Being a lefty not as many options as what I'd like. Wanted a short barrel an stayed budget friendly since I was gonna cut it. Savage Apex Hunter. Weight is with Otter Cree Labs Polonium 30 on the end. Gonna do some development this week with 4831sc,560,RL23 an 565 maybe RL26. Peterson brass 162ELDM gonna use Federal Large rifle match an magnum match. Probably start .30 or .50 off
Definitely interested in your results with the 162 ELD-X. I don't have RL26 on hand but plenty of H1000. 20" barrel on your rifle?
18 inch. I have 2lbs of RL26 I want to see how the faster burning powders do first. If I don't get what I like for velocity an accuracy I'll probably try h1000 an rl26 then I hate to use the 26 lol. I'm hoping does good with the other powders since their more available. I got 3lbs of rl23 already so high hopes for it.
If you don't hand load I'd only buy Federal. 3100fps for 24 inch barrel on box. 18 inch barrel 3000 thats impressive. Testing powders with 162ELDMs this morning working up RL23 an V560 look pretty good over 2800 an no pressure signs. Just under book max.
I don't see a Federal loading in 7 PRC with the 162 ELD-X. New release?
I think he's talking about the 155gr.
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www.federalpremium.com I think he's talking about the 155gr.
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Yes...was confused. Thank you!
Yeah bought a box of 155s shot just to see before shooting my reloads which are 162ELDM
Idk if ita setting depth or short barrel or what but I thought RL26 would of did a little better than 23. Still not accuracy I'm looking for got 139 rounds down barrel now so Idk if it'll speed up anymore I'd like to get it about 3/4 inch. 1 inch has been it so far might be all I get. Federals were about .90 an did decent idk may go out further. Only got ELDx left now gotta clean some brass then try again. Wasting powder an primers that you can't find right now lol
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Following up. Got time to shoot again today. 18” carbon six tikka prefit, 180 hybrid, Peterson brass, N570.
73.5gr average 2859. 73.0gr averaged 2833. Groups from today list today’s date (everything but the top left two). Used the same cardboard as last trip.
Edit- something to note, last time I shot these loads I was using a hybrid 46 suppressor. This trip was with a scythe ti.
73.5gr average 2859. 73.0gr averaged 2833. Groups from today list today’s date (everything but the top left two). Used the same cardboard as last trip.
Edit- something to note, last time I shot these loads I was using a hybrid 46 suppressor. This trip was with a scythe ti.
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That's sweet for 180s you liking the 570 over the 560 an 565? Groups look nice. How far off lands are you? Suppressor intrigues me I've been running my Resonator R2 quieter but had intended on using my Polonium 30.
I haven’t tried 560 or 565. I had like 14lb of 570 leftover from a 300prc I sold so I figured I’d give it a shot. So far I’m a fan.
I came up with .065 jump. 2.5935 cbto.
Very happy with the scythe so far, but this is only my second range trip with it.
Good deal don't blame you there. I never tried that far I went .050 with the 162s. Got some loaded up for 10, 20 an 30, might try some touching just to see. The 560 an 565 have pretty good sd. I've got plenty of speed just working on group with 560 an RL23 maybe 565. Got couple pounds of the 23 so hoping it works out if not I've decide with prices anymore I'm buying 8lbs of everything I can.
Can anyone with Hawkins hunter bottom metal and a spare Hawkins hunter norma mag tell me if the 7 PRC will cycle the rounds and feed properly with the Norma sized magazine and how many cartridges you fit in the magazine? Pretty please
I think if you look back at the early Hornady 7prc loads you’ll find they were much faster than the current loads. They also were causing stiff bolt lift and blown primers in rifles, mine included. I believe Hornady adjusted their recipe to a lower/safer pressure and now we are stuck with slower Hornady factory ammo. Federal seems to have gotten it figured out though.
The ammo I bought was from a year ago and I have not had a problem. I have not bought any new ammo recently. So, you are saying that damage from too much velocity made them bring it down. Jim Harmer is saying that some mysterious person he knows says that they cannot get the same powder they started with.
Then he goes on to say that this is really about the rivalry between them and 6.8 Western.
I will still get good use out of my 7 PRC, even if I switch to Federal.
And I have liked Federal in other rifles (my other rifles are .308.) One gets good results with Fusion 165 gr and another .308 with a medium bull barrel likes the Federal Nontypical Whitetail 180 gr. Granted, these are hunting rounds and I might get better with match ammo. My primary activity is hunting, though I have heard of people bringing game with match ammo. And others who prefer the all copper expanders.
I am only speculating based on what I’ve seen from the early lots compared to what’s been coming out lately.
I’m sure there is some competition and inflating between the 7prc and the 6.8 but as federal has proven, the 7prc is capable of much more velocity than Hornady is achieving. I really wish he had shot some of the federal to compare.
He might but right now, it is a click-bait thing. Controversy gets views.
Like his video on how big rifle is lying to you by saying their rifles are 1 MOA or sub-MOA.
Does anyone know Jim’s background and experience? My impression of him is a talking head without much authority. Maybe I have it all wrong.
Wade Chandler at Texas Predator Hunting podcast described him best. He first started watching the Backfire TV when it was new and he followed with interest as someone new on the scene to longer distance shooting learned the important things moving along. However, Wade does think that Jim needs some lessons, which he has offered to both him and Mike the Marine, on how to shoot long range.
Lately, though, he has taken issue with some of Jim's statements and tactics. Who knows, maybe it's all click-bait.
Jim's actual background is being an attorney though I don't know what type. Possibly a corporate attorney or attorney for a marketing company because he is good at that. I don't think he is criminal attorney. And he admits to not even practicing law now, being a full time YouTuber.
He does hunt and has shared video of an Africa hunt where his son, Ruger, got an animal with the Sig Cross in 6.5 CM.
AFAIK, he does not have military experience or that of teaching others about firearms or marksmanship. But he has had several knowledgable people on his show.
Also notice that he does not shoot at these competitions he has devised. As opposed to Brandon at Texas Plinking and his 1 MOA at a grand challenge. In fact, the last episode, his mother shot and then he shot with her gun. Talk about a challenge. Shoot a gun zeroed for someone else.
With Jim, back when he had the other guy, results could be odd. He had the worst group of shots with a Mossberg Patriot .308 in the walnut stock around 4 to 5 MOA at 100 yards. Everyone else I have seen on YT has had no worse than 1 MOA, some have had sub MOA, at least on the first 3 - 5 shots, which is what counts for a cheap hunting rifle. I know someone who has that rifle and gets about 1 MOA results. But not Jim. This was the beginning of a long-term hate relationship with Mossberg while glowing about Ruger, a brand he loves so much, he named one of his sons Ruger.
I have not seen much 6.8 Western. Only two companies make rifles for that. Whereas, now, 7 PRC is prevalent. And even if Hornady's own 175 is dropping off, other brands are picking up the slack.
For example, in all of my .308s, Hornady 150 gr SST sucks large.
Which hurts me now because I really like the 7 PRC and I want Hornady to be good at producing and not just introducing.
Yeah, I know powder availability for manufacturers has been hard. I will say, the Hornady Outfitter with the 160 CX was stupid accurate out of my PRC. 22” Proof barrel, slow velocity at 2,852 average, but 3 shot groups were a ragged hole or barely over that.
And that is what I will do with mine. Concentrate on accuracy. And I just did another chart to 1000 yards when I will hunt no further than 500 yards on a mule deer or elk, no more than 300 yards ish on a whitetail. 2,000 fps is my threshold. Precision Hunter box shows 1800 for petals to open. Hornady tech support told me in an email that they actually start to open up at 1600 fps. So, by using 2k as my limit, this ensures a full flowering into what looks like a 12 ga slug worth of destruction.
Basically, it will still outperform my .308 rifles. And with recoil management, it is less than a pushy .308. Also, I have a 24 inch barrel and Jim at Backfire did not say how long his barrel was and we know, pure and simple, barrel length makes a difference. Even he admitted that in his comparison of 6.5 CM and 6.5 PRC.
Because of the real life velocities produced by Hornady’s factory loads. When compared to real life 6.8 western they are actually quite similar. The video above lays it out pretty well.
I see there's an overlap after about 150gr but the 6.8 doesn't seem to be going as fast bullet weight to bullet weight. Kinda seems like the 6.8 bridges the 6.5 and 7prc.
I saw that video but that's only the Hornady ammo, it's not the cartridge as whole. That's why I don't really understand the comparison.
I looked at some load data and at box ammo for the 6.8 and it seems to end at the 175s not even getting up to 2900fps.
I mean that’s the comparison. If shooting Hornady factory ammo in the 7prc, it aligns with the 6.8 western in performance. If you are hand loading or shooting federal factory ammo, then the 7 beats it.
In the video he is saying he believes Hornady is actually purposely lying about the performance of 7prc by 200fps so they can say it’s the flatter cartridge. When in reality it might not be when using their ammo.
I see what you're saying. The Hornady velocities is why the 6.8 entered the chat.
I don't mind his content but is hard to follow when it's comes to the hunting side. When they had his Nephew missing all those deer in Texas then go "oh shit" he's left handed. How do you not have the kid out shooting before hand to notice that. That's the stuff that makes hunters look bad
I have noticed something close to 70fps lower velocities in 6.5cm Hornady 147 match ammunition manufactured a couple of years apart. It does seem like they changed some recipes or their hand was forced with powder availability.
Given Western is really only a Winchester/Browning thing I suspect it will die off but it is a step above 6.5PRC. If there was Lapua brass and Berger Projectiles available it would probably have a niche in Australian F open at the energy limit for some ranges for best wind performance at ~3320 ft lbs muzzle energy. I doubt Lapua will bother.
Given Western is really only a Winchester/Browning thing I suspect it will die off but it is a step above 6.5PRC. If there was Lapua brass and Berger Projectiles available it would probably have a niche in Australian F open at the energy limit for some ranges for best wind performance at ~3320 ft lbs muzzle energy. I doubt Lapua will bother.
So apparently, according to YouTube comments, everyone posting anything positive about the 7Prc are all liars. The 7Prc can't even crack 3k. It's all lies. Lol
Well. I know mine can’t…. But it’s also an 18” barrel doing 2830 with a 180. Pushed it to 2860 but groups were better at 2830. Extrapolated out to a 24” barrel @ 30fps/inch it would be over 3k.
Someone in another chat stream elsewhere said that there thousands of people reporting this problem and blown primers and beat-up weapons. But I had not even heard of it until Jim at Backfire said it. And showed a chrono.
I have only ever viewed box ammo is a good wish, even with the 7 PRC, which I really like. The testing at the company is going to involve different equipment and set-up. In fact, if they have the go - no go, they can seat that slug precisely. Fill with the fastest powder. Tweak and tune to get 3k.
But the stuff for retail is just not going to be that tight. Because there is no predicting exactly which make and model of rifle it will be in. Or barrel length.
So, really, it pays to have your own chrono, even when shooting factory ammo. Find out what your real average MV is and adjust your ballistic solver for that.
For example, a 175 gr would have 2k fps to about 750 yards. 2k fps is my failsafe impact velocity to open the petals up. The box of PH says 1800 and Hornady tech support said 1600 to start flowering.
I am not going to shoot a deer at 750 yards. More than likely, it will be inside of 400 yards. So, if the PH 175 gr is only getting 2800 in reality with a off the shelf rifle, if that is what Jim was using, then 2k fps gets to about 650 yards. Still more than adequate.
If I was shooting farther or always at long range paper, I would change to ELD-M and probably like everyone else, handload for that, in which case, bitching about factory ammo is wasted energy.
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I switched from a 7 SAUM to the PRC because the chamber design of the PRC is superior for longer bullets. I also liked that I could get factory ammo at a reasonable price if I need to shoot factory ammo. That being said, it will primarily be hand loaded for, so factory ammo velocity doesn’t concern me much.
I’m going try out and chrono my loads in my new CDG with 30” barrel, using H4831 and H1000 tomorrow. A little load work up. Only three shots per charge weight, so just an inkling, but it’s a start for me. Plus, I’ll be using just 171gr Barnes for this early stuff. Heavies will come later.
Anyone else wonder why the 7 PRC isn’t pinned at the top of the page like all the other calibers in this sub-forum?
Anyone else wonder why the 7 PRC isn’t pinned at the top of the page like all the other calibers in this sub-forum?
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