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Gunsmithing  Remington 700 DBM opinions from guys that put them in.....and use them.

pmclaine

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    Lots of options out there. Lots of opinions.

    Figured Id ask here amongst the people that install them in hopes of finding out what is preferred as far as ease of fitting and just plain works for the customer.

    My build is going to be a wood stocked R700 in .308.

    Kind of an M40esque heavy barrel with a detachable box and tiger striped walnut.

    1576870642703.png


    Screwing up and impulse buying wood is leading me into an expensive project.

    I dont have a lot of room like a McMillan stocked rifle might offer so Im thinking an option using the standard R700 BDL inlet may be the way to go.

    I like the idea of the mag release being in the trigger guard.

    Ive come to the opinion this PTG product might be my way to go.....

    1576870389604.png



    Im assuming this uses single column magazines.

    I like the idea of staggered but that probably goes against my desire to remain inside the existing BDL inlet.

    Any help with my decision making is appreciated - either installation issues or end user problems.

    Thank you.
     

    CHADPEZZLE

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    That particular one you linked won't fit into the factory BDL inlet. Most bottom metals that say M5 will use the Badger M5 inlet which is larger than the factory BDL inlet.

    Maybe something like the Wyatt's bottom metal if you want to retain the factory BDL inlet. I've never seen or used one, so I can't recommend it one way or the other.

     

    pmclaine

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    I see Wyatts has an inside the guard release and looks good. Kind of has a DD Ross look to the trigger guard.

    There is room to widen the inlet so "drop in" is not critical. Quality install because of using a part with good QC and good function once built matter most.

    The rifle is not intended for hunting.

    I shoot paper and take a yearly PSR class at Sig Sauer.

    I own other bolts but non have DBM they are all BDL style.

    This is going to be an expirement....

    Nice wood

    Wichita swivels Accu Shot 2 inch bipod rail

    5 digit R700 cut for DD Ross lugged scope rail

    DD Ross heavy M40A3 700 lug

    Kreiger 5R, cro/moly, 1/8 finished at 18 inches, likely to have an MTU (perhaps lighter, maybe heavier) once I figure how much wood I need to leave in the forearm.

    Park the B/R, Hot blue the bolt

    Glass will be an S&B 5-25/Spuhr because it is sitting unused in my safe.

    and it will need a high rise Triad Stock pack which will cover most of that beautiful linseed oiled tiger walnut.

    Doesnt make sense does it?

    But it must be built because ----- It is there.
     
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    pmclaine

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    Stockys gives a good write up on that Wyatt DBM.

    I like that the PTG product is anodized vs coated.

    How about magazine availability.

    PTG will take AI. I expect AI will be around awhile.

    Are Wyatt mags one offs that become unobtanium if Wyatt goes tits up?
     

    rth1800

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    I have used two for most apps.
    My favorite is the old Surgeon with the corner tab releases.
    Today I mostly utilize the Badger which works fine but has a bit more obtrusive lever release.
    I once had some rifles with HS DBM's and they used proprietary mags which was a mess even when you could find them.
     
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    LoanHarvey

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    I believe the Accurate Mag has a drop in fit. Currently out of stock, but something to think about.
     

    pmclaine

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    I have used two for most apps.
    My favorite is the old Surgeon with the corner tab releases.
    Today I mostly utilize the Badger which works fine but has a bit more obtrusive lever release.
    I once had some rifles with HS DBM's and they used proprietary mags which was a mess even when you could find them.


    The current Surgeon offering looks pretty solid but Im looking for flush mount forward of the trigger guard.

    Your concerns with mags is noted and I think it may benefit me to stick with something that uses AI - Id like two 5 rounders and one 10.
     

    pmclaine

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    I believe the Accurate Mag has a drop in fit. Currently out of stock, but something to think about.


    Thats a good looking metal.

    My idea right now is an inside the trigger guard mag release but the paddle isnt a deal killer and truth be told probably makes more sense for my static style of shooting - I just like the cleaner in the trigger button for looks only.

    Guessing Accurate mags are AI pattern as it seems the PTG offering can use either.

    Sorry I know nothing about mag types for bolt actions.
     
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    AMGtuned

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    Tagging in @pmclaine because I think you build neat rifles.

    My only input: I like the wood look you have also. Have you considered the KMW loggerhead hardware; in order to retain the wood, and have adjustable comb height? Just a thought. Also, prior to switching to the CDI bm I have in my 2 700's, I used the magpul hunter. I know its plastic fantastic, but it can be painted, and required only minor fitment in both my LA, and SA platforms. Mag release incorporated into trigger guard as well. Looking forward to the final assembly, and I'm sure some groups from your SMK loadings. ?
     

    pmclaine

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    Tagging in @pmclaine because I think you build neat rifles.

    My only input: I like the wood look you have also. Have you considered the KMW loggerhead hardware; in order to retain the wood, and have adjustable comb height? Just a thought. Also, prior to switching to the CDI bm I have in my 2 700's, I used the magpul hunter. I know its plastic fantastic, but it can be painted, and required only minor fitment in both my LA, and SA platforms. Mag release incorporated into trigger guard as well. Looking forward to the final assembly, and I'm sure some groups from your SMK loadings. ?

    Most of my rifles have horrible ergonomics mitigated by the good designs of Steve @Triad

    The scope I'm gonna use on this is RAL 8000 coated and a Coyote stock pack and Coyote TIS sling will give the whole thing a great color contrast between the wood, parked B/R and cold blued bolt.

    Im going to use linseed oil so the stock will darken as it cures but it should still show the striping. In 50 years it should mellow to the sweet tobacco brown color of my 03s.

    I talked to Dan Ross today as I want to build it with one of his scope rails but he only sells the rail with an install.

    Im hoping to have @LongRifles Inc. build this thing because I think his machines will be best at cutting the wood for the B/R.

    Unsure if he will be interested but by calling him into the conversation perhaps I'll get his input. I've been wanting him to build something for awhile but it just hasn't worked timing wise on my end.

    Mark Williams at Raven Rifles, @Raven 6 , built my other M40esque guns but he is in a limited production semi retirement. He deserves his time I don't want to bust his balls whining about my build.
     
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    mcfred

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    I don't believe PTG includes the pillars with their BMs, or even provide the pillar dimensions their product's designed to work with. You might have to either make some yourself or figure out if they're offered elsewhere. Without proper pillar heights you're asking for feeding issues. I've made my own and function tested everything before epoxying everything into the stock.

    Also, my experience with the PTG BMs the anodize is "Type II" not "type III" that's thicker. Type III is less likely to dye the vibrant colors you typically see aluminum take. So while it's coated, it's just 6061 aluminum (relatively soft alloy compared to others in common use e.g. 7075) the coating's pretty thin and won't withstand a lot of abuse.

    Not ripping on PTG just laying out my experience. They work, you just have to put in a little more effort for the discounted price.

    I have no experience with Wyatt's but they were around in 2011 when I was looking for a BM that maximized the OAL of a Rem SA footprint. They might go bankrupt someday but they've managed to hang around a while in the meantime.

    I go for AI double-stack, center-feed designs as they're produced by at least 4 companies (AI, Accurate-mag, MDT, Ruger, Alpha Ind. etc.) and support .223 Rem to .300 WSM cartridges. Curtis Customs (?) offers a flush 3-round mag too if you need a flat bottom.
     

    Millron

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    Hs precision makes one that fits a BdL inlet, if your wanting something that is flush fit. It however doesnt allow alot of flexibility regarding catridge length. If my memory is correct you are limited to 2.86, just like a regular internal box mag.
     

    pmclaine

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    I don't believe PTG includes the pillars with their BMs, or even provide the pillar dimensions their product's designed to work with. You might have to either make some yourself or figure out if they're offered elsewhere. Without proper pillar heights you're asking for feeding issues. I've made my own and function tested everything before epoxying everything into the stock.

    Also, my experience with the PTG BMs the anodize is "Type II" not "type III" that's thicker. Type III is less likely to dye the vibrant colors you typically see aluminum take. So while it's coated, it's just 6061 aluminum (relatively soft alloy compared to others in common use e.g. 7075) the coating's pretty thin and won't withstand a lot of abuse.

    Not ripping on PTG just laying out my experience. They work, you just have to put in a little more effort for the discounted price.

    I have no experience with Wyatt's but they were around in 2011 when I was looking for a BM that maximized the OAL of a Rem SA footprint. They might go bankrupt someday but they've managed to hang around a while in the meantime.

    I go for AI double-stack, center-feed designs as they're produced by at least 4 companies (AI, Accurate-mag, MDT, Ruger, Alpha Ind. etc.) and support .223 Rem to .300 WSM cartridges. Curtis Customs (?) offers a flush 3-round mag too if you need a flat bottom.

    That Curtis metal is good looking and gives me the ease of a paddle with the clean look I seek. Thank you for the direction.

    I hear hit/miss reports on PTG. Your points are noted regards how they meet their price point.

    For classes I shoot FGMM 175 because it takes any of my reloading sloppiness out of the equation.

    My current 175 reload for my M40A1 is my longest production at 2.878 COAL. At that length I only load 3 in the mag to avoid problems.

    All my other .308s are shorter COAL.
     

    pmclaine

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    Hs precision makes one that fits a BdL inlet, if your wanting something that is flush fit. It however doesnt allow alot of flexibility regarding catridge length. If my memory is correct you are limited to 2.86, just like a regular internal box mag.

    HS precisión looks like a great product also.

    I like that it's steel.

    The proprietary mags scare me though.

    Looks like they have already revised once.
     
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    Deleted member 113831

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    Whichever one you choose, the M5 inlet is VERY minimally larger than the standard BDL. M5 is the default standard pattern. You can also be reasonably sure that any standard AICS pattern mags will work with it.
     
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    pmclaine

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    Whichever one you choose, the M5 inlet is VERY minimally larger than the standard BDL. M5 is the default standard pattern. You can also be reasonably sure that any standard AICS pattern mags will work with it.

    Im feeling AI pattern mags are where I want to go.

    Anyone know of a flush M5 inlet, perhaps made of steel.
     
    D

    Deleted member 113831

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    Both Badger Ordnance and Pacific Tool & Gauge make flush fit. I am unaware of any steel version.
     

    jetmd

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    pmclaine, aren't you from the Great state of MO?

    You could support a local MO business by using a Badger Ordnance kit.

    And Marty is a Great guy and gives generously to support the shooting community and our Service personnel.

    Chet
     

    pmclaine

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    pmclaine, aren't you from the Great state of MO?

    You could support a local MO business by using a Badger Ordnance kit.

    And Marty is a Great guy and gives generously to support the shooting community and our Service personnel.

    Chet


    I own a few Badger items to include M40A3 rings, M40 repro rings/base and favorite of all a NOS M49 scope Marty scored for a bunch of us over a www.m40rifles.com. It was a great experience unwrapping a new scope from its anti corrosion foil wrap. Lightened my range pack big time.

    I want a lug DD Ross lugged scope base but the fact Dan wants to do the install may have me going Badger or Twomanattack for that item. I'm sure Dan would do a great job but I want one builder to do the whole thing, not build by consensus.

    The Badger M5 is a great product with USMC pedigree. Just trying to avoid the paddle if I can but might end up going that way anyhow if that is the best metal to use.

    Im guessing the CADD of the inlet required is readily available, a standard.

    PS I'm from MA not MO. Big difference one letter makes........
     

    powdahound76

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    @pmclaine

    call @LongRifles Inc.

    they can run you through them.
    they make one now IIRC that looks like a BDL and have a mag to make it flush if you want too.

    In case you missed it, they do some wild-ass guessing, second rate inletting of stocks for actions and /or DBM......
    they can even make a wood stock (see old SHC rifle with a T4 style stock out of walnut like yours).

    Having an idea of your preferences (I see the quality and classic stuff you like) I think their new DBM could be it for you.

    Plus they have great CS and comms, fast turn around, and affordable prices.
     
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    pmclaine

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    @pmclaine

    call @LongRifles Inc.

    they can run you through them.
    they make one now IIRC that looks like a BDL and have a mag to make it flush if you want too.

    In case you missed it, they do some wild-ass guessing, second rate inletting of stocks for actions and /or DBM......
    they can even make a wood stock (see old SHC rifle with a T4 style stock out of walnut like yours).

    Having an idea of your preferences (I see the quality and classic stuff you like) I think their new DBM could be it for you.

    Plus they have great CS and comms, fast turn around, and affordable prices.


    Didn't realize Chad was making DBM but as noted above I'd like to see about having them do the build.

    The stock that caused this frenzy is really nothing special.

    Someone asked about where to get an M40 stock and I said check EBay.

    Well I checked Ebay and ended up buying that stock for $140.

    $140 will end up being the cheapest part of this whole mess.

    Im working on installing a Remington 16601 buttplate now. I have a set of Wichita M40A1 style swivels and I'm going to have a BT 2 inch rail section to run an Atlas up front.

    Ben checking out LRIs pricing to figure cost of build, Bedding/pillars could be the big nut. Going back there now to see if I missed the DBM he sells.
     
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    powdahound76

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    You may have to call. i remember seeing it though. Certain of that.

    and then I knew if I was building a rifle, especially a wood stocked hunter, the DBM would be like that I saw.

    This is what you get for “saving” money....?
     

    pmclaine

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    Yep the LRI DBM looks great. Inside the guard mag release and guy that builds the metal should be able to do the inlet in the wood......That would be a no brainer choice if they will do the entire build.
     

    powdahound76

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    They will.......

    Hopefully in a thread on here with a million pics!!

    just looked at their site. Could do the 1:1 CNC inlet without the bedding to save a little $. A little few hundred $..... Of course its an LRI build, so their bedding kinda needs to be part of it.
    That wood would look awesome unbedded, perfect inlet, all oiled to perfection though.

    BA in a nice deep blueing would set it off!
    Old school......
     
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    pmclaine

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    You may have to call. i remember seeing it though. Certain of that.

    and then I knew if I was building a rifle, especially a wood stocked hunter, the DBM would be like that I saw.

    This is what you get for “saving” money....?


    It wasn't about saving money......it was about helping somebody.

    Neat thing is I think the God of Riflery wants me to buy rifles.

    Job just signed a new contract with the state and two years of retro will put some unexpected cash in my pocket.
     

    pmclaine

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    Just read the Left Hand Gain Twist thread maybe I want a Bartlein from 1:11.25 to 1:7.
     

    pmclaine

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    Been working on my stock for a week or so now. It came with a generic flat plastic Butt Plate. I want a Remington 16601 that was on the M40 series of rifles.....

    1577023965790.png


    So it started like this...

    1577023777928.png


    I bought a 16601 and by gluing sandpaper to the back of it and short stroking back and forth I built a curve into the stock. Note to self: next time use a coping saw and make a gross rough cut.....I really spent a lot of time stroking it.

    1577024009990.png


    Had to fill in the old screw bores with some walnut....

    1577024072191.png


    Bought some scrapers and using candle black Im removing material one atom at a time to get the plate to fit. Its getting close. Nice thing is Ill have a lot of aluminum to remove so the end result should be pretty smooth....

    1577024195321.png


    I plan on bedding with JB Weld to hide any of my errors. Did a test batch yesterday.........

    1577024269860.png


    The "product" still feels kind of rubbery today. Maybe the black dye is affecting cure. Perhaps those of you familiar with JB Weld have suggestions such as use slightly more than half on the hardener. I used the toe of the old butt plate to test if neutral kiwi shoe wax would be a good release agent and it looks like it will be.......

    1577024416245.png


    The semi gloss JB will be a good color match to the BP. I plan on spray painting it and the screws Rustoleum semi gloss black. I did similar to my .308 M40 and it has held up surprisingly well for 3-4 years now. A little wear on the high points but pretty well intact. Paint is what the Marines did in VN when the received their raw aluminum edged butt plate guns back in the 60s.

    Got a BT/Accu Shot 2 inch bipod rail coming this week. Ill install the rail and Wichita swivels. Went with a seperate Wichita up front rather than a rail with QD because it drives me nits that most QD swivels marked as 1.25 are really more like 1.2 and it messes with real 1.25 slings on pass through.

    I really want to start linseed oiling this. Unsure if that will be a problem to the builder. Understand that during build something may get scratched or bruised but thats the beauty of linseed oil.....wipe more on and it goes away. I figure if I start oiling it now this thing could have 4-5 months of daily love before it even goes to the builder.
     
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    deltawiskey

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    Your butt is looking good pmclaine! Can't wait to see that wood with a few coats of oil on it!!
    Great project by the way... your probably going to "make" me spend a bunch of money again : /
    DW
     
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    pmclaine

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    image.jpg


    Going to need some more candle smoke and scraping once I can see under the "shadow" of the buttplate.
     

    pmclaine

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    After the holidays I need to call Chad @LongRifles Inc. to see if he would be interested in doing this build.

    Put together my build sheet.

    Going to mock up a barrel profile on butcher paper to get an idea of how big a barrel I can install without taking away too much wood. The wood is actually pretty stout. Its trim in the wrist where I want it so but pretty beefy through the belly and fore end.

    My build ideas any comment/criticism is appreciated. Sorry for the format. I couldn't just upload the WORD doc for some reason.


    1. Modify 5 digit Remington 700 receiver to fit USMC M40 style lugged scope base. Stripper clip cut (my receiver is already partially cut per early Remington manufacture), cut rails, thumb cut. Optic will use Badger lugged base, supplied by pmcLaine, with 8-40 screws as per USMC M40 spec. I want the left side rail radius to meet the radius of the Badger rail similar to how the thumb cut radius should meet the radius of the Badger rail on the right side – I think that is a detail that looks "pretty" and rifles should be pretty.
    2. Blue print R700 5 digit receiver. True up bolt face and lap lugs to receiver. Check timing on bolt handle. Ive been lucky to never have any M700 have primary extraction issues, these early Remingtons seem to extract/eject just fine, but if I will notice a timed handle do it.
    3. Finish/Install carbon steel, (9.5:1 to 8.75:1) left hand gain twist Bartlein barrel. Barrel will ship direct to LRI from Bartlein. Barrel contour to start with 4 inch cylinder at 1.20 inches, straight taper to .90 inch. Chamber for .308. Finish length to be 21 inches from bolt face. Finish crown with Hunter style recessed target crown, Flat muzzle, straight side walls. I would like the raised "band" of the crown wide like early USMC M40A1s with Atkinsson barrels had. Im using a truck axle barrel so there is material to allow for sufficient area to be recessed around the bore and the raised area would be a bit thicker. The rifle "artist" will know the "Golden Means" dimensions.
    4. Use LRI Heavy Tactical Recoil Lug to marry receiver/barrel and stock.
    5. Install/Fit LRI Detachable Bottom Metal for Remington 700SA. Provide 2 five round AI magazines and 1 ten round AI magazine. Talk to me about AIAW mods to my receiver. I like the idea of the staggered feed magazines and their smaller projection from the rifle. I am not concerned about modifying the receiver to do AIAW. The mags must function reliably.
    6. Install pmclaine provided two inch AccuShot/BT bipod rail and 1.25 inch Wichita swivels. Install rail as close to front tip of stock as structure, function, and aesthetics allow. Install front Wichita as close to rail as function allows. If in the process of foam filling/bedding stock you guys want to embed a piece of steel for mounting the sling swivel and bipod rail such as McMillan does with USMC M40A1 HTG stocks Im liking your thinking. I will be using a canvas sling (Quick Cuff) which wont be as thick as a leather M1907, as long as the loop can rotate forward without touching the rail that should be enough space between the two. Bottom Wichita is a wood screw style.
    7. Install pillars/bed action in wood stock using LRI awesome bedding process. The stock was the impulse buy genesis of this whole endeavor and is probably the cheapest/weakest part of the whole project. Good bedding/pillars, solid LRI DBM and an unstressed receiver will clamp that wood tight negating any of its weakness. Barrel channel currently has a lightening cut in the forearm. If this is filled with epoxy to create a smooth consistent barrel channel the entire length of the stock I think structurally that is a good thing. It will fill bury the hardware for the Wichita swivel and Accu Shot 2 inch bipod rail, release agent the mount screws for removal after filling. Check balance on rifle and bring center of gravity back to the front of trigger guard by adding weight under the butt plate if necessary.
    8. I fit Remington 16601 butt plate to about 95%. I don’t have the correct tools to get the slightly proud edge of the aluminum to match the wood without risking banging up the stock. Please check fit of butt plate and if you see room to improve…..do it.
    9. Punch Mark last 4 digits of serial number in USMC tradition on following parts…
      1. Scope base – front, left
      2. DBM – Just behind front action screw, perpendicular with action (if there is room).
      3. Bolt handle, at top flat of bolt handle root, parallel with action
      4. Buttplate on inside not seen when installed
      5. Lug, on lower front, non bearing side.
    10. Barrel/receiver are carbon steel. Id like Parkerizing for a finish. All guns with carbon steel should be Parkerized. I love that stuff.

    11. Hot Blue, matte finish, the bolt and shroud. Blue or Black Oxide the firing pin indicator to match.

    12. Mil spec. Type III hard anodize the LRI DBM to as close as possible match the parkerized barreled action.

    13. Mil spec. Type III hard anodize the butt plate a matte black. If your Parkerizing finish is more toward a black color just have the DBM and BP match. If your Parkerizing is of the gray shade than go with a black butt plate and have the DBM match the action.

    14. Lets talk about builder barrel marking. I want LRI logo on there, proud to fly your flag, but I want subdued.. Right side just forward of lug. Caliber/install date on barrel as required by custom/law – left side just forward of lug - .308 Win – date code underside of barrel unseen.

    15. I will apply multiple coats of Pure Cold Pressed Linseed oil to finish the stock. Hand rubbing stocks and watching the color change as it oxidizes is a personal reward. I will send the stock to you with this process already started and expect during build bruises and stuff may happen. Just send it back as is because the beauty of linseed oil is that some hand love restores the beauty.
     
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    pmclaine

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    The new rifle will be an updated version of what is now my favorite rifles to shoot....

    Remington M40.....

    PC299065.JPG


    PC299066.JPG


    Except with the capped Leupold I have to hold mil dots for range. It works great on bigger targets like steel.

    For trying to make groups on paper though I sometimes cheat and draw an aiming point. In this case a 1.4 mil holdover red circle for shooting at 300 yards...

    PC299069.JPG


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    Steelhead

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    Jun 26, 2003
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    That is going to be awesome! Beautiful piece of wood you found there! Please post pictures when it is all finished!

    I'm interested in why you went with 1:8 twist for .308. I see it's LH twist too. I'll be very interested in seeing what your load is.
     

    LongRifles Inc.

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    www.longriflesinc.com
    First, I sincerely appreciate all the encouragement and support from the folks who have mentioned us on this thread. I am very flattered, to say the least.

    Now, down to business.

    1577718734403.png


    The DBM setup LRI is making was born out of necessity. There are issues I've encountered for a number of years that annoyed the hell out of me.

    1. A DBM with a bit of elegance to hopefully appeal to the sporting community.
    2. AI magazine compliance* (rant to follow) :)
    3. Obendorf style latch for hunting applications (goes in/out of a scabbard, vehicle, case easily)
    4. Lightweight
    5. Crowned trigger guard with hips. -an attempt at a respectful nod to how guns used to be made.
    6. Full support to gunsmiths and end-users. (more on that in a minute)

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    *AI set a standard with magazines that began almost two decades ago. When you look at any attempt at a "sporter" DBM what do you find? You find a corner that you become boxed into the moment you get your wallet out. Now, you are locked into the magazine configuration they offer. The stuff you've already spent thousands of dollars on has no use. It's a big reset button and you have to start all over again. Then add insult to injury when you later learn that the magazines are almost always poorly made. Rubber O rings and other things to bandaid problems that shouldn't exist to begin with.

    I am of the opinion that this approach is both dumb and stupid from a manufacturer's standpoint.

    It doesn't take a 30 round magazine to go shoot a deer or an elk. -Least it shouldn't. Hunting guns demand some compromise to suit the task as a whole. ( A light gun that's easy to shoot and built to deliver good accuracy from a cold bore shot.) That's really all it has to do. Now, that said, it is nice to not have to destroy your thumbs loading (3 round) magazines at the range when you just want to go shooting or while working up a load. That is where this trinket I'm making starts to get a little traction. Grab some (AI, ARC, Alpha, Accurate) 10 rounders and go to the range.

    Our floor metal works with all of them.


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    So, OP, at this point it might be a good time to review your setup and make sure I'm the right guy for your project and your application.

    The next facet of this project that I wanted to work on was the "after purchase" side of things. A big company has been the dominant force in this particular product for a long, long time. YET, the best you get from them when it comes to fitting the thing is either a photocopy void of any meaningful dimensions or a telephone call where the person on the phone says, "send it to us and we'll do it for "x" amount of dollars.

    LRI supports the product for both gunsmiths and end-users. Anyone can go to the product listing and download prints, setup sheets, tool packages, AND the ACTUAL CODE that we use to fit the parts to the stock. You may have to change a bit of the syntax to suit your machine, but the meat and potatoes of the process are lined out in detail.

    I've been on a crusade for the last 15+ years to change this side of the industry. When I can go to McMaster Carr's website and download a Solid Works Part file of a bolt, screw, pump, assembly, whatever, then we should be able to do it here as well.

    the days of being treated as though I'm asking for access to National Security matters needs to die a quick and painful death. It is just a floormetal. . .


    You can find more on our stuff here:

     

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    pmclaine

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    Im sold before you even posted.

    Been wanting to have you build me something for awhile.

    Your DBM is exactly what I was looking for - Oberndorf without the QC problems associated with PTG.

    My usage will be PSR classes and me plinking at paper targets. Id probably be better off with a M5 type paddle mag release but thats not what I want.

    This is going to be an updated USMC M40. Remove the weakness of the Remington internal magazine system, beefier barrel and better optics.

    The stock is the weakest link and as another poster and Dan Ross mentioned - get a better stock.

    But I like wood especially this striped wood. I revel in linseed oiling wood.

    Did a mock up of my barrel profile....My daughter took the pictures with the calipers. She didnt really capture that I was trying to show that there is about 1/8th inch or more of wood beyond the edge of the barrel profile. The stock is fatter than my Remington M40 stocks so it should accept a heavy profile. The added structure of epoxy bedding should only help...

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    pmclaine

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    Guess I cut it off in the picture but the overall length of finished barrel will be 21 inches.

    The diameter at the cylinder is 1.25 inches.

    This will make up for my personal inadequacies.

    Shooting yesterday with my M40 I noted that after 2 or 3 rapid shots so much heat was coming off the barrel that the Leupold greenie was a pain to see through the mirage. More than a few shots were taken with a "wavery" aim point.

    The bigger barrel better scope may negate that negative aspect.
     

    Millron

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    That Looks Spectacular!. Will you also be offering the 3rd Flush fit mags in the future? Also, it appears you will have a long action magazine available as well? I don't see those on your website yet. That seems to be a segment that is really underserved with the current offerings on the market.
     
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    pmclaine

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    That is going to be awesome! Beautiful piece of wood you found there! Please post pictures when it is all finished!

    I'm interested in why you went with 1:8 twist for .308. I see it's LH twist too. I'll be very interested in seeing what your load is.


    I want to experiment.

    I heard rumor of Govt agencies going with short barrel, fast twist .308s and getting good results.

    All my other 3.08s are 1/11.25 or 1/10.

    I just want to try something different.

    Projectiles will be 175 SMK and I load to try to meet FGMM velocities.

    Left hand twist is another experiment.

    I want to see what its like when the stock recoils into your mass instead of away.

    Ordering this thing from Bartlein is going to be the hold up. Im guessing 4 or more months before they will build it.
     
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    pmclaine

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    Talked to Eric at Long Rifles Inc.

    Sent my build sheet to @LongRifles Inc. to get an estimate on pricing.

    Will order my Bartlein tomorrow....

    1. Cro Moly Steel (finish will be Parkerizing)
    2. 5R rifling
    3. Contour - 4 inch cylinder at 1.20 inch diameter, assumes first inch of cylinder will become barrel tenon. Straight taper to .90 inch diameter at finish length. Finish length to be 21 inches from bolt face.
    4. Twist - 9.5:1 left hand even gain twist to 8.75:1.
    5. Caliber - .30 caliber intended for .308 Winchester chambering.
     

    pmclaine

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    Picked up my receiver today. Parts are coming together.......

    P1069100.JPG


    Wichita swivels are off getting an offending design feature turned down so that the swivel lug will fit flush to the wood.

    The little plastic bag is a brass reinforcing stock pin. The USMC ran one of these pins in from left to right on the thin section of wood between the trigger and magazine. The head of it was only visible on the left side. I want one on my rifle but Ill leave it up to the builder to see if that works not knowing how the LRI DBM will fit.

    Only things not on hand are the Barrel - in production, the LRI DBM and the LRI heavy lug.

    Getting the receiver from my FFL was a bad idea. I ended up putting my name on this....

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    Looks to be all GI except for the receiver - DAS marked stock with cutout, fiberglass heat shield, TRW barrel....been wanting an early SA Inc with Gi parts and today I found one.

    My Honey Hole is a place of great temptation....

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    Hobo Hilton

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    You will find both a lot of history as well as a lot of opinions in the M1A arena..... I say "just make it your's"... Fit, function and dependability all key off of "you" not what the other guy is doing with his. If the day comes when that little voice in the back of your head says "This is my GO TO weapon" when things go bad then you have accomplished more security than most owner's. Best of Luck.

    Hobo
     

    pmclaine

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    You will find both a lot of history as well as a lot of opinions in the M1A arena..... I say "just make it your's"... Fit, function and dependability all key off of "you" not what the other guy is doing with his. If the day comes when that little voice in the back of your head says "This is my GO TO weapon" when things go bad then you have accomplished more security than most owner's. Best of Luck.

    Hobo

    That M1A is in "as issued" condition as I think a commercial SA one can be. It's going to get a nylon, "seatbelt", sling and that's it for mods.

    Oh and plastilube, a nice coating of plastilube on the op spring and oprod track. Looks dry.

    I'll have to join M14 Forum and see if they have any SN info on 71288.
     
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    Hobo Hilton

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    That M1A is in "as issued" condition as I think a commercial SA one can be. It's going to get a nylon, "seatbelt", sling and that's it for mods.

    Oh and plastilube, a nice coating of plastilube on the poros spring and o prod track. Looks dry.

    I'll have to join M14 Forum and see if they have any SN info on 71288.
    I spent a lot of time with those guys at the M14 Forum... Good people, especially the one's sent to the "Banned Camp".. LOL .... Only one small part I'd verify as USGI and that is the ejector. The folks at LRB, Inc build the Cadillac of M1A's and have a lot of knowledge as well. The only thing about that platform is the desire to get more M1A's... Scout, Tanker and of course a SOCOM... Have fun.

    Hobo
     
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    pmclaine

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    I spent a lot of time with those guys at the M14 Forum... Good people, especially the one's sent to the "Banned Camp".. LOL .... Only one small pert I'd verify as USGI and that is the ejector. The folks at LRB, Inc build the Cadillac of M1A's and have a lot of knowledge as well. The only thing about that platform is the desire to get more M1A's... Scout, Tanker and of course a SOCOM... Have fun.

    Hobo

    A coworkers M1A, Socom versión I think, a shorty shit it's extractor first firing.

    I'll have to start studying up on the heat lots of the bolts to see where the one in this rifle is from. I'll check the extractor/ejector.
     

    Hobo Hilton

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    A coworkers M1A, Socom versión I think, a shorty shit it's extractor first firing.

    I'll have to start studying up on the heat lots of the bolts to see where the one in this rifle is from. I'll check the extractor/ejector.
    Here is my concern, up front. There are 100's of those (NIB) M1A's that are laid back in gun safe's that have never been fired. They are ear marked for the day the SHTF. Your co-worker is a good example of a bad situation. If any of you guys have an M1A "Safe Queen" take it out and just shoot it. Get it hot, dump some dirt on it, shoot it some more, pour some water out the nearest creek or river on it and shoot it some more.... If you have snow, lay it in a snow bank when it's warm... Run it some more. When you get home, tear it apart and oil it good. Stand it up muzzle down and make sure some oil runs out of it... Now, you are good to go.

    Hobo

    I'll add this to tie our discussion back to the theme of this forum:

     
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    pmclaine

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    Here is my concern, up front. There are 100's of those (NIB) M1A's that are laid back in gun safe's that have never been fired. They are ear marked for the day the SHTF. Your co-worker is a good example of a bad situation. If any of you guys have an M1A "Safe Queen" take it out and just shoot it. Get it hot, dump some dirt on it, shoot it some more, pour some water out the nearest creek or river on it and shoot it some more.... If you have snow, lay it in a snow bank when it's warm... Run it some more. When you get home, tear it apart and oil it good. Stand it up muzzle down and make sure some oil runs out of it... Now, you are good to go.

    Hobo


    Little familiarity with them having owned a Garand for ten years.

    It's a battle rifle.........at minimum I want 4MOA.

    From the looks of this one close to two MOA should be achievable.

    My thing is I love to rub the linseed lotion on the stock.
     
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    JMGlasgow

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    An M1 Garand extractor will work on a M14 bolt. I got a few extras made by Beretta when they were cheap. They are just as good as the GI ones too. If your bolt is a TRW it probably already has a USGI extractor and I wouldn't worry about it but always have a spare kit. I have both a Supermatch M1A and a Frankenstein Scout. The scout is a Fulton Armory receiver and an LRB bolt and other parts from various companies. Some folks on M14forum say the receiver and bolt won't work together but they're wrong.
     
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