Wow the Big Horn seems pretty attractive. being able to swap barrels like that is also very nice as long as their is no compromise in accuracy.
- Thread starter RickyRodney
- Start date
Not much to contribute here since the only custom action I've handled is my TL3 (which is awesome), but when I was considering coatings, I talked to a guy at Bighorn and he said he actually coats his with just plain ole' Cerakote, which he smooths on the inside of the action with a flex ball hone. He said nothing wrong with DLC but he likes Cerakote just as well if not better. TL3's have quite a bit more clearance between the bolt body and the action than some of the more traditional custom actions by design, so the extra thickness of Cerakote versus a PVD coating shouldn't make any difference.
There's no compromise in accuracy. Whether or not you get a perfect "return to zero" is a different question, but if done properly a switch barrel system works just as well as standard shouldered barrels.
Even better, Josh at Patriot Valley Arms will spin you up shouldered barrels for a Bighorn without even needing to see your action, which is easier than a barrel nut system and looks better, without the downside of having to send your action in and wait for a gunsmith to make a barrel just for your action. I've got a Bugnut barrel from Southern Precision Rifles and it's fantastic, but my next barrel will come from Josh because of the simplicity of switching out shouldered barrels and the streamlined look.
if going from 90 to 60 degrees give you that much headache...i bet your shoes are velcro instead of laces
lolive run nothing but my AI in matches for like 3 yrs, but i can still jump on my 90 degree actions and run them just the same...i just raise my right hand a couple inches higher
if going from 90 to 60 degrees give you that much headache...i bet your shoes are velcro instead of laces
ive run nothing but my AI in matches for like 3 yrs, but i can still jump on my 90 degree actions and run them just the same...i just raise my right hand a couple inches higher
If you could find half decent quality velcro shoes, then ya, I'd be that guy
If you could find half decent quality velcro shoes, then ya, I'd be that guy
lol i guess i shouldnt talk much...i dont even tie mine
That's the only thing I have a distaste for with my Mausingfield, the heavier bolt lift. Otherwise I love it. Sometimes a particular piece of brass will expand more when just fired for whatever reason, then the bolt becomes twice as hard to lift, yeah, when this happens it makes the lift harder on any action but more so with the Mausingfield.
Mines uncoated, the DLC'ed one I felt at the Shotshow was astoundingly smooth, maybe they had it polished first and lubed???
I think next generation M action is in order. Ted, if you're reading this, please work on a mechanically assisted bolt open feature, or strategically placed ball bearings, just something -whatever it takes!!! Or a cock on close to take advantage of momentum.
I was at a NRA show one time and walked up to a booth, the guy offered a action/rifle he designed himself. What sold me was as I pointed the muzzle to the ground, holding the bolt open and back, once let go of the bolt would completely lock closed and down by itself! It was way out of my price range at the time so that was that.
As I've mentioned before, someone needs to design a Fortner style centerfire tactical action. My 1827F has been as perfect as an action gets, what an absolute joy in every way! Most of the speed of semiauto and all the accuracy of a bolt rifle.
Last edited:
BAT panda benchrest, almost falls in by itself. add some dust int he air and its so tight it will bind but for absolute smoothness a proper bench action has to be so smooth so you dont disturb it on the bags. especially the 100-200 yard PPC guys, they barley touch the rifle.
Hearing that the Big Horn has more clearance than others is not what I was hoping to hear. This rifle will be coddled so tolerances can be tight. And yes I plan to run shouldered barrels, I was speaking more to the floating/swapable bolt head of the BigHorn. So hmm maybe I have more decisions to make. Maybe I should have respecified smooth AND tight. I'm basically looking for benchrest accuracy thats going to wear a KMW stock.
My understanding is the Bighorn is designed for field use. The floating bolt head means they could add clearance between the bolt body and action for reliability when dirty while maintaining very tight and repeatable lockup. The floating bolt head also eliminates or at least mitigates bolt bounce. It really doesn't matter how loose the bolt is during its travel, it just depends on how tight it locks up.
Give the guys at Bighorn a call, they'll explain it much better than I can.
The Bighorn TL3 is definitely a tactical action. They aren't like sloppy loose like a Surgeon, they just have a bit more clearance than a standard Deviant would. And ya, they still lock up tight, and they are a very smooth bolt throw. As far as accuracy, they are as true as an action can get plus a floating bolt head on top of that. But, again, they aren't targeting the benchrest crowd so you might be better off looking at the BAT or a Barnard or Stolle, etc, etc.
if you are looking essentially for a benchrest action, then look no further than a Borden Mountaineer action with PVD coding. For all intents and purposes, it is a benchrest action disguising itself as a Remington 700 footprint tactical action. You will be hard-pressed to find another action with as precise of timing as a Borden action.
Jigstick,
Just for the record. All Bat Actions including the Bat Tactical and Bench Rest variants are made to the same clearances and tolerances.
Comparing Nitrided and Stainless, it is amazing the difference in the feel of a well lubed and cleaned stainless action and the same action nitrided. At first the stainless feels smoother. That is until you start to get a a lot of dust and dirt flying around. Result of three days at ACS this fall. The stainless steal actions felt smoother to start (maybe feeling a little slicker than the nitrided action) but by day 2, the two stainless steel actions needed wiped down, they started slowing down. While the nitrided action still ran strong and really did not need it (although I admittedly wiped it down as well).
I like both and own both. But they are different and at first glance will give you the idea the stainless is slicker, But run in the same field conditions for a couple days, and the stainless will slow down or require a little more field care.
To go one step further. the Nitrided actions will only get smoother the more you shoot them. My oldest action feels like it is on greased rails.
Thank guys,
Great Poll,
JamieD
Wolf Precision, Inc.
www.wolfprecision.net
You want benchrest? You're on the wrong forum asking the wrong questions. Are you capable of printing a 3" group at 1000 yards? I'm pretty sure all my sloppy Bighorns will outshoot you.
Not sure wft you are talking about, but this statement has no basis in reality. Please don't repeat this silliness to anyone.
Take it easy....smooth those feathers.
To answer your question, hell no I can't shoot 3" groups at 1000 yards. I'm sure the Big Horn performs no one is knocking them.
Shooting is a hobby/sport not my career. I want a rifle that is more akin to a comfortable sunday driver than a racecar. And no one said a sunday driver can't have a blower under the hood.
When shooting for fun and spending money on a custom, I want to get the nicest and most enjoyable to operate and shoot rifle I can. The rifle's life will go safe-case-stand-case-safe. I'm not going to be sprinting through stages with it slung, throwing it on the ground and dust to shoot 4 targets in 15 seconds. Like I said....coddled.
my Steyer M/S MC made in 1961 in 243 is the slickest action I ever cycled,,might be tough getting a chassis and AI mags to fit that one though,,LOL
Uh, which part was bullshit?
I believe there is 1 or 2 people in the TL3 build pic thread that had their actions cerakoted By whoever Big Horn uses before being shipped out to them. I’ve heard elite only helps TL3s.
I’ve since gotten my TL3 DLCd and it really didn’t stop the binding. So i got the bolt cerakoted with elite cerakoted. Since my buddies that was completely done in elite cerakoted didn’t have this issue.
Any improvement?
I'll know this weekend, haven't been home in two months. I'm expecting it to be fine.
Get whatever action you like with the options you want. Then send it to someone and have the trigger and action timed so there is no “cock on close”
That will be the smoothest action you have ever felt.
That will be the smoothest action you have ever felt.
You might have been kidding when you wrote this, but I've since acquired a Krag and I would like to change my vote from Tikka to Krag. It is without a doubt the smoothest rifle action I've ever felt. It's outdated and too weak for any modern cartridge, but feels like it's on bearings.
Not kidding. have had two of them.
dandy hunting rifles, shitty military rifles.
For a factory action, I was really surprised with how smooth the Bergara action was...close to Tikka smooth. The smoothest custom action I’ve felt has been a nitrided (?) Curtis Axiom.
Had a defiance and it's a binding bitch even dlc
Got my Gap tempest and loved it but sold it as I was stupid..
Got a surgeon not liked it and I tried a TL3 and even tho a good action it's binding.
Now I run an Impact and I cannot be happier. Smooth as glass, cannot bind. That's the best 90 degree action.
The best 60 degree would be the tempest but I'd like to test the Curtis someday.
Got my Gap tempest and loved it but sold it as I was stupid..
Got a surgeon not liked it and I tried a TL3 and even tho a good action it's binding.
Now I run an Impact and I cannot be happier. Smooth as glass, cannot bind. That's the best 90 degree action.
The best 60 degree would be the tempest but I'd like to test the Curtis someday.
I have a tl3, nucleus, savage, axmc and mausingfield on its way. Out of the first four I believe the axmc is my smoothest action.
I have or have had just about every action manufacturers action come through the shop at one time or another. Right now I have 2 Bat benchrest actions, 2 Bat Tactical actions, 3 Defiance actions, 2 ARC Nucleus actions, and a couple of Bighorns, and an Impact, 2 Stillers and various other factory actions. There are various reasons to pic an action depending on personal preference but if you are looking at stricly smoothness of the action I would vote Bat. It is remarkable how smooth they are. I often have people come into the shop and compare actions and it has always been the Bat that they say is the smoothest. They do have tighter clearance so you have to way that in your decision and trigger timing can also play in the smoothness of any action. We are very lucky to have all the action manufacturers we have today but it does make ones choice that much harder.
I kind of wish i would’ve gone impact over bighorn though i think something might be up with mine. It’s nowhere near as smooth as the SR3 i got my dad. I might let a smith look at it. It just seems to bind if i remotely go off axis pushing the big diamond helical bolt handle. I had the reviver DLCd and the bolt elite cerakoted thinking it would make it tighter and it is better. Though not as slick as dads SR3 or my friends elite cerakoted TL3. Though it’s intention was a switch barrel hunting rig and a backup gun so impact would’ve cost me more in that regard. Still love my tempest. I need to feel an impact
Is it silly to want an Impact, Curtis, TL3 etc that has tight enough tolerances that you can order barrels online without the action? Just seems so much easier to me than sending my action to a smith. I know they then won’t need the action to spin another one but that means that you are stuck with that barrel maker until you send your action in to another. Seems like it could be a pain. I like the tempest features but don’t want to go through that barrel headache. So maybe an impact or Curtis then.
You can do the same for the tempest. Once the Smith has used your action they should have the dimensions and should be able to spin up a barrel for you without the action in hand. Least i could’ve sworn one of the smiths here told me that.
There was a point before the tempest hit the market that i believe George was going to do just that. Provide barrels for the tempest. Though my memory might be faulty. This was like the early tempest days before they changed the design a bit.
I understand that once the Smith has it and if he keeps the dimensions then he can spin another but youre basically stuck with that smith unless you want to send your action out to a different smith again. I mentioned all that in the original post but I’m saying that I enjoy the idea of never having to send it out and being able to buy from whatever smith can hit my timeline
Last edited:
Impact Precision and Lone Peak! Trust me I've tried more actions than most, you name it and I've either used it, or owned it. The Impact and Lone Peak are the best two if you don't want binding. Plus they have super nice and easy bolt lifts. Soooo smooth.
Plus their customer service is great! I've been nothing but pleased with my experiences with both companies.
Plus their customer service is great! I've been nothing but pleased with my experiences with both companies.
Does the lone peak need to be sent to a Smith first? Doesn’t look like PVA has a prefit for it etc
How is the action timing on the Lone Peak?
I'd give Lone Peak a call. I called them a couple months ago and they said they were JUST about to change up their actions so that they would be able to take off-the-shelf prefit barrels just like Impact Precision. So as far as I know, the newer actions may have the capability to take shouldered pre-fits, but I don't know for sure. And it seems maybe that not a lot of gunsmiths are aware of it. I'd give em' a call.
PS: They also increased the size of their bolt stop with the latest batch.
If that’s the case then that may be the direction I go. Thanks for the heads up
I had or have, Rem 700, Tikka T3, Sako 75, Stiller Predator, AIAX, and Impact.
The Impact, AI, and Tikka are close if your just going by how smooth they are running back and forth, but when you start considering the complete cycle from opening the bolt/cocking, cycling the action and then closing the Impact pulls out ahead of the AI and Tikka.
In my opinion the Impact is the smoothest to operate, and it will do it basically dry without lube, which is critical in my opinion. They all can get really smooth if they have lots of lube, but then in dusty conditions they get gummy, this does not happen with the Impact.
At a local match on the weekend I tried a Defiance and Surgeon back to back with my Impact and the two are not even close in my opinion, the impact is smother and not susceptible to the bind like the Defiance that I tried and to a lesser extend the Surgeon.
The Impact, AI, and Tikka are close if your just going by how smooth they are running back and forth, but when you start considering the complete cycle from opening the bolt/cocking, cycling the action and then closing the Impact pulls out ahead of the AI and Tikka.
In my opinion the Impact is the smoothest to operate, and it will do it basically dry without lube, which is critical in my opinion. They all can get really smooth if they have lots of lube, but then in dusty conditions they get gummy, this does not happen with the Impact.
At a local match on the weekend I tried a Defiance and Surgeon back to back with my Impact and the two are not even close in my opinion, the impact is smother and not susceptible to the bind like the Defiance that I tried and to a lesser extend the Surgeon.
You should be able to get barrels from any Smith that has the TL3 dimensions. Heck, my Smith spun up 2 barrels for my TL3 before they even existed in customer's hands...or in his hands. I was on the first pre-order from Bighorn.
As for smoothness, I have two TL3 actions and they are different in smoothness. My first, the pre-order, I broke the cocking piece, sent it to BH and they sent me a new updated bolt. Action & bolt ate raw, and it's smooth as glass!
TL3 number two was used, and has the earlier bolt and was cerakoted by original owner. It's not nearly as smooth as my first, but still not bad. I'm sending it to BH this winter to have the cerakote removed and get DLC'd. I'm hoping they upgrade this bolt too.
The S/N's on these actions are mid 1100's and low 1200's fwiw.
