New Tract Toric 4.5-30x56

screaminweasil

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That looks nice

Yeah, not bad through the cell phone..............incredible in real life. I will say they exhibit heavier cromatic abberation that other scopes, but as long as you don't shoot at bright white targets (the only time I've noticed it in this model), for $850 from CameralandNY..........NOTHING comes close for the money. Not to mention perfect tracking and return to zero
 
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screaminweasil

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One more example of vingette..............

SWFA 3-9
Little to zero vingette.........


Bushnell LRTS 3-12x44 ............medium heavy vingette..........I no longer own the bushnell for this reason



Some people may not really notice this as an annoyance, until they shoot a scope that doesn't have any "tunnelling or vingette". Kind of like discovering Chromatic abberation.............curse
 

littlepod

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    Thanks, that looks like an improvement for sure from the 1" model Tracts i've owned......and no longer own.
    You have an Ares ETR? right? How does the vingette on that compare to the Toric you have? The ETR I have has no notable black ring, atleast not enough to "bug me"

    Thanks for your response.
    ETR has slightly less vignette or black around the glass. Worse turrets. Worse parallax and worse eye box. Better fov though.
     

    screaminweasil

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    ETR has slightly less vignette or black around the glass. Worse turrets. Worse parallax and worse eye box. Better fov though.
    Thanks....how bout that resolution on the ETR though....crazy good for a $890 scope.
    Just lacks a bit of contrast compared to the Cronus BTR and Steiner p4xi I have. But, resolution wise it hangs with both and mat have an edge in certain conditions.
    I prefer the turrets on the Cronus BTR, the parallax adjust as well.

    Thanks for the Tract info, sounds like a nice scope.
     

    littlepod

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    The ETR has one of the best resolutions I've seen. The only scope I have that beats the ETR is the Leica. I don't think the Tract has better resolution than the ETR, but it does have better low light than the ETR.
     

    screaminweasil

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    Yeah, the ETR is mind blowing for the money. Cronus BTR is an exceptional scope as well for $1299 from Camerlandny
     

    littlepod

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    Yeah, the ETR is mind blowing for the money. Cronus BTR is an exceptional scope as well for $1299 from Camerlandny
    Yeh I kept my 2 ETR's for a loooong time. I finally sold them both as I upgraded one ETR to a Razor AMG, and the other ETR to the Leica. Both costing wayyyyy more than the ETR.

    My biggest complaint for the ETR was the parallax was stiff and not forgiving. And the eyebox isn't that great.
     

    fcyle10

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    Yeh I kept my 2 ETR's for a loooong time. I finally sold them both as I upgraded one ETR to a Razor AMG, and the other ETR to the Leica. Both costing wayyyyy more than the ETR.

    My biggest complaint for the ETR was the parallax was stiff and not forgiving. And the eyebox isn't that great.
    Would you take the tract over a gen 2 razor? The amg has the weight advantage which you needed but what about similar weights. Which way would you go? I may order the tract tomorrow
     

    littlepod

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    Would you take the tract over a gen 2 razor? The amg has the weight advantage which you needed but what about similar weights. Which way would you go? I may order the tract tomorrow
    I personally haven't looked through a Gen 2 Razor. No one had one in my 4 day class. Do you know how it compares to the Razor HD AMG? I know it has more travel, more light gathering, but how about just resolution/clarity?

    I would take advantage of the 30 day return policy on the Tract and pick one of those up. If you don't like it, return it. This isn't the Tract, but this is the Leica vs the Razor HD AMG, and man the details pick up a lot more in the Leica.

    The color representation of the Tract is more like the Leica. Vortex seems to be more 'brown'.

    IMG_20200809_123855.jpg

    IMG_20200809_124056.jpg

    This was the Tract on a different day. The above photos are at 24x, this one is at 30x. But no mirage on this day so the image is a bit clearer. Hard to compare.

    MVIMG_20200606_114128_1 (1).jpg
     

    fcyle10

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    I personally haven't looked through a Gen 2 Razor. No one had one in my 4 day class. Do you know how it compares to the Razor HD AMG? I know it has more travel, more light gathering, but how about just resolution/clarity?

    I would take advantage of the 30 day return policy on the Tract and pick one of those up. If you don't like it, return it. This isn't the Tract, but this is the Leica vs the Razor HD AMG, and man the details pick up a lot more in the Leica.

    The color representation of the Tract is more like the Leica. Vortex seems to be more 'brown'.

    View attachment 7394905

    View attachment 7394908

    This was the Tract on a different day. The above photos are at 24x, this one is at 30x. But no mirage on this day so the image is a bit clearer. Hard to compare.

    View attachment 7394913
    I’ve had an amg, and have a 3-18 gen 2 razor. They look like the same glass to me. My friend has the 4.5-27 razor but I’ve never compared side by side. I will say I like my xtr3 more than his razor tho. It may just be the field of view and the more natural colors instead of the warm from the razor. I’m really worried about field of view and the “vignette” as y’all call it. I do not like the black ring while looking through scopes. I’ve never noticed it in the amg, razor, or my xtr3s. How does the toric compare to the amg with the black ring? Does it feel tunneled?
     

    fcyle10

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    I’ve had an amg, and have a 3-18 gen 2 razor. They look like the same glass to me. My friend has the 4.5-27 razor but I’ve never compared side by side. I will say I like my xtr3 more than his razor tho. It may just be the field of view and the more natural colors instead of the warm from the razor. I’m really worried about field of view and the “vignette” as y’all call it. I do not like the black ring while looking through scopes. I’ve never noticed it in the amg, razor, or my xtr3s. How does the toric compare to the amg with the black ring? Does it feel tunneled?
    The leica has my attention as well but I believe you said no zero stop on it which is a no go. I like Razors I just wanna try something different and not bronze lol. I’m just over it. Hopefully the tunneling isn’t bad because I’ll be sending it back
     

    littlepod

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    Leica has a zero stop. It doesn't have locking turrets. Razor AMG has one of the best no black ring around the scope. Tract is one of the worse.

    It doesn't bother me but it bothers some people.
     
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    fcyle10

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    Leica has a zero stop. It doesn't have locking turrets. Razor AMG has one of the best no black ring around the scope. Tract is one of the worse.

    It doesn't bother me but it bothers some people.
    That’s right it’s locking turrets. What in the design causes the black ring? The razor and tract are made in Japan by low correct? I wonder why they’re very different in that aspect
     

    screaminweasil

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    That’s right it’s locking turrets. What in the design causes the black ring? The razor and tract are made in Japan by low correct? I wonder why they’re very different in that aspect
    'I'd jump on the CameralandNY Athlon Cronus BTR $1299 deal. No "black ring" and I have a feeling the optics are better than the Tract. Based off the other Tracts I've owned, I've not been super impressed with their glass.

    And, the Cronus BTR comes in "black"..........since you don't want brown scopes. Otherwise, get an Athlon ETR for under $900 ..............if you can stand Brown. Seriously great values in the Athlons.........I've looked through a large number of scopes. The Athlons really punch well above their price range indicates.
     
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    littlepod

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    'I'd jump on the CameralandNY Athlon Cronus BTR $1299 deal. No "black ring" and I have a feeling the optics are better than the Tract. Based off the other Tracts I've owned, I've not been super impressed with their glass.

    And, the Cronus BTR comes in "black"..........since you don't want brown scopes. Otherwise, get an Athlon ETR for under $900 ..............if you can stand Brown. Seriously great values in the Athlons.........I've looked through a large number of scopes. The Athlons really punch well above their price range indicates.
    Tract, and Cronus are all made in the same factory by LOW. I think the Razor is also... anything made in Japan really comes from LOW. The Leica also uses the LOW body of the scope, but they source their own Leica european glass. Tract also uses different glass / different coatings.

    $1299 Cronus Deal is pretty good... though I haven't run a Cronus in heavy mirage days to really compare. If we're talking about the Cronus then I'd just save another $300 and just get an ETR.
     

    fcyle10

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    Tract, and Cronus are all made in the same factory by LOW. I think the Razor is also... anything made in Japan really comes from LOW. The Leica also uses the LOW body of the scope, but they source their own Leica european glass. Tract also uses different glass / different coatings.

    $1299 Cronus Deal is pretty good... though I haven't run a Cronus in heavy mirage days to really compare. If we're talking about the Cronus then I'd just save another $300 and just get an ETR.
    Any idea on where tract gets their glass from?
     

    screaminweasil

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    Tract, and Cronus are all made in the same factory by LOW. I think the Razor is also... anything made in Japan really comes from LOW. The Leica also uses the LOW body of the scope, but they source their own Leica european glass. Tract also uses different glass / different coatings.

    $1299 Cronus Deal is pretty good... though I haven't run a Cronus in heavy mirage days to really compare. If we're talking about the Cronus then I'd just save another $300 and just get an ETR.
    Two days ago I was shooting out to 835 yards with both a Steiner P4xi 4-16x56 on a Bergara Premier highlander 6.5 creed and my Athlon Cronus BTR 4.5-29x56 on a Bergara Premier Approach in 223 with 75gr HPBTs.......the Cronus on 22x was more clear amd cut through mirage better than the Steiner on 16x.....the Steiner glass is no Joke. ........

    Point is....the Cronus is an amazing optic for $1300
     

    fcyle10

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    Two days ago I was shooting out to 835 yards with both a Steiner P4xi 4-16x56 on a Bergara Premier highlander 6.5 creed and my Athlon Cronus BTR 4.5-29x56 on a Bergara Premier Approach in 223 with 75gr HPBTs.......the Cronus on 22x was more clear amd cut through mirage better than the Steiner on 16x.....the Steiner glass is no Joke. ........

    Point is....the Cronus is an amazing optic for $1300
    I’ve never really looked into athlon but I’ll do some research. Thanks
     
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    tjh011

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    'I'd jump on the CameralandNY Athlon Cronus BTR $1299 deal. No "black ring" and I have a feeling the optics are better than the Tract. Based off the other Tracts I've owned, I've not been super impressed with their glass.

    And, the Cronus BTR comes in "black"..........since you don't want brown scopes. Otherwise, get an Athlon ETR for under $900 ..............if you can stand Brown. Seriously great values in the Athlons.........I've looked through a large number of scopes. The Athlons really punch well above their price range indicates.
    Where can I find an ETR under $900? I haven't seen it that cheap.
     

    screaminweasil

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    Where can I find an ETR under $900? I haven't seen it that cheap.
     

    tydex21

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    That’s right it’s locking turrets. What in the design causes the black ring? The razor and tract are made in Japan by low correct? I wonder why they’re very different in that aspect
    The Razor AMG is made in the US almost completely. Not Japan.
     

    fcyle10

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    The Razor AMG is made in the US almost completely. Not Japan.
    I wasn’t talking about the AMG, I’ve had a AMG and gen2 razor. I know where each is made and the one I was comparing the tract with was the gen 2 razor .
     
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    celltech

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    Received my replacement ELR on Friday and took it out this morning working on load development. Had my other 6.5 with a PST II 5-25 as a comparison. The immediate thing I noticed was the eye relief and eye box. Wow...the Tract had a much longer relief and huge eye box compared to the Vortex...not even close. The Tract was also much brighter and detailed, as it should be. Zero stop is 100 times easier to set. This replacement has tighter turrets with 1/2 the slop of my first one...it's very acceptable now. Up to 25X the view is amazing and just slightly drops off when pushing it up to 30X. Still love how smooth everything is. I have to run a throw lever on the PST cause the zoom is so stupid tight...none of that crap needed on the ELR. For what it's worth I used low Vortex 34mm rings and they seem top notch.

    A real pleasure to use and I look forward to stretching it out at longer distances...

    IMG_20200814_175413.jpg
     

    screaminweasil

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    Received my replacement ELR on Friday and took it out this morning working on load development. Had my other 6.5 with a PST II 5-25 as a comparison. The immediate thing I noticed was the eye relief and eye box. Wow...the Tract had a much longer relief and huge eye box compared to the Vortex...not even close. The Tract was also much brighter and detailed, as it should be. Zero stop is 100 times easier to set. This replacement has tighter turrets with 1/2 the slop of my first one...it's very acceptable now. Up to 25X the view is amazing and just slightly drops off when pushing it up to 30X. Still love how smooth everything is. I have to run a throw lever on the PST cause the zoom is so stupid tight...none of that crap needed on the ELR. For what it's worth I used low Vortex 34mm rings and they seem top notch.

    A real pleasure to use and I look forward to stretching it out at longer distances...

    View attachment 7399536
    Sharp looking setup!!
     
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    littlepod

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    Received my replacement ELR on Friday and took it out this morning working on load development. Had my other 6.5 with a PST II 5-25 as a comparison. The immediate thing I noticed was the eye relief and eye box. Wow...the Tract had a much longer relief and huge eye box compared to the Vortex...not even close. The Tract was also much brighter and detailed, as it should be. Zero stop is 100 times easier to set. This replacement has tighter turrets with 1/2 the slop of my first one...it's very acceptable now. Up to 25X the view is amazing and just slightly drops off when pushing it up to 30X. Still love how smooth everything is. I have to run a throw lever on the PST cause the zoom is so stupid tight...none of that crap needed on the ELR. For what it's worth I used low Vortex 34mm rings and they seem top notch.

    A real pleasure to use and I look forward to stretching it out at longer distances...
    I'm glad you're liking it! Agree on the zoom ring. I got my Razor AMG and the first thing I did was go spend another $50 on their Switchview throw lever just to make it usable.

    I'm running ARC 28mm (1.1") on my Terminus Zeus to get it to clear the barrel. I don't think vortex low (.92") would work for me.

    20200606_006.jpg

    Though recently I scored a deal on the Leica PRS, so I'm now running that scope.
     

    beetroot

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    Received my replacement ELR on Friday and took it out this morning working on load development. Had my other 6.5 with a PST II 5-25 as a comparison. The immediate thing I noticed was the eye relief and eye box. Wow...the Tract had a much longer relief and huge eye box compared to the Vortex...not even close. The Tract was also much brighter and detailed, as it should be. Zero stop is 100 times easier to set. This replacement has tighter turrets with 1/2 the slop of my first one...it's very acceptable now. Up to 25X the view is amazing and just slightly drops off when pushing it up to 30X. Still love how smooth everything is. I have to run a throw lever on the PST cause the zoom is so stupid tight...none of that crap needed on the ELR. For what it's worth I used low Vortex 34mm rings and they seem top notch.

    A real pleasure to use and I look forward to stretching it out at longer distances...

    View attachment 7399536
    How did the FOV feel?
    The one thing the Tracts lack is a wide FOV, specs wise the PST G2 is notably better.
     

    littlepod

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    How did the FOV feel?
    The one thing the Tracts lack is a wide FOV, specs wise the PST G2 is notably better.
    Agree. Vortex's have a very large FoV but sacrifice glass quality. Tract has a small FoV, the smallest out of all my scopes. But glass quality is better than the Vortex's.

    At 30x ~ 100 yards

    Tract has 12.4mils of FoV ~ 3.7 feet
    Ares ETR has 13 mils of FoV ~ 3.9 feet
    Leica has 13mils of FoV ~ 3.9 feet

    Lowering it down to 24x ~ 100 yardsto compare

    Leica has 16 mils of FoV ~ 4.8 feet
    Razor AMG has 16.4mils of FoV ~ 4.92 feet.
     

    Eoddave27

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    Agree. Vortex's have a very large FoV but sacrifice glass quality. Tract has a small FoV, the smallest out of all my scopes. But glass quality is better than the Vortex's.

    At 30x ~ 100 yards

    Tract has 12.4mils of FoV ~ 3.7 feet
    Ares ETR has 13 mils of FoV ~ 3.9 feet
    Leica has 13mils of FoV ~ 3.9 feet

    Lowering it down to 24x ~ 100 yardsto compare

    Leica has 16 mils of FoV ~ 4.8 feet
    Razor AMG has 16.4mils of FoV ~ 4.92 feet.
    I really don’t think 2” difference in FOV at 100 yards is enough to really worry about. Looking at it from a practical standpoint those scopes numbers are all so close if you are scanning to transition targets at 12-15x there isn’t really enough of a difference to matter.
     

    littlepod

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    I really don’t think 2” difference in FOV at 100 yards is enough to really worry about. Looking at it from a practical standpoint those scopes numbers are all so close if you are scanning to transition targets at 12-15x there isn’t really enough of a difference to matter.
    Agree. I don't know that I've ever really thought about or complained about FoV in a practical sense in a match. The only thing I've complained about is eyebox, and finicky parallax. Tract does really well on those. My only reason I swapped from the Tract was I wanted #'s down the vertical of the reticle for faster holdovers.
     
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    fcyle10

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    Agree. I don't know that I've ever really thought about or complained about FoV in a practical sense in a match. The only thing I've complained about is eyebox, and finicky parallax. Tract does really well on those. My only reason I swapped from the Tract was I wanted #'s down the vertical of the reticle for faster holdovers.
    I just compared the tract to my xtr3 5.5-30 and my only complaint is parallax forgiveness. There’s a fence about 150yds away with a sign on it, both were blurry until the 100 yard mark on the parallax. Once I got to the 150-200 yard mark both were very clear but the Burris continues to be about the same 300 to infinity. If I adjusted the parallax past 250 on the tract it went blurry quick. The 100yd to 300 yd is maybe an 1/8th to a 1/4 turn on the tract. The xtr3 is much more spread out. I’m not sure if that makes a difference or not. Initial impression is the xtr3 and tract are so close in glass that I cannot tell which one I like better. Very similar colors as well. I do like the finer scr2 reticle on the Burris but the tract is not bad at all. The tree is there when you want it and disappears as you focus away from it. The tract tree is more obtrusive but is very manageable. Tract did a great job with the mag ring, diopter ring/adjustment, and parallax knob! Much easier to adjust compared to my xtr3 and gen 2 razor. The rubber on the diopter ring is a nice touch.
     
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    littlepod

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    I just compared the tract to my xtr3 5.5-30 and my only complaint is parallax forgiveness. There’s a fence about 150yds away with a sign on it, both were blurry until the 100 yard mark on the parallax. Once I got to the 150-200 yard mark both were very clear but the Burris continues to be about the same 300 to infinity. If I adjusted the parallax past 250 on the tract it went blurry quick. The 100yd to 300 yd is maybe an 1/8th to a 1/4 turn on the tract. The xtr3 is much more spread out. I’m not sure if that makes a difference or not. Initial impression is the xtr3 and tract are so close in glass that I cannot tell which one I like better. Very similar colors as well. I do like the finer scr2 reticle on the Burris but the tract is not bad at all. The tree is there when you want it and disappears as you focus away from it. The tract tree is more obtrusive but is very manageable. Tract did a great job with the mag ring, diopter ring/adjustment, and parallax knob! Much easier to adjust compared to my xtr3 and gen 2 razor. The rubber on the diopter ring is a nice touch.
    I like not having to run any sort of throw lever with the Tract. I wonder from a mechanical perspective why some mfgs make mag rings that are so tight! The Leica is smooth like the Tract, no need for a throw lever. Vortex's require one.
     

    fcyle10

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    I like not having to run any sort of throw lever with the Tract. I wonder from a mechanical perspective why some mfgs make mag rings that are so tight! The Leica is smooth like the Tract, no need for a throw lever. Vortex's require one.
    Yes its very smooth. Did you notice a touchy/finicky parallax compared to the Leica? Still thinking about picking one of those up
     

    littlepod

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    Yes its very smooth. Did you notice a touchy/finicky parallax compared to the Leica? Still thinking about picking one of those up
    I find the parallax smoothness on the Tract to be perfect as in there's no stickiness / give. For example on my Vortex it's a very easy to turn Parallax knob, but the initial force to move it is a very slight extra give. The tract it feels like has the exact same force always to move the Parallax.

    The Leica's parallax knob is pretty harder to turn and I wish it would be slightly easier to turn. In terms of finickiness, it's different on the Leica. Since the picture pops out so much more than the reticle, I find that the picture tends to almost always be sharp and clear in my eyes and I am adjusting the sharpness of the reticle #'s as I bring the parallax in place. Kind of hard to explain. But in general I find the picture in focus across a large range on the parallax knob.

    The downside though is there are only 3 #'s on the parallax knob... 20, 100, infinity.
     

    fcyle10

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    I find the parallax smoothness on the Tract to be perfect as in there's no stickiness / give. For example on my Vortex it's a very easy to turn Parallax knob, but the initial force to move it is a very slight extra give. The tract it feels like has the exact same force always to move the Parallax.

    The Leica's parallax knob is pretty harder to turn and I wish it would be slightly easier to turn. In terms of finickiness, it's different on the Leica. Since the picture pops out so much more than the reticle, I find that the picture tends to almost always be sharp and clear in my eyes and I am adjusting the sharpness of the reticle #'s as I bring the parallax in place. Kind of hard to explain. But in general I find the picture in focus across a large range on the parallax knob.

    The downside though is there are only 3 #'s on the parallax knob... 20, 100, infinity.
    Maybe I mean fov issues I’m not sure how to explain it. I really like the parallax knob on the tract. It’s the “finickyness” of always having to adjust it compared to the xtr3 and razor. I had it set on 150-200 yards while looking at the sign, I didn’t have much window of parallax before the sign started to get blurry compared to the xtr3. I could go from 150-infinity on the xtr3 looking at that same sign and still have a good picture. The tract was blurry from 300 on while looking at that same sign. As in forgiveness I mean how often the parallax would need to be adjusted while looking at different ranges of targets. The Leica seems like a great option, I’m really thinking about grabbing one and comparing. Then selling whichever I don’t keep. Maybe keep the tract/ Leica and sell the xtr3 lol.
     

    Eoddave27

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    Jan 9, 2018
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    Maybe I mean fov issues I’m not sure how to explain it. I really like the parallax knob on the tract. It’s the “finickyness” of always having to adjust it compared to the xtr3 and razor. I had it set on 150-200 yards while looking at the sign, I didn’t have much window of parallax before the sign started to get blurry compared to the xtr3. I could go from 150-infinity on the xtr3 looking at that same sign and still have a good picture. The tract was blurry from 300 on while looking at that same sign. As in forgiveness I mean how often the parallax would need to be adjusted while looking at different ranges of targets. The Leica seems like a great option, I’m really thinking about grabbing one and comparing. Then selling whichever I don’t keep. Maybe keep the tract/ Leica and sell the xtr3 lol.
    What magnification are you doing this on? I find my Tracts and the 4.5-30 Tract I have used to have very forgiving parallax in the mag range where I would need it. usually If I’m scanning for targets at different ranges without touching parallax I’m going to be at 12-15x max. Otherwise I’m going to be shooting at a single target and will have the parallax dialed for that range.
     

    fcyle10

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    What magnification are you doing this on? I find my Tracts and the 4.5-30 Tract I have used to have very forgiving parallax in the mag range where I would need it. usually If I’m scanning for targets at different ranges without touching parallax I’m going to be at 12-15x max. Otherwise I’m going to be shooting at a single target and will have the parallax dialed for that range.
    Both scopes at 10x
     

    WildBill3/75

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    May 21, 2012
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    I see some improper terminology getting thrown around.
    Just to inform some of you if you didn't know or want to understand what Vignetting is.

    Vignetting is a darkening of the image as you move from the center...a shadowing kind of effect.


    Looks like this.
     

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    Mausertech

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    Jun 17, 2020
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    Was going to order one this week but I’m too late to the party and they’re out of stock till mid December.
    Hope to see some in depth reviews on it by that time.
    Now I have an excuse to save more for a ZCO
     

    celltech

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    Jan 9, 2019
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    Had my Tract ELR out to 1000 yds in the 100 degree Texas sun on Friday. Other scopes I had to compare are PST G2 5-25 and Athlon TAC 6-24. I could see where people think the Tract has less FOV compared to other scopes, but I feel like it has better ability to actually fine focus on the target. My other scopes are just not as sharp as the Tract. It seemed like the parallax knob was more or less useless once you dialled up for 500 yards and further...everything was more or less as sharp as it was going to get through a wide range of adjustment. The Tract cut through the mirage and haze much better than anything else and the eyebox was far more forgiving. I still say it's best up to 25X and slightly degrades up to 30X. And once again, the controls are butter smooth.
     

    Mausertech

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    Jun 17, 2020
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    Anyone have the new toric & the Delta Stryker equivalent? They look to be the same scope more or less.
     

    littlepod

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  • Oct 16, 2012
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    I put one up in the PX. Bought two, one for myself and my shooting partner, but he decided to save the cash for a new rifle.
     
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