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Calling all angry old men, what was life like with 12% home loans?

D̷e̷v̷i̷l̷D̷o̷c̷A̷Z̷

Banned x2 🤪
Full Member
Minuteman
Sep 11, 2014
3,838
4,917
Yuma, AZ
Im curious what life was like back when mortgage rates were sky high. I’ve never known anything above 3%

Or was it just so different even old timers are unsure wtf we are supposed to do.

Just curious about the “been there, done that” advice.
 
Ok I’ll go first. Bought in 90 at 10.5%. Had to buy small in a good neighborhood. Damn well put down 20%. Couldn’t afford pmi on top of the mortgage. Family grew and we cashed out refinanced to add on then eventually rolled everything into another 30 year fixed at 5.5%. Rates kept falling but we never refied again. Just started paying extra on the principal. Payed off after about 17 years.
Don’t seem to to have the extra money you’d think though. Still managed to max out 401k then a Roth later. Drove our cars til the wheels fell off and not too many toys for mom and dad. we didn’t buy in a frenzy like today though, there was plenty of inventory.
Don’t buy info the idea that it’s an investment, it’s shelter. Don’t know if that helps, one guy’s story.
 
12% ?......We bought our first house in '86 from a guy that was a banker. He was upside down on it and had been transferred out of state. His mortgage rate ? 18%. He had to bring money to the table to close on the sale. A banker......:rolleyes:

We got in at 7.75% on an ARM. Rates dropped and we re-fi'd to about 4 3/4 % fixed. Best investment we ever made. Was literally across the street from a little startup company by the curious name of "Microsoft". That $72K house is now worth about $1.3M and still going vertical.
 
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That was also back when health insurance actually paid for things and didn't cost as much as your mortgage, gas was cheap and so was food, ect.... so all in, it wasn't that much different in terms of disposable income. The culture of the country was very different though as a whole. The other side to higher rates is that it made it possible for regular people to save money and actually increase their wealth by doing so.


In the 50's, a regular job for a man could provide for a family. One job, not mommy working , but just dad. That could buy the latest in technology, a vacation or two for the family each year, a car or two, a house, and save for later. Not some high end CEO job, but a mechanic, or a plumber, or an insurance salesman, a hardware store, ect....


Now it takes 2 very strong incomes to do the same thing...... so why is that? What in our system has caused this to happen? Will it get better or worse? What can we do to alter the outcomes?
 
Late 70's... My parents were forced to sell our home and we rented for a long time.

Food left on the dinner plate didn't go into the garbage... it went into a pot in the fridge for "stew night." Both my parents worked full time to try to get ahead which quickly turned to live month to month.

We also lived 1.5 miles from the closest gas station and would see the cars lined up in front of our bus stop before sunrise. I remember seeing drivers in sleeping bags sound asleep in the back seats.
 
Late 70's... My parents were forced to sell our home and we rented for a long time.

Food left on the dinner plate didn't go into the garbage... it went into a pot in the fridge for "stew night." Both my parents worked full time to try to get ahead which quickly turned to live month to month.

We also lived 1.5 miles from the closest gas station and would see the cars lined up in front of our bus stop before sunrise. I remember seeing drivers in sleeping bags sound asleep in the back seats.
and just think who was potus at that time and how biden is making that absolute turd of a potus look now..... not a good Outlook for the next few years eh
 
As others have pointed out it was not then as it is now. My bank account/savings account in the mid '70's paid 10% annual interest for simple savings accounts....even my checking account earned interest. CD were out there for 8% - 10% - Health Insurance was nominal and even the procedures were a fraction of what it costs today. In 1979, $10 an hour would keep a Family going - today it won't even cover the Health Insurance. We want to predict the economic future based on what has transpired and that's a good measuring stick *but* what is happening today "doesn't add up" as the whole game has changed.

So using economics 101 from 1979 to predict what is going to happen in the US/Global economy is fraught with error and miscalculations. The Game has changed - some stuff applies but a lot of it doesn't. and it's not going back to The Way it was, there will be new rules as *everything* and all information is now being cooked and manipulated.

My first home purchase in 1986 was at like 9% interest *but* the house cost $31K and the monthly payment was $186 a month - another $120 a month for health care (with Dental and Vision) and a $100 deductible. For a Family of 4. It's not apples to apples anymore....real wages in America have not even close to kept pace with Corporate Executive pay for decades while the price of houses and cars and refrigerators and all kinds of shit has steadily increased multiple times over. It's not The '70's or The 80's and it never will be again.

VooDoo
 
Ah, the Carter years. Home owners felt the results of his administration for 10 years. But not to worry. If you're too young to remember, Biden has said, "Those are rookie numbers. Hold my beer."
But you know what was weird? In1980 I worked for a big utility company where my fellow workers didn't do anything more intelligent with their lives but work, drive a company truck home and watch the Dukes of Hazzard or the Dallas Cowboys play on weekends.

And even that redneck trash was scared when a far Right Conservative such as Reagan beat a communist Democrat simp like Carter.
 
First loan in 1979 was 13% / 30 year and was glad to get it on $60K starter home (DFW area)
2 professionals working, could afford it - barely.

1981 moved to new job, new house, 11-TBD %“Renegotiatable Rate Mortgage” $90K home, 2 professionals working, a little more affordable.

What you’re going to see (Thanks Joe) is teaser 1-3 year rates to get people into homes with serious adjustments coming after the home loan qualification period is over (usually 1-3 years depending on state laws), and serious “Jimmy Carter Style” Inflation.

As others have noted it’s not the 70/80s but large monetary trends have similar major components, and I believe we will see a repeat of some of that now.

What can you do? Buy a home in a solid neighborhood/ school district as a hedge and hang on.
If you don’t buy a home, inflation could keep you from qualifying for a loan in a few years for that same home.
Good luck. God Bless.
 
As a farm kid, the lessons of what can happen when interest rates skyrocket has been engrained in my mind from an early age. The 80s were tough. Dad didn't lose the farm, but it wasn't much fun paying on 18 percent interest. Lots of people lost their farms, some took their lives. Borrowing money for toys would be looked upon as extremely reckless in my family. This country is running on a whole different mindset with 3 percent interest. In my mind, people with 100k income shouldn't be buying 500k houses, but what do I know, I'm just a dumb farmer.
 
Bought my first home in 79 for $8500, $500 down the balance at 4.5% owner financed. Rough shape in a black neighborhood. Those black folks were some of the best people Ive known. Treated me as friend and family. Sold it 10 years later for $32,000.
 
were mortgages from the past comparable?..........interest rates were higher but property taxes were significantly lower........
 
I remember those days. It was 1982. I was 30. I had recently moved to San Diego. I lived with roommates. One was a real estate agent. I borrowed his MLS listing book, which was the size of a good sized phone book. There wasn't any Internet then. I browsed through the MLS book for hours and located an old neighborhood were houses were small and less costly and where younger people were moving in and fixing up. I found a house that was owned free and clear by a guy out of state who had inherited it from his aunt and wanted to sell fast. He was asking $62,000. He made a seller carry back loan for $50,000 for five years. I borrowed $15,000 from my dad to cover the down and the closing costs. The loan payment was about $450. My dad agreed to take full payment when I sold. I refinanced after the five years. I stayed there for 15 years and sold for $140,000 and moved up north. I recently looked on Zillow and saw that the place was going for over $1 million. It was built in 1922, and was only 800 sq ft. They did some remodelling, but it was still about the same. Who could afford it now at that cost? $10 an hour was good pay. You'd have to be making $200 an hour to buy it now.
 
I remember those days. It was 1982. I was 30. I had recently moved to San Diego. I lived with roommates. One was a real estate agent. I borrowed his MLS listing book, which was the size of a good sized phone book. There wasn't any Internet then. I browsed through the MLS book for hours and located an old neighborhood were houses were small and less costly and where younger people were moving in and fixing up. I found a house that was owned free and clear by a guy out of state who had inherited it from his aunt and wanted to sell fast. He was asking $62,000. He made a seller carry back loan for $50,000 for five years. I borrowed $15,000 from my dad to cover the down and the closing costs. The loan payment was about $450. My dad agreed to take full payment when I sold. I refinanced after the five years. I stayed there for 15 years and sold for $140,000 and moved up north. I recently looked on Zillow and saw that the place was going for over $1 million. It was built in 1922, and was only 800 sq ft. They did some remodelling, but it was still about the same. Who could afford it now at that cost? $10 an hour was good pay. You'd have to be making $200 an hour to buy it now.
 
Bought my first home in 79 for $8500, $500 down the balance at 4.5% owner financed. Rough shape in a black neighborhood. Those black folks were some of the best people Ive known. Treated me as friend and family. Sold it 10 years later for $32,000.
iu
 
My first and only home loan in 1994 was 8.xxx % I didn't drive a brand new loaded diesel truck and my wife a brand new loaded tahoe like I see all the newish homeowners today. I also bought a house I knew I could afford and I went in with 25% down. It is likely the reason I have never financed anything but that first mortgage. I saw how much you get robbed financing. From then on I either could buy it or I could not but there wasn't going to be a loan for anything Loans and interest are nothing but slavery and people today really have no clue. I see kids around here all the time graduate high school, get a $18/hr job while still living at home and make payments on new trucks and side by sides. The young married couples are worse. Borrowed up to the gills to buy houses and cars they cannot afford and on the thin razor of making it but with the best of everything. Eat out several nights a week and lunch every day, big vacations every year, nails done every week etc.......it's a whole different lifestyle of wasting money that just was not happening when I was growing up in the 70s and 80s
 
During the Carter administration, I can remember getting a pre-owned home mortgage at 18.5% interest.

It was a common rate then, I seem to recall they went as high as 21% then. I really didn't give a crap, because I had $5,000 to put down, the nice craftsman style house only cost $37,000 and I was making $45,000 a year and was single.

Now, the house would cost your north of $500,000.

So which situation are you getting screwed by worse, now or then? You tell me.

Same house costs now $500,000 at 3 %, or then $37,000 at 18.5%?

See, if you say then, you are wrong. You are getting screwed worse now.

Do you see how you have been tricked by the banks????
 
By the time they dropped to 12 percent, It was great, houses, cars were cheap by today’s standards, we were recovering from a recession, Regan was president, great rock, purchased my first house $37000 2 bedroom bungalow $400 month payments including taxes and insurance. Now say 1979 when they were 18 + Carter was president, no jobs huge recession it really sucked.
 
carter years well remembered. bought a house with 2nd wife when interest was 12+. got it from a small builder who built them and held the mortgage himself-10%. smart guy. we were thrilled. this was in about in '80. in tampa,house was $65K. her cousin visited from kali and told us same house there would go $250K. ratio the same now i guess.
 
Late 80's 10.5% first house, on active duty. Brand new house was $109K. zillow shows it worth $550k now.
 
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It’s no different than at your 3%. You either pay 3% on 800k or 14% on 300k for same house. I’ll take the higher rate cause they will eventually come back down and value go up and I can refi at the lower rate
 
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In San Diego in the mid 80’s, most people E5 and below couldn’t afford to buy a house, so they rented. Some of my friends went in and bought houses, and then later they became rentals once the original guys changed duty stations. It worked well for them, as a renter would move on, there was always someone at the Mobile Unit wanting a room. Later, property prices exploded there, and they did pretty good when they sold, but to answer your question, the interest rate put buying houses out of reach for a lot of us. Even renting when I was an E4, after paying rent, I would only have $15 to last me two weeks. Did a lot of bike riding then. It was a win win. I loved my bike, and was too broke to put gas in the car. We didn’t even have any furniture, only a water bed. That’s all we needed and I wouldn’t trade those years for anything.
 
Late 70s, the rate was about 10%. Paid $65K for a rather neglected house, the smallest one in a declining 1960s tract in Orange County, CA. Got it on a GI loan, so no down payment. 30 year mortgage (meaning total cost about triple house selling cost). Barely made payments for years. Eventually paid it off early in late 90s/early 2000s.

Interest rates skyrocketed after I bought mine. I remember a friend bought a house there in early 80s and was paying something like 18%. He eventually defaulted & walked away from it.

When I moved away in 1990, I hung on to the house, as I knew I could never afford to buy another one there if I sold. Still have it, as a rental. Worth about $800K now. 950 sq ft. How anyone can afford one there now, I can't imagine. Declining tract and general area got infused with lots of money when all the Vietnamese moved in. I wasn't too happy about all the Vietnamese taking over, but I gotta say they halted and reversed the declining trend there. Plus they tend to be Republicans. Now many houses in that tract have been renovated into giant 2 story monsters that fill every single allowed square inch of the lot.

Back when I lived there, each house might have a couple cars associated with it. Now, it's easy to tell a Vietnamese house - each house has half a dozen cars jammed in all over. Zoning doesn't allow parking on lawn, so many put parking pads on their lawn. I guess the only way they can afford to buy is for large extended families to all pack in to each house. They are also big on making illegal apartments in their garages. I guess that's the only way they can afford to own them.
 
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It’s no different than at your 3%. You either pay 3% on 800k or 14% on 300k for same house. I’ll take the higher rate cause they will eventually come back down and value go up and I can refi at the lower rate

A lot of truth here.

Rates have been low for a long time, but seeing what my new neighbors are paying for the houses next to me is crazy. I could not imagine being on the hook for that size of a mortgage for these houses.
 
The last mortgage I had was for 11% and rates being that high put a hurting on the real-estate market.If anyone can get those rates back up there it will be LETS GO BRADON.
 
A lot of truth here.

Rates have been low for a long time, but seeing what my new neighbors are paying for the houses next to me is crazy. I could not imagine being on the hook for that size of a mortgage for these houses.
The messed up part of this equation though is if you bought at the high price low rate your fucked for years to come and after 20 years will only break even. Those that get the low price and high rate will be a lot better off in that same 20 year span. This is why the boomers are sitting in a fuck ton of cash.

My parents bought their home in CA in the early 80’s. They always complained about the high rate. When my dad sold after my mom passed, he sold it for almost 8 times what they bought it for and they had never borrowed against it and paid it off in 20 even with a 14.5% rate
 
Higher interest rates kept run away inflation in check and kept the property market sane.

Back when I got a 7% interest rate on a 30 year mortgage, a working class person could afford a simple decent 3 bedroom house on an average wage.

You also could put your money in a safe savings account and make a decent amount of interest on it each year.

But the bankers and wall street needed the government to come bail them out and ensure profits no matter what stupid things they did, so the politicians got the interest rate lowered to near free and set off run away inflation.

Now good luck trying to buy a house as a working class type, making even a good wage.
 
The thing I really miss about the past era is that I could put my money "in the bank"....just save it in a savings account in 1974 and it would double every ten years. I left a Grand in the Uptown National Bank (saved from paper route money/birthday money/gifts) upon graduation from HS in 1974 and when I came home in 1979 broke as a dog and living in a car there was $1500 in there. No risk, no fees.

Now days if you don't risk yer savings in the Market (it's all controlled and rigged by Billionaires like yer Senators) then there is not only no return *but* they'll charge you money to leave it in their bank. The only Way to accrue interest/capital gains is to give the Assholes a chance to fleece you in a rigged game. When I was a young person I could put my money in Savings and buy a CD or two and watch it grow at ~10%. But loans were 12%, a decent apartment was $250 a month and a new car cost $2400. That world is gone - The Oligarchs now pay $0.001% on a CD, charge you for checking (while using your money to make 17% a year) and give you $0.1% if you keep a couple grand in savings.

Last year I liquidated an IRA at Wells Fargo that was invested in CD's paying a fraction of a percent in interest. Then I bought a mutual fund that was heavily invested in Wells Fargo stock and made double digit gains last years - Wells Fargo (and I assume most other major banks) are fucking the people who deposit money in their bank shitless. But their stock holders and officers? That's where all the money goes....fuck the working people who have literally billions in their bank.

It's all about the investors, stock holders, and Board and Corporate Officers. Literally, Big Money is fucking the folks who are making them rich and laughing at "The Poors" who don't have the $ to buy the stock. They are using our money to make billions while paying nothing for using the money we have deposited. I really miss being able to plop $10K in my Savings account and at the end of the year have $11K+ with no risk.

Those Days be Gone.

VooDoo
 
Those Days be Gone.
and that is why I am still working. The checking and saving don't earn anything. Neither do CDs. Stocks and bonds are risky, but you are forced to buy them if you want a chance at any earnings. I remember when a house cost 1 years average pay and a car cost 1 months average pay, savings paid 5.5% and CDs paid more. Inflation will keep increasing. The government won't cut back on spending. The Fed will just print money to cover the increased interest on the debt. Given what is going on now in the world we are moving towards a collapse of the dollar.
 
My parents had two mortgage payments due to the fact my dad had to move for a new job (for 2 years) and our old house was in a very depressed job market. It was shall we say....

Painful.

The day that house sold was a VERY happy day.
 
oh for the days of 1.00 per gallon of gas or 99c or walking into a grocery store and seeing all the shelves full of food those were good times .
 
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Just to set the record straight it was the Regan years with the highest mortgage rates in the last 50 years. Basically you had several options to deal with high mortgage rates, buy a cheaper home, make a bigger down payment, balloon mortgage (interest only for the first few years then refinance hoping the rates are lower. If you are creative and find the right seller Land Contract or a Lease to Own can be a possible option.
 
There is one group of people who have told us from the beginning of time that this was exactly the plan... I wonder who they are?
 
View attachment 7846411Just to set the record straight it was the Regan years with the highest mortgage rates in the last 50 years. Basically you had several options to deal with high mortgage rates, buy a cheaper home, make a bigger down payment, balloon mortgage (interest only for the first few years then refinance hoping the rates are lower. If you are creative and find the right seller Land Contract or a Lease to Own can be a possible option.
iT wAs rEgAn!!!!

Get the fuck outta here with that shit 🤣🤣🤣
 
Home affordability for most ignorant people only means if they can afford the monthly payment. The principle amount means nothing to them.

The government entities that levy property taxes based on market value absolutely love the stupid high selling prices nowadays.

When interest rates go up at a quick pace, housing prices WILL have to reset to a sane level just so people can afford the monthly payment. Those that bought at the peak of selling prices will be stuck for a while. Likely, they will not be able to sell anywhere close to their original buying price unless they owner finance at below market rates.
 
1983
first house 1200 sq feet. Swamp cooler
18.5% interest.
Phoenix Arizona.
Thank God Reagan fixed inflation in just a few years.
 
In 1992, my wife and I had a combined income of $30K per year. We bought a $97K house, interest rate was 8.5%
Taxes on that house were more than the principle, almost $300 mo.

I drove a 7 year old Nissan pickup and she had an older Grand Am. I did most of the repairs/maintenance on them.

For gun money, I did side jobs, and remember saving for 6 months to buy a $500 Remington Varmint rifle, that I still have. Powder was $11 a pound and primers were $10/1K.
 
1983 or 1984 (can't recall exactly the year), our first house had a mortgage rate of 16.5%. A few years later we had the opportunity to buy a larger house in the same neighborhood at a good price. The mortgage rates had gone down, but so had the house prices (probably due to the high rates of a few years earlier). We had put $35k into the house to enlarge/update it, got the same price as the original purchase.
One of our neighbors was an MIT grad, working for a large pharmaceutical company. They had bought when the rates were high as well. They wanted to refinance when the rates dropped, but the value of their house had dropped so much they would have had to pay almost 50% of the house value in cash, as the bank would have been well underwater if they didn't. So they were between a rock and a hard place.

Current situation is we put a deposit on a new build last May. We should be closing the end of this month. The appraisal of the house is about $40K more than the contract price, and our current house has been climbing in value as well, almost $10k in the last 60 days alone! Sometimes the timing works out, sometimes it doesn't.
 
My folks bought their first house in 1974. I don’t remember anything about the rate but I know it was $17k thereabouts and the pmnt was something like $140.

Man they worked hard to pay the bills. We had older cars my whole childhood until in 1985 they bought a new Escort wagon.

I bought the same home from my mom in 1994 for $60k at I believe around 10% as a first time buyer.

I think one thing that is different is that supposedly we have a 20 million home shortage so how fast (or even will?) the market cool?

Another thing is the debt is over 30t now, how does that change things?

In those days a normal family lived in a 1000-1200 foot house and large homes were not the norm. Now the normal home is much larger and smaller places are gone to a large extent. Will it ever get back to mid eighties style? I doubt it.

We can draw parallels but it’s a different landscape.


—————
My wife and I sold last year and moved to our little farm in the mountains to live in our 14x50 mobile home to wait it out. We’re happy, srsly. We live a simple stress free life and if/when prices come back to Earth, we’ll build the home from the plans we had drawn and finalized (I designed it, will be awesome).

Until then, we’re sitting back watching from the front porch.
 
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