This. Absolutely true. BTDT, got the T-shirt.
You can do it, but it'll get old REAL fast.
You can do it, but it'll get old REAL fast.
Yeah swapping sucks. Get a good scope for the most used and then cheaper for the barely used.
In each persons opinion, what are the best bang for your buck scopes starting $300 and up?
Seems like I’ve heard Arken SH4 for $300, the Arken EP5 at $500 (and sounds like worth the extra $ over SH4), and Athlon Cronus at the $1,000. What else should I be considering for the more affordable scopes for the setups I won’t be using as much?
Thinking I’ll still get one high end scope for the primary Vudoo Kreiger DIP chambered 22 LR, and then outfit the other 3 with something cheaper. Interested in any opinions up to the $2,500 price point (or beyond just out of interest) but will probably end up in the $500-$1,000 range on those… maybe $1,500 if I wait for more funds or just pick one up at a time to spread out cost.
Thanks!
Seems like I’ve heard Arken SH4 for $300, the Arken EP5 at $500 (and sounds like worth the extra $ over SH4), and Athlon Cronus at the $1,000. What else should I be considering for the more affordable scopes for the setups I won’t be using as much?
Thinking I’ll still get one high end scope for the primary Vudoo Kreiger DIP chambered 22 LR, and then outfit the other 3 with something cheaper. Interested in any opinions up to the $2,500 price point (or beyond just out of interest) but will probably end up in the $500-$1,000 range on those… maybe $1,500 if I wait for more funds or just pick one up at a time to spread out cost.
Thanks!
Being that you want it for .22LR comps, you need tons of travel, the Zeiss LRP S3 would be your best bet for the high-end optic. And for a budget scope, the new Primary Arms GLx 4.5-27x56 seems to be VERY intriguing. They recently revamped some of the GLx and SLx lines with much better glass, reticles, mechanics, and features.
I'm probably going to start slowly replacing a lot of my cheaper budget scopes with the new GLx 4.5-27x56...
Primary Arms GLx 4.5-27x56 FFP Rifle Scope - Illuminated ACSS Athena BPR MIL Reticle
DetailsThis rifle scope is part of the mid-tier optics line called GLx. GLx brings premium technology and materials into an approachable price range.Designed for superior long-range performance, the new GLx 4.5-27x56mm FFP Rifle Scope combines the proven GLx turret system with enhanced glass...
www.primaryarms.com
Yup the Zeiss LRP S3 4-25x50 would be a good choice on the high end for the Vudoo.
That Primary Arms looks interesting. The Bushnell Match Pro ED is another worth looking at in the under $1000 market.
That Primary Arms looks interesting. The Bushnell Match Pro ED is another worth looking at in the under $1000 market.
I don’t know if I’ll get a reply in the next 2 hours, but have a predicament. So I got access to Zeiss on EV, yay, right?! Well… as an experiment today took 4 scopes out to compare which composed of a Arken SH4 6-24, EP5 5-25, Vortex Strike Eagle 4-24 (the only second FP of the 4), and a Vortex Razor gen iii 6-36. Took them to the park about 2 hrs before dark. Ranged a parked car at 780 yards and another at 791 yards. I looked around at other things but primarily was testing how well I could make out the license plates (which was not well at all on any of them). I could barely tell any difference between any of them. The Razor was the best, but I didn’t think of comparing it at a comparable power so in hind sight it might have just been due to being higher power zoom. What am I doing wrong? I adjusted parallax and eye piece focus on all of them. Am I missing something? There’s no way the $300 scope should be near neck and neck with the $3000 scope… but for the life of me I really couldn’t tell. I wear glasses, I made sure they were extremely clean. I was prepared to buy the Zeiss, which now goes off sale in 2 hours, but I don’t know if I’m doing something wrong or if it’s my eyes, or what, but I don’t really want to spend all that extra money if it’s a problem with me that can’t be fixed with good glass… even if reading this after the 2 hours are up, I’d still appreciate any ideas, as I am lost as to what in the world is going on. I expected an astonishing difference between the low end scope and the one that literally cost 10x as much… I don’t know if it’s helpful but as background I have mostly used Nikon Prostaff and Vortex Diamondback 3-9 and 4-12 hunting scopes, along with a Vortex Crossfire 6-18, so maybe I don’t know what I’m looking for… but clarity is clarity right? Shouldn’t the license plate have been clearer between each?
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buy the zeiss, if you regret it, just sell it on here. with your price from EV, you will likely lose very little money if you decide to sell.
I am strongly leaning to this…
as someone who owns nothing but nightforce (NXS, NX8, ATACR, BEAST) and has practically looked through every new fandangled scope the past 10 years (i live by euro optic)…..
the zeiss is my top pick to recommend, its glass competes with optics costing $3-4k and costs basically half that.
the elevation travel is a huge bonus.
all i know is, it is a VERY solid pick, that even the most discriminating optics experts would have a hard time finding fault in.
This is probably THE most competitive long range optic overall in glass, features, price point currently in existence.
Thank you for that, I really appreciate it. I’m working on the order now and was still debating!
this is going on a vudoo right?
thats going to make for a killer set up that will let you push that gun to its absolute limits.
i had a ruger precision 22 i had 2.5-15 bushnell forge on at one point, that maybe had 60 moa internal elevation + another 30 in the reitcle? i was able to get hits out to 425 pretty easy when the gun/ammo would cooperate (some days i would just loads of vertical dispersion prob around 3-4 moa), but i never used anything besides cci standard velocity lol.
you’ll be able to blow past that with ease, with 200 moa of holdover capability between scope and reticle.
Yes, it’s a Vudoo action, 24” Krieger barrel, chambered by DI Precision. Will also be ran with a EC Tuner and eventually a DeadAir Mask suppressor.
I already have a Spuhr mount with 20.6 MOA to put the scope in… wondering if a 60 MOA rail for a total of 80.6 MOA cant would be to much to be able to zero at 100 yards, given that’s just a hair over half the vertical travel of the scope since the total is 160 MOA… I can’t seem to find a rail between 40 & 60 MOA.
that is an amazing choice, you are really going to have a very capable rig on your hands.
what you could do in the meantime until you find a 40/60 moa rail solution…..
put the 20 moa on, get your zero, then dial down and see how much you elevation you are “wasting”.
then you will be able to tell on your next rail how much taper would put you over your ability to get a zero.
personally i’d stay away from the mechanical bottom at least 10 moa to prevent any annoying optical issues when shooting at close range.
better yet, dial down and see how far from mechanical bottom you have to be to maintain a non distorted sight picture.
Excellent purchase! You did good especially at that price. Let us know what you think when it comes in.
As for the base and mount set up, try it. Worst case you can just change the base to a 40MOA and be fine. 20 moa less won't make a difference in the grand scheme of things. You will still have more elevation that you would have had with any of the other optics.
Any Remington 700 rail should fit any Remington 700 clone (like the Vudoo), right?
Does anyone know how much MOA of cant would be needed to shoot a 223 (and 308 for that matter) at distances past 1,000 yards? From what I found it looks like around 55 MOA is needed for 1000 yards but couldn’t find info past that distance. I’m sure it will be a long while before I ever get to that level anyway, but just wondering for future proofing on the scopes for those setups.
Does anyone know how much MOA of cant would be needed to shoot a 223 (and 308 for that matter) at distances past 1,000 yards? From what I found it looks like around 55 MOA is needed for 1000 yards but couldn’t find info past that distance. I’m sure it will be a long while before I ever get to that level anyway, but just wondering for future proofing on the scopes for those setups.
It should... But I don't own a Vudoo, so I don't know for sure. But if it's a 700 short-action clone, any 700 short-action base should work.
To shoot a .223 and .308 Win to 1,000 on a rifle with that Zeiss LRP S3, a 20MOA base should be fine.
I run Evolution Gun Works HD 20MOA rails on most all of my rifles.
No they will not work on a Vudoo. You have to get one from Vudoo. Just wait until the scope comes in and try it with your set up before swapping.
A 20 moa base is almost standard now. Would depend on how the rifle is set up but to 1000 my .308 is about 10 mils or around 34.5 moa and my .223 is about 8.9 mils or about 30.5 mils. Would be really slow to need 55 moa to get to 1000. You can just use any ballistic program like JBM online and run generic numbers to give you an idea.
Dang, glad I asked! So sounds like I really will be limited to just the choices provided by Vudoo and not have an option in between 40 and 60 MOA bases. It looks like the ARC M-Brace comes in A LOT of different angles, and thinking that may ultimately be what I end up using to push the limits of the scope as far as possible. Will definitely wait to try the suggestions above with my current setup, though, to figure out what I need/can use. Currently, I have a 30 MOA base, so doing that will tell me if I should order a 40 or 60 to use with my mount, or, order the 60 and a new M-Brace with an oddball angle to get where I need to be.
On the 223, sounds like I was looking at some bad data on the necessary MOA.
I don't have, and have rarely used, a ballistic calculator for what I have been doing previously. What are the best ones to be looking at? I assume I will need to buy one I can take out into the field on my phone? Or is there a free one that works well that I could print off all the data I would need beforehand? Don't mind buying one if it's something that I will need though. I just don't know which one to pick and would rather not pay for multiple just to find the best one.
I have a couple sets of ARC M-BRACE rings on my Christensen MPR's, and they are amazing! I don't think I'll ever be buying traditional rings again. I mounted, leveled, and bore-sighted 2 rifles in the time it normally takes me to do 1. Plus, the fact that both the clamp and the rings use 55 inch-pounds makes things easy to remember. Also, using my Fix-It-Sticks setup with a multi-head, and then finishing up with a 55 limiter just to verify accuracy, made things stupid fast and simple.
Also, save yourself the headache of the traditional level kits, and get a set of these... https://store.fixitsticks.com/products/bubble-level-set
It will save yourself the headache of ensuring your rifle is perfectly straight up and down, you can do things in the field if you need to, just make sure your levels match, and torque to spec. DONE!
The Works | Fix It Sticks
The Works is multiple kits in one, can fix just about anything, anywhere and includes specialty tools for rifles, optics, pistols and shotguns.
store.fixitsticks.com I purchased a 20 MOA M-Brace today on here, and looking for at least one more. Going to have a 20 MOA rail and 20 MOA M-Brace on the 223 and on the 308. Will also be looking for that oddball MOA M-Brace to optimize the usable MOA on the scope of the Vudoo once I figure out its limits. Haven’t had a M-Brace before but was told they are the best mount you can get short of a Spuhr, and at lower price point.I have a couple sets of ARC M-BRACE rings on my Christensen MPR's, and they are amazing! I don't think I'll ever be buying traditional rings again. I mounted, leveled, and bore-sighted 2 rifles in the time it normally takes me to do 1. Plus, the fact that both the clamp and the rings use 55 inch-pounds makes things easy to remember. Also, using my Fix-It-Sticks setup with a multi-head, and then finishing up with a 55 limiter just to verify accuracy, made things stupid fast and simple.
Also, save yourself the headache of the traditional level kits, and get a set of these... https://store.fixitsticks.com/products/bubble-level-set
It will save yourself the headache of ensuring your rifle is perfectly straight up and down, you can do things in the field if you need to, just make sure your levels match, and torque to spec. DONE!
The Works | Fix It Sticks
The Works is multiple kits in one, can fix just about anything, anywhere and includes specialty tools for rifles, optics, pistols and shotguns.
On the FixIt Sticks, could I accomplish the same thing with a Wheeler digital Torq screwdriver? I already have one of those. Just wondering, as I would rather use what I already have if possible.I have a couple sets of ARC M-BRACE rings on my Christensen MPR's, and they are amazing! I don't think I'll ever be buying traditional rings again. I mounted, leveled, and bore-sighted 2 rifles in the time it normally takes me to do 1. Plus, the fact that both the clamp and the rings use 55 inch-pounds makes things easy to remember. Also, using my Fix-It-Sticks setup with a multi-head, and then finishing up with a 55 limiter just to verify accuracy, made things stupid fast and simple.
Also, save yourself the headache of the traditional level kits, and get a set of these... https://store.fixitsticks.com/products/bubble-level-set
It will save yourself the headache of ensuring your rifle is perfectly straight up and down, you can do things in the field if you need to, just make sure your levels match, and torque to spec. DONE!
The Works | Fix It Sticks
The Works is multiple kits in one, can fix just about anything, anywhere and includes specialty tools for rifles, optics, pistols and shotguns.
Between the options for a Vudoo rail (40 or 60 MOA) and ARC M-Brace MOA options, it looks like 70 MOA is likely going to be where I’ll end up in total (60 rail + 10 brace, or 40 rail + 30 brace) unless it actually operates with the 80 MOA (60 rail + 20 brace) but sounds like that will be unlikely due to bottoming out.
I've been using a Wheeler FAT Wrench for over a decade, but having to adjust it up and down constantly adds time, and unnecessary effort. That all-in-one limiter kit makes things super fast, without having to swap things out. Spin them all up to 15 in-lbs, then the next pull you spin it up to 35 for all of them, then 55... Super fast without having to manually adjust anything. Once you use one, you'll see what I'm talking about. I was a skeptic at first, but a buddy bought a set, and after trying them, I was sold. Plus, carrying the Fix-It-Sticks kit in your range bag is good insurance incase something goes south, and you need to fix it on the fly.
How adventitious is it to have the complete set ($232) vs just buying the all in one torque driver by itself ($65)?
I mean, I guess you could always just buy a T-handle and an all-in-one driver, with a T-25 bit, and you'd be good for the M-BRACE rings/mounts.
Just use the driver you already have. It’s not at all that critical.
What’s up with the Zeiss store on EV. I’m Zeiss certified, but I get the message “This product isn't currently available to you on ….”
Burris is closed for a revamp and now Zeiss is down.
I’ve been hesitant to talk about EV on here do to the guidelines of not discussing pricing.
Kind of felt it was like fight club‘s first two rules……
I also felt it wasn’t fair to the supporting vendors that contribute so much.
Burris is closed for a revamp and now Zeiss is down.
I’ve been hesitant to talk about EV on here do to the guidelines of not discussing pricing.
Kind of felt it was like fight club‘s first two rules……
I also felt it wasn’t fair to the supporting vendors that contribute so much.
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