That's what I like about the .25 mil holds, if you need .6 hold edge of the .5 line. To me it's easier/faster, especially with the added pressure of a clock or similar. Add a position to the mix other than prone and the reticle helps out even more.
Rifle Scopes New Leupold Reticle
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That's what I like about the .25 mil holds, if you need .6 hold edge of the .5 line. To me it's easier/faster, especially with the added pressure of a clock or similar. Add a position to the mix other than prone and the reticle helps out even more.
I got confirmation that I should get mine January or early Feb. According to an employee at Leupold.
If they have illumination for a reasonable price i'll be outfitting a lot of hunting rifles with the MK5.
I don't shoot PRS but I shoot Run and Guns with an LPVO at distance and I have found that any reticle that reduces counting of lines under pressure is a good one.
The batteries could be dead in all my illuminated scopes and I would never know. Maybe its just me but the times where illumination has matter has been virtually non-existent. Typically, even at the lowest setting it does nothing but hinder my low light view at dawn and dusk. And if it's really dark, I run NV. Daytime, non illuminated, Dawn and Dusk, non illuminated so my vision is adjusted for the low light, and night time...NV.
While i share the sentiment i've been in situations quite a bit with FFP where I dialed back due to low light and without illumination is was a bit of a pain. It's not a must have but it's kind of like the tree reticle. I might never use it practically but i have it if i need it.
Does anyone with insider info know when Leupold is going to reopening ordering for these on their website? At the price point and with the new reticle I am in for one.
I would love if they brought the reticle to the 3.6-18 too. Would be a great optic pairing for an ACC that is in need of a scope.
I would love if they brought the reticle to the 3.6-18 too. Would be a great optic pairing for an ACC that is in need of a scope.
First Pre-Orders going out the door this week!
Nice! Maybe I'll get mine from Leupold soon.
I understand the discount for mil/le but why doesn't leupold recognize their market and give back to the people who have supported them for so long? I haven't had a different scope then leuy except for my 1st NF a couple years back.....love it but back to leupold. Low light clarity, price point, durability, and......of course weight!!! Can i get a mil/le discount for christmas?? Im trying to get a vx5hd 
Give uncle Sam at least 4 years of your life or maybe much, much more and then you can have a discount.I understand the discount for mil/le but why doesn't leupold recognize their market and give back to the people who have supported them for so long? I haven't had a different scope then leuy except for my 1st NF a couple years back.....love it but back to leupold. Low light clarity, price point, durability, and......of course weight!!! Can i get a mil/le discount for christmas?? Im trying to get a vx5hd
I understand the discount for mil/le but why doesn't leupold recognize their market and give back to the people who have supported them for so long? I haven't had a different scope then leuy except for my 1st NF a couple years back.....love it but back to leupold. Low light clarity, price point, durability, and......of course weight!!! Can i get a mil/le discount for christmas?? Im trying to get a vx5hd
I think that Leupold is following the glock template, where they are willing to make a minimal amount on a certain percentage of optics in hopes of gaining institutional users, and using that adoption as a marketing point.
Yeah I wish it was back to the good old days. The scopes that I grew up shooting where tits!! Tough as shit, great in all condtions (super shitty, fog, wet,etc) and hold a zero. All the articles im reading on the new stuff scares me away but I have ran a fixed 6 since I got behind the trigger. Moved to the variable now. NF has been great just heavy as hell and bomb proof. My dad has a vx5hd right and was looking through it these season while hunting. Looks super clear but also a little cheap. I'll obviously have to fork over the cashto find out for myself which sucks. So much misinformation these days. Might make an offer on a mark 5 but I want to stick around 20 ounces
About? I know there are better scopes out there. Im trying to stay within the $1000-1500.....care to elaborate?
You think scopes used to be built better than they are now?
I really can not comment on overall scope quality historically, but there are deals to be had, and keep an eye on eurooptics demo section, you can find a really good deal stuff. Ive seen Mk's pop up in your price range
that would be nice if it were true. I did four in the USMC, and 30 in the FBI and while in the FBI I got a LE discount. After retrurning from Afghanistan several years ago as a contractor I contacted them for another purchase. Their response was I had to be retired from the military. I said I was retired FBI. Basically the response back was the same. I have had excellent customer response when sending scopes in for work but NOT SO MUCH with the LE/MIL program.
Not complaining, just giving out info!!!
There is a link for "U.S. Military Veteran" in the VIP program.
Just follow the instructions and send them a copy of your DD214.
Leupold used to only offer their discount to Active Duty Mil/LE or retired as you were told, but late last year or early this year they opened up their program to include Veterans as well, Nightforce has done the same. I'm assuming the pressure from Vortex, Bushnell and others who offer Mil/LE discounts to veterans as well made them reconsider their requirements.
That being said, I have found that numerous Hide vendors can match and sometimes beat Mil/LE pricing from various manufacturer's so it always pays to call up and ask. The usual suspects are (in no particular order):
- CS Tactical (Richard)
- Liberty Optics (Scott)
- Cameralandny (Doug)
- Eurooptic (Jason)
- Sport Optics (Ben)
- Mile High (ask for LE)
- Bison Tactical (Fred)
- MTM (Tyler)
It's nice that a lot of companies can give back to those who have served or are currently serving, either Military, Gov or LE wise. It's a service that some are able to offer while others aren't due to lower margins available. Some think the MIL/LE/Veteran programs offer the best possible price but there may be other fees and lead times involved that don't always make it the best option for each individual.
I'm truly grateful for those that choose to and are able to offer these discounts but I've also never held anything against those companies that are just not able to give discounts on their products.
All that being said the MK5 5-25 with PR2 reticle at a $2000 price point is hard to beat currently.
I'm truly grateful for those that choose to and are able to offer these discounts but I've also never held anything against those companies that are just not able to give discounts on their products.
All that being said the MK5 5-25 with PR2 reticle at a $2000 price point is hard to beat currently.
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Im incredibly glad for this post because I prefer a 7-35, but for the price I was about to say F it and buy that 5-25. Any idea if the 7-35 will be priced as aggressively?
It will be more expensive than the 5-25 but not by much as far as I can tell!
Received a package from Richard at @CSTactical today. So far I’m liking the reticle but need to get it mounted and do a better comparison
Attachments
This is a reply I received from leupold asking if the pr2 reticle would be available in the 3.6-18x.
“The PR-2 reticle, being designed predominantly for PRS/NRL style competition, is not currently available in the Mark 5HD 3.6-18x44mm riflescope.
Sincerely, Baer”
Doesn’t seem like they have any intention of bringing it to the 3.6-18x. Disappointing in my opinion as it looks less cluttered than their other Christmas tree reticle options.
Atleast it says “not currently available”. Which is better than “it won’t be”. Makes sense to put it into the 5-25 first for the PRS folks, then something that is more likely for a gas gun.
But that 5-25 would be great on my 22.
I think the best way to get that reticle in the 3-18 is to keep contacting them about it as well as posting to show the overwhelming interest. They are for sure listening and taking your guys input into account.
If you haven't noticed, precision shooters can be a pretty finicky bunch
Put up a reticle design and it will be both loved and hated within the same group so I understand it is a hard field to navigate. That being said I am surprised more manufacturer's don't understand the industry they're trying to market to better. Back in 2015 a little scope company from Austria shook things up when they introduced a new line of reticles in their 6-24x56 scope with strange parallax adjustment location at the top of the scope, you guessed it, Kahles. When they introduced their "Gen III" scope updates they also introduced a brand new reticle series called SKMR (nicknamed "schemer"), this new reticle design departed from the traditional .5 mil hash marks of most every other manufacturer and offered .2 mil hash marks and a fine center dot. As most of the Hider's already know, this reticle garnered a lot of attention from the community, especially those interested in the PRS style sports and long range dynamic shooting. But how did this "little mom and pop" scope company from half way across the world figure out a reticle that worked so well for shooters here in the states? I'm not sure which came first for Kahles, hiring Jeff Huber (of Nightforce fame and now owner and founder of ZCO) or building a relationship with Shannon Kay (owner of K&M Shooting Complex), but Kahles listened and soon the "Shannon Kay Milling Reticle" or SKMR was born and began to take the competition scene by storm as many shooters saw the advantage of making quick and precise adjustments with those .2 mil hash marks. Soon after other manufacturer's began to follow suit with their own .2 mil hash designs. But the point is that Kahles realized their knowledge gap with the American market and looked to partner with some experts in the industry to better address this new rising sport (PRS). Oddly enough, three of the biggest holdouts are three of the largest scope manufacturers - Nightforce, Leupold and Bushnell. Nightforce finally woke up in 2018 with the introduction of the Mil-C followed by the Mil-XT reticles, Bushnell partnered with George Gardner of GA Precision (GAP) to create the G2 and G3 style reticles but these still use the traditional .5 mil spacing though the G3 tried with a couple little .2 mil ticks that don't seem to be that helpful with their location. But Leupold is the enigma, being a company founded right here in the USA you'd think they'd be tapped into the PRS base and I thought for sure when the Mark 5HD line was introduced they were going to have a new reticle that fit this .2 mil hash profile. Maybe because of their relationship with HORUS, which stands for "HORibbly Ugly S***" (okay, so I'm a bit biased
), I don't know, but the TMR is about as plain as a mil reticle comes and the CCH and HORUS are just way too busy and distracting leaving many Leupold fanboys scratching their heads wondering when Leuppy would come out with a reticle that was more usable. Enter the PR2 Mil reticle and to be honest I'm still scratching my head wondering what young millennial engineer at Leupold went before the board and said, "now listen, we know that competition shooters love all these .2 mil hash reticles with Christmas trees that have reference points every full mil below horizontal, but we're not going to offer that...", "we're not?" the board responds perplexed, young millennial retorts, "no, because we're Leupold and we do things our way". Okay, it's doubtful it happened the way I envisioned, but coming out with a .25 mil hash spacing and providing Christmas tree horizontal reference every 2 full mils seems a bit odd. That being said, it is much better than the TMR and mosquito net reticles they've offered previously and I'll try to reserve judgement until we get some more real world field reports on it. But to khuber's point above, why only in the 5-25 and 7-35? Why not put this reticle in the 3.6-18x44? To be honest, I'm not interested in the 5-25 and 7-35 (too much competition with better reticles, greater FOV, and the like in that market) but I am interested in the 3.6-18x44 but not many scopes in this range are as light or as short as the Leupold, which sets it apart from many others. I reviewed the 3.6-18x44 a couple years ago and was critical about certain features but overall really liked the scope and what it had to offer, but I won't touch these scopes (for my own personal use) with the current reticle offerings and high upcharge of illumination. For Leupold, it seems to be a dance of "two steps forward and one step back" and hopefully Leupold will soon find a dance partner who really knows how to dance
One other boutique scope company has finally sought some advise from the US market and that company is March. I've always been intrigued at how their engineers can push the envelope so far with their 8x FFP erector designs but after reviewing the 3-24x52 a few years ago I felt they could really benefit with a good .2 mil design. Last year I had the opportunity to see a new reticle design by the Hide's own ILya (Koshkin) and at first I thought "okay, that works" but as ILya explained it to me I began to see the light and earlier this year I was able to review March's new 5-42x56 HM scope with ILya's reticle called the FML-TR1 and putting the reticle into some field use began to quickly see the advantages of the design and it has become my favorite reticle to date. I mention this to say that just because I may not think a reticle will work well on paper (or rather online), we really have to wait to see how it looks through the scope.
@wjm308, most of us concur that the Horus feels too busy and eliminates some ability to spot hits, misses and trace. The TMR is a bit plane for some applications but seems to work well for hunting a lot of times. I ran it it at the Precision Hunter match and didn’t feel at a disadvantage but they were relatively big targets (12”) diamonds with not much wind and I do prefer a bit more fine wind holds.
I am accustomed to .2 mil wind holds on my Gen 2 Razors and really like them but the more I look at this .25 mil hold the more I like the concept. A bit more open than .2 holds but .05 of a mil probably won’t be a big deal when you consider the shooting we do, with the advantage of a reticle that seems more open.
Time will tell if it catches on but I like it so far, I’m going to pick up a 5-25 when they come available again. The 3.6-18 would be sweet for a DMR/Semi-Auto scope and as you said, illumination would be ideal for some of those applications ( I hardly use illum outside of work) on my precision guns.
I am accustomed to .2 mil wind holds on my Gen 2 Razors and really like them but the more I look at this .25 mil hold the more I like the concept. A bit more open than .2 holds but .05 of a mil probably won’t be a big deal when you consider the shooting we do, with the advantage of a reticle that seems more open.
Time will tell if it catches on but I like it so far, I’m going to pick up a 5-25 when they come available again. The 3.6-18 would be sweet for a DMR/Semi-Auto scope and as you said, illumination would be ideal for some of those applications ( I hardly use illum outside of work) on my precision guns.
I think you're right verdugo, the .05 difference will likely not affect anything within typical PRS ranges (1400 and in) and anyone's ability to read wind will be more than that .05 difference. It's more of a mental thing, like you mentioned with using the TMR at a Precision Hunter match and didn't feel at a disadvantage with .5 mil hash marks, if your solution called for holding .7 mil of wind, can our brains not figure out approximately where that is between the .5 and 1 mil hash marks? Even with the "old" mil dot reticles, we could still do the same. It then becomes mental, or a matter of personal preference. The good news is that for those who want more than the TMR but less than the Horus and Horus-like reticles, there is now an option from Leupold.
I think some may be forgetting the marketing aspect. We may like a reticle and price point so much that we pick up a scope in a magnification we aren’t super fans of, while waiting for it to be released in the one we really want.
Sell every bit of the model you can now, then offer changes and new models once sales slow down.
With that said, the 5-25 would be fun on a 22 after they release it on the 3-18.
Sell every bit of the model you can now, then offer changes and new models once sales slow down.
With that said, the 5-25 would be fun on a 22 after they release it on the 3-18.
This looks nice. I've come to find the Tremor 3 a little more than I need. I tried their CCH in a 3.6-18, wasn't impressed.
i know there is less lines, but i am able to ignore the grid on the h59 when i am not using it, while my eyes are drawn to the parts of the pr2 that look different from the rest of the reticle. it could just be a matter of time behind it.
As somebody new to optics I would like to see the Pr2 reticle come to the 3.6-18x. It looks simpler to use and get used to than the other reticles available. If the reticle doesn't come to the scope soon i'll probably get one with the h59 for a large frame gas gun or look at something like the nx8 with the mil-xt from nightforce.
if i hadn't started with 10ths of a mil, using a mildot master and ballistic charts all in 0.1x formats, i might try it.
as it is, i have no desire switch to seeing halves and quarters, even if that is close enough for most shooting.
as it is, i have no desire switch to seeing halves and quarters, even if that is close enough for most shooting.
my personal perception is that because of the smaller size and wider fov, the 3.6-18x44 is well suited for all around duty , whereas the higher magnification models might be more useful in prs where the small fov is not a tactical hindrance and most targets are pretty far out there.
An Official Journal Of The NRA | U.S. Army Chooses Leupold’s Mark 5HD 3.6-18x44 mm Riflescope
The U.S. Army has selected the Leupold & Stevens Mark 5HD 3.6-18x44 mm riflescope for use on its M110 Semi-Automatic Sniper System.
That's a big reason I got into the Mark 5 5-25. The 7-35 is the same length, almost the same weight, and the FOV penalty is fairly small for the magnification jump
Glad they chose from an American based company! Would love to see that FDE option for civvies. Come on Leupold, put the PR2 in the 3.6-18.An Official Journal Of The NRA | U.S. Army Chooses Leupold’s Mark 5HD 3.6-18x44 mm Riflescope
The U.S. Army has selected the Leupold & Stevens Mark 5HD 3.6-18x44 mm riflescope for use on its M110 Semi-Automatic Sniper System.www.shootingillustrated.com
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