If I was going 6mm ARC I would think long and hard about a Proof CF 14.5. I use the Proof's in every rifle I can (16 inch 5.56, 18 inch 6.5 G, 16 and 24 inch 6mm Creedmoors) and between the weight and accuracy they are impossible to beat. The only thing that keeps me from building a 14.5 6mm arc Proof is the fact that my brother and I have so much Grendel gear and it is a proven killer on Hogs and Deer.
Rifle Scopes March 1-10 Shorty Dual Focal - Reviews?
- Thread starter ClangClang
- Start date
If I was going 6mm ARC I would think long and hard about a Proof CF 14.5. I use the Proof's in every rifle I can (16 inch 5.56, 18 inch 6.5 G, 16 and 24 inch 6mm Creedmoors) and between the weight and accuracy they are impossible to beat. The only thing that keeps me from building a 14.5 6mm arc Proof is the fact that my brother and I have so much Grendel gear and it is a proven killer on Hogs and Deer.
How is the Burris? I just got back from 3 days of hunting our 200 acre farm in South Carolina using a Reap2 IR 35mm on my 18 inch Grendel (night) and the 1-10 DR March on my 11 inch (day). A clip on seems very appealing but I'm pretty sure I would want a 640.Since we are posting pictures with the Shorty, this one is a 1-8x24 Shorty behind a Burris clip-on. A scope this short really makes it easier to mount stuff in front of it even on short handguards.
Well I actually built an 18" with the proof in 6 ARC before the shorty. I mainly want the 12.5 for my daughter to hunt with and for me to play with. The 18 was just a little too long for her. I have it listed in the classifieds because I haven't done anything with it. I also have a 6.5 CM gasser with the proof that shoots .25 all day. They are great barrels.
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I just reached out to them as well. Still no plans to make a 33/30mm LEAP/07 mount for the March 1-10 shorty.
It’s frustrating that March went with 33 instead of 34 for the front. This would be an easy fix with spacers or with the Larue CAN mount.
Edit:
Speaking of the Larue C.A.N. mount, I just heard back from LaRue and they “do not and will not make 33mm rings”. I was hoping Larue would, as they wouldn’t have to make whole separate mounts and would just need to make the rings.
I don’t believe Badger Ordnance ever got back to me.
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What scope mount is that?
Yeah, the choice to go 33mm instead of 34mm still boggles my mind.
I do believe that I might have figured out a reasonably easy solution to use a Scalarworks 34mm mount. I will have to wait until I can get a scope to try it.
It is very good for the money, to be honest. If you are shopping for a 640x480, you are in a different price range though.
ILya
Looks like the Tier One Cantilever Mount:
Tier One® // QD Cantilever Monomount
[LIFETIME WARRANTY] - QD Cantilever Monomount. This is the quick detach version of the Cantilever Monomount; a true monolithic mount with class leading strength and accuracy. Discover here.
tier-one-usa.com Yea I know the 640’s are more expensive but I’m interested in the new pulsar krypton fxg50 and the Bering Optics Yoter C. $5k is much better than 10-20k. Since I’m using a Reap 2 35mm I would like similar image quality with the versatility of a clip on.
It’s the Tier One.
I do not have any hands on experience with those two. I want to set up another hog hunt around March, so that will be the time for me to look at some additional options as far as thermals go. I'll see if I can get my hands on those two thermals along with a couple of others that I know are coming.
ILya
Sounds about right for Larue. I have no idea how this company is still in business.
That is what I thought it might be.
And at the risk of a continued thrashing of a deceased stallion.......
Anyone notice the optic mount is sitting on the first slot of the handguard? And it sits in that position despite having a decent amount of cantilever. If that were the March mount with almost no cantilever, it would need to sit probably 4-5 slots onto the handguard. This continues to confirm my questioning of the design decision on the part of March to not put more cantilever in their mount.
I ordered one with the TR1 reticle this weekend, taking advantage of all the BF deals around. Th expected ship date says Jan 21, 2022. We will see when it actually shows up.
Now I need to get a Scalarworks mount on the way and start sorting that out.
Now I need to get a Scalarworks mount on the way and start sorting that out.
I just received one with the tree reticle. I think it has definite potential.
ILya
ILya
Looking forward to reading both of your thoughts.
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looking forward to your eval as always.
since i am a poor, is there something similar that is true 1x to 6x or higher with a short parallax (10yds) for an air rifle?
And like the seas parting for some Jewish dude with a bad-ass beard.............
Right on cue, Dvor has the exact Scalarworks mount I need for the best price I have ever seen. Check.
Right on cue, Dvor has the exact Scalarworks mount I need for the best price I have ever seen. Check.
Side focus in LPVOs is rarer than hen's teeth. Styrka used to make one, but they are no more.
March does have older non-Shorty 1-10x24 SFP scope that is a bit less expensive.
I can't think of any others off hand that have side focus and are available to general public.
Hi-Lux has a 1-4x34 that is aimed at service rifle competition use that has AO parrallax adjustment.
ILya
How much does the scalarworks mount weigh? The March option is around 7 ounces, right?
The reports here say the March mount is 7.1oz (without the accessory pic rail on top), the Tier1 is about 9oz, and the Scalarworks is 5.54oz (advertised).
Now keep in mind the Scalarworks will need a bit of weight added in the form of adapters to deal with the size issue. But it should still be around 5.9ish oz.
Thanks. As a comparison, the badger comm mounts for 30 mm and 1.54 height are right around five ounces from what I have read. I wish we could get them making mounts for this March scope, but they can't even keep up with current demand. I am interested to see how the scalarworks option ends up.
According to the Badger site, they are 6.3oz.
I have yet to see a production cantilever mount come in lighter than the Scalarworks, the badger is about as close as I have seen.
When you factor in the fact that the Scalarworks is tool-less QD, the weight difference between almost any competitor grows into multiple ounces. Like at least 3oz or more (~50% more total weight to put in perspective).
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EDIT TO ABOVE: I see that Badger does claim 5oz on the 30mm (which I question, see next paragraph) but a 30mm won't work for this application. It will require the 34mm setup.
Weight claim: I don't see how the 30mm set weighs 5.0oz, and the 34mm weighs 6.3oz. That is nearly 25% more weight for what is only a small amount of extra aluminum. I do CAD modelling of parts for motorsports, where I am looking to shave every gram of weight that I can in a design. I look at dimensional changes in aluminum parts continuously for weigh differences, and I just don't see that much weight difference here.
I especially don't see it when Badger claims the 30mm/1.70" height to be 6.3oz, the exact same as the 34mm/1.70" set. I suspect the 5.0oz for the 30mm/1.54" is incorrect.
i actually have a scalarworks mount i would use, except obvi it is 30/30mm. do you know what i would need to get to use it?
since this is a air rifle, i could just use the one ring mount but i would prefer the high mount i have but prolly won't go unless 34/34mm?
There is nothing you can really do with a 30/30 1-piece mount of any type. I also have a Scalarworks 30mm mount sitting here, but just had to purchase a 34mm mount.
The front mount on the scope is 33mm, and there is nothing to be done about that. The front of the scope mount must be 33mm, or larger with a reducer spacer. There is no other option.
The only reason I am going to all the trouble to make the Scalarworks fit is I need the extra cantilever. If I had this going on an air rifle (or anything else not an AR) and I didn't need the extra canitlever, I would just get the March (Audere) mount and move on. In the end, my Scalarworks will only be a bit over an ounce lighter than the March. I am super weight conscious because this a Run n Gun competition rifle, but the hassle to save an ounce isn't worth it, even in this extreme situation.
Plus, as I alluded earlier I am a machinist/design engineer, and I see plenty of places the March mount could be significantly lightened. I guarantee with a bit of millwork I could get it down to about the same as the Scalarworks, if sufficiently motivated. But again, this doesn't solve the cantilever issue.
i like the 1.93" high mount for both eyes open shooting, because the my leshiy 2 has very little drop from rail to cheek rest. the 07 will work.
It is wrong. Their weights are all over the place and I weighed out a 34mm 1.54” at 6.3oz.
Yes, something has to be off with the reported weights from badger. Those numbers don't add up at all.
My Scalarworks mount arrived a couple of days ago. Now I need to start making spacers for it.
The shipping date for the scope has been pushed back to Feb 2. I expected it to get pushed, and I am sure it will get pushed again before the time comes. Sounds like the scope and my TBAC can will get here about the same time.
Me neither. I was actually a fan of their products, but Mark just banned me from his Instagram because I benignly added context to one of his news posts. He apparently took personal offense to it, insulted me, and then banned me.
I weighed my 30mm 1.54” version a little while ago and it came out to 6.4oz. But the scale itself might have an error up to 0.4oz, favoring the heavy side.
Looking forward to see what you come up with when the scope arrives. Thanks for doing the legwork and providing the info.
Tree Shorty showed up.
Obviously, the overall package is the same and we don’t need to recap all the benefits; weight, length, friendly eye box, illumination….
Two observations:
1. Tree reticle very well executed. Very comfortable and usable 6x-10x. Obviously, disappears at 1x. The 2FP duplex feels thinner and doesn’t go as deep into the FFP reticle at 10x, which I really like.
2. Illumination knob is less stiff. It’s just right. It’s stiffer than I like on my DR1.
Haven’t mounted yet, all in-hand observations. That said, this little sucker is a beast. Could be one of my favorite LPVO’s and I own all the really expensive ones to compare.
Obviously, the overall package is the same and we don’t need to recap all the benefits; weight, length, friendly eye box, illumination….
Two observations:
1. Tree reticle very well executed. Very comfortable and usable 6x-10x. Obviously, disappears at 1x. The 2FP duplex feels thinner and doesn’t go as deep into the FFP reticle at 10x, which I really like.
2. Illumination knob is less stiff. It’s just right. It’s stiffer than I like on my DR1.
Haven’t mounted yet, all in-hand observations. That said, this little sucker is a beast. Could be one of my favorite LPVO’s and I own all the really expensive ones to compare.
Now shipping date has been pushed back to Feb 25.
Oh well, I knew what I was getting into with this purchase when I did it. At least it is winter, so I am not going to be missing much range use by not having it.
Any chance of a pictures of the reticle at 1/4/6/10x?
I just got shipping conformation for my tree reticle version, but no one has had mounts in stock for a while...
I have one on order with MK machining, but no ETA.
I have one on order with MK machining, but no ETA.
https://www.marchscopes.co.uk/product/march-1x-8x24-1x-10x24-shorty-unimount/I just got shipping conformation for my tree reticle version, but no one has had mounts in stock for a while...
I have one on order with MK machining, but no ETA.
Can anybody who has time behind the March 1-10 compare it to a NF ATACR 1-8?
I’m looking for optics for a “do it all” 14.5” AR. Glass quality, brightness, reliability and size/weight are all important. I’m familiar with NF quality and robustness, never dealt with a March scope before.
I’m looking for optics for a “do it all” 14.5” AR. Glass quality, brightness, reliability and size/weight are all important. I’m familiar with NF quality and robustness, never dealt with a March scope before.
Weight and Size: The March is the clear winner on weight and size, not really even a contest.
As for the rest of it, I suspect you will have a lot of trouble getting any quality answers as there simply are not enough of these March scopes in the wild to have many opportunities for comparison. But in general:
Glass: March seems to have a reputation for very good glass. So does the NF. But glass clarity is subjective, dependent heavily on the individual, and highly subject to cognitive bias. Personally, I have not found NF glass overall to be any better, or worse, than anything else in its price comparison. I have never seen any March glass, so I have no opinion.
Durability: Again, tough to know. The ATACR is known to be durable, but I have never seen anything reporting March durability, neither good or bad. You will be able to find singular incidences of both early failure and of long-term trouble-free use for any product. None of this really speaks to anything about expected durability of a median product from a company. Since there are so few March scopes to examine, I doubt you will find anything meaningful being reported.
Things Not Mentioned: The March does have more magnification than the NF, though that may or may not matter. The Dual Focal reticle is also an advantage to the March, if it works as well as claimed.
But the one crucial thing that the March has over every other scope in the class, including the ATACR, is the adjustable parallax. The weight already had me considering the March as a replacement for my Vortex. But it is the parallax adjust-ability, more than anything else, that convinced me to drop the money on the March. If I find durability issues, and I bet it will show up for me doing Run N Gun competitions, then I will know I made the wrong choice. And everyone here will know about it as well.
My guess? And these are just guesses based on the few measurable specifications, what I have seen for myself, and what people I trust have had to say on the subject: The March will be at least equal to, and in many cases be significantly better than, the NF in everything but durability. The durability question will take a long time to answer. And if issues start to arise, March may address them with upgrades and design changes for no charge. They seem like a company that desires to produce the best product they can, so I would not be surprised if this is their response if issues start appearing. Then again, they may say "So Sad, Too Bad". Time will tell
In the end, if you want answers to your questions, you will probably have to do like me and others buying them unseen, and find out for yourself. If you wait on someone else to figure it out, you might be a while.
I expect people are ordering depending on how they will use it.
I have a capped version coming, because mine will be a Run N Gun scope. I will be moving through rough terrain, lots of mud and dirt, and with various obstacles to manage. I generally don't have more than 1 stage per event that requires much of any holdover, and you don't really want to take the time to dial for that. So for me, a tactical just didn't make sense.
Others will have different use-based justifications for their choice. Maybe the $100 lower price for the capped version will come into play for some people as well.
I am building an AR-10 Tactical Carbine and have been struggling with the optic. I narrowed it down to the Vortex RAZOR HD GEN III 1-10X24 FFP and the NF ATACR - 1-8x24mm F1, the SB 1-8x24 PM II ShortDot Dual CC is just too much coin for my application. Then I stumbled on this thread. Thanks to everyone for all the great posts and information, I just ordered the March D10SV24FIMLN-DR-TR1 from Scopelist, they had 2 available. Still need to decide on the mount.
I recently ended up trading into a March DFP 1-10.
Man oh man, to me that side focus on higher magnification is EVERYTHING! I discovered my old eyes just do not work well with LPVO's at higher magnification above 6x - so I sold the 1-8 and sent back the other 1-10.
This March actually does what I want which is to be focused at any distance or magnification!
10x is the minimum magnification I want to use for long range and at least I have 1x if I need it.
I had a Athlon 2-12x42 DMR on my short AR, and honestly, except for being longer, heavier, and not having daylight bright illume, I prefer it, because I really like the 12x vs 10x for long range, BUT I feel 2x is a bit too much magnification for close in, so March 1-10 it is.
I put the 2-12 on my 6mmFatRat which works pretty good for it.
Man oh man, to me that side focus on higher magnification is EVERYTHING! I discovered my old eyes just do not work well with LPVO's at higher magnification above 6x - so I sold the 1-8 and sent back the other 1-10.
This March actually does what I want which is to be focused at any distance or magnification!
10x is the minimum magnification I want to use for long range and at least I have 1x if I need it.
I had a Athlon 2-12x42 DMR on my short AR, and honestly, except for being longer, heavier, and not having daylight bright illume, I prefer it, because I really like the 12x vs 10x for long range, BUT I feel 2x is a bit too much magnification for close in, so March 1-10 it is.
I put the 2-12 on my 6mmFatRat which works pretty good for it.
Yep. This is why when I found an LPVO with a side focus, I knew that was likely the one for me. And what separates the March from everything else in the category.
I suspect that many people have never had a good scope with adjustable parallax. They have no idea how much more effective that feature makes a scope.
Serious question here…
So when you’re shooting quickly and you need to transition from say, 600 yards and then rapidly engage a 1 MOA~ish target at 200-250 shooting positionally, how do you set your parallax? Mark it and wing it with your weak side hand? Do you drop it off your shoulder? Break your view down range?
I ran a 3.5x-10 M3 for a year on my mk12. Fine for flat range slow fire or bench shooting. However, when shooting off a barricade, etc. I find it much faster to shoot a fixed parallax scope.
Curious if there is a technique to get a parallax adjustable scope fast like a fixed LPVO outside just setting it at 300 and living with the sight picture/ parallax. (Kind if defeats the purpose) I am not sold on my Gen3 1-10 and this scope is interesting to me IF if will work for my style of shooting.
Set it to ~300 and leave it alone. Unless you zoom in to 10x on a target under 100, or closer even to 75 or 50, it won’t hinder you. If you’re shooting closer just dial down your magnification to like 4-6x and you won’t even notice. Or, alternatively just adjust your parallax if you have a few seconds and need maximum magnification.
I head shoot squirrels under 10 yards with the G3 (fixed parallax at 150 yards). I have to dial down to 3-4x to get a clear sight picture at under 10 yards. I also shoot it to 525 and dial it up to 10x, can see impacts no problem and the image is very good. That said, I like adjustable parallax a lot and may sell my G3s to buy Marches.
Exactly what I was doing with the M3, which suffered some clarity issues when shooting out long like this. However, this kind of defeats the purpose of a parallax adjustable scope. Edit: at least this particular scope.
So if my reading comprehension is on point this early, my take away is you can get around it with compromised fixed parallax and then use it as a precision scope when you have time. That this unit (March 1-10 short) has good clarity from say 10 yards to 600 with the parallax on one setting?
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Here is the paradox: you cannot have a set parallax optic with perfect clarity through the entire magnification range at all distances (which appears to be what you're asking for) but with an adjustable parallax optic you cannot have perfect clarity through the entire magnification range at all distances without adjusting the parallax.
Depending on the type of shooting that you're doing, a minor parallax error isn't a huge deal and leaves an acceptable margin of error for most shots under a time constraint out to 3-400 meters. At 10 yards most shooters are probably worrying more about height over bore than parallax, especially if the optic has a daylight-bright red dot... This appears to be the premise behind nearly all LPVO having fixed parallax.
For longer distances or where image clarity is very important, having an adjustable parallax is extremely useful. Keep in mind that everyone's eyes are different, and therefore parallax is also somewhat relative to the shooter's vision at a set distance.
As others have said, the benefit of the March 1-10 is that you have the ability to adjust the parallax for optimum image clarity at any distance, or set it at an acceptable distance that will work for the majority of your shooting needs without having to touch it. To many, this feature quite desireable, and one of the drawbacks of the 1-8 and 1-10 LPVO when used at longer distances.
Not on one setting. You’d have to adjust it. But, from 100-600 yards you would find that clarity would be acceptable for rapid engagement if you set it at say 200 and left it due to the fact that 1) Max magnification is 10x and 2) it has a small objective diameter. If you took the time to adjust it between distances, you would have optimal image quality and no parallax.
