Gunsmithing regarding cleaning rod rotation inside a barrel

Helix

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May 22, 2009
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Hey guys, sorry I'm bit of a newbie but I just had a quick question regarding how a cleaning rod acts whilst being pushed inside the bore. I have noticed with my only rifle (a .22-250) that when I run patches (pre-cut tetra-gun .22 cleaning strips) down the bore on a spear tipped jag, the rod does not spin. I assumed that the rod would spin with the rifling whilst in the bore. The handle on the rod does spin freely as it should, however it doesn't turn at all while being pushed down the bore. I tried using another rod and it only managed a mere single 360 degree revolution despite being run from the chamber all the way through to the muzzle. Is this normal or could I be potentially damaging the lands?

Kind Regards,

Simon
 

Niles Coyote

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  • Aug 13, 2007
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    Re: regarding cleaning rod rotation inside a barrel

    It could be the patch is just not tight enough to give you a twist. Also are you using a jag or a slotted tip?
     

    Badshot308

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    Re: regarding cleaning rod rotation inside a barrel

    As Niles said the patch might not be tight enough to be engaging in the rifling. Try a slightly thicker or larger patch. Check to make sure your jag isn't trying to unscrew itself in the barrel. If the patch slips past the rifling it really shouldn't hurt a thing. Are you using a bore guide to keep the rod centered in the barrel?
     

    thatguy

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    Feb 18, 2009
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    Re: regarding cleaning rod rotation inside a barrel

    ok, lets think about some things for a minute... simple common sense, really. your bullet is coated with what? copper right? and copper is harder than what? your patches right? if anything was gonna hurt than lands it would be your bullet, right? sorry if i sound like a dick, but i had to do it.
     

    Victor N TN

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    Feb 16, 2002
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    Re: regarding cleaning rod rotation inside a barrel

    Have you tried a bore brush? You can even use the black nylon.
     

    Helix

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    May 22, 2009
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    Re: regarding cleaning rod rotation inside a barrel

    I asked the guys at the SSAA, a major sporting shooters association in Australia and a young guy there said it's normal and i shouldn't be concerned at all. The jag i'm using is a Tetra gun Spear shaped jag, i find them a little more simple than the loop shaped ones that I have as you can puncture them simply through the patches and feed them up the bore. The patches, as I mentioned earlier are tetra gun pre-cut ones made for .22 cal. Whilst I'm sure a bullet would probably do far more damage I have read so much about things ruining the lands. I'm a youngster who's just inherited his first rifle from his dad. a Winchester S70 heavy varmint, which is currently shooting slightly better than an MOA (even with my poor shooting). I'm very keen to keep it in good shape. Admittedly, since obtaining it I have been obsesing over treating it constantly, especially when it comes to a cleaning regime. But as I mentioned, I would hate to be trying to treat it appropriately and finding my hard work is actually ruining the bore. I understand that even if I'm not screwing the lands, I'm failing to reach fouling that's accumulting within the rifling, but like I said.. for an amateur where the rod isn't even twisting in the slightest while im feeding patches, it's creating some concern.
     

    Helix

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    May 22, 2009
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    Re: regarding cleaning rod rotation inside a barrel

    Oh and I should probably also mention that yes after a few feeds down the bore, whilst the rod isn't moving, I am finding that the jag needs a bit of 'screwing back on' so to speak, so something is definitely twisting. And in response to 'thatguys' post, feel free to sound like a dick, I'm glad to be getting some advice! So thankyou! I've been around firearms my whole life but it's only now that I have the responsibility of my own and I have the duty of taking due care of a great family heirloom that I'd love to keep in the great condition that it is. Out here in Australia, surprisingly, we don't have too many people who appreciate the art of a great firearm.
     

    Greg Langelius *

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    Aug 10, 2001
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    Re: regarding cleaning rod rotation inside a barrel

    Rod guide, right sized rod, patch, and jag; whatever happens is very, very likely just fine.

    Please note that the rod guides have varying sized exit diameters that should pretty closely match the rod diameter (a .22 caliber rod in a .30 caliber bore guide is not such a hot idea). Slop there equates to slop in the bore, and that's probably the main cause of cleaning rod bore damage.

    Beyond that, it's not really anything like rocket science, except, don't be tempted to use oversized patches. Get one jammed, and things could get dicey.

    Greg
     

    Helix

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    May 22, 2009
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    Re: regarding cleaning rod rotation inside a barrel

    heh.. I'm using a gunslick univeral bore guide (http://http://www.gunslick.com/products/accessories/cleaning_rods.aspx) not ideal I know, but surely it is better thanh nothing, right? It was all my local gunshop has (we don't have too many of them out here), and everyone I have spoken to doesn't even bother with them, my father doesn't even know what a bore guide is, I have only discovered it through my own research through forums such as this.
     

    FNuser

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    Apr 6, 2009
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    Re: regarding cleaning rod rotation inside a barrel

    Be careful not to go too tight on the patch, I've come closer to damaging a rifle trying to remove stuff that was too tight then anytime else. Let the solvent do the work. It sounds like everything is ok to me your twist is prob @1-10 give or take a few inches so I wouldn't expect a tip to have more than 2 or so revolutions per trip.
     

    bigwheeler

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    Oct 18, 2008
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    Re: regarding cleaning rod rotation inside a barrel

    I think Badshot308 nailed it. The jag is unscrewing. Any rifling is going to spin an
    even poor fitting patch on a jag providing the jag is the right caliber.
     

    Badshot308

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    Apr 16, 2008
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    Re: regarding cleaning rod rotation inside a barrel

    I should have mentioned that if you use a larger or thicker patch,don't force it into the bore. As others have said,you can do a lot of damage if you get a jag and patch jammed in a barrel. I experiment with different patches and jags until I get a snug fit but that's not without risks. A good bore guide is the Lucas guide http://www.6mmbr.com/catalog/item/1433308/954882.htm which is custom made to your rifle. Are you using a one piece rod or a multi-piece rod? There's a lot of discussion in these forums regarding various cleaning techniques and equipment,but one thing most people agree on is that keeping the cleaning rod centered in the bore and not bowing or striking the throat area is very important to maintaining accuracy.
     

    Badshot308

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    Re: regarding cleaning rod rotation inside a barrel

    You definately want to keep that centered in the bore. I'll use stainless rods in conjunction with aluminum jags or nylon brushes when using a strong copper solvent such as Sweets 762. For most cleaning I use the coated Dewey rods. Read the threads on bore cleaning and you'll see that many shooters here feel that excessive cleaning does more damage than not. Modern ammo isn't corrosive so until you see accuracy start to fall off or plan to store the rifle for an extended period time,it isn't necessary to clean constantly. I haven't cleaned my AR15 since last year and it still runs fine and accuracy hasn't fallen off yet. Read the threads and you'll see wildly varying opinions on the subject.
     

    Helix

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    May 22, 2009
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    Re: regarding cleaning rod rotation inside a barrel

    I did do exactly that once, Greengo. Tried to us larger patches and got it caught a few inches into the bore. Had to gently push a rod through from the muzzle end, I was a little scared about that!
     

    teambarlar

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    May 14, 2009
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    Re: regarding cleaning rod rotation inside a barrel

    definitely use quality cleaning gear if you want to preserve that heirloom.is it coming clean,hopefully you have a bore light to inspect the bore.i always take a peek before and after a cleaning.and really it depends on the firearm that i am cleaning at the time as to how nitpicky i get.man if you want to see extreme watch a benchrest shooter.it is almost obsessive .
     

    Helix

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    May 22, 2009
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    Re: regarding cleaning rod rotation inside a barrel

    It appears really clean when I look down the bore and it's still shooting great groups! I gather that there's not much risk of damage through a cleaning rod that's not spinning 14 (or however many times the rifling twists) down the bore, right? I haveb't fired it since I had to push that patch back out with a cleaning rod from the muzzle end though. It was only once and I made sure I was very careful!
     

    Clark

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    Re: regarding cleaning rod rotation inside a barrel

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    I find that the Dewey cleaning rods have the lowest friction thrust bearings.

    When a cleaning rod does not want to turn, I push is with my finger tips grasping the rod like one grasps a fencing sword handle. I then twist as I push. It is usually right hand riflings, so clockwise push, counter clockwise pull.