 0.2" it is now 0.15" behind the bolt face.

The potential energy stored is actually higher than when the pin is fully decocked but that's useless storage to set off the primer, you can't get it out of the system because the primer is strong enough to withstand regular pin forces while decocked. Try it sometime. Put a piece of primed brass in the chamber and hold the trigger while closing the bolt slowly. Open it back up.

There may be a tiny witness mark on the primer but the primer didn't go off nor did it dent the primer.

So, this is important because if we cannot get that energy back into the pin tip during impact we're never going to setoff the primer.
Back to the energy of the spring while it's cocked.

At full cock on a 0.05" pin protrustion the system has a given amount of PE
If we pull that pin back by 0.02" to a protrusion value of 0.03" then we have given 0.02" more travel on the pin before it crosses the reference plane to hit the primer.

Since we had 0.2" to begin with total, less 0.05" protrusion

We had 0.15" lift useful.
Now we have 0.17" lift useful.
The mass and springrate hasn't changed, just the X value.
so PE15 = 1/2*k*(0.15"+preload)^2
PE17 = 1/2*k*(0.17"+preload)^2
In a bighorn there's about 1" of preload in the spring

when we look at a ratio of the values PE17/PE15 everything cancels except the X^2 values

1.17^2/1.15^2

Doesn't look like much but it's about 3.5% difference in energy available to start with.

A more extreme example would be an action presented to us by someone who was tired of dealing with "it must be the Jewell trigger" from his last gunsmith. The guy had charged him for 3 triggers total and every time he got it back he had a brand new trigger installed and more firing pin protrustion.

It was so bad that the thing wouldn't set off primers at all and then got to the point that it would have extremely hard closing on teh bolt on factory ammo.

When I got it the pin was unable to retract through the bolt face any longer. It was protruding nearly 0.015" just in a cocked condition. That explained the heavy bolt closing. As the bolt was being closed it was cocking the action off the trigger...

I adjusted the firing pin protrusion back to 0.032" and it set off every primer we threw at it, including the notoriously hard machine gun primers from CCI the #41's

So in a less severe but similar example that came in from an adjustable pin action the customer had extended the pin out to 0.07" travel and "it keeps getting worse, I think I have a defective action"

0.2" lift with a target of 0.035" protrusion is 0.165" delta
At 0.07" protrusion they had 0.13" lift available

0.13^2/0.165^2 = 0.621 or 62.1% of the strike energy that it should have had. It was not going off 90% of the time, I was amazed that anything went bang to be honest.

When we reset it back to 0.035" of protrusion it went off 50 times in a row with primed brass at the shop.
Long story short, the VAST majority of the time adding firing pin protrusion is not the answer. There are other much simpler reasons for light strikes.

In an action that's brand new from the factory it's possible but I know that ARC has a jig setup to set the pin protrusion from the start and they have a design that cannot come loose and wiggle further out.

Some designs can do that and I've seen it where over thousands of cycles the locking screws work loose and the pin wanders forward. The light strikes are inconsequential at first but then they get to a critical point and all of the sudden it seems to be endless light strikes and ultimately completely failure of the system.




Not enough protrusion is a possible failure as well but even back at 0.015" I watched a bolt action that went off 47 times out of 50 rounds. The pin was an accidental setup part that was mixed in with good ones but even at 0.019" short of the design nominal it still went off a LOT... The customer discovered it when the weather turned cold and he got a lot more failures.

Replaced the pin, set it to 0.032" protrusion and it's been back for 2 more barrel replacements without a single reported failure since.

This has been discussed
 
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Yeah, I know I should stop but I just absolutely love playing with different loads and bullets/powders.

Im going to focus on other guns and shoot the barrels out of those, though, I think.

I’m going to find a load for 147 eld-m and then that’ll be it for this gun, I’ll just be down to shooting it and trying to find time for that.
Sure you are...:)
 
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Sure you are...:)

It’s what I’m telling myself anyway haha. ??‍♂️ The biggest reason to save barrel life at the moment with the Hancock is I think we are really far away from the “barrels on the shelf” situation for Hancocks.
 
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From my readings, I'm not surprised to hear your experience. I would be frustrated as well. Strange that the Nucleus is advertised as being such a reliable and robust design, yet I doubt there has ever been a custom action that was ever as picky when it comes to trigger compatibility, sear engagement, FP protrusion, fire-control maintenance/cleaning, etc.
Seems to be as reliable as their magazines. ?
 
The biggest reason to save barrel life at the moment with the Hancock is I think we are really far away from the “barrels on the shelf” situation for Hancocks.

Having to save barrel life for that reason really, really sucks! When it's time to replace the barrel on my JHR, I'll be talking with the folks at LRI.
 
Having to save barrel life for that reason really, really sucks! When it's time to replace the barrel on my JHR, I'll be talking with the folks at LRI.

If u dont plan on shooting production class, that's fine but if you do, you'll have to get your replacement barrel from PVA. It has to be a "factory" barrel to qualify for production.
 
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Having to save barrel life for that reason really, really sucks! When it's time to replace the barrel on my JHR, I'll be talking with the folks at LRI.

I’ll just get it from PVA after the backlog gets cleared up. I’m sure it’ll happen this year.

...well I hope. Haha
 
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The backlog is well on its way to being cleared. The reason most people are complaining in here, is the reason shit is getting done. Spinning new personnel up on everything, using multiple machines, not chatting it up on here or on the phone. They are keeping their hands moving and heads down to completely catch up. This whole issue will be a thing of the past and won't stick to the PVA name when things get straightened out. By the time people need new hancock barrels, there should be surplus on the shelf. That was the whole idea behind the hancock. It'll happen.
 
The backlog is well on its way to being cleared. The reason most people are complaining in here, is the reason shit is getting done. Spinning new personnel up on everything, using multiple machines, not chatting it up on here or on the phone. They are keeping their hands moving and heads down to completely catch up. This whole issue will be a thing of the past and won't stick to the PVA name when things get straightened out. By the time people need new hancock barrels, there should be surplus on the shelf. That was the whole idea behind the hancock. It'll happen.
I will remember that when you purchase something from me in the exchange. I will message you ssaying I will ship tomorrow and then end all comminications. I wont answer your call and wont respond to your messages. Im sure you would cry to a mod about it, and maybe start a thread similar to this one bashing me. Im not a theif so a year later you would get your package. All is well.
 
I think comparing PVA who has a storefront & an established reputation to some Joe schmoe in the Exchange is a bit unfair. I'm over a year into this thing & while I see the point you're trying to make (kind of), I'm also SIGNIFICANTLY more confident that PVA WILL deliver than I would be in the scenario that you described.

Waiting is not for everyone.
 
I think comparing PVA who has a storefront & an established reputation to some Joe schmoe in the Exchange is a bit unfair. I'm over a year into this thing & while I see the point you're trying to make (kind of), I'm also SIGNIFICANTLY more confident that PVA WILL deliver than I would be in the scenario that you described.

Waiting is not for everyone.
Look in the feedback section on here and the akfiles. I have a much better reputation than PVA.

Once again it is not the wait. Its the misinformation and non-communication.

When PVA responds in this thread notice how they never address this situation.
 
If u dont plan on shooting production class, that's fine but if you do, you'll have to get your replacement barrel from PVA. It has to be a "factory" barrel to qualify for production.

The informal F class matches here in Albuquerque won't be concerned about that. When the time comes I'll be looking at a 28" tube.
 
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So I spoke with ARC about light primer strikes with the 19lb spring in my Nucleus again. I’m sending my entire bolt in for them to replace the spring to the 25# and inspect the bolt. I’ll report back when I get it back.
 
Rofl come on dude.

I’m not thrilled about the wait times either but be real.
All my sell transactions (at least 50) have closed with all happy customers. All my items shipped out on time as stated. There are no negative threads about me. All my customers would buy from me again without hesitation. How many of those boxes can PVA check off. Thats being real.
 
I think comparing PVA who has a storefront & an established reputation to some Joe schmoe in the Exchange is a bit unfair. I'm over a year into this thing & while I see the point you're trying to make (kind of), I'm also SIGNIFICANTLY more confident that PVA WILL deliver than I would be in the scenario that you described.

Waiting is not for everyone.

So you're saying that you would expect some Joe schmoe in the PX to provide better customer service and communications than PVA, who has a storefront and an established reputation??

Having a storefront and being a well-known name in the industry is not an excuse for poor customer service, in fact I have come to expect the opposite. The die-hard fanboys in this thread always give me a good laugh. You guys should all continue to purchase from PVA so the rest of us can have shorter wait times from the dozens of other top-notch 'smiths in the country.
 
You've done 50 transactions, all of them flawless... Great. PVA does that in a given day or week. Sure, some people are unhappy with the way this particular deal (Nucleus/JHR) has gone. You're entitled to your opinion & I'm entitled to mine... I'm not going to argue on the internet with you about it.
 
You've done 50 transactions, all of them flawless... Great. PVA does that in a given day or week. Sure, some people are unhappy with the way this particular deal (Nucleus/JHR) has gone. You're entitled to your opinion & I'm entitled to mine... I'm not going to argue on the internet with you about it.
They might. And they ship all of them late knowing that they will when they take the order which is the point I am trying to make. Shady. Be upfront. Many are willing to wait. Many are not. Give the consumer the choice which PVA is not.

Anyhow, we are just engaging in debate. We both said everything we need to say anyhow. Everyone else following this thread can use what was said by us and everyone else as well to form their own opinions. Im out of the thread now.
 
They might. And they ship all of them late knowing that they will when they take the order which is the point I am trying to make. Shady. Be upfront. Many are willing to wait. Many are not. Give the consumer the choice which PVA is not.

Anyhow, we are just engaging in debate. We both said everything we need to say anyhow. Everyone else following this thread can use what was said by us and everyone else as well to form their own opinions. Im out of the thread now.
The consumer most certainly has a choice they purchase of their own freewill it's not like this is the power company you have alternatives.
 
The consumer most certainly has a choice they purchase of their own freewill it's not like this is the power company you have alternatives.
The customer didn't have the choice with all of the information. They had a bogus timeline. The customer never had the choice to make a decision with an accurate timeline - that was Wade's point I believe. If PVA offered a refund, they're basically giving the customer that choice again - "Hey we know we missed our date. We still are going to give you an awesome gun and we know you'll love it, but we recognize that even though the delays are outside of our control, they could be causing unanticipated issues for you. If that's the case and you'd like to go a different route, then here's your money back and we hope you would consider us in the future." How hard is that?

Also, forum posts are not a substitute for a response to an attempted contact. If you have a customer's money and their product and you've missed the date and they try to ask about it, you owe them the courtesy of a response. Or, you have no right to complain when customers say that your customer service sucks. Can't have it both ways.
 
Interesting...I can see the 'arguments' on all sides of the JHR/delivery question...Perhaps some method of informing customers might mitigate the anxiety felt by its customers... Presenting more salient information on its website, by better defining which orders are which??? Say into JHC orders, barreled action, and other??? Perhaps listing its weekly production figures...Thus giving customers a better idea of where they stand... Also, I understand PVA incurred non-refundable costs when the order was placed and the deposit was received...Perhaps offering customers a credit towards alternative items PVA sells??? Also, a mechanism for transferring/selling one's 'slot' although it is difficult to envision just how that could be done... In any case, I, for one, am so impressed with the rifle I am willing to wait as long as it takes...Even at the age of 73...If I die before I get my email, I won't really care...Full disclosure, I don't, and never will, compete and have no timeline I'm trying to meet/beat... Except death...:)
 
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I like this open discourse. I'm hoping my rifle is done soon and proves to be worth the wait. If the finished product lives up to expectations than all is well, but the lack of open communication to the customers with time & money invested is troubling. My confusion might have been my fault, but I was expecting to be shooting my JHR by late summer 2018, now I'm hoping for spring 2019.

I wish there was a biweekly status update from PVA - the last email I can find from them is 11/7/2018. that's a long information drought if I wasn't a member here.
 
I am coming up on the one year anniversary of my JHR order and am running out of patience.If it isn't one thing it's another. I called PVA the other day to inquire about my rifle as I was asked for final payment the beginning of February and hadn't heard squat since. I was told the rifle is completely finished with the exception of the KRG stock which was held up with no date for delivery to PVA. As I said previously, if it isn't one thing it's another with no communication from PVA.
That being said, I bought a 6mm Creedmoor on the secondary market for a small premium. I replaced the trigger with a BixN'Andy competition model and topped it with a NF 15-55 x 52 Competition scope.The plan is to have a Whidden custom sizer die made so I shot 3 pieces of Lapua brass three times so I could ship them off for Whidden to use in making the die. Wanting to shoot Berger 105 Hybrids, I called Berger for any info they might have regarding powders. With no actual testing I was told that they had run a QuickLoad computation on H-4350, minimum was 37.0 grains with the max at 41.1 grains, I loaded the minimum at .030" off the lands (I'll do a complete ladder test when I receive the die). Below is the second and third group of 3 shots @ 100 yards. Needless to say, I am happy with he rifle but still pissed about the ongoing problems getting my original rifle and the deafening silence on the part of PVA as it takes minutes to send out an update to customers who paid the deposit. Let's just call it common courtesy.

7035049
 
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yeah, back in November I was told I was in next batch for Nucleus B/A. Nothing from them since then despite a couple emails from me in Feb.
 
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Wanted to post an update on the KRG ARCA rail issue I was having. I pulled off and sold the KRG ARCA rail since they didn’t have a way of fixing the bending issue. I ordered and installed the Area 419 12” ARCAlock M-lol rail with the Area 419 Harris ARCAlock direct mount and the problem is solved. The Area 419 ARCA rail is twice as thick as the KRG rail and doesn’t bend into a wave like the KRG rail. I highly recommend the Area 419 ARCA rail over the KRG rail.
 
Incase some of you didn't get this. From PVA.


Valued customers,
We have received some feedback that our targeted updates are not reaching everyone. Sometimes they are landing in the recipient’s “SPAM folder.” We’re working with our Email provider to see id there’s a way to alleviate that specific issue. In the meantime, we’ve elected to send this status update to all customers with outstanding orders of any kind.
We know many of you have been waiting for barrels purchased during our Black Friday barrel sale. The volume of orders generated during that sale forced us to shut down the sale early and change our projected lead times for fulfilling all barrel related orders from 10 -12 weeks to 14 -16 weeks.
Since that time, our barrel supplier has lost a portion of their workforce. This has impacted their ability to fill our orders, which in turn, has impacted our production schedule and ability to meet previously posted lead times. We have recently experienced similar delays for some of our other components, such as chassis, as well.
We are working with our suppliers to remedy the situation. As we get a clearer understanding from our suppliers, we’ll endeavor to do a better job of contacting customers directly with updates. We are also going to begin emailing a weekly production schedule to customers so they will know + or – 1 week when their barrel will ship. Specific orders for John Hancock Rifles will continue as usual.
Moving forward we are also working to better synchronize our production schedule with barrel shipments by running selected calibers and contours in batches once we have barrels in hand. This will help us move more efficiently with the materials we have available and fill your orders as fast as we can while ensuring the quality you deserve.
Thank you for your continued patience. We sincerely appreciate your patronage.
 
Excellent news. I’m excited for updates on barrels etc.
 
Copy that...I'm 13 months in for a BA, not a Black Friday barrel, so perhaps that's why I didn't get it....or maybe the innertubes are clogged and Google is still trying to get it to my inbox.

I can understand the frustration here - WAY upthread (ie. last spring) I was complaining about a 223 prefit barrel that took nearly 5 months to ship. I understand chomping at the bit to get your shiny and start playing with it. On the other hand, just-in-time inventory keeps overhead low for everybody but puts companies (providers and end users) at the far end of the dog's tail when supply issues start and I can't really fault PVA if ARC or Rock Creek or whoever is blowing past their expected delivery times too.

If PVA is anything like every other business I know, they'd love nothing more than to get your/our money and ship you a product fight fuckin' now, so they can get the revenue, clear the backlog, and process new orders in a more timely manner...but when you are at the mercy of suppliers there's only so much you can control...
 
All comes down to being transparent and having good communication. Great that they're saying they'll give updates and production schedule/estimates now.
 
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Just so people know. I went back and read all the issues and wanted to put together all the facts that the general public is missing. 95% of the grievances have been directed in the wrong place for blaming PVA for all the backlog.

ARC shipped retail nucleus actions to customers before dealer actions. Even after agreeing and publicly posting that the barreled action deal with PVA would get delivered first ordered, first delivered and acknowledged on Sniper's Hide they deviated from that path. It wasn't until people started commenting about friends who ordered a Nucleus in November and received it in December that PVA was aware of this deviation of agreement with ARC. When ARC admitted to it in January PVA posted a statement about it. ARC made excuses for it but the months of shady deliveries had already happened.

While all of that was going on they took a "bird in hand" option and made a custom configured Mausingfield for LRI to sell while all of the rest of us were waiting for the Nucleus orders that they took months before that.

Then when people get upset with PVA and they get after ARC for deliveries the actions show up in a pile and immediately ARC says "oh we delivered everything to PVA"... they don't bother to tell anyone that they literally delivered it that week in January (a year after orders were placed) they just hung PVA out to dry on it.

Not to mention, there has been nothing but radio silence from ARC when it comes to addressing the hold ups or why they decided to throw PVA under the bus when it was PVA that helped ARC launch the nucleus action last year. The delay isnt with the middle man, it's at the source of manufacturing. The only real grievance that people could understandably place at the feet of PVA is not answering the phone or emails in a timely fashion. That's it. It's already been explained why your $250 deposit cant be refunded bc that money has already gone to the government for the excise taxes.

Not to mention the ARC xylo and Archimedes that is taking and has been taking up time that could have been used on filling people's 1 year old orders.

Your anger and frustrations have been placed in the wrong direction.
 
Folks,
I have not been online here for a few days and I see this has continued along at a pretty heated pace. I'm going to attempt to cover a few topics and address things but it would take an incredible amount of time to touch on each individual post point by point. I feel, and I suspect most would agree with me, that a post by post, point by point discussion is not a good use of time instead of me taking that same time to go back to the machines and keep working on barrels.

First, Excise Tax:
I think I read in here just recently where someone suggested a possible understanding for the fact that the non refundable deposits are instead accounted towards PVA products.

That is certainly something I can discuss with folks however there will be some limitations to it. It cannot be applied to custom ordered parts and it's not going to be applied to a different action or anything that has excise involved in it. It CAN be a credit towards shop labor or parts we have on the shelf such as brakes, barrel nuts, action wrenches, etc.

Second:

As we sent out in an email update this morning, we found out earlier this week that Rock Creek is down 2 machinists in a shop of only 6 or 7 people to start. I asked Russ about posting on it last night and he gave us the green light to talk about it so our email went out a few hours ago. I'm not sure how much faster we could have gotten it out, it's been a couple days since we got any news of it and about 16 hours since I was told it was OK to talk about it.

They are working to get us more blanks, we got a crate this week with 60 barrels in it and those will be gone off to customers in the next 10-14 days. It also brings us up to the next 26 Nucleus orders that we have actions here and we will be filling those out immediately. I have another status call with them in the middle of the week so that they can get us an accurate projection of the blanks being shipped to us.


Hancocks:
For the first time since the project started we are not waiting on ARC for actions. We are building the batches of rifles and since we got receivers in the 2nd week of January we have shipped a complete batch of 20 on top of billed for the next batch and are currently cutting those.

This is true of Nucleus orders, we got in actions the 3rd week of January and are cutting those orders currently to get them out the door as fast as possible.

Just as a metric: The lead time from Actions to delivered rifles or barreled actions has, until this month, been under 2 weeks. Right now with the availability of blanks we're looking to be about 6 weeks total time from actions arriving to the rifles shipping.

KRG notified us late last week that there will be a delay in BRAVO chassis though I didn't get a projection of the length of delay. We found out this week that it's going to be end of March before they will have stocks on a truck to us. In the mean time we're simply going to cut and assemble Hancock barreled actions so that the arrival of stocks gets rifles out the door in the following week.

Barrels:
I mentioned that Rock Creek is struggling due to a lack of folks in the shop. They're working to get more people in and trained up. We're trying to be patient with them as I completely understand what it means to have a person in the shop vs. a person who knows what they're doing in the shop. Believe me, it benefits all of us to have the right work done the first time.


Status Updates:
We have put together a new process with the help of Rick, our 'new guy' to have a lead time projection and "orders filled this week" email to folks weekly. Jeremy is finishing up the lists into a format that we can email out regularly. The website lends itself to products on the shelf and not products that need to be built. This approach was mentioned by someone recently though I don't remember exaclty which as I did a lot of reading this morning, so to the guy who suggested it: THank you, we are doing that going forward.


Going forward:
We are not claiming that our communication has been perfect. It has failed in several cases and unfortunately that's not time we can get back. What I can do is change that process so that we get the communication done. I've long felt that if we send an update and nothing has changed then another update is not necessary; only sending status updates when something changes. Apparently this is not what the customer wants so we're going to update that and change that.

Not everything is quite so simple as some in this thread would suggest. Claiming how easy it is to sell something in the PX and not have problems is a red herring. Our order fulfillment rate is, based on overall order count, over 97% filled within 1 business day. Parts on the shelf ship next business day over 99.7% of the time. The customer complaints come from custom ordered pieces.

Our lead time isn't as fast as some but when customers supply the parts our lead time is quite short because we simply need to do the work as opposed to find all the parts and then do the work.

We've learned several lessons in this endeavor. In the past year our capability to push barrels through the shop has increased nearly 10 fold. Every month our actual throughput of chambering jobs goes up. We are not at capacity of the machinery, we are struggling primarily with parts availability. It's a hard pill to swallow that we're dropping the ball on our customers, that's the last thing I want to do.

One thing that I have maintained and continue to maintain is that the quality of the product will not be pushed behind the lead time. Things are right or they don't go out. If someone has an issue with something we made then we will support it. I think this is supported by the customer testimonials on the Hancocks. They are indeed late, there is a substantial delay from the government agency we've all come to love, but the rifle is exactly as advertised on the range... they are hammers. We will not sacrifice the ability to make the best product in the market for lead time. This is why we stick with Rock Creek as a barrel manufacturer. They make excellent blanks and even being behind on production they are not sending us trash just to appease the customer nor will we.

On that note, I'm going to step away from here for a couple days in order to help Jeremy get the barrels through the machines. I will be back to here and try to answer things, I'm not going to take time to rehash details already covered. I'm going to cut muzzle threads all afternoon.
 
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