post pandemic wood prices / quality / supply and demand
had gone downhill for a while, hopefully its getting better.
- Thread starter sirhrmechanic
- Start date
had gone downhill for a while, hopefully its getting better.
Yeah, I know. I’m more worried about flex than dings, but I have considered just buying maple butcher block countertops already made. They just aren’t as thick. I haven’t decided which way I’ll go on that yet.
You can get butcher block up to 12' length and 2" thick if ya know where to look.
My bench is a cheap wood working kit repurposed.
I would want tougher wood if starting from scratch.
A lot of effort into building and the top is on display forever.
I'm old and no longer care except for function. If the case were different I would upgrade that one part.
And whoever said it's not like you use a hammer on it is WRONG .lol
I would want tougher wood if starting from scratch.
A lot of effort into building and the top is on display forever.
I'm old and no longer care except for function. If the case were different I would upgrade that one part.
And whoever said it's not like you use a hammer on it is WRONG .lol
I don't think a heavier bench top necessarily equals more rigidity. Like I said earlier I built my bench cabinets out of plywood. I then mounted 2 in thick butcher block to the top of it. I bolted the cabinets to the wall and then screwed a mounting plate against the back wall. So I was able to connect the butcher block to both the cabinets and the mounting plate on the back wall. It is rigid as hell.
On one of the cabinets are used in 11 ft long butcher block. 2 in thick and 23 in deep. That thing is heavy as hell. It was a b**** to pick up by myself, walk it into the room and then swing it around to put it on top of the cabinets. Actually sprained my wrist doing it. If it was twice as thick, I don't think I would be able to pick it up by myself.
Yeah it really is. I had to load and unload and carry my tops which are 2" thick x 26" wide and it was extremely difficult by myself. I also used some metal corner bracket material I had in the shop to screw off the top in the open areas to the wall. It's very rigid and works well. There's no way I could even drag a top double the thickness and 10 or 12' long.
What would you have to mount a planer to, to be able to run a 8 ft long 25-in wide 2x4 butcher block through? That would be near impossible.
That works fine. I used 3/8” oak to sturdy up mine. I glued and pressed it. Then applied screws and there is zero give. Just because pine is used doesn’t mean you cannot remove any deflection as long as you do it right. One does not need a butcher block as your work surface.
Ditch the hammer
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www.rcbs.com You mean like a hand planer or a shop machine? There's planers that can run it but it would be super heavy, even if it were made of spruce 2x4's. We use lam beams like that often enough.
Drum sander will make quick work of that . 24" open side .
I have about 12ft space to assemble a bench in so I am going to buy two 4ft sections of kitchen height cabinets/ drawers and place them on the outer edges then in the center im just going to frame a lower section that is desk height where I can mount my press and whatever else.
If I were only going to be doing reloading in my space I might would do the same thing, but I need all my bench top at the same height for building fishing rods.
What kind of rods? Is there much info on the net for that?
Bass rods. Good ol’ college of YouTube will get you started, but I’m lucky enough to know a professional builder that helped me get things going. Not a business venture for me, but I like that I can take $75 to $100 worth of small parts, a high quality blank ($75-$150 on sale) and build something that is far better than the ones going $500-$600 at Bass Pro. As much as my family fishes, it’d take a second mortgage to outfit everyone with top quality rods otherwise.
Where are you getting that length?
Awesome!! I already scouted out YouTube. Will be jumping into that in a few weeks.
Much thanks!!! I am excited about a new project!
Just remember, it’s girth that’s most important.
Man, what are you doing to break rods? I think in my entire life I have only broken 1 that I remember.
Problem I have seen is that far too many of those rods (including fly rods) are made in good ole Red China. I hates Red China.
Good luck on all your builds. I built several in the late 1970’s and early 1980’s. They did exactly what I wanted and needed and NO where could what i really needed be found in stores or tackle shops.
Not hard to find USA fly blanks - McFarland, Steffen, Livingston, T&T... Plus almost all of the higher-end "mainstream" fly rod manufacturers have blanks & rods that are USA, even if their entry level are Chinese
A bass fisherman that doesn't break sticks. ?
Are you from up north somewhere?
I fish in places that many won't try / can't to get thier boat into.
Only to drop baits into busted up docks fallen timber vegetation some people can't conceive of and the fish grow large there .
I have cracked a hull using it to push trees over to access an area. Jumped sandbars on the old Mexico side and that's just bass fishing.
In and around Texas we fish some heavy cover, with heavy line and you have to turn thier heads or there gone.
Sticks break while fishing unless your a careless type and break them by accident.
You want to really break sticks go fishing for redfish or black drum and keep a knife handy to cut line before they spool you and bend the spool. Maybe you are fishing for specs and a drum grabs your catch busts your stick and bends your spool, that's always a bonus day right there.
Go fish out of Cocodri or Dulack, you'll get stuff broke there.
Or maybe it's well below freezing and a smallmouth hits so hard the rod shatters.
Can't belive you fish Toledo Bend and haven't broke rods. I'm not much impressed with bass fishing around the Bossier City area mostly small fish up there.
Rods break all the time unless you can't tie knots or use crappy line.
Are you from up north somewhere?
I fish in places that many won't try / can't to get thier boat into.
Only to drop baits into busted up docks fallen timber vegetation some people can't conceive of and the fish grow large there .
I have cracked a hull using it to push trees over to access an area. Jumped sandbars on the old Mexico side and that's just bass fishing.
In and around Texas we fish some heavy cover, with heavy line and you have to turn thier heads or there gone.
Sticks break while fishing unless your a careless type and break them by accident.
You want to really break sticks go fishing for redfish or black drum and keep a knife handy to cut line before they spool you and bend the spool. Maybe you are fishing for specs and a drum grabs your catch busts your stick and bends your spool, that's always a bonus day right there.
Go fish out of Cocodri or Dulack, you'll get stuff broke there.
Or maybe it's well below freezing and a smallmouth hits so hard the rod shatters.
Can't belive you fish Toledo Bend and haven't broke rods. I'm not much impressed with bass fishing around the Bossier City area mostly small fish up there.
Rods break all the time unless you can't tie knots or use crappy line.
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Most of my fishing to date was in Mississippi and some in Louisiana. Haven’t fished Texas anything since arriving about 10 years ago. LOL I used to live close to the Pearl river reservoir. Crappie, bream, bass and alligator lol (never fished for alligator, just ran into them often enough).
I am 69, and used to fish a lot. I also used to hunt a lot. North Texas, Dallas area, where I live doesn’t seem to be a sportsman’s paradise by appearances, not to mention that stuff is hard work for me these days
You are correct DFW is not a sportsman's paradise.
It does have a lot of lakes though and I used to fish most of them in local and regional tournaments.
It does have a lot of lakes though and I used to fish most of them in local and regional tournaments.
2x4 on edge are plenty strong enough for a reloading bench. Laminated 2x4 are commonly used for hand tool wood working and see more abuse in a week than a reloading bench will see in its lifetime.
If you have to hammer on it, clamp down or permanently attach an oak strike plate.
A Planer large enough to run a 24 inch wide panel or table top through is going to be north of $3,000.00.
A 2x10 plank top is more than sufficient for reloading of any type. Just use cross stretchers and enough fasteners. I’d also look at anchoring the legs to the floor since the priming process (on the upstroke upward force) is what causes the most movement.
It’s usually not the top that makes a reloading bench suck ass. It’s usually terrible frame and support of the top.
If you have to hammer on it, clamp down or permanently attach an oak strike plate.
A Planer large enough to run a 24 inch wide panel or table top through is going to be north of $3,000.00.
A 2x10 plank top is more than sufficient for reloading of any type. Just use cross stretchers and enough fasteners. I’d also look at anchoring the legs to the floor since the priming process (on the upstroke upward force) is what causes the most movement.
It’s usually not the top that makes a reloading bench suck ass. It’s usually terrible frame and support of the top.
2x10 is very solid choice.
I was thinking plane it in sections and then assemble the sections.
TLDR: 0.00% chance I would do a laminated 2x4 top for a reloading bench. Even if the wood was free.
I’m going to post my opinion, some presumptions, and some assumptions.
Some questions first:
A) Do you have a lot of clamps?
B) do you have a jointer or at least some way to ensure one flat and straight edge?
C) Do you have roller supports to provide in-feed and out-feed support for the lengths you plan to put through the planer?
D) Do you have a way to surface and flatten the top of the completed table top after it’s planed and glued together?
Your method is sound in theory. in practice it rarely ever works like you wish it would. Even using dominoes, biscuits, or dowels.
If you don’t have true flat and straight bottom reference faces when going through the planer, then all of those irregularities will be transferred into the top. Think cups and bows. So you won’t truly have a flat top.
Ensure you leave each piece about 6” long on each end to account for planer snipe.
I’m a woodworker and there is a 0.00% chance I would do a laminated 2x4 top even for a hand tool wood working bench. They are made that thick so they’re thick enough to work with hold fasts, and withstand the hammering and pounding with chisels and stuff. People use laminated 2x4 because it’s cheaper than a 2.5”-3” solid wood top (depending), and is much more dimensionally stable over time.
Absolutely overkill for a reloading bench. Put your efforts into your frame, and then buy you a nice 1.5” thick butcher block top in the correct size. You’ll be light years ahead that way.
People don’t think making laminated 2x4 bench tops be like it is, but it do.
In that case I guess I’ll just buy butcher block then. I’d rather have hardwood than pine anyhow.
A piece of hardwood glued to 2x4 would be nice.
Thought we were being smart and tied it into the wall joists. Strong but picked up vibrations in the rest of the house that the digital scales didn't like.
Plywood is strong but fugly my son painted the dang stuff.
We used thick plywood for tops and shelves . 4x4's for legs on my sons bench it was a monster.
Thought we were being smart and tied it into the wall joists. Strong but picked up vibrations in the rest of the house that the digital scales didn't like.
Plywood is strong but fugly my son painted the dang stuff.
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For the cost of the 2x4 to make a top that's 24" wide , and the labor/time it takes to do it, it makes much more sense to just buy a thick butcher block. It doesn't matter what species of wood it is. You can get 10' sections of it for like $200 here in cheaper woods. That's about twice what your material would cost to do 2x4 but you'd have a good flat top. It's the finishing that makes butchers block expensive to do, and you can definitely do that. Use some poly and light sand between coats. Do 3 coats and your good.
I think all of my tops which was 3 pcs.(2@ 10' and 1@12'), it was like $800 with tax and cheaper wood would save you a few hundred if you bought the same sizes.
Damn. A 10’ section runs over $400 everywhere I’ve looked.
HD has two or three options under $400
I thought I'd peek at this thread even though the idea of a "reloading room" isn't practical for me. I use a space in the garage that's shared with the general-purpose tool chests, the chemical/fluids/paint cabinet and some wire shelving for auto and household tools (jack stands, skilsaw, drill, wheel chocks, grease gun etc.)
Press Stand in lieu of Bench
I read a lot about people striving to build monster benches and benchtops that don't flex. I've never tried it. I use a press stand and would never go any other way.
I bought a 10' piece of 2" steel pipe at the home store and had it cut and threaded with their Rigid machine at several lengths. I bought flanges for each end. One flange I bolted to the concrete floor. The key here is to drill out the flange for larger bolts or it will flex too much. I was able to bolt my single-stage press directly to the flange on the top, but it would be easy to bolt a plate to the flange and then mount any press or a press-plate system on there.
I still have another two pieces from the 10-footer. I'm going to install another stand for a vise, and I could definitely use the third but might not have the place for it.
When I cut the 10-footer, I cut three different lengths of pipe so I could try them and find the height for the press that I liked best. I chose the highest stand that puts my press a little higher than it would be with a press riser on a bench.
I also have a Lee tri-pod stand with a heavy concrete weight on the bottom. I like it because it holds the Akro bins nicely, but otherwise it's too short/low. It's sturdier than a lot of bench setups, but I wouldn't want to use it to resize rifle brass. I just use it to run a Lee APP Deluxe or a ABLP progressive to perform light operations like resizing and flaring handgun brass, de-capping, and priming. I think Lee made it so low because they wanted the legs to ship via regular carrier. The wide base has some advantages over the narrower pipe flange.
Ideally, I'd have larger diameter pipe and flanges, maybe 4" or 6". I also considered building stands using 12" concrete-filled Sono-Tubes. Grizzly sells a nice steel bench grinder stand, but it would be too low.
In any case, I don't envy any bench.
Press Stand in lieu of Bench
I read a lot about people striving to build monster benches and benchtops that don't flex. I've never tried it. I use a press stand and would never go any other way.
I bought a 10' piece of 2" steel pipe at the home store and had it cut and threaded with their Rigid machine at several lengths. I bought flanges for each end. One flange I bolted to the concrete floor. The key here is to drill out the flange for larger bolts or it will flex too much. I was able to bolt my single-stage press directly to the flange on the top, but it would be easy to bolt a plate to the flange and then mount any press or a press-plate system on there.
I still have another two pieces from the 10-footer. I'm going to install another stand for a vise, and I could definitely use the third but might not have the place for it.
When I cut the 10-footer, I cut three different lengths of pipe so I could try them and find the height for the press that I liked best. I chose the highest stand that puts my press a little higher than it would be with a press riser on a bench.
I also have a Lee tri-pod stand with a heavy concrete weight on the bottom. I like it because it holds the Akro bins nicely, but otherwise it's too short/low. It's sturdier than a lot of bench setups, but I wouldn't want to use it to resize rifle brass. I just use it to run a Lee APP Deluxe or a ABLP progressive to perform light operations like resizing and flaring handgun brass, de-capping, and priming. I think Lee made it so low because they wanted the legs to ship via regular carrier. The wide base has some advantages over the narrower pipe flange.
Ideally, I'd have larger diameter pipe and flanges, maybe 4" or 6". I also considered building stands using 12" concrete-filled Sono-Tubes. Grizzly sells a nice steel bench grinder stand, but it would be too low.
In any case, I don't envy any bench.
This is the way. Just strap on a charge bag for your calipers, gauges, shell holders, and 50rd loading block (although I haven't figured out how to keep the brass from falling out of the loading block in the charge bag yet).
Can't wait to hear how he one-hand holds his AMP and runs brass through it.
I did HD butcher block on top of Lowe’s in stock cabinets. I was concerned the cabinets couldn’t support the presses and motions long term so I made 2x4 frames ( covered with matching dishwasher panels ) that do most of the supporting for the tops. I also made another frame under the bottom of the cabinets that supports the weight on the bottom shelf for projectiles and stuff.
I would just go with a couple of 10 or 12 inch wide oak. You can glue/screw a couple more sheets under. There won’t be any deflection that way as long as you have the sheets supported with strong and supported legs.
I have something like 1.5” pine that had a slight deflection when pressing. I stuck (glue and screw) a 1/2” or 3/8” sheet of oak under the presse area and no deflection whatsoever. I do need to anchor the entire table better, though.
I have something like 1.5” pine that had a slight deflection when pressing. I stuck (glue and screw) a 1/2” or 3/8” sheet of oak under the presse area and no deflection whatsoever. I do need to anchor the entire table better, though.
Although my presses are on stands and not benches, I do have some work surfaces. I have a large steel desk that I found on the roadside. I'm not normally a scrounger, but this is a nice steel desk made in the 70's. It's at least 200 pounds empty. At one point, I put it in front of the house with a sign "free" on it, but nobody who wanted it could move it, so I brought it in and adopted it despite not really having the space for it (it's huge).
The reason I want to share this with you is because of the unique surface I put on it. The desk itself has a steel top with a woodgrain melamine surface (not particleboard, but melamine laminated to the steel).
Rubber Stall Mats
On the floor, I put those thick rubber pads for inside a horse's stall. That's where I got the idea to put one over the desk surface. It works great. It very damping of any vibrations. Nothing slides on it or even rolls. It's firm enough that I can stand brass on it (though I would normally use a case block). Whether I drop something on the desk or the floor, the rubber prevents damage more than a hard surface -- think about dropping calipers for example or a die.
The rubber stall mats have been pretty durable and I've had them for almost 5 years now. They might not be resistant to all chemicals, so I would be cautious about cleaning solvent spills or over-spray. To clean the stall mats, I use a shop-vac and an air-compressor blow-gun.
Rubbermaid Cart
I use solvents on a different surface. I use a Rubbermaid Commercial polymer cart. The wet tumbler (Rebel 17) and the dry tumbler (Lyman Magnum) is in the bottom of it, and the top is for stripping and cleaning. The deep sides keep liquids, solvents, and loose parts contained. It also isolates the vibration from the tumblers and it can be rolled outside.
The reason I want to share this with you is because of the unique surface I put on it. The desk itself has a steel top with a woodgrain melamine surface (not particleboard, but melamine laminated to the steel).
Rubber Stall Mats
On the floor, I put those thick rubber pads for inside a horse's stall. That's where I got the idea to put one over the desk surface. It works great. It very damping of any vibrations. Nothing slides on it or even rolls. It's firm enough that I can stand brass on it (though I would normally use a case block). Whether I drop something on the desk or the floor, the rubber prevents damage more than a hard surface -- think about dropping calipers for example or a die.
The rubber stall mats have been pretty durable and I've had them for almost 5 years now. They might not be resistant to all chemicals, so I would be cautious about cleaning solvent spills or over-spray. To clean the stall mats, I use a shop-vac and an air-compressor blow-gun.
Rubbermaid Cart
I use solvents on a different surface. I use a Rubbermaid Commercial polymer cart. The wet tumbler (Rebel 17) and the dry tumbler (Lyman Magnum) is in the bottom of it, and the top is for stripping and cleaning. The deep sides keep liquids, solvents, and loose parts contained. It also isolates the vibration from the tumblers and it can be rolled outside.
Either a single or better a double piece of 3/4” 7 ply plywood over a strong frame of 2x4’s makes a great work top. Not pretty but solid. However what I found on my shop workbench which is now 16 years old and still solid, is that you should screw in the top to the 2x4’s. On this table, I glued it on and after years of every kind of work on the bench it sorely needs a replacement. however, adding another board on top would raise it higher than the saws. So, the only answer is to cut down the legs. Been better to screw it on and I could screw it off when I am ready to replace.
Table is still solid, but the top is really rough, with gouges and paint build up, soaked in grease and oil, its just not what I need to do decent quality woodwork.
I see ‘em now. Could’ve sworn they were $400 or more. Maybe I had been looking somewhere else.
We do have a good source. Southestern Salvage. They got into the butcher block 10 ish years ago and have grown that part of their business a lot and now have quite a selection for a good price.
Currently building another reloading room in the unfinished part of the basement. The wife got an at home job and I gave her my current room in the finished part of the house. What your some successes and fails with lighting? I have exposed joists and running a new 20amp circuit just for this room. Ought to be able to accomodate about any lighting I need.
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