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Best varmint rifle from factory?

#51
I went the route of the Kimber Longmaster Classic in 223 with the 24" barrel. This is it with a 10X variable scope. I'v since switched out the scope for a Zeiss Conquest 4-14. It loves 40 grain Nosler Ballistic Tips and 63 grain Sierra Semi Spitzers and anyting heavier. It has a 1:9 twist.



This is a game we play at the range ... throw your ante in the pot ... everyone gets their own target, first shot must be in the 10 ring, everyone shoots. Everyone with a clean 10 ring shot moves to round 2. Next shot must be fully on the target but not touching another bullet hole. Everyone with a clean shot moves to round 3 etc. You keep shooting till everyone drops out and someone gets the money. Then you do it again. The target keeps getting smaller and smaller. This was at 100 yards. It gets real tough at 200 yards. This target was a winner. Bragging rights are great.

 
#55
ranger1183 said:
The Steyr Tactical Elite is a factory rifle that I would stack up against any other factory rifle. Without going to a custom built rifle, this Steyr is more accurate than any other factory rifle I have ever shot.
STEYR ELITE :: steyr-mannlicher.com :: count on it

terifle.jpg

Steyr_Elite.jpg
Click to expand...

long range newbie said:
Yeah but they're like 2300 and I could get a tikka and deck it out for that price. (tikka t3 varmint 820, base 80, bolt shroud/handle kit 130, 750 for chassis, 40 for warne rings, and ~400 for decent scope). all adds up to 2220
Click to expand...

Sorry, didnt see the $1200 budget on the first read. In that case a 5R Stainless Steel Remington 700 is the way I'd go. So many great upgrades for it and so much demand and value on resale. Those .223 AI mags and chassis systems really make for a stand out rifle.
 
#56
I've just broke in a Savage VLP-DBM .308. It is shooting sub moa at 2670 fps with the trigger set at 2.5 lbs. I have to say I am impressed. It was ordered sight unseen. What came into the shop is what I got. All I did was a visual inspection before the purchase.
 
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#57
long range newbie said:
I like the XLR chassis, never have seen a whiskey chassis before (in real life) and the xlr is cheaper. I also don't know of any savage rifles that come at as good as of a deal as the tikka varmint.
Click to expand...

Not pushing one or the other on you. Just showing some pros and cons on the price. Performance, in my opinion, will be the same out of the box.
Price to price on just the rifle the Tikka wins. It has plastic bits. Can't beat that when going cheap. However, savage has a better backing on parts and you could even change the barrel on your own no hassle (wrench and go gauge is all you need). Savage also doesn't need to be trued. If you stick with early game the Tikka will win. If you think about the long run they will both cost the same :p.

A lot of different variables. You can't go wrong with either one. What is most important to you? $1200 and out of the box accuracy alone can't determine either one of these.
 
#58
Most important thing is to have 24in bbl, 1:8 (1:9 may be acceptable), nice trigger, nice bolt (smooth), nice bolt handle, detachable mags, I'd also like it to be at least 3/4 moa. Weigh about 9lbs max (I might be ok with little heavier) threaded would be a plus. I'd spend more if It came in a nice stock.
 
#61
This!!
The Steyr will out shoot any factory stick I've ever shot. The only way to beat one is to go the custom route and even then you'll have your work cut out for you.


ranger1183 said:
The Steyr Tactical Elite is a factory rifle that I would stack up against any other factory rifle. Without going to a custom built rifle, this Steyr is more accurate than any other factory rifle I have ever shot.
STEYR ELITE :: steyr-mannlicher.com :: count on it

terifle.jpg

Steyr_Elite.jpg
Click to expand...
 
#62
I have a custom Remington 700 $2,300 and will shoot just a good as the Savage $850 I mentioned above so it doesn't need to be a custom rifle. And you're not paying attention to his budget.

BTW, that is a kick ass Kimber rifle, flashhole !!!
 
#64
Surgikill said:
If you want customizability go with a Remington. However a nice savage or cz would leave You with 400-500 for a scope

Sent from GS3 Synergy
Click to expand...

Does that remy come with a 'Smith? If not, you are going to need one. On the other hand, Savage is user friendly and has just as much aftermarket parts.

I haven't played with a Tikka much but they seem very well built. I know their aftermarket support is growing which is great. I'd put the Savage and Tikka way ahead of anything remy currently has to offer.
 
#65
Is Tikka associated with Sako associated with Beretta now. My only concern is parts. I have a Sako Finnfire that is super. The only problem is parts.
 
#67
346ci said:
Does that remy come with a 'Smith? If not, you are going to need one. On the other hand, Savage is user friendly and has just as much aftermarket parts.

I haven't played with a Tikka much but they seem very well built. I know their aftermarket support is growing which is great. I'd put the Savage and Tikka way ahead of anything remy currently has to offer.
Click to expand...

I don't disagree with you. Personally I hate Remington and Remington style actions. That's why i stick with CZ. Not much aftermarket availability but I really like them. Amazing trigger and a nice sturdy action. Not to mention they shoot lights out. I was torn between CZ and Savage and i went with CZ because i have shot one before. I want to buy a savage in the future, but i don't think I'll ever by a Remington.

Sent from GS3 Synergy
 
#70
FailToObserve said:
Not pushing one or the other on you. Just showing some pros and cons on the price. Performance, in my opinion, will be the same out of the box.
Price to price on just the rifle the Tikka wins. It has plastic bits. Can't beat that when going cheap. However, savage has a better backing on parts and you could even change the barrel on your own no hassle (wrench and go gauge is all you need). Savage also doesn't need to be trued. If you stick with early game the Tikka will win. If you think about the long run they will both cost the same :p.

A lot of different variables. You can't go wrong with either one. What is most important to you? $1200 and out of the box accuracy alone can't determine either one of these.
Click to expand...

What are you talking about? If anything a Savage is going to be unreliable over the long haul. Tikka's are probally the most true factory action you can buy.... as been said by many of the smiths on this very website. Tikka All day everyday over a Savage.
 
#71
Culpeper said:
Is Tikka associated with Sako associated with Beretta now. My only concern is parts. I have a Sako Finnfire that is super. The only problem is parts.
Click to expand...

Tikka is a subsidiary of Sako.

Its Basicaly the same exact quality, slightly different designs, made on the same machinery. Both companies are owned by Berretta and BerrettaUSA is fucking RETARDED when it comes to supporting them.

The good news is, they rarley need parts/upgrades.
 
#72
#73
My Rem 700 SPS-V shot 3/4" out of the box with factory ammo. Changed out the stock for a VLS takeoff that I picked up from the classifieds on this site and put a Timney trigger in it. It now shoots 1/4 - 1/2" with several different hand loads.
 
#74
long range newbie said:
well never really shoot 200yards plus its dense brush here and I can always take out the 260 or something bigger if I need more umph for the wind or distance. I might consider another caliber
Click to expand...

200 yards or less varmint rifle and you're looking at cannons. I've got a Remington model 7 with a 1-13tw Kreiger #4 barrel in .221 Fireball for sale that will shoot chipmunks at that distance all day, use less powder doing it, weighs less, and will last longer than the .223.
 
#75
dKilla said:
My Rem 700 SPS-V shot 3/4" out of the box with factory ammo. Changed out the stock for a VLS takeoff that I picked up from the classifieds on this site and put a Timney trigger in it. It now shoots 1/4 - 1/2" with several different hand loads.
Click to expand...

Yea its amazing how everyone on this site has a 700 SPS or other $500 gun that shoots better than GAP's and Suergeons... Yet it never happens in person when I actualy shoot around them.
 
#76
Best varmint rifle from factory?

Well sir, I have nothing to prove...admittedly, I spent probably $1000 on reloading components working up a few loads that shoot that well. Clearly there's no interest here.

I'll kindly move on if my input is not wanted. For the record, however...

Best group:
8epurajy.jpg


First group with lam stock:
epu2aqyg.jpg


Pic of original rifle:
a4yzy6ah.jpg


Pic of out of the box group with factory ammo:
re7aha5u.jpg


Pic of rifle as it stands today:
4etydequ.jpg
 
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#77
Cobracutter said:
Yea its amazing how everyone on this site has a 700 SPS or other $500 gun that shoots better than GAP's and Suergeons... Yet it never happens in person when I actualy shoot around them.
Click to expand...

Expensive tools are no more precise than a hatchet in the hands of a talentless hack. Many have witnessed skilled artists/craftsman create beautiful sculptures with little more than a chainsaw, a chisel and a block of wood or ice.

There are plenty of sub-MOA,100 yard $500 rifles on the market...sub-MOA shooters are another matter. Here's how mine shot out of the box:

gebesu2e.jpg


And after some work:

esy8ava2.jpg
 
#78
Gun either shoots or it doesn't. Custom guns just help guarantee better accuracy, but even they have their problems. About 95% of accuracy comes from the barrel any way, other 5% in concentricness of the action and bedding.
 
#79
Best varmint rifle from factory?

Expensive tools are no more precise than a hatchet in the hands of a talentless hack. Many have witnessed skilled artists/craftsman create beautiful sculptures with nothing more than a chainsaw, a chisel and a block of wood or ice. There are plenty of 100 yard sub-MOA $500 rifles on the market....sub-MOA shooters are another matter, entirely.

For the record, here's my SPS-V .243, brand new with scope mounted:
rifle1.jpg

And here's the first group I shot with it and factory ammo
target1.jpg

And here's the upgraded rife:
rifle2.jpg

And the best group the first time I took that out:
target2.jpg

And finally, the best group I've shot with it during load development (.265")
target3.jpg


Cobracutter said:
Yea its amazing how everyone on this site has a 700 SPS or other $500 gun that shoots better than GAP's and Suergeons... Yet it never happens in person when I actualy shoot around them.
Click to expand...
 
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#80
[MENTION=81527]dKilla[/MENTION] that last group is velocity deviation. Tighten up your load tolerances and that will become one hole

Sent from GS3 Synergy
 
#81
Best varmint rifle from factory?

Surgikill said:
[MENTION=81527]dKilla[/MENTION] that last group is velocity deviation. Tighten up your load tolerances and that will become one hole

Sent from GS3 Synergy
Click to expand...
[MENTION=88318]Surgikill[/MENTION]
Thanks, I thought it was either that or me not breaking the shot at the same point in my breath cycle.
 
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#82
Surgikill said:
[MENTION=81527]dKilla[/MENTION] that last group is velocity deviation. Tighten up your load tolerances and that will become one hole

Sent from GS3 Synergy
Click to expand...

More likely breaking the shot at different points in the breathing cycle. His velocities would have to vary more than 10% between shots at this difference to produce that much vertical discrepancy.
 
#83
paindoc said:
More likely breaking the shot at different points in the breathing cycle. His velocities would have to vary more than 10% between shots at this difference to produce that much vertical discrepancy.
Click to expand...

Can you explain how that would affect it? I've never heard that before so I'm curious.

Sent from GS3 Synergy
 
#84
Zoom way in and watch your crosshairs rise as you exhale and fall as you inhale. If you're not breaking the shot at the same point in your breathing cycle it will cause vertical stringing in your shots. I actually think I learned about it the first time watching some instructional videos that I found on the homepage of this site. I'm at work now but I'll see if I can dig them up and post a link when I get home tonight.
 
#85
Surgikill said:
Can you explain how that would affect it? I've never heard that before so I'm curious.

Sent from GS3 Synergy
Click to expand...

The principal reason a shot string appears in a vertical fashion is that at the point the shot is released, if there is any difference in intrapleural volume (air in the lungs), the rifle will be pointed either higher or lower. Eg. During inhalation, the rifle will point downward and during exhalation the rifle will point upward. So if the shot breaks at different points in the breathing cycle the shots will have this classic grouping pattern.
 
#86
Originally Posted by dKilla View Post
My Rem 700 SPS-V shot 3/4" out of the box with factory ammo. Changed out the stock for a VLS takeoff that I picked up from the classifieds on this site and put a Timney trigger in it. It now shoots 1/4 - 1/2" with several different hand loads.
Click to expand...

Cobracutter said:
Yea its amazing how everyone on this site has a 700 SPS or other $500 gun that shoots better than GAP's and Suergeons... Yet it never happens in person when I actualy shoot around them.
Click to expand...

What's the deal. He never compared his Remington to anything. It's not that difficult to get a .75" group with a new rifle at 100 yards. It's almost point blank. So, if he is getting smaller groups with hand loads it only makes sense. He is not saying it happens all the time. I never assumed that when I read it. Also, taking out that BS factory trigger made a big difference as well. He got a good rifle out of the box. It happens. Go figure.
 
#87
paindoc said:
The principal reason a shot string appears in a vertical fashion is that at the point the shot is released, if there is any difference in intrapleural volume (air in the lungs), the rifle will be pointed either higher or lower. Eg. During inhalation, the rifle will point downward and during exhalation the rifle will point upward. So if the shot breaks at different points in the breathing cycle the shots will have this classic grouping pattern.
Click to expand...

Does this happen on a lead sled as well?

Sent from GS3 Synergy
 
#90
Best varmint rifle from factory?

Culpeper said:
What's the deal. He never compared his Remington to anything. It's not that difficult to get a .75" group with a new rifle at 100 yards. It's almost point blank. So, if he is getting smaller groups with hand loads it only makes sense. He is not saying it happens all the time. I never assumed that when I read it. Also, taking out that BS factory trigger made a big difference as well. He got a good rifle out of the box. It happens. Go figure.
Click to expand...

Yeah, some guys just can't wrap their head around the fact that you don't have to spend $2500 on a rifle to be able to hit the broad side of a barn. The original poster is looking for. .223 that'll shoot under an inch at 100 yards...hell, go down to your local Wally World and buy whatever bolt rifle they have in stock, pick up some quality ammo and you're pretty much good to go. The guy isn't looking to shoot holes in the foreheads of mosquitos at 1000 yards. Ease up!

On a side note.. If it makes anyone feel better, I probably spent another $500 testing different reloading components to find a few good loads for my 700. The process will likely never end.
 
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#91
I cant see the Remington 700 Police mentioned in .223...I have one and man it is a hammer, I had a pro trigger job done on it lightened a bit, I've worked up two perfect hand loads 55gn and 69, shoots one hole groups all day at 100....(sure it doesnt have a detachable mag)
 
#94
dKilla said:
Zoom way in and watch your crosshairs rise as you exhale and fall as you inhale. If you're not breaking the shot at the same point in your breathing cycle it will cause vertical stringing in your shots. I actually think I learned about it the first time watching some instructional videos that I found on the homepage of this site. I'm at work now but I'll see if I can dig them up and post a link when I get home tonight.
Click to expand...

dkilla: I like the laminate stock on that rifle. Boyds or Remington factory take-off of a VLS?
 
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