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Educate me on mirage shenanigans

Billiam1211

Gunny Sergeant
Full Member
Minuteman
Feb 19, 2018
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So I'm trying to understand some mirage behavior that's bitten me in the ass in a few matches now.

I'm running a LP Fuzion / Centurion in 6mm BRA with 107 SMKs going 2,880 fps. All my DOPE out to 750 yards has been validated. At the last couple matches I struggled on the KYL at 400 yards shooting prone. I know my DOPE at 400 yards is spot on because I've set my own up rack and confirmed on 6, 4, and 2-inch steel.

During the match a heavy mirage set in and I missed low on the small targets. After the match, I shot the KYL from a bench and cleaned holding dead center. During the match while prone I needed .to add .2 - .3 mils to connect.

From what I've read, boiling mirage typically has the opposite effect where the image appears higher than it actually is, so what the hell is going on and why?
 
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I think you answered your own question.

Yeah but if it appears higher then wouldn’t I be missing over the top?

I know the answer but I want to understand why if that makes sense
 
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Trajectory is Science
Wind is Art
Light is Voodoo

Guessing terrain and wind created the reverse of what you would expect. Where conditions identical when you went back? Clouds, sun.... voodoo
 
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Similar experience from a couple years ago.
 
Well it sounds like everyone is saying just take note and adjust accordingly and that’s fine.

It’s been fairly consistent over the years at this particular range that when it’s super hot out, you need to add a few tenths when shooting prone I just didn’t know if this had a specific predictable explanation
 
Yeah but if it appears higher then wouldn’t I be missing over the top?

I know the answer but I want to understand why if that makes sense
If the target appears higher than it physically is then you will aim at that higher image and your impact will be high.

Hopefully that helps.
 
zxyk8l7ly3b71.jpg
 
Would this match happen to have been at ASC Saturday?
I’ve had that same issue with the KYL in the past. I shot same match and was spot on this time. I was in squad 2 so I got to the KYL stage fairly early.
Which squad were you in?
Did you shoot later in day making the sun behind you?
 
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Would this match happen to have been at ASC Saturday?
I’ve had that same issue with the KYL in the past. I shot same match and was spot on this time. I was in squad 2 so I got to the KYL stage fairly early.
Which squad were you in?
Did you shoot later in day making the sun behind you?
Haha yep! I started on the hostage stage, not sure which number that was, maybe 3 or 4? I just know to hold a little high on the KYL but my brain wants to quantify it, I dont like doing the SWAG approach 😂
 
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That means you were in stage 3 just ahead of us. So that throws that theory out the window!🤣
What kind of scope were you using? Some scopes cut through the mirage better than others.
 
That means you were in stage 3 just ahead of us. So that throws that theory out the window!🤣
What kind of scope were you using? Some scopes cut through the mirage better than others.
Gen 2 Razor. John and Nick were both running ATACRs and although it was better, don’t think it made too much difference.

Mirage was pretty bad that match. That last big/small stage I couldn’t even see some of the small targets
 
Yeah, wasted about 9 rounds on that stage myself! The wind gets weird over there depending on which direction it’s out of.
I may have just been lucky on the KYL and the stars were lined up for me that day.
 
When I was shooting with my buddies and we all had the same thing happen, I was using an Athlon Helos, buddies were had an older Vortex PM2 and a S+B PM2. One cheap, one middle and one badass. All had the same result.
Shooting from prone at a target 2-3 feet up and could shot the head off a match. Shooting at about a 2 inch spinner target on the ground and caliche dust was flying.
Exactly the same thing you experienced.
Learning is fun.
I would also like to know what we experienced and havbe a name for it and be able to identify the conditions ahead of time.

Do you know which direction you were shooting? Where was the sun?
 
When I was shooting with my buddies and we all had the same thing happen, I was using an Athlon Helos, buddies were had an older Vortex PM2 and a S+B PM2. One cheap, one middle and one badass. All had the same result.
Shooting from prone at a target 2-3 feet up and could shot the head off a match. Shooting at about a 2 inch spinner target on the ground and caliche dust was flying.
Exactly the same thing you experienced.
Learning is fun.
I would also like to know what we experienced and havbe a name for it and be able to identify the conditions ahead of time.

Do you know which direction you were shooting? Where was the sun?
Shooting directly east and this was at peak mirage so 11am-1pm. The sun was directly overhead, Southeast and no real cover since it was a square range
 
My theory:
inferior mirage, a term used to describe the effect when the image is perceived at a position beneath the true position of the object.
hotroadmirage004.gif

 
My theory:
inferior mirage, a term used to describe the effect when the image is perceived at a position beneath the true position of the object.
hotroadmirage004.gif

Dude, I think you nailed it!
If you look in my mirrage thread this situation happened when the air temp rose pretty rapidly.
Inferior mirrage, Hot road mirrage. Makes sense that it happens with both the shooter and target close to what is causing.
Fantastic find! Thank you.
 
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Sketch show arrow (target) image inverted.
Does OP remember noticing that? It would be one more line of evidence in addition to terrain and conditions.
 
Sketch show arrow (target) image inverted.
Does OP remember noticing that? It would be one more line of evidence in addition to terrain and conditions.

Target was a KYL with circles so there wouldn’t be much distortion to the shape
 
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Try putting yourself as close to the same level as the target to mitigate the mirage.
 
Try putting yourself as close to the same level as the target to mitigate the mirage.

This just reminded me that there is a 12-15’ incline from the firing line to the ~600 yard line. This probably explains a lot as to why the inferior mirage is occurring as well
 
If a boiling mirage with lateral movement or hot road mirage is not enough to kick your butt there was a discussion about "looming mirage." Someone even posted a video -
 
Sketch show arrow (target) image inverted.
Does OP remember noticing that? It would be one more line of evidence in addition to terrain and conditions.
I thought the arrow was just pointing the way the mirrage moved the image. Reading through the description the image should be flipped. Looking back at my experience I do not remember the image being flipped. The road I was shooting on was caliche, which is basically crushed powdered limestone rolled smooth.
 
Deployed sniper/nerd in the Middle East here... thought I might throw some more science in the ring. Hopefully, I'm not too late to the party.

I actually had to do a few experiments to find solutions to problems like this in graduate school. I think what you were experiencing at the match is a combination of factors but can primarily be chalked up to the tricky effects of heat distortion, driven by reflection and/or refraction (essentially a speed change). I’m going to just jot down my train of thought and hopefully, you can use some quick math and confirms your findings.
Addressing the direction of refraction and reflection: The image as the observer sees it can reflect and refract.

1690033582204.png

Light passing from a less dense to a more dense medium bends toward the normal(N), and vice versa. Now, I don’t know where you were in relation to the sun and target, but since the image refracted or reflected the light down, and you held too little of DOPE, we can surmise there was a significant difference in air density between your shooting position and the target position. You just happened to be situated right at a barrier below the density line of two parcels of air…

The heat distortion effects are caused when light is refracted through air of differing densities. Hot air is obviously less dense than colder air, so light waves are bent differently in hot versus colder air toward what is called the normal, or the idealized 1:1 refraction through a medium with a 0-degree path shift. The result is visible heat waves when there is a significant temperature difference between the ground and the air above it that will bend the light path to the observer by up to 90 degrees! However, that is not super relevant here, as light rays bend 1.33 to normal in just water, or about 33% from the medium to the observer. Results can even be seen as an even larger shift at a greater distance and more angular perspective (the difference between elevated platforms and prone is significant).

So, let’s see if your results are within an expected refraction angle through presumably not perfectly dry air, and not submerged in 100% water. It would be helpful to know all your DOPE and weather data to really calculate this thoroughly, but we can roughly assume and estimate your angle of refraction to be between 1% and 33% (i.e. refraction angles of light--> Perfectly dry air = 1.0 and Water = 1.33).

Since we know light can appear upwards of 33 degrees off the actual straight/normal path to your eye, we simply need to see if your correction was within ~30% of your DOPE…. definitely are assuming your DOPE isn’t 3 mils or higher.

A DOPE of 1 mil would have an adjustment of up to < 0.3 mils
A DOPE of 2 mils would have an adjustment of up to < 0.6 mils
I'd wager given your DOPE, your correction was within 10% of it.

So, it all depends on the severity of air density, temperature, humidity, engagement angle, and distance! It really is one of those situations where you can’t possibly be completely precise without all the data… and the match lords certainly won’t give you everything. I think it was just an extra complicated stage due to environmental factors…

Hopefully, this helps and didn’t make it worse.

Peace from the Middle East
 
Deployed sniper/nerd in the Middle East here... thought I might throw some more science in the ring. Hopefully, I'm not too late to the party.

I actually had to do a few experiments to find solutions to problems like this in graduate school. I think what you were experiencing at the match is a combination of factors but can primarily be chalked up to the tricky effects of heat distortion, driven by reflection and/or refraction (essentially a speed change). I’m going to just jot down my train of thought and hopefully, you can use some quick math and confirms your findings.
Addressing the direction of refraction and reflection: The image as the observer sees it can reflect and refract.

View attachment 8188078
Light passing from a less dense to a more dense medium bends toward the normal(N), and vice versa. Now, I don’t know where you were in relation to the sun and target, but since the image refracted or reflected the light down, and you held too little of DOPE, we can surmise there was a significant difference in air density between your shooting position and the target position. You just happened to be situated right at a barrier below the density line of two parcels of air…

The heat distortion effects are caused when light is refracted through air of differing densities. Hot air is obviously less dense than colder air, so light waves are bent differently in hot versus colder air toward what is called the normal, or the idealized 1:1 refraction through a medium with a 0-degree path shift. The result is visible heat waves when there is a significant temperature difference between the ground and the air above it that will bend the light path to the observer by up to 90 degrees! However, that is not super relevant here, as light rays bend 1.33 to normal in just water, or about 33% from the medium to the observer. Results can even be seen as an even larger shift at a greater distance and more angular perspective (the difference between elevated platforms and prone is significant).

So, let’s see if your results are within an expected refraction angle through presumably not perfectly dry air, and not submerged in 100% water. It would be helpful to know all your DOPE and weather data to really calculate this thoroughly, but we can roughly assume and estimate your angle of refraction to be between 1% and 33% (i.e. refraction angles of light--> Perfectly dry air = 1.0 and Water = 1.33).

Since we know light can appear upwards of 33 degrees off the actual straight/normal path to your eye, we simply need to see if your correction was within ~30% of your DOPE…. definitely are assuming your DOPE isn’t 3 mils or higher.

A DOPE of 1 mil would have an adjustment of up to < 0.3 mils
A DOPE of 2 mils would have an adjustment of up to < 0.6 mils
I'd wager given your DOPE, your correction was within 10% of it.

So, it all depends on the severity of air density, temperature, humidity, engagement angle, and distance! It really is one of those situations where you can’t possibly be completely precise without all the data… and the match lords certainly won’t give you everything. I think it was just an extra complicated stage due to environmental factors…

Hopefully, this helps and didn’t make it worse.

Peace from the Middle East
Thank you for what you do.
Comment/question, I have seen mirrage moving up and right due to sun/heat and wind, I hit high and right. I would probably be able to correct for it a little bit now by holding sightly low and left. When would you know that image is shifted lower? Is there a tell tale or some type of sign that you could pick out? The only way we could tell was our bullets hitting low, but nothing to lead us to think that they would.
 
Absolutely. Kind of...

No celestial, or terrestrial refraction, usually causes objects to appear higher than they actually are (like we usually encounter), although in the afternoon when the air near the ground is heated, the rays can curve upward making objects appear lower than they actually are. The conditions just have to be right and changing... like shifting density altitude variables from heat gradients near the target. You can actually see this shift of the target in that other forum post of the target being filmed through the afternoon.

Since the line of sight in terrestrial refraction passes near the earth's surface, the magnitude of refraction depends chiefly on the temperature gradient near the ground, which varies widely at different times of day, seasons of the year, the nature of the terrain, the state of the weather, and other factors... so unfortunately there is no quick calculation to do... the math actually gets semi complicated. And the upward curvature of light rays creating a displaced mirage requires a more finite set og conditions when compared to a traditional mirage position. But if you want to deepdive, look up geodetic refraction calculations...

Another consideration to high and low impacts are the crosswinds themselves and how they roll bullets due to twist. With a right hand twist, a left to right crosswind will push the bullet down as it stabilizes through the air.

I'll do some more research in my old e books and see what else I can find. Sorry I dont have a sweet simple solution. Yet?...
 
All good points. At this point I’m strongly leaning towards a light refraction issue. At this match, I shot the PRS barricade at 400 yards and center punched the plate, then moved to a troop line where I hit a few sub-minute targets cleaning both stages (or maybe dropping 1) before moving to the KYL so I had a very strong grasp of windage and elevation. The issue here occurred during peak sun exposure, while prone, in 90-100 degree weather. In August if I see those conditions again, im going to give it a bold extra .3 mil and see what happens
 
Well it sounds like everyone is saying just take note and adjust accordingly and that’s fine.

It’s been fairly consistent over the years at this particular range that when it’s super hot out, you need to add a few tenths when shooting prone I just didn’t know if this had a specific predictable explanation
=D.O.P.E.
 
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