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Got $2 for better handloaded ammo??

#2
Re: Got $2 for better handloaded ammo??

Thanks Tres
laugh.gif
you da man
 
#3
Re: Got $2 for better handloaded ammo??

Tres, I myself have tried this in the past but have been concerned about my ability to return dies to the exact same position again and again due to the elasticity of the o-ring.

Have you found any negatives from using this technique?
 
#4
Re: Got $2 for better handloaded ammo??

V,

What I did is scribe a line on top of my press across the die hole running 6 to 12 o'clock position. My seating dies a micrometer style and have a vertical line on them.
As far as my sizing dies I either have scribe a vertical line on them or made a stripe with a paint pen.

When I screw a die in I purposely dont quite line up the line on the die to the line on the press. I begin loading or sizing on the brass and keep snugging up the die till my measurements fall in place.


 
#5
Re: Got $2 for better handloaded ammo??

A better mouse trap....

A "wrench" I made to fit my torque wrench and the the Hornady style split rings that I use.

Dies are set up and then torqued the same each time, which puts them back to the same place each time. I use 200 inch pounds.

IMHE, a whole lot more exact than fartin' around with lines marked on stuff, and o rings....

torquewrench.jpg
 
#6
Re: Got $2 for better handloaded ammo??

If You had a forster Co-Ax you dont even have to worry about tightening down the same each time because you just snap the dies in and out.

CJG
 
#9
Re: Got $2 for better handloaded ammo??

Been using the o-ring on the bottom for years since I read it in Zediker's book - it does work pretty slick. Never been 100% comfortable with the o-ring under the die ring - the concept is good and all, but there is some room for variability depending on how you snug it down from one time to the next, at least for me. The Forster Co-Ax press provides much the same effect both top and bottom between the snap-in floating die ring and the spring-loaded shell-plate jaws. For other presses like RCBS, Redding, Lee, etc. the o-rings are definitely worth looking into.

One observation... Lee Collet (dunno about their 'regular' ones) dies have been coming with an o-ring on the underside of the lock-ring for years - apparently they believe in it as well.
wink.gif
 
#10
Re: Got $2 for better handloaded ammo??

Trip:
way to think precision but your still snugging your die down metal to metal. And when your metal to metal what you get is what you got regarding misalighnment in the tolerance stacking between the press frame, ram od, machining of the ram to accept the shell holder, machining of the shell holder itself, threading of the die, the bore of the die to the body itself... on & on.

RotorTuner: Yep! Forster co-ax is the way to go!! I have wanted one for YEARS but can't afford one and have been unable to convince anyone to give me one cause I'm so nice. I guess until they do then I'm an o-ringer. I can afford $2 in o-rings.

Kwak: right on bro! 2TIM3:16
 
#11
Re: Got $2 for better handloaded ammo??

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: TresMon</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Trip:
way to think precision but your still snugging your die down metal to metal. And when your metal to metal what you get is what you got regarding misalighnment in the tolerance stacking between the press frame, ram od, machining of the ram to accept the shell holder, machining of the shell holder itself, threading of the die, the bore of the die to the body itself... on & on.

</div></div>

Well, yeah, and that would be a worry with shit dies and a shit press....and of course a misconception about one's own mechanical apptitude. The truth lies squarely in the run out, or lack thereof.....(pun there, likely)

I run good dies and presses, which tend to aleviate a considerable amount of bullshit in that regard, and no one held a gun to my head making that/those choice/choices. One thing few "average" reloaders bother to find out about is in fact the variations in shell holders. This comes into play the worst when having several holders that fit the same case head dimensions; and allowing them to be used interchangably without any regard to the fact that not all shell holders are created equal. The biggest problem is the height of the shell holder, which will easily change the headspace of a sized case. I've at least a half dozen here to fit a .473 case head, and from shortest to tallest is about a .025" difference. Not exactly "bump-the-shoulder-back-a-couple-thou" friendly.

Dedicating a shell holder to a specific RIFLE is the only way I go.........
 
#12
Re: Got $2 for better handloaded ammo??

I have forster co-ax and I can't imagine using any other press anymore.

However, before I bought the co-ax I took the spring clip that held the shell holder in the ram out. This allowed the shell holder to move freely in one direction. I then turned the shellholder so that the opening for the case head to slide in was at a 90 deg to the opening of the ram. This allowed the case to slide freely in both directions. I also stopped snugging down my dies in the press at all but indexed them with witness marks so they returned to the same place every time. Once I had my die where I wanted it, I would just turn the lock ring back just slightly and lock the lock ring to the die. I have a set witness mark on the press, and then I made one on the lock ring. This way after I snugged the die in the press all I had to do was turn it back slightly to the witness mark.

Same theory as the co-ax, allowing the cartridge to self align itself with the die. I couldn't tell you if it made a crap of difference but it made sense in my mind to allow the cartidge to self align as much as possible and my runout numbers were still pretty good.
 
#15
Re: Got $2 for better handloaded ammo??

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: TresMon</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Trip:

RotorTuner: Yep! Forster co-ax is the way to go!! I have wanted one for YEARS but can't afford one and have been unable to convince anyone to give me one cause I'm so nice. I guess until they do then I'm an o-ringer. I can afford $2 in o-rings.

</div></div>


Ya I did a lot of research before buying my first press and it had a lot of good feedback so I went with it. Im a mechanical engineer and I will say that I was impress from day one with the design. Floated holder, the linkage, the priming system, spent primer catcher etc. Whichever group of guys sat down and came up with the design, my hat is off to them.

Any ways, point is, you should start a savings fund for one, because they are awesome!

CJG
 
#17
Re: Got $2 for better handloaded ammo??

Tripwire: "I've at least a half dozen here to fit a .473 case head, and from shortest to tallest is about a .025"

25 thou difference in your .473" shell holder depths? That's astonishing! Mine are no more than a tenth of that!
wink.gif
 
#18
Re: Got $2 for better handloaded ammo??

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Fuzzball</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Tripwire: "I've at least a half dozen here to fit a .473 case head, and from shortest to tallest is about a .025"

25 thou difference in your .473" shell holder depths? That's astonishing! Mine are no more than a tenth of that!
wink.gif
</div></div>

Really?

Aquired over a span of 30ish years, and from at least two, maybe three, different manufacturers.

Yeah, flabbergasts the shit out of me too.........
 
#19
Re: Got $2 for better handloaded ammo??

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Tripwire</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Fuzzball</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Tripwire: "I've at least a half dozen here to fit a .473 case head, and from shortest to tallest is about a .025"

25 thou difference in your .473" shell holder depths? That's astonishing! Mine are no more than a tenth of that!
wink.gif
</div></div>

Really?

Aquired over a span of 30ish years, and from at least two, maybe three, different manufacturers.

Yeah, flabbergasts the shit out of me too......... </div></div>

Why did you ever buy more than one?

When I was about 13 I bought me a shell holder to load my .45 and have used it on every '06 based case (generally speaking) thereafter.

Just wondering...
 
#20
Re: Got $2 for better handloaded ammo??

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: TresMon</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Tripwire</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Fuzzball</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Tripwire: "I've at least a half dozen here to fit a .473 case head, and from shortest to tallest is about a .025"

25 thou difference in your .473" shell holder depths? That's astonishing! Mine are no more than a tenth of that!
wink.gif
</div></div>

Really?

Aquired over a span of 30ish years, and from at least two, maybe three, different manufacturers.

Yeah, flabbergasts the shit out of me too......... </div></div>

Why did you ever buy more than one?

When I was about 13 I bought me a shell holder to load my .45 and have used it on every '06 based case (generally speaking) thereafter.

Just wondering... </div></div>

Well, to satisfy your incessantly annoying drive to nitpick meaningless detail; I recall misplacing one, purchasing another, then recovering the lost one. Or maybe it was that I loaned one out, didn't get it back right away, and replaced it before the loaner was returned. Something like that, I'm sure. The others I'm almost 100% positive came with used sets of dies aquired hither and yon....

Clear as mud?
 
#21
Re: Got $2 for better handloaded ammo??

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: TresMon</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
Why did you ever buy more than one?
</div></div>

The same reason some folks have more than one progressive press: leave one setup and ready to rock for each caliber. I prefer to leave certain tools setup and ready to go rather than play change-the-shell-holder every time I want to use something. Since I use .473" head cases for a *lot* of what I load, I leave one setup in the RCBS Partner press I use for expanding necks prior to turning, and for the collet bullet puller. I leave one set up in a Lee Reloader C-press for decapping away from the main loading area. I leave one set in my RCBS hand-priming tool, as they tend to come apart without a shell holder installed. Etc. etc. etc. I have one 'main' Redding shellholder size #1, and a full set of the Competition shell holders from before I got my Co-Ax and I used them for adjusting sizing of cases. Those *did* get used for sizing and sizing only, so I didn't have to worry about (unintentional) differences in thickness.

To me, having just one of them (for a commonly used size that I load a lot of) seems like being cheap for no good reason. When I load my .338 LM and have to go swap the shell-holder around from this tool to that tool to another... it seems like a waste of time. Given the small amount of rounds I actually fire through that gun... I choose to live with it. For the other 95% of what I shoot that uses a .308 Win sized shell-holder. no freakin' way.

YMMV,

Monte
 
#22
Re: Got $2 for better handloaded ammo??

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: memilanuk</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: TresMon</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
Why did you ever buy more than one?
</div></div>


To me, having just one of them (for a commonly used size that I load a lot of) seems like being cheap for no good reason. When I load my .338 LM
</div></div>

Seems cheap? Well if you load for a Lap Mag then my "budget" will be far beyond what you can comprehend.

I have sold blood plasma to buy a pound of powder or have the entrance fee to a match in the past. Multiple progressive presses??

Not crying. Such is my lot. I'm happy for you if you got the that kind of budget and would never take it away from you. But it's not "being cheap" for sure on my end.

Trip: Clear as mud indeed. You come across as allergic to curiosity. Curiosity is a powerful tool of learning.
 
#23
Re: Got $2 for better handloaded ammo??

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: TresMon</div><div class="ubbcode-body">

Trip: Clear as mud indeed. You come across as allergic to curiosity. Curiosity is a powerful tool of learning. </div></div>

So is debate, and to some degree heated debate....<grin>
 
#24
Re: Got $2 for better handloaded ammo??

Tresmon,

Multiple progressive presses is something beyond my wants and needs at this point... but I do know some folks who are serious action pistol or 3-gun enthusiasts who run that way. They'd rather be shooting than loading, and view the time spent tearing down, swapping over, and setting up and checking everything works as time wasted (for them).

I think you misunderstood me... for something I shoot once in a while, like a .338LM, one shellholder works well enough. For stuff I load regularly in quantity for matches like a .308 Win... it seems worth the few extra bucks (for me) for an extra shellholder or three to keep things set up and moving along.

Tough to question your dedication if you go to such lengths to buy a pound of powder.

YMMV,

Monte
 
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