Suppressors Will Surefire muzzle brake cause crown fouling and accuracy issues?

[Scooter1942]

Just bought an LMT MWS and slapped a Surefire 7.62 muzzle brake/suppressor mount on it. Certainly helps tame recoil, but I it was suggested somewhere that the Surefire 1st chamber functions a bit like a AK Krink booster which causes quite a bit of carbon fouling on the crown. The same person suggested that this build up of carbon could negatively impact accuracy.

I'm toying with switching over to a Surefire flash hider, but before I drop $$ wanted to get opinions. Does SF's brake cause carbon fouling on the crown and does it or could it affect accuracy?

 

[KYS]

I've never heard of that and I along with many others run Surefire brakes for our suppressors or just to help tame recoil. I would take what he or she said with a grain of salt.

 

[SilentG21]

In not an expert by any means, but as a Surefire customer who has done mucho research on their products have never heard of such an issue in the past 20+ years. Ask Garin Lee on this forum. ..he can set your thoughts straight on this.

 

[-Nick-]

I do have first hand experience with the 762RE and YES it can. I would take the brake off every 800-1k rounds and clean it. Because of the way the brakes are designed and some exposed threads between the crown and the first baffle in the brake it tends to build up a false crown from deposits which hurts the accuracy. I discovered this the hard way before a match one time. The build up was so bad I had to soak the brake for awhile and pull out some dental picks later to clean up the ring left behind inside the brake.

 

[normbal]

Surefire regular or mini?

I've owned a TL Guns (Ty Meligan) "Smidget" 5.56 supressor for about 15 years and have had it on several AR guns - including an M16 - and a couple of .223 Bolt guns. I've probably put close to fifteen thousand rounds through it. Never had a problem with carbon buildup (or lead, I used an atchisson .22 LR conversion in an M16 for a few years - it was easier for my 5 year old son to shoot - must've run thousands of rounds of cheap non-plated rounds through it too) but you'll find suppressor manufacturers from sea to shining sea whining about how the too-short can causes carbon buildup and negatively affects accuracy by eroding the crown. That fatuous ass-hat at Red Jacket even opined on this subject at length on some web forum or another.

Pshaw.

After all that, I literally shot close to 1,000 rounds (I could dig up the numbers, I've got the DOPE logs somewhere) through a second-hand Rem 700 PSS with that can on it, sold the gun back to the guy I bought it from and he's put another 2,000 rounds through it no problems, it's still a sub 1/2 MOA gun.

I just picked up a SF 5.56 RC and it locks up TIGHT. I'm looking forward to having it for many tens of thousands of rounds. It's solid, and I doubt there will be any carbon "buildup" or other problems.

Get the Surefire.

I'm wondering if there's a way to clean the smidget but it's working as well today as it was 15 years ago.

 

[Scooter1942]

Surefire regular or mini?

I'm just talking about the SF Brake/Suppressor Mount...not the actual can

 

[normbal]

I'm just talking about the SF Brake/Suppressor Mount...not the actual can

D'oh!

No, I don't see that it should/could/would hurt at all.

There are a LOT of long-range shooters who use brakes of one type or another, I've never come across this being an issue.

 

[KYS]

I will say that for a short while Surefire was turning out some brakes that were found to be made incorrectly. They tried to round them up as a recall because they were causing most rifles to shoot horribly. I think it was the fact the the chambers were cut crooked on the machines.

 

[Kudu22]

We have never had a recall on adapters. I have no idea where that story every got started. There are more QC checks on the adapters than I could even begin to go into. As far as the carbon build up on the crown causing accuracy issues that has never came up as far as I know. I could see a carbon issue if it had a deep recessed target crown but you don't see those on gas guns often. Just running a brush out the bore would hit the carbon and even the bullet uncorking from the crown would knock any carbon away. I am not saying it couldn't happen...all I can say is I haven't had it come up or heard about it before. If you ever have anything else you might have come up just hit me at [email protected]. I will help out however I can.

 

[Scooter1942]

Garin,

Thanks for the response. I'll check the muzzle at 500 rounds and give you a shout if there's any detrimental build up. I'm not too worried about it, but thought I'd switch to a flash hider if it was a commonly known issue.

 

[KYS]

We have never had a recall on adapters. I have no idea where that story every got started. There are more QC checks on the adapters than I could even begin to go into. As far as the carbon build up on the crown causing accuracy issues that has never came up as far as I know. I could see a carbon issue if it had a deep recessed target crown but you don't see those on gas guns often. Just running a brush out the bore would hit the carbon and even the bullet uncorking from the crown would knock any carbon away. I am not saying it couldn't happen...all I can say is I haven't had it come up or heard about it before. If you ever have anything else you might have come up just hit me at [email protected]. I will help out however I can.

Maybe not a "recall" but you all switched out several adapters for a few guys I know and one for me. I know for a fact a prominent rifle builder was having serious issues with some of the 762SS brakes and had to switch out quite a few. The problem existed, it was documented and corrected. Just stating it is not a far fetched issue for a muzzle device to affect the way a rifle shoots/groups.

 

[sic65stang]

I have 2 762SS brakes on my rifles. I have yet to clean the crown or see accuracy issues. Likely 3000 through one and 2000 through the other and I shoot suppressed often. Does it get dirty and look nasty in there yes, but do I notice an issue, not yet....

 

[-Nick-]

My issue must have been due to the type of crown on my GAP10 then, but it did build up to the point that I had to take a dental pick to the thread inside the brake to remove the ring left behind and the crown took some work cleaning back up. I'll try to see if I can dig up the old photos of the issue.

 

[sic65stang]

My Gap10 hasn't seen this issue yet. Maybe it would be worth a clean and see if anything changes.

 

[Rob01]

Same answer as over at AR15 PR section. Never a problem in thousands of rounds through mine and you will most likely shoot the barrel out before it causes accuracy issues.

 

[Chucky]

I had over 5K rounds through my OBR with the MB762-211C on it and it never effected accuracy before I put a SOCOM flash hider on the same rifle.

 

[normbal]

I had over 5K rounds through my OBR with the MB762-211C on it and it never effected accuracy before I put a SOCOM flash hider on the same rifle.

I was talking to the owner of a local gunstore where I just bought another SOCOM about the problems I'm having with my 762SDN-6 and AAC's customer service (where did Paul go? No email forwarding) and when I said "baffle strikes" he said he had a customer who had that happen with his SOCOM recently. Said Surefire insisted the guy return both the can AND the brake, which makes sense. What didn't make complete sense was, in this day and age of CNC machining how a part like a brake could be off-center enough to cause a problem but, considering AAC uses the same technology, it adds up.

Interesting.

 

[Chucky]

It doesn't necessarily have to be the brake or the adapter that is off to get a baffle strike. I have also seen first hand factory barrels that the bore was not concentric to the threads and I had a bad lot of ammo that in two different guns was unstable and caused baffle strikes. Because of the barrel thread issue I now have a set of the Geisselle bore rods that I take with me when ever I meet with customers to make sure their barrel is good.

 

[normbal]

We have never had a recall on adapters. I have no idea where that story every got started. There are more QC checks on the adapters than I could even begin to go into. As far as the carbon build up on the crown causing accuracy issues that has never came up as far as I know. I could see a carbon issue if it had a deep recessed target crown but you don't see those on gas guns often. Just running a brush out the bore would hit the carbon and even the bullet uncorking from the crown would knock any carbon away. I am not saying it couldn't happen...all I can say is I haven't had it come up or heard about it before. If you ever have anything else you might have come up just hit me at [email protected]. I will help out however I can.

It doesn't necessarily have to be the brake or the adapter that is off to get a baffle strike. I have also seen first hand factory barrels that the bore was not concentric to the threads and I had a bad lot of ammo that in two different guns was unstable and caused baffle strikes. Because of the barrel thread issue I now have a set of the Geisselle bore rods that I take with me when ever I meet with customers to make sure their barrel is good.

Thanks for this, Chuck. I've been thinking about having my DPMS REPR's barrel checked. It might be an easier fix than sending my can back to AAC.