Rifle Scopes OK, I've narrowed it down to 2 scopes......Updates inbound!

[10ring'r]

My budget has been reduced some, so I've decided between a Vortex PST 5x25x50 w/EBR7C MOA ret. or the Bushnell Forge 4.5x27x50 w/deploy MOA ret. Of the two, which would you choose? I've looked at a few others (Athlon, Trac, N.F.($$), Burris) and none of them had the reticles I preferred (Christmas tree style). So that's my story and I'm sticking with it. Mac
ETA: Will be used on a .223 600yd. AR and maybe a 6.5CM in the future.

 

[wade2big]

I like the gen ii PST scopes. I do not like the EBR-7C reticle. I sold several Razors and several AMG’s because of that reticle and that is saying something since It is the only reticle up to this point that I just can not deal with. Anyhow that part is completely subjective as you may like it.

I have no experience with the Bushnell.

 

[Diver160651]

I like the gen ii PST scopes. I do not like the EBR-7C reticle. I sold several Razors and several AMG’s because of that reticle and that is saying something since It is the only reticle up to this point that I just can not deal with. Anyhow that part is completely subjective as you may like it.

I have no experience with the Bushnell.

I agree - dang the new pst is a value, especially used.. its not tier 1 but it works

 

[Kevins750]

The forge scopes are on sale, about half off on a certain site....that may factor in your choice.

 

[DeadeyeD’rick]

PST Gen II would be my choice out of those 2. It hits a lot of boxes for the money. The Ares ETR could be another great option depending on budget and based on used values.

 

[10ring'r]

Thanks all, I'm kinda torn on the "floating dot" myself. I have to admit, out of the two reticles mentioned, the Forge, is my pick. BUT, the PST's knobs are "grippier" and the reticle is "glass etched", which I feel, is much more durable, compared to a "wire" type. Thanks again! Mac

 

[DeadeyeD’rick]

After using my ETR and Midas TACs for a while I prefer the center dot. It just works well for me and doesn’t cover much of the target

 

[beetroot]

Ive not seen a Bushnell Forge, but AI do not believe they are of the same quality/performance as the PST/Athlon Ares/Burris XTRII price point.

The PST Gen 2 is a very good scope for the money, the 3-15x44 would do well on an AR15.

 

[10ring'r]

UPDATE: I got bored last night and went ahead an ordered the Vortex Viper PST 5x25x50. Went with that mag., because I'm old! I also ordered a Seekins MXM 20MOA mount to go along with it. Will update, if this combo works out. Again thanks everyone. Mac

 

[richthe1]

I like the gen ii PST scopes. I do not like the EBR-7C reticle. I sold several Razors and several AMG’s because of that reticle and that is saying something since It is the only reticle up to this point that I just can not deal with. Anyhow that part is completely subjective as you may like it.

I have no experience with the Bushnell.

Why don’t you like it? I was looking at picking one up. I like the EBR-7C on paper, but haven’t had a chance to look through one myself.

 

[wade2big]

Why don’t you like it? I was looking at picking one up. I like the EBR-7C on paper, but haven’t had a chance to look through one myself.

Its all preference man. I typically shoot at no more than 15x and usually less than that. The EBR-7C seems to be built around 18x on the low end. On the magnification that I shoot, the .2s along with the .5 underneath turn into a crowded mess that my eyes just can’t deal with. Up at 18x and above the .2s are useful. The Ebr-2c or 2D suit me much better. The pst 3-15 has a thicker reticle yet which is even more of a plus.

 

[koshkin]

I know you already ordered, but for what it's worth:

Between your two options, PST Gen II is the better way to go. If you open up your options a little, with scopes that go to 25x and above, in terms of optical quality, Meopta Optika 6 5-30x56 seems to be your best bang for the buck. Mechanically, they seem to be holding up really well so far, but being new, I can't tell you anything about long term durability.

With scopes of somewhat more moderate magnification, for $1k, I am really impressed with what Brownell's MPO offers. For a bit less, Meopta's Optika 6 3-18x50 looks really promising and I really like PST Gen 2 3-15x50.

ILya

 

[10ring'r]

I know you already ordered, but for what it's worth:

Between your two options, PST Gen II is the better way to go. If you open up your options a little, with scopes that go to 25x and above, in terms of optical quality, Meopta Optika 6 5-30x56 seems to be your best bang for the buck. Mechanically, they seem to be holding up really well so far, but being new, I can't tell you anything about long term durability.

With scopes of somewhat more moderate magnification, for $1k, I am really impressed with what Brownell's MPO offers. For a bit less, Meopta's Optika 6 3-18x50 looks really promising and I really like PST Gen 2 3-15x50.

ILya

I looked at those also and did consider them. I went with the PST due to the fact my gun guy uses one and he had nothing but praise for them, but he is a salesman. Time will tell and I hope it serves my needs, because it will probably be the last scope I buy for a while( boy, I hope I don't eat my words here). I think the reticle will work for me because I've always have used MOA scopes and after starring at the reticle and reading how to use it, I think it will be fine. I don't have to estimate yardages, because all my shooting is done at known distances, but it's nice to be able to when/if the need ever arises and if I move back to the desert, then I will really get my monies worth out of it. I will probably be using 15x to 25x most of the time anyway, because I shoot prone and from a bench 100% of the time( not a runner and gunner type). Thanks again everyone! Mac

 

[spife7980]

( boy, I hope I don't eat my words here)

keep hanging around here and I guarantee you will

 

[10ring'r]

Update: New PST arrives today and will get it mounted. Hope to make it to the range next week, if the weather will hold out, and get it zero'd and do at least a short target tracking test. Wish me luck! Mac

 

[92trk]

You'll love it. I have that same scope and have no complaints.

 

[Kickin45]

Meopta Optika6

 

[10ring'r]

Update #2: Received scope and after wifey do's, got started mounting it (scope, not wife). My Seekins mount, was a little lower than I wanted, but do-able. Had to remove my cheek riser, off of my CTR stock, which I use with a 16" "Gen. use" upper. I had a bitch of a time getting the eye relief set, I bet it took me 30-45 min., moving that darn scope back & forth, just to get it it perfect. You do not have to move your head much, to get the "toilet paper" roll effect. After adjusting the ocular, with the mag. set at 25x and paralax at infinity, the reticle is actually nice, illum. is outstanding, even at pos. 5, it's brite enough and even with my old/corrected eyes. Even on 5x, I can see the "floating dot". So, as far as I can tell now, I'm impressed and looking forward to hitting the range next week, Wx permitting. Mac

 

[blindeye]

My budget has been reduced some, so I've decided between a Vortex PST 5x25x50 w/EBR7C MOA ret. or the Bushnell Forge 4.5x27x50 w/deploy MOA ret. Of the two, which would you choose? I've looked at a few others (Athlon, Trac, N.F.($$), Burris) and none of them had the reticles I preferred (Christmas tree style). So that's my story and I'm sticking with it. Mac
ETA: Will be used on a .223 600yd. AR and maybe a 6.5CM in the future.

Not sure your budget but the new NX8 units from NF with the MIL-XT or T3 might be an option. Starting at $1950, just a thought.

 

[10ring'r]

Not sure your budget but the new NX8 units from NF with the MIL-XT or T3 might be an option. Starting at $1950, just a thought.

NF is my top choice, and has been for quite a few years. Just never could justify 3-5k on glass, nice, but don't shoot competitively, so I don't make any money at it, so, I'm just one of those guys that shoot because it's relaxing and fun. When I hunted elk, deer, I used to use 4x Weaver scopes (dating myself now). I didn't get into "spendy" glass until I started hunting yotes. This is the most $$ I've spent on glass in my shooting career. Thanks for the suggestion though. Mac

 

[10ring'r]

Update #3: Went to range today. Got it on paper in 3 shots, zeroed in 2. Quite pleased at how easy it was to set the RZR stop, that is if you remember to bottom it out prior to starting, Duh! Did a short tracking test (only used 10 moa) and was surprised that my 2 shot groups, were only 1/4 inch from my pasters. Maybe I pulled, maybe I didn't? Anyway, thought it was close enough for what I'm going to be doing. It also returned to "0" perfectly. Glass is very vivid/sharp. I was looking thru it during sunlight and during overcast periods ( 6 hours total ). The EBR-7C reticle is pretty easy to see and decipher and does not appear to be too "busy". Illumination worked as advertised, but during sunny times, the reticle looks orange, not red. Even when turned on and on the highest setting, it's still sharp, did not appear to "wash" to me. As far as I can see (pardon the pun), if this thing holds together and gives me trouble free viewing, I will feel it was money well spent. That's my story and I'm sticking with it! Mac
ETA: Using my Seekins 20 moa mount, I ended up having 59.25 moa elevation left over for dial-ups. Not bad.

 

[10ring'r]

Ok, math ?? for the optics pros here.
I used a Seekins 20 MOA 1-piece mount for my PST. ? is, after I got my hard "0", adjusted my zero stop, I had 59.25 MOA left for dial-ups, so if the scope had originally 70 MOA total for elev. and you subtract the 20 MOA from the 59.25 (237 Cl.) MOA I had left, that means I'm at 39.25 MOA or 4.25 MOA above the optic center (70÷2=35 + 4.25= 39.25) of the reticle/glass. Am I correct in this math or am I smok'n crack?? Thanx to all that will poke fun at me! Mac

 

[black5.3]

Have you confirmed your mount is on the gun in the correct orientation? you should have around 50-55MOA of upward adjustment available to you give or take a few MOA. So by your previous comment when you said you had 59.25 MOA of up adjustment after zero then it sounds like your right.... But it sounds like your doing your math wrong...

 

[10ring'r]

Have you confirmed your mount is on the gun in the correct orientation? you should have around 50-55MOA of upward adjustment available to you give or take a few MOA. So by your previous comment when you said you had 59.25 MOA of up adjustment after zero then it sounds like your right.... But it sounds like your doing your math wrong...

Hi, the mount and scope are mounted correctly. 59.25 MOA is what I have with the Elev. turret, topped out(?). The mount is 20 MOA, so if it is a true 20 MOA, it should give back an additional 20 MOA of adjustment to the erector. In other words, instead of my "0" being at 55 MOA ( Hypothetically, 35 MOA is the center of scope's mech. "0" w/"0" MOA mount), it's now at 15 MOA w/ 20 MOA mount, saying my "0" is at mech. "0" of 35 MOA, subtract 20 MOA = 15 MOA, at least in a perfect world anyways. Sorry, it's probably not the proper way to equate this issue, but it's late and my math skills are starting to falter. Thanx! Mac

 

[black5.3]

So your saying that with your scopes adjustment sitting at the mechanical zero stop your about 15 moa below the mechanical center on the erector?? And that your total come up to max out the elevation turret is about 59.25 moa?? If im understanding what your saying correctly then it sounds alright to me.. have you checked to see what ranges you can shoot out to with 59 minutes of come up? If it falls in line with your shooting requirements then let it ride.

 

[10ring'r]

So your saying that with your scopes adjustment sitting at the mechanical zero stop your about 15 moa below the mechanical center on the erector?? And that your total come up to max out the elevation turret is about 59.25 moa?? If im understanding what your saying correctly then it sounds alright to me.. have you checked to see what ranges you can shoot out to with 59 minutes of come up? If it falls in line with your shooting requirements then let it ride.

According to Strelok Pro and JBM, at my DA, I can reach out to 900-950 yds. (B/H 5.56mm 77gr. TMK @ 2650 fps m.v.). I think I had it explained better in my post #23, whereas, I am 4.25 MOA above/below optic/mech. center of the erector/glass. From what I have read and understood, being in the center of the glass/reticle/erector, is the optimum place to be, for optic clarity. Kinda being ADHD, but I've got time on my hands. Thanx for the input. Mac

 

[10ring'r]

UPDATE #4......Old thread, but maybe this update will give those that are considering a Vortex optic, this might answer the tracking questions.
Got a few projects completed on the homefront, so, I figured I'd fine tune my rifle/scope combo. Did a box/tracking test at 100yds. Made up a target, using 5 moa spacing for a total of 35 moa (up/down) and 10 moa, in total for right/left. Didn't re-zero from last time, but, I used older/different .223 ammo, instead of my usual 5.56mm TMK's, which shot higher (1.5"). Shot a total of 42 rnds. (2 per poi). See photo below and I know, I can't write worth a crap anymore. Thought scope tracked well, considering I had full value wind gusts up to 15 mph. A couple of shots, were touching, soooo....I think the scope did quite well and works as advertised.
Mac