My Department is getting rid of our MP-5s for a 5.56 platform. I sent a letterhead to POF for a quote on their SBR in an 11.5 bbl. I also sne out to LWRC and RRA. Anyone own a POF in 11.5? Any suggestions for a new guy on here as to whom else to contact?
Looking for new SWAT entry weapon
- Thread starter Blue Line
- Start date
Re: Looking for new SWAT entry weapon
Phx PD SAU uses POF SBR's. I can't recall if they are the the 9.25 or the 11.25 off the top of my head. When I was working over there the officers I talked to really liked them.
Phx PD SAU uses POF SBR's. I can't recall if they are the the 9.25 or the 11.25 off the top of my head. When I was working over there the officers I talked to really liked them.
Re: Looking for new SWAT entry weapon
Our SWAT uses Colt but our patrol rifles are RRA. I liked the RR so much that I went out and bought one to add to the collection. Now it's the only (5.56) AR that I use at home. I'd recommend it for personal or professional use.
Our SWAT uses Colt but our patrol rifles are RRA. I liked the RR so much that I went out and bought one to add to the collection. Now it's the only (5.56) AR that I use at home. I'd recommend it for personal or professional use.
Re: Looking for new SWAT entry weapon
all listed are great--also try Daniel Defense and Noveske
depending upon your budget
all listed are great--also try Daniel Defense and Noveske
depending upon your budget
Re: Looking for new SWAT entry weapon
Colt and RRA, POF wasn't in our budget for the ammount of money we had and the number of rifles we had to buy.
Colt and RRA, POF wasn't in our budget for the ammount of money we had and the number of rifles we had to buy.
Re: Looking for new SWAT entry weapon
I should also add that I'm looking at select fire and plan to run cans on them. LMT and SIG 516 were definately interesting price wise at $1500 or less (not sure if I should disclose LE pricing I'm new here and don't want to piss off the wrong people). Budget wise I'm ok as we contribute officers to 2 regional teams and currently I'm it from my Dept. For the Cans i'm thinking AAC so far.
I should also add that I'm looking at select fire and plan to run cans on them. LMT and SIG 516 were definately interesting price wise at $1500 or less (not sure if I should disclose LE pricing I'm new here and don't want to piss off the wrong people). Budget wise I'm ok as we contribute officers to 2 regional teams and currently I'm it from my Dept. For the Cans i'm thinking AAC so far.
Re: Looking for new SWAT entry weapon
Colt or LMT would both be wise choices. Local Sheriff's office has F/A Colts in every patrol car. For departmental purchases I always advise not to "budget shop." Get quality equipment when you can.
I saw two mentions of RRA, when I took my Armorers course the departments with RRAs had problems with their two stage triggers. Some had failures in as little as 25 rounds if I remember correctly. The departments with troubles should be somewhere near you Blueline. Anyone else experience this?
Colt or LMT would both be wise choices. Local Sheriff's office has F/A Colts in every patrol car. For departmental purchases I always advise not to "budget shop." Get quality equipment when you can.
I saw two mentions of RRA, when I took my Armorers course the departments with RRAs had problems with their two stage triggers. Some had failures in as little as 25 rounds if I remember correctly. The departments with troubles should be somewhere near you Blueline. Anyone else experience this?
Re: Looking for new SWAT entry weapon
All above are excellent options. It really comes down to an issue of what's in your budget and, depending on any other equipment you might need, how much you really want to devote to the new entry guns. If you have the money and can spend it on replacements without other concerns, the POF is an EXCELLENT option!
Also, and I know you said you were purposely switching from the 9mm to 5.56, but you might want to consider the HK UMPs. I was at a training session with one of our local county sheriff dep'ts last fall and they had just gotten several new HK UMPs (.45acp "replacement" for their aging MP5s). In talking with them and in shooting one for part of the afternoon, all were impressed with the reliability, accuracy and overall performance of the UMP. Just one more option for consideration if you aren't set on the 5.56. The UMPs are also available in alternate calibers (at least they were planned for 9mm and .40S&W too if those might interest you/your team).
All above are excellent options. It really comes down to an issue of what's in your budget and, depending on any other equipment you might need, how much you really want to devote to the new entry guns. If you have the money and can spend it on replacements without other concerns, the POF is an EXCELLENT option!
Also, and I know you said you were purposely switching from the 9mm to 5.56, but you might want to consider the HK UMPs. I was at a training session with one of our local county sheriff dep'ts last fall and they had just gotten several new HK UMPs (.45acp "replacement" for their aging MP5s). In talking with them and in shooting one for part of the afternoon, all were impressed with the reliability, accuracy and overall performance of the UMP. Just one more option for consideration if you aren't set on the 5.56. The UMPs are also available in alternate calibers (at least they were planned for 9mm and .40S&W too if those might interest you/your team).
Re: Looking for new SWAT entry weapon
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: BERTMAN77MK2</div><div class="ubbcode-body">all listed are great--also try Daniel Defense and Noveske
depending upon your budget</div></div>
i've been very impressed with my Daniel Defense Mk18. they're definitely worth checking out.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: BERTMAN77MK2</div><div class="ubbcode-body">all listed are great--also try Daniel Defense and Noveske
depending upon your budget</div></div>
i've been very impressed with my Daniel Defense Mk18. they're definitely worth checking out.
Re: Looking for new SWAT entry weapon
For an entry weapon, that will also no doubt have to endure thousands of rounds in training and qualifications; you can't go wrong with Noveske's Mk18. The barrels have a chrome lining as thick as that of an M249 SAW barrel, and at 10.5 inches it is very handy inside of a house or vehicle.
For an entry weapon, that will also no doubt have to endure thousands of rounds in training and qualifications; you can't go wrong with Noveske's Mk18. The barrels have a chrome lining as thick as that of an M249 SAW barrel, and at 10.5 inches it is very handy inside of a house or vehicle.
Re: Looking for new SWAT entry weapon
I have no experience with Spikes Tactical ST Compressor SBR but it looks like a very five stick. When I was on swat we use Colt and HK and had no problems with them.
I have two KAC rifles now and have become very fond of them and that would be my choice if it were in the budget.
Back to the Spike ST Compressor I going to look more into them I think I’m might and one to the collection.
I have no experience with Spikes Tactical ST Compressor SBR but it looks like a very five stick. When I was on swat we use Colt and HK and had no problems with them.
I have two KAC rifles now and have become very fond of them and that would be my choice if it were in the budget.
Back to the Spike ST Compressor I going to look more into them I think I’m might and one to the collection.
Re: Looking for new SWAT entry weapon
"For the Cans i'm thinking AAC so far."
I have a couple AAC cans and they are great, but the KAC has a more pleasant tone than the AAC in 5.56mm. The KAC meters louder IIRC but your ear is a lot more dynamic than any sound meter and cares about things like tone often more than total DB numbers.
Wish I had picked the KAC over the M4-2000 after hearing them side by side.
"For the Cans i'm thinking AAC so far."
I have a couple AAC cans and they are great, but the KAC has a more pleasant tone than the AAC in 5.56mm. The KAC meters louder IIRC but your ear is a lot more dynamic than any sound meter and cares about things like tone often more than total DB numbers.
Wish I had picked the KAC over the M4-2000 after hearing them side by side.
Re: Looking for new SWAT entry weapon
I can look at anything. I won't say stop sending ideas or sharing experiences, I just want to say that so far this tells me I made a great decision joining Sniper's Hide. Thank's everyone and keep em coming!
I can look at anything. I won't say stop sending ideas or sharing experiences, I just want to say that so far this tells me I made a great decision joining Sniper's Hide. Thank's everyone and keep em coming!
Re: Looking for new SWAT entry weapon
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Blue Line</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I should also add that I'm looking at select fire and plan to run cans on them. LMT and SIG 516 were definately interesting price wise at $1500 or less (not sure if I should disclose LE pricing I'm new here and don't want to piss off the wrong people). Budget wise I'm ok as we contribute officers to 2 regional teams and currently I'm it from my Dept. For the Cans i'm thinking AAC so far.</div></div>
The LMT would be a good call, so would Colt or BCM. The Sig is not suitable for duty use. Stick with a proven design froma company that manufacturees to a standard. SIG aint it. Niether is RRA.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Blue Line</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I should also add that I'm looking at select fire and plan to run cans on them. LMT and SIG 516 were definately interesting price wise at $1500 or less (not sure if I should disclose LE pricing I'm new here and don't want to piss off the wrong people). Budget wise I'm ok as we contribute officers to 2 regional teams and currently I'm it from my Dept. For the Cans i'm thinking AAC so far.</div></div>
The LMT would be a good call, so would Colt or BCM. The Sig is not suitable for duty use. Stick with a proven design froma company that manufacturees to a standard. SIG aint it. Niether is RRA.
Re: Looking for new SWAT entry weapon
Seriously can't go wrong with the Colt M-4 or Commando with can! Proven design, and used by most teams. Around my area most agencies are doing the same with their MP-5's. I think it is Phoenix Distributors that take the HK's in trade for good value and provide the Colts. Jeff
Seriously can't go wrong with the Colt M-4 or Commando with can! Proven design, and used by most teams. Around my area most agencies are doing the same with their MP-5's. I think it is Phoenix Distributors that take the HK's in trade for good value and provide the Colts. Jeff
Re: Looking for new SWAT entry weapon
How about letting Red Jacket work their magic on a Thompson for ya?
Super Tommy Gun
How about letting Red Jacket work their magic on a Thompson for ya?
Super Tommy Gun
Re: Looking for new SWAT entry weapon
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Gavin S.</div><div class="ubbcode-body">How about letting Red Jacket work their magic on a Thompson for ya?
Super Tommy Gun </div></div>
Dude, who cares?
Back on topic. Vances's law enforcement in Columbus are great to deal with if you want to trade up to something new. I wouldn't mind making the drive up there to shoot them before you guys get rid of them if you do.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Gavin S.</div><div class="ubbcode-body">How about letting Red Jacket work their magic on a Thompson for ya?
Super Tommy Gun </div></div>
Dude, who cares?
Back on topic. Vances's law enforcement in Columbus are great to deal with if you want to trade up to something new. I wouldn't mind making the drive up there to shoot them before you guys get rid of them if you do.
Re: Looking for new SWAT entry weapon
Not sure what the max range your officers would be required to engage at, but IMHO, a 12.5 inch barreled carbine is very ideal for almost every situation. I've been running a 12.5 for some time now, hits are no problem at 300 yards. I just picked up Noveske's 12.5 that they just came out with, and I love it. Like all of my Noveske's, this one too is sub moa. I'd like to put surefire's new 8 oz can on it when they become available, but I have a feeling it will be a bit out of my price range.
Not sure what the max range your officers would be required to engage at, but IMHO, a 12.5 inch barreled carbine is very ideal for almost every situation. I've been running a 12.5 for some time now, hits are no problem at 300 yards. I just picked up Noveske's 12.5 that they just came out with, and I love it. Like all of my Noveske's, this one too is sub moa. I'd like to put surefire's new 8 oz can on it when they become available, but I have a feeling it will be a bit out of my price range.
Re: Looking for new SWAT entry weapon
Give John a call at Noveske about his 10.5" 6.8spc. I have been using one of these for the last 6 months with nothing but praise and exceptional performance out of it. Am currently looking intop one of his 12.5" units in both callibers(6.8 and a 5.56 ) His 12.5" 5.56 is as or more accurate than most companies 18" SPR's. Check into his stainless barrel systems. He has recently released a new 12.5" ,5.56 . He has just released his new 12.5" GPR 5.56 aimed at LEO markets.
Give John a call at Noveske about his 10.5" 6.8spc. I have been using one of these for the last 6 months with nothing but praise and exceptional performance out of it. Am currently looking intop one of his 12.5" units in both callibers(6.8 and a 5.56 ) His 12.5" 5.56 is as or more accurate than most companies 18" SPR's. Check into his stainless barrel systems. He has recently released a new 12.5" ,5.56 . He has just released his new 12.5" GPR 5.56 aimed at LEO markets.
Re: Looking for new SWAT entry weapon
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Downrange1x</div><div class="ubbcode-body">...aimed at LEO markets. </div></div>
I'm curious. What makes you say that?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Downrange1x</div><div class="ubbcode-body">...aimed at LEO markets. </div></div>
I'm curious. What makes you say that?
Re: Looking for new SWAT entry weapon
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: TallShot</div><div class="ubbcode-body">We use Colt 11.5 commando's. No complaints. </div></div>
North Hollywood back in Feb'97 on my mall where 2 bank robbers were surprised when LAPD tried to stop the robbery with hand guns, it was Colts that my brother gave them off his shelf for the fight...
Surefire fast attach suppressor would also be my recommendation.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: TallShot</div><div class="ubbcode-body">We use Colt 11.5 commando's. No complaints. </div></div>
North Hollywood back in Feb'97 on my mall where 2 bank robbers were surprised when LAPD tried to stop the robbery with hand guns, it was Colts that my brother gave them off his shelf for the fight...
Surefire fast attach suppressor would also be my recommendation.
Re: Looking for new SWAT entry weapon
I just checked their website and I just found out Bravo Company can sell select fires. BCM's are top of the line and are pretty affordable. I personally run a BCM midlength upper as my patrol rifle. From an armorer's standpoint BCM does everything right.
I just checked their website and I just found out Bravo Company can sell select fires. BCM's are top of the line and are pretty affordable. I personally run a BCM midlength upper as my patrol rifle. From an armorer's standpoint BCM does everything right.
Re: Looking for new SWAT entry weapon
+1 for Spikes. I know those guys personally, and they are top notch.
Your department may want to consider the 6.8 as an entry weapon. I know Miami SWAT had a few issues with in and out shots at close range on the 5.56 that got them sued. One hit by a 6.8, and no one is left to sue.
Call Spikes and ask for Ross. He'll hook you guys up with a deal nobody in the business can top. They even work trades on guns such as MP5's. You can tell him I sent you.
+1 for Spikes. I know those guys personally, and they are top notch.
Your department may want to consider the 6.8 as an entry weapon. I know Miami SWAT had a few issues with in and out shots at close range on the 5.56 that got them sued. One hit by a 6.8, and no one is left to sue.
Call Spikes and ask for Ross. He'll hook you guys up with a deal nobody in the business can top. They even work trades on guns such as MP5's. You can tell him I sent you.
Re: Looking for new SWAT entry weapon
Dustin, I won't lie I saw the ST Compressor that Cliff posted and liked it a lot. Spike's had a nice write up on patrol rifles from Law and Order (I think it was). I gotta find someone who stocks them I want to shoot that! I just found out today that my friend who owns a shop will be stocking AAC's along with his Gemtech's WOOHOO!!! Noveske came back with a nice quote on their 12.5 Light GPR Switchblock. POF, who I spoke to today, said he had it in front of him and would get me a quote today. Well someone should tell him I got off at 2300 after a 13 Hr day, no quote.
Dustin, I won't lie I saw the ST Compressor that Cliff posted and liked it a lot. Spike's had a nice write up on patrol rifles from Law and Order (I think it was). I gotta find someone who stocks them I want to shoot that! I just found out today that my friend who owns a shop will be stocking AAC's along with his Gemtech's WOOHOO!!! Noveske came back with a nice quote on their 12.5 Light GPR Switchblock. POF, who I spoke to today, said he had it in front of him and would get me a quote today. Well someone should tell him I got off at 2300 after a 13 Hr day, no quote.
Re: Looking for new SWAT entry weapon
Have you looked at all at 300 BLK? Looks like a nice round. Noveske sells them also. From what I understand, they will work terrifically with suppressors.
http://militarytimes.com/blogs/gearscout/2010/09/29/300-aac-blackout-new-caliber-new-mission/
http://www.m4carbine.net/showthread.php?t=63569
http://noveskerifleworks.com/cgi-bin/imcart/display2.cgi?cat=173
If I weren't wrapping up my last build for a while, a 308, an AR of this caliber would be my next.
Have you looked at all at 300 BLK? Looks like a nice round. Noveske sells them also. From what I understand, they will work terrifically with suppressors.
http://militarytimes.com/blogs/gearscout/2010/09/29/300-aac-blackout-new-caliber-new-mission/
http://www.m4carbine.net/showthread.php?t=63569
http://noveskerifleworks.com/cgi-bin/imcart/display2.cgi?cat=173
If I weren't wrapping up my last build for a while, a 308, an AR of this caliber would be my next.
Re: Looking for new SWAT entry weapon
not sure whats in yall's heads but why a leo thinks they need f/a for anything is really beyond me. cant fathom how it would ever be useful unless yer at platoon strength fighting a numerically superior gang. is this the pocky clips vision here?
not sure whats in yall's heads but why a leo thinks they need f/a for anything is really beyond me. cant fathom how it would ever be useful unless yer at platoon strength fighting a numerically superior gang. is this the pocky clips vision here?
Re: Looking for new SWAT entry weapon
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: marduk185</div><div class="ubbcode-body">not sure whats in yall's heads but why a leo thinks they need f/a for anything is really beyond me. cant fathom how it would ever be useful unless yer at platoon strength fighting a numerically superior gang. is this the pocky clips vision here? </div></div>
Better to have and not need than need and not have. LAPD didn't NEED patrol rifles until the B of A shooting....
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: marduk185</div><div class="ubbcode-body">not sure whats in yall's heads but why a leo thinks they need f/a for anything is really beyond me. cant fathom how it would ever be useful unless yer at platoon strength fighting a numerically superior gang. is this the pocky clips vision here? </div></div>
Better to have and not need than need and not have. LAPD didn't NEED patrol rifles until the B of A shooting....
Re: Looking for new SWAT entry weapon
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: marduk185</div><div class="ubbcode-body">not sure whats in yall's heads but why a leo thinks they need f/a for anything is really beyond me. cant fathom how it would ever be useful unless yer at platoon strength fighting a numerically superior gang. is this the pocky clips vision here? </div></div>
Ugh. not again. OP wants recommendations on mfgrs and set-ups, not a F/A vs. S/A discussion. For everyone's sake, please take it elsewhere.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: marduk185</div><div class="ubbcode-body">not sure whats in yall's heads but why a leo thinks they need f/a for anything is really beyond me. cant fathom how it would ever be useful unless yer at platoon strength fighting a numerically superior gang. is this the pocky clips vision here? </div></div>
Ugh. not again. OP wants recommendations on mfgrs and set-ups, not a F/A vs. S/A discussion. For everyone's sake, please take it elsewhere.
Re: Looking for new SWAT entry weapon
I've been using a 10.5" RRA for the past five years or so. Runs like a sewing machine even though there is literally no resistance left between the gas rings and the BCG. I recently installed a one piece ring and if you turn the BCG up the bolt falls all the way to the rear under it's own weight.
That said, I've got a 10.5" LMT upper on order which will replace the RRA for no other reason than to save weight.
I've been using a 10.5" RRA for the past five years or so. Runs like a sewing machine even though there is literally no resistance left between the gas rings and the BCG. I recently installed a one piece ring and if you turn the BCG up the bolt falls all the way to the rear under it's own weight.
That said, I've got a 10.5" LMT upper on order which will replace the RRA for no other reason than to save weight.
Re: Looking for new SWAT entry weapon
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: tip2oo3</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: marduk185</div><div class="ubbcode-body">not sure whats in yall's heads but why a leo thinks they need f/a for anything is really beyond me. cant fathom how it would ever be useful unless yer at platoon strength fighting a numerically superior gang. is this the pocky clips vision here? </div></div>
Ugh. not again. OP wants recommendations on mfgrs and set-ups, not a F/A vs. S/A discussion. For everyone's sake, please take it elsewhere. </div></div>
I didnt realize you were the omnipresent SH moderator super ninja, being that yer name isnt green and 78 posts and all. F/A or not makes a difference in which system to suggest or discuss so please climb down off your mighty steed and chilax
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: tip2oo3</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: marduk185</div><div class="ubbcode-body">not sure whats in yall's heads but why a leo thinks they need f/a for anything is really beyond me. cant fathom how it would ever be useful unless yer at platoon strength fighting a numerically superior gang. is this the pocky clips vision here? </div></div>
Ugh. not again. OP wants recommendations on mfgrs and set-ups, not a F/A vs. S/A discussion. For everyone's sake, please take it elsewhere. </div></div>
I didnt realize you were the omnipresent SH moderator super ninja, being that yer name isnt green and 78 posts and all. F/A or not makes a difference in which system to suggest or discuss so please climb down off your mighty steed and chilax
Re: Looking for new SWAT entry weapon
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: VAJayJayPunisher</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
I didnt realize you were the omnipresent SH moderator super ninja, being that yer name isnt green and 78 posts and all. F/A or not makes a difference in which system to suggest or discuss so please climb down off your mighty steed and chilax </div></div>
I'm not going to clutter this thread. If you want to start a discussion based on "post counts" you can pm me.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: VAJayJayPunisher</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
I didnt realize you were the omnipresent SH moderator super ninja, being that yer name isnt green and 78 posts and all. F/A or not makes a difference in which system to suggest or discuss so please climb down off your mighty steed and chilax </div></div>
I'm not going to clutter this thread. If you want to start a discussion based on "post counts" you can pm me.
Re: Looking for new SWAT entry weapon
Quick update from POF. They said I would have a quote Monday..no dice. I sent a reminder email Tuesday, nothing when I left at 1900 EST. Let us see what Wednesday brings!
Quick update from POF. They said I would have a quote Monday..no dice. I sent a reminder email Tuesday, nothing when I left at 1900 EST. Let us see what Wednesday brings!
Re: Looking for new SWAT entry weapon
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Blue Line</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Quick update from POF. They said I would have a quote Monday..no dice. I sent a reminder email Tuesday, nothing when I left at 1900 EST. Let us see what Wednesday brings! </div></div>
If its "ok" to answer, Whats the reasoning behind moving from the MP-5's to the 556?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Blue Line</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Quick update from POF. They said I would have a quote Monday..no dice. I sent a reminder email Tuesday, nothing when I left at 1900 EST. Let us see what Wednesday brings! </div></div>
If its "ok" to answer, Whats the reasoning behind moving from the MP-5's to the 556?
Re: Looking for new SWAT entry weapon
Max. my Dept went from 9mm to 40, the MP's are 15yrs old and the team (which is multi-jurisdictional) wanted M4's up front with suppressors. Combined with the age of the weapon and no other reason to buy 9mm it was just easier. Also, still no reply from POF.
Max. my Dept went from 9mm to 40, the MP's are 15yrs old and the team (which is multi-jurisdictional) wanted M4's up front with suppressors. Combined with the age of the weapon and no other reason to buy 9mm it was just easier. Also, still no reply from POF.
Re: Looking for new SWAT entry weapon
Blue Line,
Have you checked out Kesler's Defense? They are distributor that offers agency pricing; plus they will give you a credit for buying your old MP5s/ any other equipment.
Blue Line,
Have you checked out Kesler's Defense? They are distributor that offers agency pricing; plus they will give you a credit for buying your old MP5s/ any other equipment.
Re: Looking for new SWAT entry weapon
Jak, I'm on their email list. I will give them a call I just thought going through the manufacturers would be the easiest route. So far POF's (future)customer service leaves a lot to be desired. Noveske got back to me in 2 hrs after I emailed them, which was because their answering machine was set to give you 5 seconds to leave a message lol. Vance's in Ohio is great too for Sig 516 and LMT.
Jak, I'm on their email list. I will give them a call I just thought going through the manufacturers would be the easiest route. So far POF's (future)customer service leaves a lot to be desired. Noveske got back to me in 2 hrs after I emailed them, which was because their answering machine was set to give you 5 seconds to leave a message lol. Vance's in Ohio is great too for Sig 516 and LMT.
Re: Looking for new SWAT entry weapon
Another good dealer is G&R tactical. He can get you anything ar-related you need. I also been to his shop and talked with him, great guy to deal with. He's located near Dover, OH and is a class3 dealer, he might have some silencers in stock to check out.
http://www.gandrtactical.com/cgi-bin/commerce.cgi?display=home
Another good dealer is G&R tactical. He can get you anything ar-related you need. I also been to his shop and talked with him, great guy to deal with. He's located near Dover, OH and is a class3 dealer, he might have some silencers in stock to check out.
http://www.gandrtactical.com/cgi-bin/commerce.cgi?display=home
Re: Looking for new SWAT entry weapon
We sell 11.5" SR-16's to LE
Personally I would not go shorter than 11.5" for 5.56mm guns. 10.3" would be the very min of what I beleive is useful or acceptable.
Colt, LMT, DD, BCM all make good guns as well.
I dont drink Piston cool-aid.
We sell 11.5" SR-16's to LE
Personally I would not go shorter than 11.5" for 5.56mm guns. 10.3" would be the very min of what I beleive is useful or acceptable.
Colt, LMT, DD, BCM all make good guns as well.
I dont drink Piston cool-aid.
Re: Looking for new SWAT entry weapon
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: tip2oo3</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: marduk185</div><div class="ubbcode-body">not sure whats in yall's heads but why a leo thinks they need f/a for anything is really beyond me. cant fathom how it would ever be useful unless yer at platoon strength fighting a numerically superior gang. is this the pocky clips vision here? </div></div>
Ugh. not again. OP wants recommendations on mfgrs and set-ups, not a F/A vs. S/A discussion. For everyone's sake, please take it elsewhere. </div></div>
yer right, lets not adress the legitimacy of the op's question but just blindly sling on more fuel for a misguided fire. my bad.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: tip2oo3</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: marduk185</div><div class="ubbcode-body">not sure whats in yall's heads but why a leo thinks they need f/a for anything is really beyond me. cant fathom how it would ever be useful unless yer at platoon strength fighting a numerically superior gang. is this the pocky clips vision here? </div></div>
Ugh. not again. OP wants recommendations on mfgrs and set-ups, not a F/A vs. S/A discussion. For everyone's sake, please take it elsewhere. </div></div>
yer right, lets not adress the legitimacy of the op's question but just blindly sling on more fuel for a misguided fire. my bad.
Re: Looking for new SWAT entry weapon
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: 1/2milejodie</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
yer right, lets not adress the legitimacy of the op's question but just blindly sling on more fuel for a misguided fire. my bad. </div></div>
Legitimacy and misguided are pretty strong words, so I'm taking it that your stance is that any agency with Select fire weapons in their arsenal are "misguided and illegitimate'? I'm I not understanding you correctly?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: 1/2milejodie</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
yer right, lets not adress the legitimacy of the op's question but just blindly sling on more fuel for a misguided fire. my bad. </div></div>
Legitimacy and misguided are pretty strong words, so I'm taking it that your stance is that any agency with Select fire weapons in their arsenal are "misguided and illegitimate'? I'm I not understanding you correctly?
Re: Looking for new SWAT entry weapon
imho and with a possible few exceptions yes thats what i was implying. sorry if i made yer nethers twitch.
imho and with a possible few exceptions yes thats what i was implying. sorry if i made yer nethers twitch.
Re: Looking for new SWAT entry weapon
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: KevinB-KAC</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
Personally I would not go shorter than 11.5" for 5.56mm guns. 10.3" would be the very min of what I beleive is useful or acceptable.
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Kevin can you expand on why that very specific minimum of 10.3 vs shorter, 10 or 10.5?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: KevinB-KAC</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
Personally I would not go shorter than 11.5" for 5.56mm guns. 10.3" would be the very min of what I beleive is useful or acceptable.
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Kevin can you expand on why that very specific minimum of 10.3 vs shorter, 10 or 10.5?
