Getting real close to ordering my barrel for my M40 A1 build. It's not going to be a real clone just a look a like. I want to make the gun bullet specific, I would like to shoot the smk 168 gr. What would be the best twist for this bullet? I have heard 1-12 and 1-11. Whats your thought and experience?
- Thread starter justintimesc
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Re: What twist for 168 gr smk
1-12 it shoots 175s great and all things being equal its faster.And its ideal for 168s.All this assuming your staying at 20" or more.
1-12 it shoots 175s great and all things being equal its faster.And its ideal for 168s.All this assuming your staying at 20" or more.
Re: What twist for 168 gr smk
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Graham</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I wouldn't chamber a bullet-specific rifle for the 168SMK bullet.</div></div>
+100 Why of all bullets would you choose that one, many many many better options.
Go 1-11.27 if you have no plans to shoot subsonic, shoot everything from the 155s to the 208s.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Graham</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I wouldn't chamber a bullet-specific rifle for the 168SMK bullet.</div></div>
+100 Why of all bullets would you choose that one, many many many better options.
Go 1-11.27 if you have no plans to shoot subsonic, shoot everything from the 155s to the 208s.
Re: What twist for 168 gr smk
I'd like my barrel to be 24" so I would be above 20".I think I'm gona try the 1-11 on this one from what your saying. I would like to shoot the 175 smk but I have only ever used the 168 smk, guess I got hung up on it. I have a 1-12 now on a gun and it shoots the 168 well just looking to get the most out of a new gun didn't know if the 1-11 would be a little better. Any other suggestions let me know.
I'd like my barrel to be 24" so I would be above 20".I think I'm gona try the 1-11 on this one from what your saying. I would like to shoot the 175 smk but I have only ever used the 168 smk, guess I got hung up on it. I have a 1-12 now on a gun and it shoots the 168 well just looking to get the most out of a new gun didn't know if the 1-11 would be a little better. Any other suggestions let me know.
Re: What twist for 168 gr smk
The 168's are basically the dogs, the 175's are a much much better bullet in design and long range performance. 155 Scenars are fun too, fast with a high BC, good stuff there too.
If I could only shoot one 308 bullet right now it'd likely be the 175.
Barrel length is up to you, I understand the desire for a clone. If you decide to go against that idea then 22" is a very handy length and you're not giving up anything with a 308 at 22".
The 168's are basically the dogs, the 175's are a much much better bullet in design and long range performance. 155 Scenars are fun too, fast with a high BC, good stuff there too.
If I could only shoot one 308 bullet right now it'd likely be the 175.
Barrel length is up to you, I understand the desire for a clone. If you decide to go against that idea then 22" is a very handy length and you're not giving up anything with a 308 at 22".
Re: What twist for 168 gr smk
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Graham</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I wouldn't chamber a bullet-specific rifle for the 168SMK bullet. </div></div>
I agree with this train of thougt. My best shooting .308 is a 1:12 and it loves 168SMK's, HOWEVER I would love it if it shot the heavier stuff better than it does. Shoot for something that is suitable for the aplicaiton you want to employ it. Good luck.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Graham</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I wouldn't chamber a bullet-specific rifle for the 168SMK bullet. </div></div>
I agree with this train of thougt. My best shooting .308 is a 1:12 and it loves 168SMK's, HOWEVER I would love it if it shot the heavier stuff better than it does. Shoot for something that is suitable for the aplicaiton you want to employ it. Good luck.
Re: What twist for 168 gr smk
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: JSTARSZ</div><div class="ubbcode-body">go in the middle with 1:11.25 that way you can go all the way up the 308 ladder - 155 - 208. </div></div>
Is there any maker you prefer when using that twist?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: JSTARSZ</div><div class="ubbcode-body">go in the middle with 1:11.25 that way you can go all the way up the 308 ladder - 155 - 208. </div></div>
Is there any maker you prefer when using that twist?
Re: What twist for 168 gr smk
My TRG has a 11.25 twist and it loves 168gr SMK's, it also loves the 175 and 155 gr varieties as well.
My TRG has a 11.25 twist and it loves 168gr SMK's, it also loves the 175 and 155 gr varieties as well.
Re: What twist for 168 gr smk
1-13" for 168 grain 30 cal bullets, not that other twists won't work, but if your specifying a twist for shooting that particular 30 cal bullet only......that would do it.
Bob
1-13" for 168 grain 30 cal bullets, not that other twists won't work, but if your specifying a twist for shooting that particular 30 cal bullet only......that would do it.
Bob
Re: What twist for 168 gr smk
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: longebow</div><div class="ubbcode-body">1/10 to 1/12 will do well. Agree with the above comments on the 168--it was great back in the day, but it is now so, dare I say, passe?
</div></div>
So if I showed up at a tactical match with 168 SMK loads would it be considered:
A. a party foul
B. rather gauche
C. Faux Pas
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: longebow</div><div class="ubbcode-body">1/10 to 1/12 will do well. Agree with the above comments on the 168--it was great back in the day, but it is now so, dare I say, passe?
So if I showed up at a tactical match with 168 SMK loads would it be considered:
A. a party foul
B. rather gauche
C. Faux Pas
Re: What twist for 168 gr smk
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: GRIM</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: longebow</div><div class="ubbcode-body">1/10 to 1/12 will do well. Agree with the above comments on the 168--it was great back in the day, but it is now so, dare I say, passe?
</div></div>
So if I showed up at a tactical match with 168 SMK loads would it be considered:
A. a party foul
B. rather gauche
C. Faux Pas
I'm gona go with charlie on this one (C). Somebody tell me why is the 173 and 175 smk so much better than the 168. This gun is not going to be a range only gun or for tatical comp, but also for hunting. I was planning on shooting game with the 168 also.
</div></div>
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: GRIM</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: longebow</div><div class="ubbcode-body">1/10 to 1/12 will do well. Agree with the above comments on the 168--it was great back in the day, but it is now so, dare I say, passe?
So if I showed up at a tactical match with 168 SMK loads would it be considered:
A. a party foul
B. rather gauche
C. Faux Pas
I'm gona go with charlie on this one (C). Somebody tell me why is the 173 and 175 smk so much better than the 168. This gun is not going to be a range only gun or for tatical comp, but also for hunting. I was planning on shooting game with the 168 also.
</div></div>
Re: What twist for 168 gr smk
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: justintimesc</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Getting real close to ordering my barrel for my M40 A1 build. It's not going to be a real clone just a look a like. I want to make the gun bullet specific, I would like to shoot the smk 168 gr. What would be the best twist for this bullet? I have heard 1-12 and 1-11. Whats your thought and experience? </div></div>
justintimesc,
This was your original question as posted above:
Now your question is:
<span style="font-style: italic">I'm gona go with charlie on this one (C). Somebody tell me why is the 173 and 175 smk so much better than the 168. This gun is not going to be a range only gun or for tactical comp, but also for hunting. I was planning on shooting game with the 168 also. </span>
Let me see if I can put all this in context for you:
First, you asked for what would be the best twist for a 168 gr SMK?
Answer: 1-13" for that bullet only or lighter bullet weights...
Next you want to know why 175 SMK's are better than the 168's?
Answer: Because the 168 SMK's will not stay supersonic to 1000 yds out of a normal 308 winchester, at factory ammo velocities. But most factory loaded 175's can reach 1K yds, and stay supersonic.
If you are Never going to shoot @ 1000 yds, then this answer is moot.
By requesting a twist that will shoot 168's SMK the "best", you may be limiting future use of your rifle for other bullets/ applications that you may want to try in the future.
However, it is your rifle, and build whatever you like, for whatever purpose that floats your boat.
But in my opinion only, if you want useful answers, you must ask useful questions. What this means describing fully what your goals, intentions, and maximum ranges you intend shooting with said rifle.
That way posters are not speculating as to what uses you intend to build the rifle for. Asking an open ended question, without context, leads to open ended answers that may or may not be useful to you. Or confuse you, because we are confused, because you have not fully articulated what you are planning to do with the rifle and why.
With such questions that start out with "What is the best?" Context is everything. Without context we are all groping for an answer, without fully knowing what the question is.
Bob
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: justintimesc</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Getting real close to ordering my barrel for my M40 A1 build. It's not going to be a real clone just a look a like. I want to make the gun bullet specific, I would like to shoot the smk 168 gr. What would be the best twist for this bullet? I have heard 1-12 and 1-11. Whats your thought and experience? </div></div>
justintimesc,
This was your original question as posted above:
Now your question is:
<span style="font-style: italic">I'm gona go with charlie on this one (C). Somebody tell me why is the 173 and 175 smk so much better than the 168. This gun is not going to be a range only gun or for tactical comp, but also for hunting. I was planning on shooting game with the 168 also. </span>
Let me see if I can put all this in context for you:
First, you asked for what would be the best twist for a 168 gr SMK?
Answer: 1-13" for that bullet only or lighter bullet weights...
Next you want to know why 175 SMK's are better than the 168's?
Answer: Because the 168 SMK's will not stay supersonic to 1000 yds out of a normal 308 winchester, at factory ammo velocities. But most factory loaded 175's can reach 1K yds, and stay supersonic.
If you are Never going to shoot @ 1000 yds, then this answer is moot.
By requesting a twist that will shoot 168's SMK the "best", you may be limiting future use of your rifle for other bullets/ applications that you may want to try in the future.
However, it is your rifle, and build whatever you like, for whatever purpose that floats your boat.
But in my opinion only, if you want useful answers, you must ask useful questions. What this means describing fully what your goals, intentions, and maximum ranges you intend shooting with said rifle.
That way posters are not speculating as to what uses you intend to build the rifle for. Asking an open ended question, without context, leads to open ended answers that may or may not be useful to you. Or confuse you, because we are confused, because you have not fully articulated what you are planning to do with the rifle and why.
With such questions that start out with "What is the best?" Context is everything. Without context we are all groping for an answer, without fully knowing what the question is.
Bob
Re: What twist for 168 gr smk
Ditch the 168 and use the 175SMK or beven better... Berger 175 or 185BTLR. For that go with 1-11" or 1-11.25"
If you are hellbent on the 168 why not use the amax instead. And in that case it's a 1-12" twist. I can't speak for everybody, but to me...the 168 cuts the nuts off of the .308. It shoots great and is popular in the LE world of sniping because most of these shots are done at an average of 71 yards. Where wind and other atmospheric factors dont have time to effect the bullet. It is a close range headshot bullet. Point is there is much better out there for longer distance.
For game I would look at the 150SST. They shoot great in a 11.25 stock 5R...mine are damn near a one holer.
Ditch the 168 and use the 175SMK or beven better... Berger 175 or 185BTLR. For that go with 1-11" or 1-11.25"
If you are hellbent on the 168 why not use the amax instead. And in that case it's a 1-12" twist. I can't speak for everybody, but to me...the 168 cuts the nuts off of the .308. It shoots great and is popular in the LE world of sniping because most of these shots are done at an average of 71 yards. Where wind and other atmospheric factors dont have time to effect the bullet. It is a close range headshot bullet. Point is there is much better out there for longer distance.
For game I would look at the 150SST. They shoot great in a 11.25 stock 5R...mine are damn near a one holer.
Re: What twist for 168 gr smk
If I was building an M40A1 (I am) I would go with the original 1:12 twist.
1:12 shoots 155 Scenars, 168 and 175 SMK's just fine. Some guys are even getting great results with 208 Amaxes through them.
1:12 is not OPTIMAL for the 175SMK, but then again a M40A1 is not "optimal" for a tactical match.
If you are building a clone, then build a clone. If you are building a match rifle, then select the cartridge you want to use and build the rifle around that.
I have shot and won matches with 168gr duty ammo. I prefer to use 175gr hand loads, but it's not a deal breaker.
If I was building an M40A1 (I am) I would go with the original 1:12 twist.
1:12 shoots 155 Scenars, 168 and 175 SMK's just fine. Some guys are even getting great results with 208 Amaxes through them.
1:12 is not OPTIMAL for the 175SMK, but then again a M40A1 is not "optimal" for a tactical match.
If you are building a clone, then build a clone. If you are building a match rifle, then select the cartridge you want to use and build the rifle around that.
I have shot and won matches with 168gr duty ammo. I prefer to use 175gr hand loads, but it's not a deal breaker.
Re: What twist for 168 gr smk
Well let me lay my plan out here so everyone knows what I'm wanting to do. I'm building a M40A1 look a like, not clone. It will never wear the correct scope and rings, thats why i say look a like and why I don't care about the barrel twist. As for purpose I want the gun for all around use. I do shoot a few matches a year local and would like the gun to perform the best it can for that. Also it would be used as a hunting rifle. The split I would say would be 50/50 as far as use. For shooting distance I am really limited to that by my location, most matches are shot at 200yds or less. Distance for hunting would be a maximum of 400 yds. But I would like this gun to perform well out to 600 yds in the event I do find somewhere around that would allow me to shoot that kinda distance. Currently this would be about a 3.5 hr drive to shoot that kinda distance. I was stuck on the 168 because I have had good luck with them. But I'm no long range or tactical shooter so thats why I came here for info. Right now everyone has me leaning to a 1-11.25 for a broader range of bullet weight, which does make more since.
Well let me lay my plan out here so everyone knows what I'm wanting to do. I'm building a M40A1 look a like, not clone. It will never wear the correct scope and rings, thats why i say look a like and why I don't care about the barrel twist. As for purpose I want the gun for all around use. I do shoot a few matches a year local and would like the gun to perform the best it can for that. Also it would be used as a hunting rifle. The split I would say would be 50/50 as far as use. For shooting distance I am really limited to that by my location, most matches are shot at 200yds or less. Distance for hunting would be a maximum of 400 yds. But I would like this gun to perform well out to 600 yds in the event I do find somewhere around that would allow me to shoot that kinda distance. Currently this would be about a 3.5 hr drive to shoot that kinda distance. I was stuck on the 168 because I have had good luck with them. But I'm no long range or tactical shooter so thats why I came here for info. Right now everyone has me leaning to a 1-11.25 for a broader range of bullet weight, which does make more since.
Re: What twist for 168 gr smk
To kill as many birds with one stone I'd go with the 11 or 11.25 twist. That way if you can shoot 155's though 178's no problem. At the ranges you specify you'll probably end up shooting a 168 SMK and it will perform flawlessly after you work up a load for it (flawlessly to 800 yds that is). If in the event that you travel to a long range match where you can shoot beyond 800 yds you'll have the ability to do so with that 11-something twist barrel and 175 SMK's or 178 AMAX's. You're just gonna have to try a lot of different combos after getting a good 168 load worked up.
For hunting I like the Barnes series of bullets - they perform well at any velocity and are solid thoughout so they are consistent from bullet to bullet.
Ever thought that if you have to sell it what twist rate would be more desirable? Just a thought...
To kill as many birds with one stone I'd go with the 11 or 11.25 twist. That way if you can shoot 155's though 178's no problem. At the ranges you specify you'll probably end up shooting a 168 SMK and it will perform flawlessly after you work up a load for it (flawlessly to 800 yds that is). If in the event that you travel to a long range match where you can shoot beyond 800 yds you'll have the ability to do so with that 11-something twist barrel and 175 SMK's or 178 AMAX's. You're just gonna have to try a lot of different combos after getting a good 168 load worked up.
For hunting I like the Barnes series of bullets - they perform well at any velocity and are solid thoughout so they are consistent from bullet to bullet.
Ever thought that if you have to sell it what twist rate would be more desirable? Just a thought...
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