love her. takes no prisoners from either side.

If your velocity made a difference in how your reticle tracked - imagine trying to spot for the guy next to you who is shooting a different cartridge.

"Come up 1.5 mils, Bob"
"1.5 mils for a Creedmoor or an ARC?"

LRRPF52 said:

Russia has deteriorated significantly in its military industrial capacity. They always cranked out low airframe life trash, but now their fighter-manufacturing has been consolidated into a tiny building in Eastern Russia much closer to Japan than it is to Moscow. They are a shell of their former selves when it comes to MIC.

The US and almost every other nation doesn’t want Russia at the doorstep of Poland, Romania, Slovakia, and Hungary again. It has nothing to do with political ideology and everything to do with containment of a bad actor who disrupted regional stability.

Russia showed the world though that it can’t even take ground like it did when it was equipped with US Lend-Lease in WWII, so nobody is going to take them as seriously anymore. 3 years and how much did the map change vs the cemeteries?

Trump tried to massage an offramp for Putin, which he didn’t take. Trump framed the peace talks in a way as if Putin could claim victory and then cease fire, but instead of doing that, Putin thought he could flex and continue fighting. So now he ticked off Trump, who will now likely start to give Ukraine game-changing weapons, not the outdated obsolete stuff we were going to de-mil.

The mantra about this being a US MIC-funded and focused campaign is retarded, as I’ve said repeatedly. All the major US and even European contractors are way back-ordered to entirely different countries who pay top dollar. Ukraine is not one of them.

There are no trillions being sent to Ukraine. I agree in US first, and those are entirely different line-items in the National budget.

The mineral deal is the best proposal anyone has put forth in this whole mess, as it places a major political barrier on Putin and Russia from violating a peace deal.

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damn. neocons gotta neocon.
the billions in cash weapons and misc aid that has gone to Ukraine is all a hallucination? everyone aware or involved,including the Obiden crew is making that up?
the known,documented and confirmed luxury spending by Z,his wife and his posse is just stuff made up by Putin?
the US labeled weapons sent to Ukraine and recovered from or seen in the hands of cartel players is just Russian photo shopping?
the billions going to our MIC doesn't come from Ukraine-true. comes from the US taxpayer. it is funneled back to them after passing thru Uke hands. ie after a large handling fee. that was even admitted in a dem congressional speech.
i guess Russia has really gone balls to the wall and can't win at all. or,maybe,they learned their lesson in WW2 with 8+ mil combat deaths. gave up on the mass frontal assault thing and trying something else? hard to know but we learned nothing in VN or ME. but low cost,only about 65K or so KIA.
the freely admitted about 50% of cash sent to Ukraine being missing and unable to be accounted for is just fine.
oh my,oh my we and "other nations" don't want Russia moving west. who gives a fuck? let the "other nations" (on the same continent) deal with it.
we have never had anything to lose in Europe worth 1$ or 1 life. we have spent much more than that since 1917. president TJ could not have been more right. meanwhile the Chinese now and yes the Russians in the past have and are jerking us around in the w.hemisphere.
you believe in US 1st? bull shit you mean after w.Europe,Ukraine and Israel have their needs met and their defense paid for. oh,and after our mil contractors have made as much money as they want.
all of our and Europe's contractors are back ordered? hard to see where the Europeans are making anything substantial other than weapons to sell elsewhere. they certainly don't seem to want to employ them in their own defense.
you seem to have a lot of tech data. wonder if it's open source. maybe just fed to you by the Mcconnell/Graham fan club if it's not?
fact is Trump was the 1st to send stuff to Ukraine. his mineral deal is just bullshit. depends on who you believe but some say most that's there is in places that the Russ already control. hate to say it,i am a big supporter,but his handling of Ukraine is just abysmal. i can chalk his 1st aiding Uke to being lied to and tricked by Pompeo and Pence. he claimed he could end it in 1 day before he got installed. truth. pull every human,every $,every bullet out on day 1-game over,
OMG! we have to stop the new Hitler! yea Putin is corrupt,brutal and self serving. he's a politicin and a lawyer and a KGB guy. doesn't appear to be irrational. our good friends of Saudi,UAE,Kuwait,UK,Germany,France and most of all Israel are all run by honest,gentle,caring,sympathetic and kindly people. esp our new bud in Syria.

CK1.0 said:

Huh?

I re-read the OP’s initial post and can’t see where he’s telling us anything that rules out tracking?

That said, I guess the OP could double check his math after he chronos his gun, because speed/MV absolutely affects how much a click = distance per inch.

If he’s going 2800fps a click at 100 yards would be 0.4”, so 5 mils would print 20” above his zero. So If he isn’t sure how fast his gun is going, then looking for 18” at 100 yards with 5 mils dialed on the scope may not even be the correct number to be looking for.

Doing it the way he’s doing it is iffy at best, guessing 5 mils will print 18” high without knowing one’s true MV and BC is kind of pointless/indecisive.

He’s got to chrono it if he wants to do it the way he’s doing it, but even then it depends on the math. Using a tracking target or taking it out further would be far more decisive.

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The opposite he tells us exactly that the scope is not tracking.

How much the reticle moves has zero to do with velocity. He adjusts the turret 5 mils and instead of going 5 mils it’s going more

3.6”=1mil@100yards and 3.6x5=18”

19”/3.6=5.278

37-37.5/3.6”=10.27-10.42

oldrifleman said:

They change impact points dope is based on bullet ballistics and measured velocity

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And if those all stay the same: at 100yards, how much should the scopes adjustment either scale or jump from what has been dialed?

Fig said:

Many NDs are holstering and unholstering. Yes, not an issue for most of us. It just is for genpop, and the careless. Manual safeties prevent glockleg. Unless someone is comfortable and knows what they’re doing it’s better to have one than not. Those of us who grew up with them they’re no big deal. If you grew up with only plastic fantastic striker pistols I can see why you would think them unnecessary, but for most people they can prevent NDs, and that’s all there is to it.

Mas Ayoob teaches people to shoot through panic rather than learning to fight panic, remain calm, and breathe. Why, because it’s not a six week combat course. For the love of God!

He teaches a seminar and done, and that’s the most effective way to teach self defense with a pistol in a single seminar to people who aren’t going to train and practice. Shit, some people who have work guns barely practice.

They don’t need to learn to be gunfighters. They need to learn the basics and to shoot through panic, because guess what? They’re gona panic.

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Mas ayoob opinion on guns?
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Trigger Monkey said:

I've never heard of muzzle velocities changing click values. Tell me more.

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They change impact points dope is based on bullet ballistics and measured velocity

Trigger Monkey said:

I've never heard of muzzle velocities changing click values. Tell me more.

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That's only for MOA shooters...

I've never heard of muzzle velocities changing click values. Tell me more.

Congrats! I am Jealous, I have to wait 10 more months...

sirhrmechanic said:

And the Abrams is a smooth bore. So it has very different dynamics from a rifled barrel. It's more like a blowgun than a rifle. It doesn't have the same twisting or resistance of a rifled projectile.

So it can get away with much thinner walls. And it is all backed up with electronics. IIRC it's a German gun and stabilization system. Krupp or Rhinemetal. The accuracy comes from the fire control computers.

As for the barrel to bore diameters on a 16"... Not as thin as one thinks! And if you look at the breech area (much lower pressure back there than a rifle round, too) the working area is pretty thick. Look, too, at the OAL. It's short and stubby (even though it looks long and thin). View attachment 8682767

As for structured barrels, they have been around a while in artillery and similar applications. But can be expensive to make vs. the cost of using 'regular' barrels and swapping them out often or using fire control computing to make up for the deficiencies. And now using smart munitions.

None of that is an option in a small arm/precision rifle that has to be toted from place to place in competition or the field.

Cheers,

Sirhr

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Doing the math for the 16"-50 guns is the equivalent of a 15" 308 barrel or 13.2" 6.5 bore.

The way I read the OP, he shot at group at his zero. He then fired (2) shots at 5 mils, and another (2) shots at 10 mils. Unfortunately for him the shots didn't land where he thought they should

That would be a form of tracking test.

I would repeat it by drawing 1 mil marks up to 10 from a zero, lock his optic or rifle down, and just adjust the scope and see if everything lines up. If it doesn't his original tracking test is confirmed and the scope needs to go to Leupold.

oldrifleman said:

Not from what he wrote. His test is not a tracking test ( checks repeatability) but seems to be about checking that it matches known dope.

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Ragin_cajun said:

So here’s the problem, new scope I mounted right before a PRS match and my dope seemed to be off at longer distances. After trying to figure out what I was doing wrong I decided to test the tracking. I shot a group at zero then 2 at 5mil and 2 at 10mil all @100yrds. Problem is with 5mil the point of impact is moving 19” instead of 18 and at 10mil it’s moving 37-37.5”. Doesn’t seem like much but shooting .5mil high at longer ranges makes a difference. Do you guys see anything I could be doing to cause this or just a tracking issue? I shot the groups round robin to see shifts. View attachment 8682707

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He said the new scope wasn't "tracking" with his existing dope, and then did a tracking test.
Definitely looks like a normal tracking test, which it has indeed failed.

mattmcg said:

Starting to get my MWS upgraded to get it out shooting again. Have a 15.5" MLOK upper and am getting it outfit with some Dwilson Arca rails. What do you guys recommend for Atlas compatible bipod adapters?

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Pricey, but this is what you want.

918v said:

So it will be like the Iran-Iraq war back in the day, except with extra jet action.

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Iran Iraq war was an endless cannon-fodder human-wave attack massacre...

Battalions of Iranian kids (and I mean kids... 12 - 15) were given magic keys that they were told would protect them from bullets and sent charging across mine fields to clear a path for the Iranian soldiers. Artillary slugging matches.

Doubt USA China would work that way. Both had enough of that in Korea! More possible on the India/Pak border. But doubt it. Both have pretty professional armies.

Iran/Iraq was an attrition slaughter. The Ayotollah's threw away an entire generation of kids... Saddam was not much better. And in the end, Iraq ended up devastated and in Debt. Iran ended up with a lost generation. For nothing. No ground gained or lost. Over something like 8 years!

High intensity conflicts among heavily-armed second world armies are never going to be pretty.

Sirhr

Lawless said:

View attachment 8682536

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She got three days - darling.

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CaptNkllm said:

The Trinity never existed before the council of nicaea. The Trinity does not exist. There is only one God his name is Jesus.
Plz explain again to me who the trinity exists in the Bible. The word is not in the Bible and there is the SPIRIT of the Old Testament and a body in the New Testament . Very simple.. since we are made in his image GODS? How could we be made in the image of God? God is a spirit. So when that baby was born of the HolyGhost (Father). Is. Is tranferred by the blood of the male (Adam). The babies blood comes from the Dad and Adam’s sin was passed down.

Eph 4:4-6 one body (like you with flesh and spirit).
2 Corinth 5:19 God was in Christ reconciling the world unto himself.. hmm God the spirit was in Christ?

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Who the hell was Jesus praying to and talking to? Saying Jesus is God, but there was no God in Heaven when he was on earth, and not believing that the holy spirit that is also part of makes you what?

For me “The Trinity” is a way to explain something in a not wrong way, but certainly not a complete understanding by any stretch. But it doesn’t have to make perfect scientific sense, because a lot of it doesn’t.

Since you know more than any Christian theologians (these aren’t my original ideas, ha) explain to me how God is outside of time? When you can explain that I’ll explain precisely how God can be in more than one place and be perceived by us as more than one being.

I suspect that you think this is clever, and only you are a true Christian because you only consider Jesus God, but to me it’s a distinction without a difference, and it isn’t supported, because sometimes two things that would seem to conflict can both be true, and that’s one of the keys to glimpsing part of the answer to some of these mysteries.

But, I’m glad you think anyone who believes in or thinks about it in terms of a Trinity isn’t a Christian, because that only puts you in the cult. Not the largest and oldest sect of Christians.

Adam’s sin IS consciousness, or self awareness if you will. The fruit in the garden was on "The Tree of Knowledge". It’s our understanding of good and evil, like God understood it, not some physical pathogen in blood. Satan even tells Eve that she can be like God if she eats! Our original sin is our loss of innocence and the ability to choose evil over good when we (even innately) know the difference.

You need to go to Bible Study.

6.5x55, consider going with a Sendero or Medium Palma taper barrel.

Bump price drop.

Retired last year. It's great.