K-Bars  Ultralight self defense blade for female runner

ChrisF308

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Feb 4, 2019
24
7
Hi ,

I have a little girl , she's 8 , and just started Karate , along with my boy 10 , I would recommend a book , " The Modern Survival manual ; Surviving the Economic Collapse " by Fernando " Ferfal " Aguirre , has some very useful practical advice , ( self defence & other stuff ) its 250 pages of the good oil , its info comes from the collapse of Argentina in the 2000s .
It covers a lot of areas.

I would advise your daughters to have their hair cut shorter than what they like , and not wear necklace/jewerly that can cause injury .
If they kick , donot use toes , you just break them , use the shin bone for ( groin kick ) or low side kick into knee .

Donot discount completely folders , Cold Steel Voyager XL , very light & compact .

Later Chris
 

Mayhem52

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Mar 10, 2013
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If the assailant is close enough for you to need a knife it's much too late to be making a call. I'm a believer in the Karambit. A slashing swing does considerable damage and the weapon is difficult to dislodge from your hand. If you really learn to use one they are deadly. They are really good for harvesting squash, too.

1614841780519.png
 

ChrisF308

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Feb 4, 2019
24
7
As to training/martial arts, I feel any training is better than NONE , and while some styles are more practical than others , and easy way to asses any is to ask what % of the class time is spent sparing/fighting .When I did Karate it was with my mates , and quickly devolved into just a few lads training and fighting , and the mix was about 50% training , kata's , bags etc , and 50% spent on free fighting , no gloves , pads or head guards ,noting as we could afford none , and only Ban , was the groin , if you got kicked in the head , you where too slow.
 

jbell

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    Push dagger, push dagger, push dagger. @jbell from what you said and described, this fits the bill, somebody makes contact with her she pokes and pushes away and takes off running. Some grabbing or assaulting of female joggers has happened a couple of times on the nature trails just across from the Nike World Campus in Beaverton.
    Yeah, a push dagger is what I am leaning toward after a lot of looking and reading all the suggestions.
     

    Eostech

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    Apr 13, 2014
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    I'll try keep this sort.
    HFB pneumo spike

    No, It seems overly large with no real ability to inflict sufficient trauma. More on this later.

    ake a look at push daggers

    Odd blade design limits options. More on this later.
    Not a huge fan of Gerber, but I like this for light, easy to carry, quick access, likely jurisdictionally legal and fits in the hand well.

    Ghost Strike

    resource_gerberamericas_30-001005.ashx

    Design limits usage options.



    Not really made for stabbing.

    I'll pile onto the not suggesting a fighting knife of any sort as a useful solution. Random thoughts:

    That was mostly about coms, which should be part of the plan but does not exclude knives. Also the "draw a knife and they could draw a gun argument." They still have a gun, sometimes your precautions are not enough and that argument can escalate forever. (ie you pack a compact handgun, they show up with a long gun, machine gun, rpg, tank etc.)

    I tried to punch that thing in the chest with my Ka-Bar

    Going to say it.
    Ka-Bar is not a great design.

    I make these g10 NPE Stabbys. I started making these for females to use in self defense nice light weight and discreet. These will get the job done.
    Message me for info.
    View attachment 7569734View attachment 7569745

    In a situation were you can carry a knife, this could co-exist with the knife but I would not replace it with one.

    PIKA Karambit

    No.

    Spyderco's Endura (serrated) and Delica (serrated)

    Fuck serrations, have fun sharpening them. No serration, hone your blade nice and sharp.

    I'm a believer in the Karambit.

    No.

    sharp pointy object go for the stomach, growing, or inner thigh depending on the situation.

    Depending on the situation.

    This pretty much sums it up. It's situational, say for example you get completely blindsided, knocked over the head and tackled. You are laying on the ground with someone on top of you, say they are experienced so even in that position of advantage they will still use violence to subjugate you (ie punch you in the face.).

    You are on the ground dazed and winded, possibly limited mobility. What the fuck do you do with a Karambit? Can't deliver a straight stab if it's needed.

    A push dagger has ONE way it can be held and used. handy right?

    Blade design for this task is super simple and old as time.

    medium_SMG00189110.jpg


    Straight blade and handle, doubled edged, nice point. But decent cutting ability, and hone the blade to a razors edge. Comfort will probably determine blade length but say 2.5 inch min.

    Straight handle and blade is important. A weaker person (or any IMO) should not give up the advantage of being able to use both hands on the knife. The handle can not be round (like old Ka-bar,) so you are able to index the blade automatically and instinctively.

    With a knife we are basically looking to inflict sufficient trauma or disable the attacker so we can escape/survive.
    Something like the "HFB pneumo spike" leaves a lot on the table. Even with a perfect heart shot sometimes shit does not work out as one would think.

    "In one case seen by the author,a young man was shot in the left chest at a range of 3 to 4 ft with a 12-gaugeshotgun firing #7 1/2 shot. The pellets literally shredded the heart, yet, this individual was able to run 65 feet prior to collapsing."

    chapter 9.

    https://www.academia.edu/35579763/G...f_firearms_ballistics_and_forensic_techniques

    So the attacker is not stopped after you stuck a large needle into them, what do you do after that?

    History is interesting on this topic.

    What people think Italians used to kill each other.
    Thinktank_Birmingham_-_object_1885S002241-640x480.jpg


    Actual knife for getting stuff done.
    1280px-Cinquedea-MAHG_Inv_Arm_1877-IMG_1455-gradient.jpg


    For a knife to do it's job it needs to suitably sharp. I've no idea on how well you sharpen a blade but inwards curved blades like on karambits are a pain in the ass. Odd shaped blades will make maintenance harder and so they may not end up being as sharp as they could be when you need them.

    In modern times kitchen knives are responsible for most knife fatalities. They are in every house hold, people use them almost everyday and the design works with the instinctual parts of our brains ( the whole gross motor skills idea).

    That stone blade I posted earlier has been co-invented the world over, you will find it in pretty much every society. It has evolved from stone to copper, bronze, iron, finally steel over thousands of years. In contrast something like the Karambit came from like one island in Indonesia. People have been killing each other for thousands of years with knives. The basic ideas have worked, but people need new shit to buy and sell so now we got exotic blade designs to buy. Karambits, tanto points and such (push daggers to a degree.)
     

    pmclaine

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  • Nov 6, 2011
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    I'll try keep this sort.

    Going to say it.
    Ka-Bar is not a great design.


    Its an overly large utility knife.....the example of "Jack of All Trades....Not Ideal for Any of Them"


    but still I love it so.

    I have yet to read your whole post but snippets I read seem to indicate you know something about knife fighting.

    Knife fighting is no joke and my understanding in situations if you come across someone that actually knows, and is capable of knife fighting......dont let them get within arms length of you and if you think you can fight them expect to get cut........cut bad.
     

    DarT8

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    Jan 12, 2008
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    3
    I am researching and will be purchasing a knife for my daughter to carry on her while running. She puts a lot of miles in mostly on trails so it needs to be light weight, have a secure carry system (that will not flop around and irritate / chafe her), be easy to access and deploy, can be carried under clothing. I am not looking for a “combat knife” that is capable of killing someone, rather something that can effectively deter an attack and create space / an opportunity to get away.

    I just wanted to reach out and see what I am missing in my search. Thank you
    Buy a small kydex sheath with a hook to catch on pocket and a couple holes to run a string through for neck or belt carry. practice 5 minutes a day ripping the neck, ,underneath an arm for a brachial cut, across the belly just above the belt freeing the intestines to fall on the attackers boots. the point can be used to cut above the eyes on the forehead to allow blood to hinder an attacker who my under the influence for ltl use.
    A Beretta Bobcat or Tomcat could be considered also. Drill to never quit. I have had a family member murdered. She fought mightily for her life.
     

    pmclaine

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  • Nov 6, 2011
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    I'll try keep this sort.


    No, It seems overly large with no real ability to inflict sufficient trauma. More on this later.



    Odd blade design limits options. More on this later.


    Design limits usage options.



    Not really made for stabbing.



    That was mostly about coms, which should be part of the plan but does not exclude knives. Also the "draw a knife and they could draw a gun argument." They still have a gun, sometimes your precautions are not enough and that argument can escalate forever. (ie you pack a compact handgun, they show up with a long gun, machine gun, rpg, tank etc.)



    Going to say it.
    Ka-Bar is not a great design.



    In a situation were you can carry a knife, this could co-exist with the knife but I would not replace it with one.



    No.



    Fuck serrations, have fun sharpening them. No serration, hone your blade nice and sharp.



    No.



    Depending on the situation.

    This pretty much sums it up. It's situational, say for example you get completely blindsided, knocked over the head and tackled. You are laying on the ground with someone on top of you, say they are experienced so even in that position of advantage they will still use violence to subjugate you (ie punch you in the face.).

    You are on the ground dazed and winded, possibly limited mobility. What the fuck do you do with a Karambit? Can't deliver a straight stab if it's needed.

    A push dagger has ONE way it can be held and used. handy right?

    Blade design for this task is super simple and old as time.

    medium_SMG00189110.jpg


    Straight blade and handle, doubled edged, nice point. But decent cutting ability, and hone the blade to a razors edge. Comfort will probably determine blade length but say 2.5 inch min.

    Straight handle and blade is important. A weaker person (or any IMO) should not give up the advantage of being able to use both hands on the knife. The handle can not be round (like old Ka-bar,) so you are able to index the blade automatically and instinctively.

    With a knife we are basically looking to inflict sufficient trauma or disable the attacker so we can escape/survive.
    Something like the "HFB pneumo spike" leaves a lot on the table. Even with a perfect heart shot sometimes shit does not work out as one would think.

    "In one case seen by the author,a young man was shot in the left chest at a range of 3 to 4 ft with a 12-gaugeshotgun firing #7 1/2 shot. The pellets literally shredded the heart, yet, this individual was able to run 65 feet prior to collapsing."

    chapter 9.

    https://www.academia.edu/35579763/G...f_firearms_ballistics_and_forensic_techniques

    So the attacker is not stopped after you stuck a large needle into them, what do you do after that?

    History is interesting on this topic.

    What people think Italians used to kill each other.
    Thinktank_Birmingham_-_object_1885S002241-640x480.jpg


    Actual knife for getting stuff done.
    1280px-Cinquedea-MAHG_Inv_Arm_1877-IMG_1455-gradient.jpg


    For a knife to do it's job it needs to suitably sharp. I've no idea on how well you sharpen a blade but inwards curved blades like on karambits are a pain in the ass. Odd shaped blades will make maintenance harder and so they may not end up being as sharp as they could be when you need them.

    In modern times kitchen knives are responsible for most knife fatalities. They are in every house hold, people use them almost everyday and the design works with the instinctual parts of our brains ( the whole gross motor skills idea).

    That stone blade I posted earlier has been co-invented the world over, you will find it in pretty much every society. It has evolved from stone to copper, bronze, iron, finally steel over thousands of years. In contrast something like the Karambit came from like one island in Indonesia. People have been killing each other for thousands of years with knives. The basic ideas have worked, but people need new shit to buy and sell so now we got exotic blade designs to buy. Karambits, tanto points and such (push daggers to a degree.)


    Perhaps an appropriate response to you, all things considered....

     
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    JH1961

    Private
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    Jan 24, 2021
    32
    30
    Alabama
    I'll try keep this sort.


    No, It seems overly large with no real ability to inflict sufficient trauma. More on this later.



    Odd blade design limits options. More on this later.


    Design limits usage options.



    Not really made for stabbing.



    That was mostly about coms, which should be part of the plan but does not exclude knives. Also the "draw a knife and they could draw a gun argument." They still have a gun, sometimes your precautions are not enough and that argument can escalate forever. (ie you pack a compact handgun, they show up with a long gun, machine gun, rpg, tank etc.)



    Going to say it.
    Ka-Bar is not a great design.



    In a situation were you can carry a knife, this could co-exist with the knife but I would not replace it with one.



    No.



    Fuck serrations, have fun sharpening them. No serration, hone your blade nice and sharp.



    No.



    Depending on the situation.

    This pretty much sums it up. It's situational, say for example you get completely blindsided, knocked over the head and tackled. You are laying on the ground with someone on top of you, say they are experienced so even in that position of advantage they will still use violence to subjugate you (ie punch you in the face.).

    You are on the ground dazed and winded, possibly limited mobility. What the fuck do you do with a Karambit? Can't deliver a straight stab if it's needed.

    A push dagger has ONE way it can be held and used. handy right?

    Blade design for this task is super simple and old as time.

    medium_SMG00189110.jpg


    Straight blade and handle, doubled edged, nice point. But decent cutting ability, and hone the blade to a razors edge. Comfort will probably determine blade length but say 2.5 inch min.

    Straight handle and blade is important. A weaker person (or any IMO) should not give up the advantage of being able to use both hands on the knife. The handle can not be round (like old Ka-bar,) so you are able to index the blade automatically and instinctively.

    With a knife we are basically looking to inflict sufficient trauma or disable the attacker so we can escape/survive.
    Something like the "HFB pneumo spike" leaves a lot on the table. Even with a perfect heart shot sometimes shit does not work out as one would think.

    "In one case seen by the author,a young man was shot in the left chest at a range of 3 to 4 ft with a 12-gaugeshotgun firing #7 1/2 shot. The pellets literally shredded the heart, yet, this individual was able to run 65 feet prior to collapsing."

    chapter 9.

    https://www.academia.edu/35579763/G...f_firearms_ballistics_and_forensic_techniques

    So the attacker is not stopped after you stuck a large needle into them, what do you do after that?

    History is interesting on this topic.

    What people think Italians used to kill each other.
    Thinktank_Birmingham_-_object_1885S002241-640x480.jpg


    Actual knife for getting stuff done.
    1280px-Cinquedea-MAHG_Inv_Arm_1877-IMG_1455-gradient.jpg


    For a knife to do it's job it needs to suitably sharp. I've no idea on how well you sharpen a blade but inwards curved blades like on karambits are a pain in the ass. Odd shaped blades will make maintenance harder and so they may not end up being as sharp as they could be when you need them.

    In modern times kitchen knives are responsible for most knife fatalities. They are in every house hold, people use them almost everyday and the design works with the instinctual parts of our brains ( the whole gross motor skills idea).

    That stone blade I posted earlier has been co-invented the world over, you will find it in pretty much every society. It has evolved from stone to copper, bronze, iron, finally steel over thousands of years. In contrast something like the Karambit came from like one island in Indonesia. People have been killing each other for thousands of years with knives. The basic ideas have worked, but people need new shit to buy and sell so now we got exotic blade designs to buy. Karambits, tanto points and such (push daggers to a degree.)
    Serrations quadruple the cutting area of a blade. A knife carried for self defense should ONLY be used for self defense, thereby limiting the need to resharpen. My recommendation stands, and is based on personal observations as an LEO, as well as those by an ER surgeon.
     

    Eeegadd

    Gun enthusiast, Realtor, boyfriend and father
    Minuteman
    Feb 9, 2021
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    I am researching and will be purchasing a knife for my daughter to carry on her while running. She puts a lot of miles in mostly on trails so it needs to be light weight, have a secure carry system (that will not flop around and irritate / chafe her), be easy to access and deploy, can be carried under clothing. I am not looking for a “combat knife” that is capable of killing someone, rather something that can effectively deter an attack and create space / an opportunity to get away.

    I just wanted to reach out and see what I am missing in my search. Thank you
    I would also go with pepper spray with a longer distance rating. A knife is good for contact but pepper spray would be better to avoid contact.
     

    Eostech

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    Apr 13, 2014
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    Knife fighting is no joke and my understanding in situations if you come across someone that actually knows, and is capable of knife fighting......dont let them get within arms length of you and if you think you can fight them expect to get cut........cut bad.

    Yeah so that's a pretty shitty situation. Same as an adult male attacking a teenage girl, but I would confidently say more people are battered to death every day with fist than are getting into the deep end with someone that know how to use a knife. Has nothing to do with knife fighting, only choosing a suitable tool for a job.

    Perhaps an appropriate response to you, all things considered....

    Man, makes my sad :ROFLMAO:

    1. video does not work so had to google it
    2. If you think that, I've failed to get the context across.

    So on one hand we have a overly large, near useless clip point type blade, the other blade is what, 3-4 inch long, double edged, nice point.
    Not really a contest choosing which one for self defense right?

    I think the picture of the cinquedea caused this. The idea behind that comparison is to choose a blade that gives you options. The stiletto type blade idea abandons everything for being stabby, it's basically a large needle. Cool, can it disable the biomechanics of attacker?
    Even if it get a perfect stab in, size of the wound channel is going to be small. The cinquedea can aptly disable an attackers biomechanics with slashes or deliver a catastrophic wound channel if used for stabbing (hence why they were used).

    SO long way of saying, choose a blade that can cut and stab.
    Someone grabs hold of his daughter, she can cut across the arm. Cutting muscle or nerves will disable that arm, does not matter what state of mind the attacker is in disabled is disabled, it will not work. Hopefully this allows her to get away, wound could be non fatal but that's not the metric of success here.

    Conversely in a situation where there may not be room for cutting a decent shaped blade will still allow stabbing. The blade should be wide enough to cause a decent wound channel because frankly if you can't get away (ie on the ground etc.) it's probably going to come down to killing someone.

    Serrations quadruple the cutting area of a blade. A knife carried for self defense should ONLY be used for self defense, thereby limiting the need to resharpen. My recommendation stands, and is based on personal observations as an LEO, as well as those by an ER surgeon.

    Sharks have had serrated teeth for millions of years, yes they work.

    A knife carried for self defense should ONLY be used for self defense

    This is more of a personal point but knives are also tools and most get used as such. I use a knife almost everyday for something, carry one pretty much everyday but have never used one in a self defense situation. I'm not going to carry two knives (one for self defense) and even if I did, in a high stress situation the brains going to go for the one you use everyday because that's a ingrained habit.
     
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    NateSavannah

    Sergeant of the Hide
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  • May 25, 2020
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    I am researching and will be purchasing a knife for my daughter to carry on her while running. She puts a lot of miles in mostly on trails so it needs to be light weight, have a secure carry system (that will not flop around and irritate / chafe her), be easy to access and deploy, can be carried under clothing. I am not looking for a “combat knife” that is capable of killing someone, rather something that can effectively deter an attack and create space / an opportunity to get away.

    I just wanted to reach out and see what I am missing in my search. Thank you
    HalfFace Blades SHPOS (sub human piece of shit) blade. Joe rogan runs with one so theres that. I keep one in my work bag. small. light. made for stabbing bad people with bad intentions. real good for that. guy originally made it for squeel team six for their clandestine stabbing operations.

    side note, so much advice in this post and I agree with very little of it. so cheers guys good job. a bunch of you make it real clear, you have never ran an inch in your life. so you need a sat phone, dual machetes, a glock, a phone book, extra socks, completely change her appearance,......
    this a road march or a run? running in Afghanistan? where you gonna stash all that shit in your running shorts? further who goes for a run with a pistol tucked in their running shorts? makes you sound like one of those guys who runs with their work boots on.
    like I said, blatantly obvious most you all have never ran an inch in your life.

    My advice. light. small. concealable. comfortable to run with. and do some training with her, so shes comfortable pulling the knife out and the actions associated with sticking it deep inside some fool.
     
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    thejeep

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    Stainless folder like one of the Spyderco s without liners carried aiwb, probably wouldn’t get left behind. Many different blade choices available.
     

    JH1961

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    Jan 24, 2021
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    Yeah so that's a pretty shitty situation. Same as an adult male attacking a teenage girl, but I would confidently say more people are battered to death every day with fist than are getting into the deep end with someone that know how to use a knife. Has nothing to do with knife fighting, only choosing a suitable tool for a job.



    Man, makes my sad :ROFLMAO:

    1. video does not work so had to google it
    2. If you think that, I've failed to get the context across.

    So on one hand we have a overly large, near useless clip point type blade, the other blade is what, 3-4 inch long, double edged, nice point.
    Not really a contest choosing which one for self defense right?

    I think the picture of the cinquedea caused this. The idea behind that comparison is to choose a blade that gives you options. The stiletto type blade idea abandons everything for being stabby, it's basically a large needle. Cool, can it disable the biomechanics of attacker?
    Even if it get a perfect stab in, size of the wound channel is going to be small. The cinquedea can aptly disable an attackers biomechanics with slashes or deliver a catastrophic wound channel if used for stabbing (hence why they were used).

    SO long way of saying, choose a blade that can cut and stab.
    Someone grabs hold of his daughter, she can cut across the arm. Cutting muscle or nerves will disable that arm, does not matter what state of mind the attacker is in disabled is disabled, it will not work. Hopefully this allows her to get away, wound could be non fatal but that's not the metric of success here.

    Conversely in a situation where there may not be room for cutting a decent shaped blade will still allow stabbing. The blade should be wide enough to cause a decent wound channel because frankly if you can't get away (ie on the ground etc.) it's probably going to come down to killing someone.



    Sharks have had serrated teeth for millions of years, yes they work.

    A knife carried for self defense should ONLY be used for self defense

    This is more of a personal point but knives are also tools and most get used as such. I use a knife almost everyday for something, carry one pretty much everyday but have never used one in a self defense situation. I'm not going to carry two knives (one for self defense) and even if I did, in a high stress situation the brains going to go for the one you use everyday because that's a ingrained habit.
    I carry (2) knives every day. It isn't difficult. A smaller, Kershaw 'Needs Work' general purpose utility knife (clipped in right front pocket), that is used to open pkgs, cut string, rope, etc, and a larger Spyderco Endura w/serrated edge (clipped in right rear pocket) for 'anti-social' uses. I also carry a small pepper spray in my left front pocket. When not at work, a G19 rides on my right side @ 3:30-4:00.
     

    theLBC

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    super light options out there like g10 or poly knives. not for duty obviously.
     

    pmclaine

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    Yeah so that's a pretty shitty situation. Same as an adult male attacking a teenage girl, but I would confidently say more people are battered to death every day with fist than are getting into the deep end with someone that know how to use a knife. Has nothing to do with knife fighting, only choosing a suitable tool for a job.



    Man, makes my sad :ROFLMAO:

    1. video does not work so had to google it
    2. If you think that, I've failed to get the context across.

    So on one hand we have a overly large, near useless clip point type blade, the other blade is what, 3-4 inch long, double edged, nice point.
    Not really a contest choosing which one for self defense right?

    I think the picture of the cinquedea caused this. The idea behind that comparison is to choose a blade that gives you options. The stiletto type blade idea abandons everything for being stabby, it's basically a large needle. Cool, can it disable the biomechanics of attacker?
    Even if it get a perfect stab in, size of the wound channel is going to be small. The cinquedea can aptly disable an attackers biomechanics with slashes or deliver a catastrophic wound channel if used for stabbing (hence why they were used).

    SO long way of saying, choose a blade that can cut and stab.
    Someone grabs hold of his daughter, she can cut across the arm. Cutting muscle or nerves will disable that arm, does not matter what state of mind the attacker is in disabled is disabled, it will not work. Hopefully this allows her to get away, wound could be non fatal but that's not the metric of success here.

    Conversely in a situation where there may not be room for cutting a decent shaped blade will still allow stabbing. The blade should be wide enough to cause a decent wound channel because frankly if you can't get away (ie on the ground etc.) it's probably going to come down to killing someone.



    Sharks have had serrated teeth for millions of years, yes they work.

    A knife carried for self defense should ONLY be used for self defense

    This is more of a personal point but knives are also tools and most get used as such. I use a knife almost everyday for something, carry one pretty much everyday but have never used one in a self defense situation. I'm not going to carry two knives (one for self defense) and even if I did, in a high stress situation the brains going to go for the one you use everyday because that's a ingrained habit.

    The only connection with the Dundee vid were Australia, where it appears you are, and the point "that's not an appropriate knife.

    His Bowie was probably made in India.

    You read too much into it.
     
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    TurboTrout

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    I heard the issue with a knife for women’s self defense is a genetic issue where once they draw it they look for ingredients to make a sandwich lol

    jokes aside, think this is the best answer
    1614938762260.jpeg


    I’d say most attackers would just skip her as a target. A natural suspicious breed and with their legs they will be more than happy to run with her for as long as she can run.
     

    jbell

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    Unfortunately my daughters already have 2 dogs, and the are exactly runners or have a defensive bone in their body:
    3EAD35DC-1899-4E64-BF62-38FADD3F4854.jpeg

    A83E6D0C-4255-4287-818B-EBBC7B0A33B1.jpeg
     
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    pmclaine

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    I heard the issue with a knife for women’s self defense is a genetic issue where once they draw it they look for ingredients to make a sandwich lol

    jokes aside, think this is the best answer
    View attachment 7573627

    I’d say most attackers would just skip her as a target. A natural suspicious breed and with their legs they will be more than happy to run with her for as long as she can run.


    Just dont dock the tail and ears.......all the SJW willl be getting in her grill to say how cruel it is.
     
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    Leftie

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    Unfortunately my daughters already have 2 dogs, and the are exactly runners or have a defensive bone in their body:
    View attachment 7573634
    View attachment 7573635
    You would be surprised at just how protective "house pets" can be when put in the right situation. Goldens and Labs particularly are the cause of more severe bites in the United States than many would care to admit. If your dog enjoys playing with a rope toy and can hang on, then it will likely do the same to anything that it sets its mind on putting in its mouth, and the results are horrifyingly impressive.

    A few months ago a friend of mine nearly lost their finger due to breaking up a fight between their dog and another dog whose inattentive owner let it happen. Guess what... they were both over-stimulated adult Labradors, and it only took one good clamp to do serious damage. If a dog is bonded to its handler (pretty much if you feed and care for the dog consistently), it isn't uncommon for the dog to become extremely emotionally heightened and protective of their handler if something happens to them. If the doggos need some light PT, it might be worth her running with them if they can keep up. It's not going to be a 5-6 minute-mile pace over multiple miles (dogs literally don't have enough sweat glands in their bodies to thermo-regulate to the level needed to compete with humans over distance), but if it's a question of sprints, they will definitely keep up. One thing to keep in mind is that the leading preventable cause of death in working dogs is temperature emergencies - specifically heat-related.

    The other component of handling dogs that comes to mind is that it is a lifestyle, especially so if you choose to go down the protection route. You will spend tens of thousands of dollars (at least) on training and upkeep, and will likely spend at least 15 hours/week on upkeep and assorted interaction with your dog to keep them sharp. You'll also spend more time training yourself than you will the dog (because dog training is really 60% human training, and 40% training the dog, at best... some trainers say 80% human. 20% dog... because humans don't listen or understand how to read dog cues). I didn't know what I didn't know until I got into the dog world, and even now, I wouldn't begin to say that I know enough to say much definitively outside of "dogs are a lifestyle choice, especially if you want a very well-trained one".

    Situational awareness and a few tools carried on your body have a much more compact logistical footprint, and are much more widely adaptable in the long run, to any environment, as great as dogs are.
     

    Rthur

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    As far as running partner and protective dogs I like the Border Collie.
    Very family/pack oriented.
    A mass of intelligence and muscle.
    Unless you run marathons you'll not out distance them.
    Can be trained in minutes for minor tasks.
    Much easier that Malinois lol.

    R
     
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    Austan

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    Another potential option as if you haven't had enough. lol
    I wanted my wife to carry this one as it should be an easy deployment from a waistband pocket or armband after removing the clip and finding a way to fasten the kydex into the pocket so it stays there all the time. Ultimately she decided to carry her CRKT folder because she "likes it". She mostly goes out with the dog now who is very protective so it's not really the same situation.

     

    TurboTrout

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    Just dont dock the tail and ears.......all the SJW willl be getting in her grill to say how cruel it is.

    I’d get one who had their tail done (no issue as long as their do it when the pup is VERY young), the ears I can go ether way on, its nice having the full ears because they show so much of their emotion with their ears.
     

    coyotewillie

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    Quite honestly, the dog thing isn't a bad idea anyway. Most attackers, unless they surveil the victim and plan, don't know anything about the animal. Majority aren't going to risk getting their balls ripped off by a pet/guard dog protecting their owner. +1 for a knife, but even those big white fluffies pictured wouldn't be a bad idea either.
     

    Texasflyer

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    Im a mechanic sometimes, i carry a cheap lightning otf knife with the tanto blade. It is perfect for so many tasks other than just being kinda scary. I think an otf is the knife equivalent of cocking a 12 guage pump. Its light and strong and small and useful, also cheap at about 40 bucks.
     

    TurboTrout

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    Im a mechanic sometimes, i carry a cheap lightning otf knife with the tanto blade. It is perfect for so many tasks other than just being kinda scary. I think an otf is the knife equivalent of cocking a 12 guage pump. Its light and strong and small and useful, also cheap at about 40 bucks.


    R0c3ed48e5a23457f40b50b993e70a379
     
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    schmi015

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    If another dog is to be considered it either needs to be a Rhodesian Ridgeback(does well in heat), Weimaraner, GSP or Vizslas. They all love long runs/trail running. https://www.runnersworld.com/runners-stories/a20810747/the-best-types-of-dogs-for-runners/
    I may be biased toward Mals, but likely wont go down that road again when I get my next dog.
    Skeletonized and 6 oz

    That scabbard is yuuuge.
     

    Choid

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    i am going to tell you something you dont want to hear......but yes.....yes they can.

    1) most martial arts suck...karate sucks...judo sucks...muah thai sucks...thai chi sucks...TKD sucks....escrima sucks

    when you look at the realm of professional (non-disciplinary specific) fighters......they are learning BJJ, Krav, and boxing


    2) size/ strength matters....men by and large are genetically stronger and larger than women.....and even in martial arts that claim "size doesnt matter" like judo and Bjj......size fucking matters.....thats the reason why professional fighters are sorted by weight class, and not by "rank"......and its also why men dont fight women.

    a competent mid level male fighter in nearly every discipline will handily beat the shit out of the top women fighters......no contest......same goes for weight, you can take a 100lb BJJ black belt and put him against a 240lb BJJ purple belt......and they are going to be scraping that 100lb guy off the mat.

    when i was training in BJJ, there were 5' blue and purple rank women that simply could not execute the throws on me...technically everything they were doing was perfect...but the only way they could throw me was if i "assisted"......if i put up even a tiny bit of resistance, they just sat there dry humping me....martial arts are not magic, physics still apply.

    im not saying its a bad thing for women to train in martial arts......they just need to have a realistic expectation of what they can actually do, and what martial arts makes them think they can do.

    i see this all the time in training....especially doing full contact weapons retention training.....more often than not the guy coming in whos been training in some form of martial arts gets a wake up call when he gets thrown around like a rag doll by a guy whos been in construction for 20 yrs.
    This is good advice. Krav would be the optimal discipline for her situation. There is no good reason for her to learn something that emphasizes ground fighting. My opinion is, if you are a woman, and you want to learn self defense, discard any system that does not concentrate on testicle destruction, much as it pains me to say that.

    Also, bear spray.

    My assumption is that the interest in a pretty teenager running is not that of a serial killer, but of a sexual predator. Not a lot of that left with broken balls and a face full of bear spray, and explaining that to the authorities is non problematic.
     

    Choid

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    As far as running partner and protective dogs I like the Border Collie.
    Very family/pack oriented.
    A mass of intelligence and muscle.
    Unless you run marathons you'll not out distance them.
    Can be trained in minutes for minor tasks.
    Much easier that Malinois lol.

    R
    I've worked with both in their natural sports. I love both breeds. There are some really trainable Mal lines out there, and they are going to be a shit load better than a BC in protecting something, and no harder to train. Maybe easier in some ways, and a lot easier to find finished for protection stuff.

    Anyway, it really doesn't matter what breed of dog you run with. People are so unlikely to attack a person running with any dog that you should just pick the one you like. I would feel no less protected running with a black lab than I would a pit bull or whatever. It's just bad criminal sense to choose a victim with a dog if you can go look for one without.
     

    Lazlo

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    I used to run with one of these. You run holding the "ball" of the club in one hand, and the shaft aligns with your arm. Surprisingly light and easy to move with... almost like the Masai in Kenya who've been running constantly for the last 3,000yrs were onto something.

    When needed, you simply release your grip on the ball, and gravity extends the shaft. You now have a 24" ass whooper that's useful on people or dogs. It's just a piece of wood, so local laws for knives/daggers becomes moot.

    I've seen a few neighbors take a renewed interest in controlling their dogs when this thing drops out of my hand.

    It's called a rungu club. Pretty sure you can buy one online for $10 or so.

    RunguClubWClr.jpg
     
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    Rthur

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    I've worked with both in their natural sports. I love both breeds. There are some really trainable Mal lines out there, and they are going to be a shit load better than a BC in protecting something, and no harder to train. Maybe easier in some ways, and a lot easier to find finished for protection stuff.

    Anyway, it really doesn't matter what breed of dog you run with. People are so unlikely to attack a person running with any dog that you should just pick the one you like. I would feel no less protected running with a black lab than I would a pit bull or whatever. It's just bad criminal sense to choose a victim with a dog if you can go look for one without.
    Have been around both.
    Unless one has solid training skills, best leave the mals for the experts.
    Average folks BC can be handled most times.

    R
     

    Choid

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    Have been around both.
    Unless one has solid training skills, best leave the mals for the experts.
    Average folks BC can be handled most times.

    R
    I will definitely agree that people who shouldn't have mals have mals, and that a mal malcontent is a lot more dangerous than a BC, who is more likely to ruin an apartment than a leg. I have kelpies, which I would kind of say Kelpie:Border Collie::Mal:GSD, but like BCs, they don't really like to bite. But I really don't think most people should have Border Collies either. Too many people who do are city twats who like to say their dog is the smartest, just like their kid. But there are also really good lines of Mals these days that don't require the neanderthal training techniques of two decades ago.
     
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    Rthur

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    I will definitely agree that people who shouldn't have mals have mals, and that a mal malcontent is a lot more dangerous than a BC, who is more likely to ruin an apartment than a leg. I have kelpies, which I would kind of say Kelpie:Border Collie::Mal:GSD, but like BCs, they don't really like to bite. But I really don't think most people should have Border Collies either. Too many people who do are city twats who like to say their dog is the smartest, just like their kid.
    Do you live in the city?

    R
     

    Bigfatcock

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    Titanium smatchet or GTFO.

    On a real note, I’d go with a titanium blade. Lightweight, and no corrosion issues from sweat. They come very sharp, and since you’re not using it to process firewood, edge maintenance isn’t too much of an issue.

    Reach out to mad science forge. He will probably be able to make your thoughts a reality with quality titanium.

    This thread reminds me of something funny I read: “ I know judo, and if you force me to prove it then I’ll shoot you.”
     

    madmikes262

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    When I was on the job undercover I wore a Cold Steel small one around my neck.It was in alittle sheath and with alittle practice it was easy to deploy.Light weight ,not exspensive.I bought a chain to wear it around my neck.
     

    steve123

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    I like the semiauto Co2 pellet pistol idea but only with pellets dipped in poison dart frog toxin. How's that for dorky but fun! :cool:;) :D🤪

    If they run off they live, if not then nobody has to worry about getting perped by that one again.
     
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    MudRunner2005

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    I know I'm late to the party, and it might be hard to find because they don't make them anymore, but if you can find a Spyderco Bradley 2 Folder with the real carbon fiber scales, it is ridiculously sharp, very lightweight for it's size, and large enough to do some real damage to an attacker. 👍🏼

    A Microtech HALO, UltraTech, or Troodon is also always a good option. Push button, blade deploys, stab offender... 👍🏼

    The Spyderco Bradley 2 Folder is on the bottom. I use the Gerber Flatiron (top) for work everyday. It's a hoss, and a great utility knife.

    Knife.jpeg
     
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    pmclaine

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    Titanium smatchet or GTFO.

    On a real note, I’d go with a titanium blade. Lightweight, and no corrosion issues from sweat. They come very sharp, and since you’re not using it to process firewood, edge maintenance isn’t too much of an issue.

    Reach out to mad science forge. He will probably be able to make your thoughts a reality with quality titanium.

    This thread reminds me of something funny I read: “ I know judo, and if you force me to prove it then I’ll shoot you.”


    The minimum standard of performance with training........

     
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    Choid

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    The more I think of this, the more I think a knife is a terrible idea. I mean, she should have one for utility purposes, but the likelihood of a 16 year old girl using a knife on an attacker, even if in mortal danger, is close to zero. I obviously don't know your daughter, but if she is like any other 16 year old I've known, it isn't a good idea.

    I still think a dog is the best idea, really any breed, because it keeps people away. Then bear spray, which has a much better radius than a knife, and then maybe an extendable baton. With that at least she can swing away and try to kneecap somebody before he gets too close. I just think a knife requires a certain mentality.
     

    Longshot231

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    The more I think of this, the more I think a knife is a terrible idea. I mean, she should have one for utility purposes, but the likelihood of a 16 year old girl using a knife on an attacker, even if in mortal danger, is close to zero. I obviously don't know your daughter, but if she is like any other 16 year old I've known, it isn't a good idea.

    I still think a dog is the best idea, really any breed, because it keeps people away. Then bear spray, which has a much better radius than a knife, and then maybe an extendable baton. With that at least she can swing away and try to kneecap somebody before he gets too close. I just think a knife requires a certain mentality.

    Lana Turner’s daughter did a number on Johnny Stomponato.
     

    Bigfatcock

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    The man wants a knife for his daughter. A knife is for stabbing and slashing. Stabbing someone with something sharp object is better than scratching with fingernails.

    she’s not trying to be the worlds best knife fighter, just needs a sharp metal object to stab and slash if attacked by surprise.

    Her number one defense is running fast. The knife is for the oh shit.