- Thread starter Schw15
- Start date
Last summer, a cold front blew through and dropped a little rain. We were camping and shooting ELR, so our targets were up and we were ready to roll before sunrise. It was the best light + air I've ever had for ELR. The target at 2650 yards had knee-high grass in front of it. Even through our cheapo Celestion spotting scope, I could see the grass clearly. Shooting through a Vortex Razor Gen 2, calling the wind was simple. The target was painted white and we could see the stain of the impacts clearly. It's normally not that easy.
I'm running a Valdada 16x fixed usign holds. My first real glass.
Same , Love it but Steiner seems to get no love here lol
Hi I have run many scopes and now run a ZCO 4-20 , PM2 5-25 PF4 . Stiener t5-25 SCR, USO B25-H102 , PM2 5-45 Tremor 3 , Swarovski v8I 2.3x18 SFP .bushnell DMR 11 3x18 , Tangent theta 3x15 mildot 30mm tube , IOR 3.5-18X50 MP8 , I use only FFP optics and all my optics are MIL , except 1. which is my Swarovski V8I 2.3x18 which is a SFP MOA , not a big fan of the 5 zero ballistic turret , but I love the glass in this scope for hunting.
SO I have a lot of choiceS , But I usually seem to go to my favorites most of the time , which are my PM2 5-25 Pf4 . and I love the ZCO with MPCt 2 .
My future scope I will sell off some here and I really would like to get the ZCO 5x27 and try the new MPCT- 3
LOU
SO I have a lot of choiceS , But I usually seem to go to my favorites most of the time , which are my PM2 5-25 Pf4 . and I love the ZCO with MPCt 2 .
My future scope I will sell off some here and I really would like to get the ZCO 5x27 and try the new MPCT- 3
LOU
Interesting to note here...saw a guy at my range sell his Steiner M7Xi because he went back to his Gen II Razor.
S&B 3-27x56 Hi-Power H2CMR
NF 7-35x56 ATACR Mil-C
NF 7-35x56 ATACR Mil-C
I woke up ignorant and bliss.....and then you had to say that....now I'm jealous....I've been eyeballing 37XC....and I need a scope that has a little more magnification for those times you want to shoot 2 States over.
If it makes you feel any better, I didn't get the 6-60 - "just" the 4-40. And if you're getting close on the 37XC, @jasent has some dies he was trying to get rid of.
Excited to hear about this scope. Way out of my price haha but doesnt it have a crazy amount of mils? 140?
Still have them. Happy to sell or trade
Yeah, it essentially is a fixed elevation and windage tube with external adjustment all encased in a housing. It's a pretty simple and innovative design that allows a lot more travel.
Now, I'll justify the price... at least it's how I justified it to myself
- Most scopes have roughly 30 mil of elevation travel. A few go to 34-35ish, but tend to be in the 5-25 range (ATACR - 5-25 - 34 mil, ZCO - 5-27 - 35 mil).
- Either of those by themselves will only get you so far, so you'd need more - those are also only 25/27 max magnification. The 7-35 ATACR only goes to like 30 mil.
- One choice is a mount like an Era Tac or an Ivey to get more elevation.
- The Era Tac only gets you 20 mil. I just got one for my 300, and it will work there, but adding that to even one of the 34-35 mil scopes will get 55 mil - pretty good, but not quite a 2-mile setup.
- The Ivey goes to 70 mil, but looked just too unwieldy for me. It also costs ~$800. When you add that to the cost of even an ATACR, you're not so far away from the price of the March.
- You could also get a Charlie Tarac, but with any applicable scope, the cost goes above what a March costs. There are other advantages and disadvantages, but I won't go into each here.
Flawed or not, that's the reasoning that led me to the March.
Well maybe im thinking they are more than they are haha. I dont have a 2 mile rifle or even a place that far. Wish i did. Shoot to 2100 yards very maxYeah, it essentially is a fixed elevation and windage tube with external adjustment all encased in a housing. It's a pretty simple and innovative design that allows a lot more travel.
Now, I'll justify the price... at least it's how I justified it to myself
- Most scopes have roughly 30 mil of elevation travel. A few go to 34-35ish, but tend to be in the 5-25 range (ATACR - 5-25 - 34 mil, ZCO - 5-27 - 35 mil).
- Either of those by themselves will only get you so far, so you'd need more - those are also only 25/27 max magnification. The 7-35 ATACR only goes to like 30 mil.
- One choice is a mount like an Era Tac or an Ivey to get more elevation.
- The Era Tac only gets you 20 mil. I just got one for my 300, and it will work there, but adding that to even one of the 34-35 mil scopes will get 55 mil - pretty good, but not quite a 2-mile setup.
- The Ivey goes to 70 mil, but looked just too unwieldy for me. It also costs ~$800. When you add that to the cost of even an ATACR, you're not so far away from the price of the March.
- You could also get a Charlie Tarac, but with any applicable scope, the cost goes above what a March costs. There are other advantages and disadvantages, but I won't go into each here.
Flawed or not, that's the reasoning that led me to the March.
Two miles with access to set targets is tough to find unless you're out in the desert somewhere. I think a spot where I've been once (accessible only during the winter/spring) will get me to about 3k, but I might be able to find a lane to 2 miles there.
For summer months I'll have to travel 3 hours or more to find a suitable spot.
This is all for my new build. My current 300 PRC currently only dials to ~2100, but I also just got an Era Tac that will extend that by as far as is reasonable for that rifle.
I have an 8-32X 56 Nightforce Benchrest and a 6-24x50 Vortex Viper PST sitting on my 6.5 CM bolt action rifles. I’ve used both just shoot 850 yards. I would use them out to 1200 yards if I had somewhere I could shoot that distance.
I have a 10-50X Sightron and it has served me well, feels like you get a lot of scope for the cash and I have pushed it out to 1000 with ease (wish I could find somewhere with more range).
I wish mine had zero stop but I like the reticle and its been solid in every way.
Picked up a 7-35X ATACR recently so at some point I will take both to the range for a head to head comparison.
I also have a Swarovski ATX spotting scope that I compared to the ATACR and while the ATACR put up an admirable fight the Swarovski is amazing (crazy clear). Not apples to apples I know but the Swarovski made me change my mindset a little in that I now rate clarity over magnification (which I had the other way around before).
I have gotten a real itch for a ZCO of late though.......
That is a well thought out list of reasons. If I may be so bold as to add one more: with the Genesis, you are always looking through the middle, the sweet spot of the glass, experiencing the very best IQ from that superb High Master glass.Yeah, it essentially is a fixed elevation and windage tube with external adjustment all encased in a housing. It's a pretty simple and innovative design that allows a lot more travel.
Now, I'll justify the price... at least it's how I justified it to myself
- Most scopes have roughly 30 mil of elevation travel. A few go to 34-35ish, but tend to be in the 5-25 range (ATACR - 5-25 - 34 mil, ZCO - 5-27 - 35 mil).
- Either of those by themselves will only get you so far, so you'd need more - those are also only 25/27 max magnification. The 7-35 ATACR only goes to like 30 mil.
- One choice is a mount like an Era Tac or an Ivey to get more elevation.
- The Era Tac only gets you 20 mil. I just got one for my 300, and it will work there, but adding that to even one of the 34-35 mil scopes will get 55 mil - pretty good, but not quite a 2-mile setup.
- The Ivey goes to 70 mil, but looked just too unwieldy for me. It also costs ~$800. When you add that to the cost of even an ATACR, you're not so far away from the price of the March.
- You could also get a Charlie Tarac, but with any applicable scope, the cost goes above what a March costs. There are other advantages and disadvantages, but I won't go into each here.
Flawed or not, that's the reasoning that led me to the March.
Edit: Fixed typo.
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A Swaro spotter is well above atacr glass.
the ZCO and TT glass will hang well with your Swaro with clarity and that weirdly pleasant mirage that you get will great glass.
Kahles DLR
Steiner M7Xi 4-28x56 IFS w/ MSR2 reticle on my 300 prc
IFS system is expensive, but once you upload your load data, pair the LRF binos and kestrel via bluetooth. There is nothing else like it.
IFS system is expensive, but once you upload your load data, pair the LRF binos and kestrel via bluetooth. There is nothing else like it.
I used cabelas scopes for years. My dad can still outshoot me using a cabelas scope. Round count and time behind a weapons system will be infinitely more valuable than any upgrade or glass money can buy.
I'm using the same on my 300 PRC. I love the dials and the optics. I have two beefs with the scope:
1) The available elevation is a little short. I have a 20 MOA rail and had a 20 MOA mount that would get me to about 26 mil - this was about 2100 yards max dial at relatively normal altitudes.
2) Due to the above, you might find yourself needing to hold over depending on your mount and rail, and the MSR2 is not a great hold-over reticle.
I just got an Era Tac which cost me the 20 MOA in the mount, but got me 20 mil back in return.
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@Rocketmandb lol there are no ranges near DFW that come anywhere close to those kind of targets.
Atacr 7x35x56
I've been running the same since 2008 and have hit the elevation limit increasingly, so starting to look at the 3-27x with MT2 turrets for 39.5 mils of elevation or maybe I'm cool enough to get a ZCO now?
I wish Khales kept the AMR reticle, which I think is a great ELR reticle.
Ya i agree
i personally dont care for the DLR
i have had it a month . will most likely sell it and go back to NF
I like simple reticles with floating dots. Not drop lines but hard to come by. The minox lr has treated me very well so far. But hearing the new Bushnell xr3 is a atarc killer lol idk anything about it but a g3 with floating dots
Shooting the 338 Lapua at 1 mile and 375 CheyTac at 2 mile, on both of these I have been using the Schmit and Bender P ll with H59. I have used many others but have made my choice with S&B for ELR. For the 1,000 yard shoots I have been using the Nightforce NX8 4-32X50 with Mil-X reticle and it has worked fine.
You like the h59? I hated that reticle very cluddered but I also don't shoot to 2 miles if I had a place I would for sure
dang it...
I was all set with the S&B PM II 5-45X56 High Power and @Rocketmandb makes me have to rethink and analyze all over again.
why did you decide on the 40X instead of the 60X?Note that I haven't received it yet
Isn't extra power like HPs in cars... don't always need it, but it's nice to have when you do?
what was the deciding factor? For me, I tend to shoot ELR with less zoom than many. With my current 3-27 Steiner, the only time I'm up at the 27 is when I'm spotting through it. Even at 2k+ yards, I seldom hit 20x. Now, with my new build, I'll be going a lot farther, but I couldn't see myself needing more than 40x - and paying the extra $$ for the 60.
If you look at what the Ko2M guys are using, it's mostly stuff that maxes out at 25x.
A lot of people smoke dope it does make it a good choice or selection. Nothing aginst wink or his reports. They are useful but not the end all.
the March is sick glass
Curious to hear what you don't like about the DLR? I am looking at getting one.
you receive your March yet? I'm curious on your first impression.
Hey guys I have 1 range trip (~40rounds) on an awesome new setup. Right now its on a Ruger RAP 6.5 but I have other plans already. I am going to get use to this setup on the 6.5 until the other build is done then plop it on that.
Basically its an Ivey 200MOA base with a Sightron SIII 10-50 MOA-1 reticle. I bore sighted and shot it from 100 to 1000, then with the last 4 rounds was able to get on the sighting plate at 1250 (personal best). I've loaded some other rounds to try to stretch the legs on this one.
Elevation is so easy, just dial base (close) and hold reticle. no calculations about 20 MOA rail but 15MOA rings, then dial 12 and hold 6 more... I figured by the time you buy all those MOA adders your half way to the Ivey anyway. The base has markings down to 2.5 MOA increments. It has resettable zero which is also cool. It shipped fast. It is super beefy 6 hole rings. Base is legit thick as shit.
The scope is jacked up on the poor rubbermaid stock that I just shoot right handed and spot with my dominant eye. Since I heavily spent on the base, I skipped on the scope and got the best glass and turrets for the money. It doesn't have the biggest tube(who care with 200MOA), illumination, but the glass is great, on 24x I have 1 MOA hashes for holds. At 48x the hashes are 1/2 MOA holds. It has zero stop, but I doubt I'll use that much. It was just about a grand$. I figure this way your also looking through the center of the glass where it *should be the crispest. Being more of an F class scope and SFP its a little funky but I figure I will stay on 24 or 48 power. I was glassing yesterday and I was able to spot a loop crimp on a telephone pole wire about 500yds away. I can't wait to stretch the legs on this thing and try some early morning groups at 1250.
Basically its an Ivey 200MOA base with a Sightron SIII 10-50 MOA-1 reticle. I bore sighted and shot it from 100 to 1000, then with the last 4 rounds was able to get on the sighting plate at 1250 (personal best). I've loaded some other rounds to try to stretch the legs on this one.
Elevation is so easy, just dial base (close) and hold reticle. no calculations about 20 MOA rail but 15MOA rings, then dial 12 and hold 6 more... I figured by the time you buy all those MOA adders your half way to the Ivey anyway. The base has markings down to 2.5 MOA increments. It has resettable zero which is also cool. It shipped fast. It is super beefy 6 hole rings. Base is legit thick as shit.
The scope is jacked up on the poor rubbermaid stock that I just shoot right handed and spot with my dominant eye. Since I heavily spent on the base, I skipped on the scope and got the best glass and turrets for the money. It doesn't have the biggest tube(who care with 200MOA), illumination, but the glass is great, on 24x I have 1 MOA hashes for holds. At 48x the hashes are 1/2 MOA holds. It has zero stop, but I doubt I'll use that much. It was just about a grand$. I figure this way your also looking through the center of the glass where it *should be the crispest. Being more of an F class scope and SFP its a little funky but I figure I will stay on 24 or 48 power. I was glassing yesterday and I was able to spot a loop crimp on a telephone pole wire about 500yds away. I can't wait to stretch the legs on this thing and try some early morning groups at 1250.
Nope. Got pushed out to a Sept 15 ship date. I'm not sweating it too much because my barrel's not getting shipped until the end of the month, and still no word on my action.
USO FDN?
Currently run Steiner M7Xi 4-28 with MSR2 reticle, love it.
Want: Tangent Theta (Love the zero change parallax), S&B 5-45 PMII High Power - would love to see what magnification that high is like at distance.
And, Steiner IFS if they develop it further - would love to see an integrated range finder/weather station thats part of the unit to provide shooting solution without having to integrate a kestrel, terrapin etc; probably wishful thinking. I remember seeing Vortex (i think) had a prototype like this for a military contract they were competing for, but i cant remember where i saw it, hence the trip down the rabbit hole LOL.
Want: Tangent Theta (Love the zero change parallax), S&B 5-45 PMII High Power - would love to see what magnification that high is like at distance.
And, Steiner IFS if they develop it further - would love to see an integrated range finder/weather station thats part of the unit to provide shooting solution without having to integrate a kestrel, terrapin etc; probably wishful thinking. I remember seeing Vortex (i think) had a prototype like this for a military contract they were competing for, but i cant remember where i saw it, hence the trip down the rabbit hole LOL.
