- Thread starter Dthomas3523
- Start date
He can do what ever caliber you want ,if I am not mistaken , he does everything in house
The regular tuner still needs to be turned by smith.
The tuner brake is an actual brake and the tuner on it is substantially smaller which can at times matter on larger contour barrels.
Hello,
Looking for insight into load development experiences using Varget and Shooters World Precision with the Barnes 112s and Hornady 108's along with Alpha OCD brass...
Kind regards,
Mike
Looking for insight into load development experiences using Varget and Shooters World Precision with the Barnes 112s and Hornady 108's along with Alpha OCD brass...
Kind regards,
Mike
Well I have the competition barrel contour and it fits perfectly can go a little bit thicker on the the barrel and still fit
@Dthomas3523 and it was done by Enrique over in Brownsvile.
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Has nothing to do what I was talking about.
I’m referring to the size of the weight vs barrel contour and the effectiveness.
has any one ever used N130 for 6gt, if so how did it preform and what was your weight used?
Well now that I have a functioning load in the 6GT I think I'll share it.
A page or two back I listed my struggles in getting this rifle to shoot, while troubleshooting the problem, swapping bullets cleared up my issue. This rifle just didn't like my initial bullet choice. So here's the load I landed on.
115gr DTAC
35.5grs Shooters World Long Rifle
CCI 450 SRP
Hornady brass
2840fps in a 26" Hawk Hill barrel
I put 32 rounds across a V3 on a Wiser mount yesterday getting zero and playing at various yardages. SD settled at 5.4 with an ES of 21. Last 5 shots back at 100 yards measured a .22".
A page or two back I listed my struggles in getting this rifle to shoot, while troubleshooting the problem, swapping bullets cleared up my issue. This rifle just didn't like my initial bullet choice. So here's the load I landed on.
115gr DTAC
35.5grs Shooters World Long Rifle
CCI 450 SRP
Hornady brass
2840fps in a 26" Hawk Hill barrel
I put 32 rounds across a V3 on a Wiser mount yesterday getting zero and playing at various yardages. SD settled at 5.4 with an ES of 21. Last 5 shots back at 100 yards measured a .22".
Thats the tipped rebated boat tail.
They're shooting really well for me. I stacked everything on one spot verifying velocity at 600yds. My BC check at 1000 was a 4" vertical spread. About 6 to 7" wide with the 6 to 9mph FV wind.
I'm at 1200 rounds on the barrel. Not sure how much life I'll get out of it. I shot the Ruger-Koenig match in Colorado in 104 degree heat. The rifle shot great all weekend. The Hornady PRC in Wyoming this weekend is supposed to be high 90's. I dont expect a high round count from this barrel.. I'll keep running this load and see how she holds up.
I tried joining the 6GT forum on Facebook to get some load data but have yet to get a reply. I'm trying to get loads for the 105 match burners for practice. I have the following powder:
IMR 4166
StaBall
IMR 4451
H4350
RL 17
Anyone have load data I'd greatly appreciate it.
IMR 4166
StaBall
IMR 4451
H4350
RL 17
Anyone have load data I'd greatly appreciate it.
Looking for brass or dies? I have some for sale in the PX.
www.snipershide.com
300 new brass GA Precision branded $240 delivered.
Dies $160 delivered.
SOLD - Price lowered -6GT RCBS Dies and 300 new brass
6GT RCBS Dies and 300 new GA Precision brass I’d prefer to sell these together. $395 delivered for the unused dies and new in bag brass. That’s what it cost me delivered with shipping and tax, plus a medium flat rate box to you. PayPal or Venmo or Zelle
www.snipershide.com 300 new brass GA Precision branded $240 delivered.
Dies $160 delivered.
Anyone have some some success with 112 match burners and h4350? Running in 26” barre and looking to run on the slower side. Less than 2900.
Perfect thank you. My first break in rounds were done slow with low grain bullets so I was thinking that I needed to be I. The 36 grain area. Much appreciated. How did they shoot for you?
Great thank you for the insight. That’s a big help as I would have started in the .02 range.
Thank you and much appreciated.
ES of 17 is fine. Good shooting. I would load a bunch and send it.
26" PVA Rock Creek cut rifle 7.5T
Prime Hornady once fired brass. Annealed, full length sized with .002 shoulder bump, trimmed 1.716, 21st Century .242 mandrel
I love to hear others thoughts on mandrel size?
My seating pressure was very consistent based on feel, but it felt low. I might try a .2415 mandrel if I can find one.
Charges were done on a chargemaster & I counted 4-5 kernels of the 555 to change scale by .1
109 Berger touches lands in my barrel @ 2.613
CCI #41
N 555
All seated at 2.583 COAL
37gr = 2809 avg SD 14
37.3gr = 2847 avg SD 11
37.6gr = 2865 avg SD 12.5
37.9gr = 2894 avg SD 9.8
38.2gr = 2907 avg SD 7.4 no pressure & not compressed
The above all shot under .5 moa with 37.9 and 38.2 a little better.
So based on that I loaded the rest @
38.6gr = 2920 avg SD 7.4
All velocities were with a Magnetospeed
Tweaked the 109 G7 to .298 to get AB lined up at 1000y
Never put a group on paper of the above load before the match but it shot well.
I've got about 15 rounds left from the match so I'll seat them deeper in .010 inc & put those groups on paper.
The Vit N555 seemed to just get better as the charge went up. It was a Hot as hell at the match today & zero pressure signs.
If I don't wind up having to seat deeper I'll try stuffing in 38.9gr next & that's going to be compressed.
The 38.6 info above was 5 x over the magneto & first shot was with a cold clean bore.
First shot was a little slow, then it got happy.
38.6gr Brass
Prime Hornady once fired brass. Annealed, full length sized with .002 shoulder bump, trimmed 1.716, 21st Century .242 mandrel
I love to hear others thoughts on mandrel size?
My seating pressure was very consistent based on feel, but it felt low. I might try a .2415 mandrel if I can find one.
Charges were done on a chargemaster & I counted 4-5 kernels of the 555 to change scale by .1
109 Berger touches lands in my barrel @ 2.613
CCI #41
N 555
All seated at 2.583 COAL
37gr = 2809 avg SD 14
37.3gr = 2847 avg SD 11
37.6gr = 2865 avg SD 12.5
37.9gr = 2894 avg SD 9.8
38.2gr = 2907 avg SD 7.4 no pressure & not compressed
The above all shot under .5 moa with 37.9 and 38.2 a little better.
So based on that I loaded the rest @
38.6gr = 2920 avg SD 7.4
All velocities were with a Magnetospeed
Tweaked the 109 G7 to .298 to get AB lined up at 1000y
Never put a group on paper of the above load before the match but it shot well.
I've got about 15 rounds left from the match so I'll seat them deeper in .010 inc & put those groups on paper.
The Vit N555 seemed to just get better as the charge went up. It was a Hot as hell at the match today & zero pressure signs.
If I don't wind up having to seat deeper I'll try stuffing in 38.9gr next & that's going to be compressed.
The 38.6 info above was 5 x over the magneto & first shot was with a cold clean bore.
First shot was a little slow, then it got happy.
38.6gr Brass
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I just broke my first barrel in today. Wow I'm sold.
Virgin alpha ocd brass, H4350 .060" jump berger 109 lrht
Sent 35, 35.5, 36, 36.5
All printed 3/4" and in 5 shot groups.
I didn't Chrono it, but confirming groups at 600y the dope lined up around 2850-2860 which is fine by me, maybe it will still speed up. Either way it was a very easy and fun day because everything shot well.
I'm just stoked I used my regular 6.5 creed mags and they fed perfect, plus I was easily able to stuff x15 of those guys in there with my 419 extension.
Virgin alpha ocd brass, H4350 .060" jump berger 109 lrht
Sent 35, 35.5, 36, 36.5
All printed 3/4" and in 5 shot groups.
I didn't Chrono it, but confirming groups at 600y the dope lined up around 2850-2860 which is fine by me, maybe it will still speed up. Either way it was a very easy and fun day because everything shot well.
I'm just stoked I used my regular 6.5 creed mags and they fed perfect, plus I was easily able to stuff x15 of those guys in there with my 419 extension.
I'm loving the shit out of mine.
33.6 of Varget.
Alpha Brass (Virgin)
CCI 41's
105 Berger Hybrids jumping about 40
Running at 2885 fps out of a 26" Proof
I think she's sped up and settled down now. This is right about 250 or so rounds into the barrel.
33.6 of Varget.
Alpha Brass (Virgin)
CCI 41's
105 Berger Hybrids jumping about 40
Running at 2885 fps out of a 26" Proof
I think she's sped up and settled down now. This is right about 250 or so rounds into the barrel.
Benchmark 26” 7.5t VCC (Strait Jacket)
Curtis vector
105 hybrid ~ .040 off touch. I eye balled it. I will remeasure for a .060 jump for remainder .
36.0 H4350
Cci #450
Virgin alpha OCD brass just .242 mandrel.
2900fps, 9sd, 21es…only the first 100 rounds through tube so I expect more speed over the next 50-150 rounds where I’ll really check numbers. It shot bug holes at 100 and dope was dead on out to 600.
Also planning on running the 109 for PRS. So I’ll get new numbers when barrel settles down. Planning on running it to 3000 for the 109.
damn it’s a heavy barrel contour. Definitely taking off some weights when I get it ready for matches.
Curtis vector
105 hybrid ~ .040 off touch. I eye balled it. I will remeasure for a .060 jump for remainder .
36.0 H4350
Cci #450
Virgin alpha OCD brass just .242 mandrel.
2900fps, 9sd, 21es…only the first 100 rounds through tube so I expect more speed over the next 50-150 rounds where I’ll really check numbers. It shot bug holes at 100 and dope was dead on out to 600.
Also planning on running the 109 for PRS. So I’ll get new numbers when barrel settles down. Planning on running it to 3000 for the 109.
damn it’s a heavy barrel contour. Definitely taking off some weights when I get it ready for matches.
3000fps is smokin' for 109s. There's usually a great node in the low 2900's that would probably treat you a lot better on consistency and barrel life.
The harder you push them, the more finicky they get.
You may wanna slow it down a little. Try and find something in the 2850-2950 range.
My 6creedy is rocking them at 3100 and it is a laser beam. Proof 7twist. No where near pressure in the VA heat. I think after it settles down and speeds up it will be a great barrel. Fast! Looking forward to testing another 100 rounds next week to get it broken in. My 6creeedy has got to be getting close to its end. It will be at 1400 rounds after Pigg this weekend.
I'm not saying the bullet isn't capable. In the 6 Creed the capacity is there to push those speeds.
Less capacity in the GT. You're approaching a load that can give you fits in anything but ideal conditions. Its going to be a hot load at that velocity.
For reference I run 36.0 h4350 in alpha brass and my 109's are going 2850 and it might speed up a little since I'm only at 100 rounds. That said, sounds like you have a fast barrel regardless
I agree. Benchmark makes fast barrels. I’m at 36.0 with 105 at 2900. Only 100 down tube. I can’t wait to see where I end up in a week or 2 after 200-250 through it.
Some data from today:
Hornady 2x brass, CCI 450, Berger 109 at ~.080 off (2.535ish OAL), Varget, 26" Bartlein with 400 rounds through it, 95 degrees outside.
33.2 - 2870
33.4 - 2892
33.6 - 2901
33.8 - 2921
34.0 - 2938
34.2 - 2962
33.8 was right in the middle of a nice steady POI and shot a 3 shot group (I know..) in the .2s. I'd say that's a wrap for load development.
Oh and no pressure signs for any of these loads despite the heat, which was nice.
Hornady 2x brass, CCI 450, Berger 109 at ~.080 off (2.535ish OAL), Varget, 26" Bartlein with 400 rounds through it, 95 degrees outside.
33.2 - 2870
33.4 - 2892
33.6 - 2901
33.8 - 2921
34.0 - 2938
34.2 - 2962
33.8 was right in the middle of a nice steady POI and shot a 3 shot group (I know..) in the .2s. I'd say that's a wrap for load development.
Oh and no pressure signs for any of these loads despite the heat, which was nice.
I'm not sure what you're seeing, but I'm not seeing a node here on this velocity string.
A 100 yard group doesn't mean anything if your ES is so high that you're all over the place at 600 yards plus.
33.4/33.6 are only 9fps apart. Thats the closest thing I see.
I just typed a up a response and hit reply but don't see it here, so sorry if this double taps with a reworded post.
I was looking at the change in POI, which I thought was the idea behind an OCW test. The POI was the same for 33.6, 33.8 and 34.0. I also thought we didn't believe in velocity flat spots anymore?
I didn't write down the ES, but SDs were low single digits, 2-7fps, but only for three shots each, so take that for what its worth.
This is more just info, should someone want to load up some 109s with Varget.
If folks stopped believing in flat spots, that's news to me. In all my years I've never used more simple and accurate means of load development.
Back before everyone bought chronos and they were amazingly reliable, we did the ladder tests at 400 yards or thereabouts. Or we did Optimum Charge Weight testing. Lots of drawbacks.. Time consuming, larger ammo usage, data easily sloughed by a pulled shot. Velocity ladders across a quality chrono cut all that in half.
So I have a couple things to add.
I've never seen OCW testing done with one round in .2 increments. I cant see how that would be as effective as the traditional method.
And it seems to me it would be easier, and more effective to work on one aspect of your load development at a time. If you hit a load in this process that maintains single digit SD and shoots under half inch all while working on accuracy and velocity at the same time, you got lucky.
I would have ran those loads into a ditch and somewhere and found my node. Then tightened it up with seating depth or a tuner. Deal with one variable at a time.
If you hit a nice load with it thats all that matters.
Thats just my two bits.
Pick a speed. Forget "nodes." Shoot more, develop less.
Everyone has a different way of doing the same thing. If it works for you, then it works.
I agree. I'm not trying to be a dick.
I have a Facebook page called Competitive Precision Rifle Series for Beginners. It has 40,000 members.
I see a LOT of people post up that are flailing away at trying to develop a load. Wasting a lot of ammo and using methods that are close, but not quite at nailing down a load for their rifle. So I guess its a knee jerk reaction on my part when I see something like that to try to offer a tip to trim off the rough edges and simplify the process. Reduce the rounds downrange and land on the best possible load.
I have a Facebook page called Competitive Precision Rifle Series for Beginners. It has 40,000 members.
I see a LOT of people post up that are flailing away at trying to develop a load. Wasting a lot of ammo and using methods that are close, but not quite at nailing down a load for their rifle. So I guess its a knee jerk reaction on my part when I see something like that to try to offer a tip to trim off the rough edges and simplify the process. Reduce the rounds downrange and land on the best possible load.
If it shoots 3/4" load dev for me stops and the practice and shooting begins 
. Which happened to be the case with this 6gt.... 36.0 h4350, let's try .060" off... Cool all rounds touching I'm done.
I don't shoot f-class, most targets average 2moa, we'll all be just fine blaming ourselves and not the load that isn't .1 "if I do my part".
. Which happened to be the case with this 6gt.... 36.0 h4350, let's try .060" off... Cool all rounds touching I'm done.I don't shoot f-class, most targets average 2moa, we'll all be just fine blaming ourselves and not the load that isn't .1 "if I do my part".
Did anyone else hit the Big Sky Brawl last weekend in Dupuyer Montana?
The Applied Ballistics team was there with their Doppler radar set up. They let us run ten rounds over it to 1160 yards. The data is pretty cool.
Saw some first hand bullet performance I wouldn't have expected. Got a bulletproof velocity reading of 2775fps going into the match. And got feedback on a handful of 6mm bullets.
The Hornady 108gr ELD came in at a .273 G7 BC with a 1.2% SD in the BC
The Berger 109gr LRHT came in at a .294 G7 with a .57% SD
The 112gr Matchburners came in at a .301 G7 and a .8% SD.
My 115gr DTAC came in at a .306 G7 and a .83 SD.
According to the AB guys, <.5 is brilliant, <1% is still very good, going over 1.5% starts to be an issue. Over 2% is like adding 20fps to your extreme spread, that can go in any direction.
I also found out my barrel probably isn't going to go the distance this year. I'm at 1500 rounds, and it has maybe 500 more left in it. Too much shooting in too hot of weather I guess.
And coming as a bit of a surprise, in all their testing, they found JBs bore paste and Kroil to be the best combination for accuracy and barrel life. I wouldn't have guessed that one.
The Applied Ballistics team was there with their Doppler radar set up. They let us run ten rounds over it to 1160 yards. The data is pretty cool.
Saw some first hand bullet performance I wouldn't have expected. Got a bulletproof velocity reading of 2775fps going into the match. And got feedback on a handful of 6mm bullets.
The Hornady 108gr ELD came in at a .273 G7 BC with a 1.2% SD in the BC
The Berger 109gr LRHT came in at a .294 G7 with a .57% SD
The 112gr Matchburners came in at a .301 G7 and a .8% SD.
My 115gr DTAC came in at a .306 G7 and a .83 SD.
According to the AB guys, <.5 is brilliant, <1% is still very good, going over 1.5% starts to be an issue. Over 2% is like adding 20fps to your extreme spread, that can go in any direction.
I also found out my barrel probably isn't going to go the distance this year. I'm at 1500 rounds, and it has maybe 500 more left in it. Too much shooting in too hot of weather I guess.
And coming as a bit of a surprise, in all their testing, they found JBs bore paste and Kroil to be the best combination for accuracy and barrel life. I wouldn't have guessed that one.
I’ve heard this before. Was there any number of rounds attached to this cleaning recommendation?
edit by heard this before, some people are recommending this classic combination with 300nm after every 60ish rds, on the army’s new MRAD.
Seems aggressive.
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I've been hearing good thing about the match burners, they are actually more readily available then the bergers
It does seem aggressive doesn't it. Most of us have prescribed to the school of clean less often to prevent unnecessary barrel wear. This subject actually came up because not everyone gets the same SD in their ballistic coefficient. And barrel cleaning methods can have a significant impact on that. And we had a really great conversation about it.
Everyone pretty much knows variation in BC occurs with different types and cuts of barrels, but another factor apparently is wear and tear. As lands erode and firecracking becomes prevalent, it degrades your bullet BC. I actually didn't know that.
But apparently JBs goes a long ways to preventing firecracking from making an absolute mess of your throat. Smooths it out..
We brought up that JB is an abrasive, but barrel wear can go a few different directions. You get the guy who's barrel opens up when its finished and it shotgun blasts everywhere. Or you can get the barrel that bugholes its entire life, but just can't maintain velocity. The AB guy said keeping a smoother throat helps with both of those scenarios.
So the tip we got was every 200 to 300 rounds, soak VFG pellets in Kroil, run them through and let it soak 15 to 20 minutes. Apply JBs, hit it 20 to 30 strokes. Patch out the barrel.
The Matchburners came as a big surprise to me. Reports seemed to be hit and miss.
Not only did the 112gr perform really well, but one of my travel partners from here in Boise went up to that match with me. He won the Tactical division with his .308 running 175gr Matchburners. That thing had a SD of BC of about .78. Which seems awfully good for a bullet at that price point.
He's been shooting pretty solid with that bullet. He took top Tac when we were at the Hornady PRC last month against some pretty good Tac shooters.
That bullet should be on more people's radar..
good info, good thing I just snagged 1500 MBs I guess lol. I had good luck with them earlier tho. They’re a good value for sure.
As it turns out, you're correct, I was wrong. I'm behind the times and I apologize for the now archaic correction to your methods.
Thanks to @reubenski for the article link. Looking for nodes isn't exactly wrong, but its not right either. And looking for flat spots in velocity certainly isn't what I thought it was. So I'm an old dog meeting yet another new trick
So with me not being able to find varget and wanting to save my h4350, I was able to grab some n140, has anyone messed with it?
I know it's popular with Dasher, and wanted to know if it's comparable? Anyone have a load?
I know it's popular with Dasher, and wanted to know if it's comparable? Anyone have a load?
Went out yesterday and fired off a few rounds.
I picked a charge weight in the middle of Hodgdon’s recommended load data and went with it.
24” Hawk Hill with 36g H4350 under a 107SMK yielded 2780.
7 rounds and an SD of 8.8.
This with virgin Hornady brass
Mirage was horrible but less than an inch at 100 yards.
Next up, a seating depth test, but this looks promising provided I can get ahold of more bullets.
I picked a charge weight in the middle of Hodgdon’s recommended load data and went with it.
24” Hawk Hill with 36g H4350 under a 107SMK yielded 2780.
7 rounds and an SD of 8.8.
This with virgin Hornady brass
Mirage was horrible but less than an inch at 100 yards.
Next up, a seating depth test, but this looks promising provided I can get ahold of more bullets.
Tried this basic load of h4350 34.5 grains and 107 SMK in two new rifles. Amazing not even worked up and shooting this good. Mirage was horrid, yet still good groups.
13 rounds though this Curtis. Bore sighted, three rounds to hone in on paper then two groups of 5
This Ruckus has 32 rounds through it now. Twenty the other day at a 100 yard indoor range, and 12 yesterday at 200 yards.
13 rounds though this Curtis. Bore sighted, three rounds to hone in on paper then two groups of 5
This Ruckus has 32 rounds through it now. Twenty the other day at a 100 yard indoor range, and 12 yesterday at 200 yards.
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