Is Something Happening with Nord Stream 1 and 2 under the Baltic Sea?

sirhrmechanic

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I thought we established this was only 200ft, not meters. Also, how many times has the U.S. done something without getting "permission" from other countries, in international waters no less. Pretty sure the motto, "Deny, deny, deny... then if caught.. deny some more" is standard operating procedures for any black-ops type work?
You are right... my bad. 70 meters of water. About 210 feet. Tough for scuba but dooable. Still need support.

But not as difficult as 200M.

Thanks!

Sirhr
 

theLBC

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    fake news..way to obvious for every radar and undersea listening device

    every sonar receiver would have heard high speed screws in the water moving toward the event

    every military radar in the area including commercial would have a record

    would be plastered all over the news by now
    Not really.
    We heard trump colluded with Russia for 6 years...same agencies.
     

    GreenGO Juan

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    Bathymetry map, in Meters btw. Not very deep.

    Waiting for images of the damage to surface.
     

    wade2big

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    fake news..way to obvious for every radar and undersea listening device

    every sonar receiver would have heard high speed screws in the water moving toward the event

    every military radar in the area including commercial would have a record

    would be plastered all over the news by now
    It probably is fake news but the covid tyranny was a big ass lie that every country in the world was in on and the majority of the people were none the wiser. Nothing is too obvious and no conspiracy too big as far as I’m concerned.
     

    Emerson0311

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    Yes, I did. We have treaties and agreements that we just can't violate without getting in serious trouble with the hosting governments. And you sure as hell don't want to get in a blue on blue conflict. The Scandinavian countries don't fuck around and can hit what they shoot at and will go weapons free if they catch someone doing something stupid in their lakes. And on top of that the pipeline is critical infrastructure so attacking it is an act of war that widens the conflict, something that is outside the current ROE used by the EU and US.

    There is no oxygen in the pipeline and its in the water at depth. Any energy needed has to come solely from the explosive charge.

    The current thinking is that the Russians did it to deny its modification and use by Norway to ship gas to the EU.
    It is very difficult to believe that you actually think those ridiculous statements you posted are facts. ROEs? When 3 “fighting age” males close together is a legitimate drone target, anything is possible.
     

    Emerson0311

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    People can get that deep.
    This. The US has a whole sub branch devoted to such jobs, with several others that would love to help out. They were on site doing exactly that work a few weeks ago. The ships just recently left. The US did it and doesn’t give a fuck who knows it. Biden’s teleprompter said do in so many words. Allowing a negotiated settlement to the Russia/Ukraine/German conflict/energy crisis will not be permitted. Big war and death tolls in Eastern Europe is the goal, while allowing China/India/Pakistan to expand without conflict.
     

    Sako man

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    200 meters is going to be special suits, mixed gas, support lines. Support ship for carrying explosives. No way that is done with divers. Except hard shell divers working from a sub.

    An ROV could do it and those are commercially available and cheap.

    Anyone have gps guided torpedos in inventory?

    Not a diver job.

    Sirhr
    No not diver. ROV or guided weapon probably. Besides, the Sweeds already found that ROV with explosives on it in 2015.

    This is war, accords and agreements be damned.
     

    BytorJr

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    Not really.
    We heard trump colluded with Russia for 6 years...same agencies.
    Wait, I thought Trump planted these explosives because he's an expert deep diver ;). Possibly he's also an expert ROV operator too.
     

    GreenGO Juan

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    This. The US has a whole sub branch devoted to such jobs, with several others that would love to help out. They were on site doing exactly that work a few weeks ago. The ships just recently left. The US did it and doesn’t give a fuck who knows it. Biden’s teleprompter said do in so many words. Allowing a negotiated settlement to the Russia/Ukraine/German conflict/energy crisis will not be permitted. Big war and death tolls in Eastern Europe is the goal, while allowing China/India/Pakistan to expand without conflict.
    I have not seen anything that says exactly who did. Highly likely we will never know. But its not hard to imagine who wanted it shut off and couldn’t control the valves.

    Who ever did this, wanted to control that source, and this was their way of doing it. This was one of the last links they could not sever... until now.
     
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    n2ishun

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    Not an impossible dive with nitrox and hypoxic mixes.
    Like brianf mentioned earlier in the thread....
    You take this specially outfitted sub for just such missions..
    A few good divers....you know, SEALS or just some rank grade UDT trained navy divers, an underwater RV (rov) for pulling the explosives into place.
    Bang, job done.
    Hoist the Jolly Roger and lets go home and drink till we puke.
     

    jrhtx

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    I can’t imigian they don’t have boats on site with ROV’s in the water already. Where’s the video of the damage?
     

    brianf

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    Not really.
    We heard trump colluded with Russia for 6 years...same agencies.
    Not our alphabets, other nations would be putting out info.

    England, Iceland etc don’t want the US getting involved with Russia more than we are already
     

    pmclaine

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    I actually seriously doubt it.

    First of all it would be an act of war and no matter how nuts a few people might be we’re not that nuts.

    Second you cannot move that many resources without a huge logistics and paper trail. Nobody and I mean nobody in the defense or intelligence communities are going to sign off on that stuff and put their name on the operation enough to pull it off.

    We certainly have the resources and we certainly have the personnel to pull something like that off. But as much as people like to think that the CIA or SOCOM or hiding under every rock and pulling every string, they are really just big bureaucracies . And no one in the bureaucracy is going to let this happen under their watch.

    Even Gearing up for some thing like this would result in leaks As there would be dissenters who knew that their lives in careers and Cushy jobs would be on the line.

    Look east. Because while we have men with the balls to do this, we don’t have a civil service with the balls to do this. Cheers
    I disagree.

    I think they are starting to feel they can not do enough to steal November and nothing like a full scale war will perhaps save them.

    Also.,..,,in a few weeks winter will be creating cracks in the European will.

    I’m guessing Zelensky offered to offer up the goods on what the swamp has been up to in the Ukraine.

    The only way to hold the “Game Stop” line in Europe is to create a situation you can not go back on.

    They are going all in.

    We will be the collateral damage.

    This absolutely is a US operation.
     

    pmclaine

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    I think elements, using primarily NGO's... and possibly driven by NGO's (aka... foundations, billionaires, tech oligarchs), would and could do some very, very dastardly things. And did. Don't get me wrong.

    But an operation on a 200M pipeline, unless someone shows me Mark Zuckerberg or Bill Gates is running special operations submarines, virtually has to come from a nation state.

    You have to look at capabalities and intentions... and will! People forget Part III.

    We have the capabilities. We might have the intentions. We are too 'bureaucratize' to be able to demonstrate the will.

    In the East.. there are places with the capabilities. And the intentions. And the will. This has FSB/SVR and Russian .Mil all over it. Along with maskirova to blame everyone else. Don't discount the Ukrainians, either. They are sneaky bastards and heirs to the old Soviet system. As well as having a nice cozy money-laundering relationship with the people in 'Our Gummint' who you reference above. That makes for a convenient capability run through NGO's... and 'connected' individuals that does not represent government policy and did not access US resources.

    Occams razor here, imho, does not say 'Accident,' But thats just my opinion. It sure as hell points a big neon flashing arrow right at the Eastern Bloc.

    Just my opinion. Meh, what do I know anyway.

    Sirhr
    Bob Ballard and that dastardly Woods Hole CIA base.
     

    pmclaine

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    There are plenty o various cables in international waters to play with i guess all are open game now. You should download your daily dumps of various ***hubs asap....
    We fucked around, we will find out.

    And the propaganda machine will groom us for a reaction and sadly instead of rejecting it we will respond.
     

    pmclaine

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    Its Reuters do take it for that but two things stick out.

    1. Buyers in Germany where making nominations for gas.

    2. Siemons claims the technical issues that Gazprom states put the pipeline out of commission, would not technically stop function.

    I will restate. What if Germany and Russia were continuing to trade natural gas, on the sly, somebody found out about it and put a stop to it.
    Germany fuck Europe?

    You don’t say..,,,
     
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    GreenGO Juan

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    Russia has a big gate valve in safe territory.

    It doesn’t need a clandestine operation nor would it remove its biggest bargaining chip.

    Every time that douche at the press brief says Russia weaponized energy remember who started the sanctions.
    48210485-721F-4302-9F84-47F1B4C32DF9.jpeg

    Yep. 4 of them. Two in Russia, two in Germany.
     

    GreenGO Juan

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    One thought I had was not even using divers, Rov etc. not an exterior explosion.

    They could’ve set charges inside the pipe and used something like the pig to send them down the line.

    But that would’ve required somebody with access.
     

    pmclaine

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    Sorry, but there was never going to be an outcome acceptable to Putin other than grabbing land and the resources (mainly people) within. This is manifest-destiny sort of stuff from the Russian perspective, not some sort of border tit-for-tat that blew up. The only negotiation was going to be something along the lines of "we can do this the easy way or the hard way". Obviously, the West picked "hard way" because it's not (yet) our soldiers and civilians dying in large numbers.
    Imagine if we hadn’t tried to move that useless NATO organization east to the Russian border per our agreements..,,,

    Ukraine could have continued to bomb ethnic Russians and life would have went on as normal.
     
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    n2ishun

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    I gotta bunch of theory, but nothing to substantiate it....yet.
    No one has mentioned presidential wartime powers yet and I have a feeling something is buried in there we are not seeing as of this moment.
    Bidet has to KNOW he won't win the next election, he's a moron, but he's not that far gone I don't think.
    There is a metric shit ton of legalese bullshit involving the president and wartime.
    The one I am seeing most of is that he can become a total dictator of all communications....and yes, that would include internet and cell phones now.

    I had forgotten this little blurb...


    Could his simple minded handlers be hedging on it ?
    Obviously no below sea level area is beyond them stooping to, they will take a full on nose dive from the empire state building to stoop lower if needs be, and they prove it over and over.

    I just have this itchy feeling they want this war to find some way to keep slow Joe in orifice....I mean office .
    Do dominion machines communicate ? i.e. are they online ?
    Yes I'm reaching.....nothing is beneath their actions so we're going to have to look at literally anything that they can think of as a benefit to the current regime because you can be damn sure that's where this is all headed, and it's damn sure behind everything they do.

    Dunno guys....anyone more hep than me on wartime presidential powers ?
     

    Short-bus

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    One thought I had was not even using divers, Rov etc. not an exterior explosion.

    They could’ve set charges inside the pipe and used something like the pig to send them down the line.

    But that would’ve required somebody with access.
    Eventually somebody is going to get a look at the pipeline. It'll be obvious if it was destroyed from within. The blast had to be pretty massive, and i'm guessing really close. A blast from within' wouldn't need to be as large, and we wouldn't have the earthquake readings that they announced tied to the explosions. The steel pipe was 1.6" thick, and had a steel reinforced concrete outer coating that ranged in thickness that I believe ranged from 12 to 18". I don't have the article pulled up anymore, and i'm not going to go look for it right now.

    I suppose that if they were able to target a segment that perhaps that could be considered a week point, but I just don't know. Someone out there knows the level of explosive energy required to damage the pipeline sufficiently to cause that kind of leak.

    Branden
     
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    GreenGO Juan

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    Eventually somebody is going to get a look at the pipeline. It'll be obvious if it was destroyed from within. The blast had to be pretty massive, and i'm guessing really close. A blast from within' wouldn't need to be as large, and we wouldn't have the earthquake readings that they announced tied to the explosions. The steel pipe was 1.6" thick, and had a steel reinforced concrete outer coating that ranged in thickness that I believe ranged from 12 to 18". I don't have the article pulled up anymore, and i'm not going to go look for it right now.

    I suppose that if they were able to target a segment that perhaps that could be considered a week point, but I just don't know. Someone out there knows the level of explosive energy required to damage the pipeline sufficiently to cause that kind of leak.

    Branden
    B9D35696-1A80-4E19-8E88-5F26FEC93341.jpeg

    25mm=1” And The concrete they wrap around the outside is not very thick and done for ballast/weight. Not structural.

    Yeah I agree a picture of the damage is what I’d like to see, surprised none have surfaced. Not like its a mile deep, I believe they are between 70-110 meters. I know people capable of driving that deep. Hell, my cousin was an underwater pipeline welder in the Gulf of Mexico, nearly killed him, lost oxygen( regulator exploded) around 300ft down and woke up in a helicopter!
     

    nikonNUT

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    You are right... my bad. 70 meters of water. About 210 feet. Tough for scuba but dooable. Still need support.

    But not as difficult as 200M.

    Thanks!

    Sirhr
    Tri-Mix CCRs are a thing for recreational divers but it's a hellaciously technical form of diving. 100 meters is doable. The SCUBA record is 1089 feet.
     
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    Sako man

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    Not our alphabets, other nations would be putting out info.

    England, Iceland etc don’t want the US getting involved with Russia more than we are already
    Ah, the UK is so involved with this war, they have SAS there. The UK under Boris was pushing along with us very hard. Not sure about the new gal PM?
     

    BCP

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    CIA or some other spy org shoved something down that line to blow it up.
     

    Sako man

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    FIFY.

    Day do da water ting while hard N stuff…yeah...

    Sirhr
    FIFY

    Sorry man, couldn't help it.

    Anywhoo, yeah they could be, but I know the SAS is there as well doin stuff. Wouldn't doubt the Brits got all kinds of shit there. The idea/comment that GB doesn't want us more involved then we currently are is just not true.
     
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    Sako man

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    Scrumbag

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    I have a suspicion it was Putin to deplete Europe's stockpiles of gas before winter.

    Scrummhy
     

    pmclaine

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    I have a suspicion it was Putin to deplete Europe's stockpiles of gas before winter.

    Scrummhy
    Spock says not logical.

    The pipe was not supplying unless Germany was cheating which is very likely.

    Putins only bargaining chip is the gas line and if Germany was cheating he was making good money.

    More likely some big player on the Ukraine side had to ensure Europe was not going to abandon sanctions once it really started getting cold or knowing the Germany was cheating decided that had to stop.

    And accepting this serious escalation and performing it in my mind is the result of some corrupt little shit hole saying you better save our ass or all the corruption you have been involved in since 2014 will see the light of day.

    Than you have psychopaths like Victoria Nuland that don’t care how many die she has her war mongering appetite to feed and some unnatural obsession with this useless part of the world.
     
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    DarnYankeeUSMC

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    And the perfect timing of a distraction. The news cycle is only a couple days before they chase another squirrel. So this pipeline gets one day of coverage and..... Hurricane! Hurricane!!! Then they will be on to the next headlines never to really cover the pipeline. The American people are sheep being led by the PRAVDA. I wonder how much on the pipeline Twitter Facebook and the others removed.
     

    AngryKoala

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    Well the US will profit at the expense of its own people.

    That money will go to communists while we pay more here.

    Meh, I think someone in Europe did it personally. Your statement is correct though but that hasn't really changed over history.
     

    brianf

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    If only they were smart enough to put some valves on the line when they built it they wouldn't have had to blow it up. Probably designed by the Welsh.
    italian company petrovalve (biggest valve company in the world) won the design competition as it was the largest valve of that style ever made

    i think 48" gate and ball valves at a certain pressure etc.

    they made 10 of the them...figure there has to be a few down there

    but since we all know this wasnt a rogue guy in a row boat they prob hacked/crippled the valves as well

    if they close the valves soon we know it wasnt a pure sabotage

    when its found out that the US or other nation did it, there will be recourse for the pollution etc. so im doubting total destruction/un repairable event
     

    DarnYankeeUSMC

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    If the USA didn't do it directly. It was done with our backing/approval/financing.
    Just a plausible deniability like gain of function in China. They sent the money to a third party who was supplied with the equipment. They came out in January and said they would do it and have been scheming for the how since then.
    Iran Contra, Benghazi, Wuhan, 2020 election and the list goes on.
     

    brianf

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    If the USA didn't do it directly. It was done with our backing/approval/financing.
    Just a plausible deniability like gain of function in China. They sent the money to a third party who was supplied with the equipment. They came out in January and said they would do it and have been scheming for the how since then.
    Iran Contra, Benghazi, Wuhan, 2020 election and the list goes on.
    thats how the world works and why we are still in charge for the last 70 years

    if we didnt pull or be involved in most of the important strings we would be another useless nation waiting for its daddy to tell it what to do

    ...like all of europe
     

    WaltHer

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    Sorry if this is posted elsewhere but is a pretty interesting analysis (have not done any fact-checks- especially on the aircraft flight paths). Comments at the bottom appear to have several Euro perspectives...FWIW

    Love these quotes from the comments section:
    "This is a real blowup to NATO. If Baltic is NATO sea (as they say), this just proved that they are not even able to protect their own infrastructure from terrorist attacks.
    Don't forget, NS is not just Russian pipeline, it is almost half a west's pipeline too."
    And:
    "So in objectively you have 2 possibilites

    1. NATO did it (pick your perpetrator)
    2. Someone else did it (pick your perpetrator), and NATO failed to detect it

    In either case, why should NATO exist?

    The overwhelmingly evidence points to #1"