Public Camping Ban

[Alpine 338]

So what do you think, and yes there's already a post regarding the homeless, so let's not go down that rabbit hole.

Supreme Court Won't Hear Case On Ban Against Homeless Sleeping In Public Spaces

The denial upholds a lower court ruling that put severe limits on cities' ability to enforce anti-camping ordinances on streets and in public rights of way. Advocates for the homeless lauded the move.

www.npr.org

My little local resort town already bans public camping on city property and streets (and private property). They won't allow you to stay in your RV or Camper at the Walmart parking lot. However, they turn a blind-eye to the Semi-Trucks that park overnight at a turnout at the edge of town.
So how will this effect things? One of my friends who was a lawyer, but no longer practices says the city will no longer fight it if taken to court, but the people who are usually ticketed or arrested don't have the money to fight it in court. My other friend who is a Deputy Sheriff just starts going off on the unintended consequences of this all, trying to stay politicly correct.
And what about camping in your car? City regulations prohibit it, but between this latest round, and the SCOTUS previously ruling that your vehicle is an extension of your home, can it be enforced???

Where am I coming from? No I have no simpathy for the homeless, just hate over-reaching govt. that tries to control every aspect of your life, like sleeping in your car in the Walmart parking lot.

 

[atepointer]

Tampa passed a law on panhandlers in 2013 which was great. No more people standing in traffic backing up lights, glares for not handing money or outright crazy people yelling at cars. Then a federal judge ruled it a 1st Amendment infringement and they are back clogging up traffic everywhere. Now supposedly there is still a ban on 'aggressive panhandling' covering what I mentioned. Care to guess if that still goes on? I swear these liberal judges could confuse a push up if given the chance. Between texting at stoplights and panhandlers it's a miracle 2 cars per light cycle get through.

 

[W54/XM-388]

Where am I coming from? No I have no simpathy for the homeless, just hate over-reaching govt. that tries to control every aspect of your life, like sleeping in your car in the Walmart parking lot.

There is a very good public safety reason to not only let but actually ENCOURAGE drivers who tired or fatigued, pull over and get a couple hours rest before continuing. Some more enlightened places have it clearly defined in law that long distance over the road drivers or people on long trips are fully allowed to pull off to areas not causing any issues for traffic while on the public roads and get a bit of rest.

Laws against taking a rest in the car, Usually follow the same pattern, good citizens who pull over for some rest are probably the ones who will be ticked and fined because well they make easy money targets and those actually homeless types won't because well it costs the city money to deal with it.

When it comes to the Walmart parking lot, that seems like private property and maybe Walmart can decide what they let and don't let park there.
They may decide that if someone parks their RV there overnight, statistic show they may fill up and go shopping there and the commerce is worth it.
Or they can decide not to, up to them either way.

 

[Alpine 338]

Tampa passed a law on panhandlers in 2013 which was great. No more people standing in traffic backing up lights, glares for not handing money or outright crazy people yelling at cars. Then a federal judge ruled it a 1st Amendment infringement and they are back clogging up traffic everywhere. Now supposedly there is still a ban on 'aggressive panhandling' covering what I mentioned. Care to guess if that still goes on? I swear these liberal judges could confuse a push up if given the chance. Between texting at stoplights and panhandlers it's a miracle 2 cars per light cycle get through.

I have no problem with them standing there in the freezing rain holding a cardboard sign, but the second they start inpeeding traffic, they should be given a citation for inpeeding traffic, or causing a hazard to traffic, etc. Nothing to do with panhandling.

 

[Alpine 338]

There is a very good public safety reason to not only let but actually ENCOURAGE drivers who tired or fatigued, pull over and get a couple hours rest before continuing. Some more enlightened places have it clearly defined in law that long distance over the road drivers or people on long trips are fully allowed to pull off to areas not causing any issues for traffic while on the public roads and get a bit of rest.

Laws against taking a rest in the car, Usually follow the same pattern, good citizens who pull over for some rest are probably the ones who will be ticked and fined because well they make easy money targets and those actually homeless types won't because well it costs the city money to deal with it.

When it comes to the Walmart parking lot, that seems like private property and maybe Walmart can decide what they let and don't let park there.
They may decide that if someone parks their RV there overnight, statistic show they may fill up and go shopping there and the commerce is worth it.
Or they can decide not to, up to them either way.

It's not Walmart prohibiting overnight camping in their parking lot, it's a city ordinance.

 

[Mike Islander]

Most effective thing we did here in Charleston is make it an $800 fine to hand something out of a running car to someone on a public street. Probably not enforced, but well publicized and made it easy on the conscience of people who resent getting the shake down from public bums. "Sorry Man, I don't want to get a ticket. There's a shelter downtown. Good luck!"

 

[ditter]

Worse than the homeless in the streets begging for a buck are the little kids raising money for football games or cheerleading trips. I don't know, but sending your 11-year-old out into a major intersection with a football helmet collecting dollars seems like a bad idea. I'd assume your average 11-year old doesn't fare too well against a 3000-pound car.

 

[Alpine 338]

...or the Fire Dept stopping traffic to fill a boot with money for a fund raiser.

Ok, let's get back on track concerning Public Camping Bans.

 

[acudaowner]

Ah there young they still bounce a little , old bones break far to easily besides isn't that what children are for as you get older they do the work on the farm you are not capable of doing anymore free slave labor . If they pass in a colision with a car you can sue , get money , then have another one or two as back up . the whole you change there dipers so later they can return the favor and change yours . lol that and the fact that families used to be big because 80% of the kids would not live to make it to 9 years of age but that's a long long time ago .

 

[nn8734]

Las Vegas recently passed a ban on public (homeless) camping in city limits. Seeing whats happening in california and seattle is ridiculous so glad the mayor is trying to prevent that shit from happening here.

Of course, as soon as it went into force, some POS “social justice warrior” was threatening to hold protests and block freeways. Lol.

 

[W54/XM-388]

Most effective thing we did here in Charleston is make it an $800 fine to hand something out of a running car to someone on a public street. Probably not enforced, but well publicized and made it easy on the conscience of people who resent getting the shake down from public bums. "Sorry Man, I don't want to get a ticket. There's a shelter downtown. Good luck!"

So fleece the productive citizens instead of just going after the panhandling bums you didn't like?

Oh let me guess... it's way too hard to actually go after your own bums, but who could resist really ass pounding some productive citizen who probably thought they were just being charitable.... Of course there are lots of folks who think that's of course the way to do things.
Might as well continue the tradition of using the police to shake down the productive members of society so the politicians can give it to the least productive.

Sounds like exactly the way the government runs law most of the time and why good will towards those doing the "enforcing" is becoming an endangered species.

 

[W54/XM-388]

It's not Walmart prohibiting overnight camping in their parking lot, it's a city ordinance.

So shouldn't it be Walmart's call on that then, since it's their property that they pay taxes on?

 

[Alpine 338]

So shouldn't it be Walmart's call on that then, since it's their property that they pay taxes on?

I agree 100%, however it's the cities ordanance. The County passed an ordanance that says we can't have short term rentals (30-days or less), so I can't legally do nightly rentals via Air BNB, Zillow, etc., Even though it's my property. They are having a hard time enforcing that ordanance.

 

[MtnCreek]

It was never Wal-Mart's call on what to do on the property. They had to ask permission to build a Wal-Mart. They had to submit their building plans for approval, most likely several submissions for review. They probably had to upgrade some City owned infrastructure as a condition of approval. They had to pay the City for this 'service'. They continue to pay the City so that the City will allow them to continue to operate a Wal-Mart there.

 

[Jgunner]

So fleece the productive citizens instead of just going after the panhandling bums you didn't like?

Oh let me guess... it's way too hard to actually go after your own bums, but who could resist really ass pounding some productive citizen who probably thought they were just being charitable.... Of course there are lots of folks who think that's of course the way to do things.
Might as well continue the tradition of using the police to shake down the productive members of society so the politicians can give it to the least productive.

Sounds like exactly the way the government runs law most of the time and why good will towards those doing the "enforcing" is becoming an endangered species.

Cause ticketing someone with no traceable income and no property is nothing but a “guess we get to lock up the bum and give them 3 hot meals a day and a place to shit/shower/sleep”.

its the charitable cunts fault. I give nothing, to anyone, unless I know them personally and then i give it to em secretly.

 

[Alpine 338]

Govt Overreach.

 

[W54/XM-388]

I agree 100%, however it's the cities ordanance. The County passed an ordanance that says we can't have short term rentals (30-days or less), so I can't legally do nightly rentals via Air BNB, Zillow, etc., Even though it's my property. They are having a hard time enforcing that ordanance.

And the cities did that probably because the Technocrats that run those big "internet" "gig economy" companies were cutting the cities out of their cut. And probably the local hotel/motel lobby didn't like competition so they went whining to the government to get involved with what folks could do with their houses.

 

[Mike Islander]

So fleece the productive citizens instead of just going after the panhandling bums you didn't like?

Oh let me guess... it's way too hard to actually go after your own bums, but who could resist really ass pounding some productive citizen who probably thought they were just being charitable.... Of course there are lots of folks who think that's of course the way to do things.
Might as well continue the tradition of using the police to shake down the productive members of society so the politicians can give it to the least productive.

Sounds like exactly the way the government runs law most of the time and why good will towards those doing the "enforcing" is becoming an endangered species.

No citizens were actually harmed in this post. They don't enforce it. As I said, it gives people an excuse to say no to bums. Worked like a charm and not a single ticket issued that I ever heard of or can find in any news article. Within a few months the street corners and intersections were clear. Bums heard about it and moved TF on.

 

[smoooth1]

I agree 100%, however it's the cities ordanance. The County passed an ordanance that says we can't have short term rentals (30-days or less), so I can't legally do nightly rentals via Air BNB, Zillow, etc., Even though it's my property. They are having a hard time enforcing that ordanance.

Sooooo, no motels / hotels in your "city" any longer either?

We have no one to blame but ourselves. This shit started at the bottom, decayed, and has floated to the top

 

[Alpine 338]

Sooooo, no motels / hotels in your "city" any longer either?

We have no one to blame but ourselves. This shit started at the bottom, decayed, and has floated to the top

Hotels/Motels are jam packed full all the time, especially during tourist season. And they're building more.

I think it was the Hotel Lobby and Chamber of Commerce who advocated and pushed the city to enact the public camping ban (read no camping in your RV at Walmart).

The short term rental thing was a result of neighbors complaining about renters partying all night, disturbing behavior, illegal parking, etc. So instead of dealing directly with the problem (renters who cause the problems), they enacted the short term rental ordanance. Again Govt. Overreach.

 

[TheGerman]

GBPSE

Thing is if they made it legal to set up anywhere that wasn't privately owned, where does it stop,a nd by default, you now have anyone paying taxes basically paying for homeless housing.

Technically, they could then set up camp infront of your door on the sidewalk and it would be completely legal.

Fuck all that.

 

[Alpine 338]

GBPSE

Thing is if they made it legal to set up anywhere that wasn't privately owned, where does it stop, and by default, you now have anyone paying taxes basically paying for homeless housing.

Technically, they could then set up camp infront of your door on the sidewalk and it would be completely legal.

Fuck all that.

And that's the problem they're having in San Francisco, Seattle, etc. But to stop people from camping in the Walmart parking lot (which Walmart welcomes), camping on your own property, etc is Govt. Overreach. And saying you can't rent your own home or apartment is downright Communist.

 

[Hobo Hilton]

This is a very "Timely" post... I traveled as a Union Pipefitter / Welder all over America with a new model RV. We have dealt with this issue for the past 25 years. Many of the Boom Towns where our jobs were had no RV parks. We have stayed at State and County Campgrounds, Rest stops, parked in a friends drive way, on some job sites. San Onofre Nuke (SO Cal) had an RV park next to the plant. Today the cross country Pipeliner's have the same issues. Early on, some entire counties prohibited camping anywhere but an approved RV park. I'm not sure what the answer is. What I can say is that it has reached the point where the "Rich" are paying for the "Poor" to camp. Tax payers, businesses, tourist, Fed's, etc are all throwing money at the problem. Unfortunately there are people, public and private sector, making a very nice living off of the so called "Homeless"...

Here is Portland, OR answer...

Thanks for the discussion.

Hobo

Joint Office of Homeless Services

The Joint Office of Homeless Services oversees the delivery of services to people experiencing homelessness in Multnomah County.

multco.us

 

[Alpine 338]

Here's the problem, if people are camping on the sidewalks, blocking entry to business, etc. Arrest them, cite them, remove them for a number of rules and regulations, but to do nothing but ban public camping, is where Govt has over reacted. Now if I were to go into town, block pedestrian movement on the sidewalks, block entrances to businesses, etc., without camping or being homeless, I would be arrested. Why can't they directly address the problem without creating more useless laws?

 

[smoooth1]

Here's the problem, if people are camping on the sidewalks, blocking entry to business, etc. Arrest them, cite them, remove them for a number of rules and regulations, but to do nothing but ban public camping, is where Govt has over reacted. Now if I were to go into town, block pedestrian movement on the sidewalks, block entrances to businesses, etc., without camping or being homeless, I would be arrested. Why can't they directly address the problem without creating more useless laws?

Because creating useless laws is what they believe "job creation" is, as well as a mind fuck justification for their own "job" of knowing what is best for everyone else. It's really quite childish and selfish when you think about it...…

 

[Mike Casselton]

Worse than the homeless in the streets begging for a buck are the little kids raising money for football games or cheerleading trips. I don't know, but sending your 11-year-old out into a major intersection with a football helmet collecting dollars seems like a bad idea. I'd assume your average 11-year old doesn't fare too well against a 3000-pound car.

You must have been driving west bound on Kennedy Blvd at about 12:30 yesterday too.
Fucking people need to teach the kids to earn their money and not beg for it.

Rebecca and I live in a good neighborhood with A rated schools.
A $200k house is few and far between around here.
In fact there are many homes that break the $1M mark.
Every weekend, there are local kids in front of Publix begging for money to play sports or some other purpose.
When they ask me to donate, I tell them I have five kids to support and if they want money they should work for it and earn it instead of begging.
I also make it a point that I say it loud enough for their parents and coaches to hear me.

I get a lot of dirty looks.