Re: max effective range for leupold 12X fixed scop
You your rifle and ammunition have a lot more to do with "effective range" than the scope
You your rifle and ammunition have a lot more to do with "effective range" than the scope
Re: max effective range for leupold 12X fixed scope?
I guess thats what I was asking.....Can I see enough of a 2'x2' target at 500 yards, 800 yards? to even have a shot at hitting it?
Maybe I can ask it like this....whats the normal zoom most folks use for shooting small targets at 500 and 800 yards?
Sorry, new to this and trying to learn....Have been reading some of the intro stuff...seems like they use 12-15X scopes....
I guess thats what I was asking.....Can I see enough of a 2'x2' target at 500 yards, 800 yards? to even have a shot at hitting it?
Maybe I can ask it like this....whats the normal zoom most folks use for shooting small targets at 500 and 800 yards?
Sorry, new to this and trying to learn....Have been reading some of the intro stuff...seems like they use 12-15X scopes....
Re: max effective range for leupold 12X fixed scope?
2'x2' is not very small, with 12x if the gun and shooter is capable you could shoot at 1500 yards.
Figure the eye resolves about 1 MOA, so you can see with the naked eye an 8" target at 800 yards. 12x would increase that apparent size and the target would look like an 8' target looks to the naked eye.
2'x2' is not very small, with 12x if the gun and shooter is capable you could shoot at 1500 yards.
Figure the eye resolves about 1 MOA, so you can see with the naked eye an 8" target at 800 yards. 12x would increase that apparent size and the target would look like an 8' target looks to the naked eye.
Re: max effective range for leupold 12X fixed scope?
You should have no problem with a 2'x2' with 12x out to a considerable range.
How far you can "see" it is going to depend on your eyes, mirage, and how fine the reticle is. How far you can hit with it will depend on your skill and the platform it's mounted to.
You should have no problem with a 2'x2' with 12x out to a considerable range.
How far you can "see" it is going to depend on your eyes, mirage, and how fine the reticle is. How far you can hit with it will depend on your skill and the platform it's mounted to.
Re: max effective range for leupold 12X fixed scope?
Sir,
What you want to do sir is look at the MOA per distance. so a 2"x2" is 1 MOA at 200yds, or 2 MOA at 100yds.
That same target is 1/2 MOA at 400yds.
So take it for what its worth.
Any target past 300yds that is 1 MOA or SMALLER in over all size, is not a good target to practice marksmanship on. Due to its a hit or a miss with no feedback.
If you have a larger than 1-2 MOA past 300yds you get much better feedback if thats what you want.
There is no shame in the game to have a 2 to 4 MOA target past 300yds and a 1/2 to 1 MOA right next to it to "TEST" your dope.
Hope that helps.
John
Sir,
What you want to do sir is look at the MOA per distance. so a 2"x2" is 1 MOA at 200yds, or 2 MOA at 100yds.
That same target is 1/2 MOA at 400yds.
So take it for what its worth.
Any target past 300yds that is 1 MOA or SMALLER in over all size, is not a good target to practice marksmanship on. Due to its a hit or a miss with no feedback.
If you have a larger than 1-2 MOA past 300yds you get much better feedback if thats what you want.
There is no shame in the game to have a 2 to 4 MOA target past 300yds and a 1/2 to 1 MOA right next to it to "TEST" your dope.
Hope that helps.
John
Re: max effective range for leupold 12X fixed scope?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">What you want to do sir is look at the MOA per distance. so a 2"x2" is 1 MOA at 200yds, or 2 MOA at 100yds. </div></div>
Look again, John.
He's talking about 2 feet by 2 feet, not 2 inches.
And, for what it's worth, I've shot LaRue plates - 11.75" by 22" - at 1000 yards with a 10X scope. I prefer a higher power at that distance, but 12X should be fine. The current Marine sniper scopes top out at 12 power.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">What you want to do sir is look at the MOA per distance. so a 2"x2" is 1 MOA at 200yds, or 2 MOA at 100yds. </div></div>
Look again, John.
He's talking about 2 feet by 2 feet, not 2 inches.
And, for what it's worth, I've shot LaRue plates - 11.75" by 22" - at 1000 yards with a 10X scope. I prefer a higher power at that distance, but 12X should be fine. The current Marine sniper scopes top out at 12 power.
Re: max effective range for leupold 12X fixed scope?
John makes a good point. All that's necessary for any marksman to get a good hit is to be able to maintain a relationship between the sight and target. Although, having too much magnification may not be an issue, a 1 MOA marksman being able to discern a 1/4 minute target will only serve to show such a marksman his miss.
John makes a good point. All that's necessary for any marksman to get a good hit is to be able to maintain a relationship between the sight and target. Although, having too much magnification may not be an issue, a 1 MOA marksman being able to discern a 1/4 minute target will only serve to show such a marksman his miss.
Re: max effective range for leupold 12X fixed scope?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Lindy</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">What you want to do sir is look at the MOA per distance. so a 2"x2" is 1 MOA at 200yds, or 2 MOA at 100yds. </div></div>
Look again, John.
He's talking about 2 feet by 2 feet, not 2 inches.
And, for what it's worth, I've shot LaRue plates - 11.75" by 22" - at 1000 yards with a 10X scope. I prefer a higher power at that distance, but 12X should be fine. The current Marine sniper scopes top out at 12 power.
</div></div>
Thanks for the check.
Its in the am and my OJ is just bottomed out.
A 2 foot by 2 Foot.
Thats a great target to use.
John
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Lindy</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">What you want to do sir is look at the MOA per distance. so a 2"x2" is 1 MOA at 200yds, or 2 MOA at 100yds. </div></div>
Look again, John.
He's talking about 2 feet by 2 feet, not 2 inches.
And, for what it's worth, I've shot LaRue plates - 11.75" by 22" - at 1000 yards with a 10X scope. I prefer a higher power at that distance, but 12X should be fine. The current Marine sniper scopes top out at 12 power.
</div></div>
Thanks for the check.
Its in the am and my OJ is just bottomed out.
A 2 foot by 2 Foot.
Thats a great target to use.
John
Re: max effective range for leupold 12X fixed scope?
Itbird,
On a 2'x2' steel plate you will probably be limited by the cartridge(caliber specifically) that you choose. When the round goes sub-sonic it likes to wander off it's intended path a ways. but, will still hit a large enough target if not totally disrupted. Meaning you and your rifle may hold MOA out to where the bullet goes sub-sonic, then through the trans-sonic stage it may only hold 3-4 MOA. Which at 900 yds equates to 9" turning into 27-36". More if you go farther out. This takes an almost completely windless environment to experience. Because you still have to call that when you are up against it. I have a couple of very clear 10x scopes that I have used to a mile and beyond on larger targets. Clear desert air helps, and altitude. I've also got a "lesser expensive" 24x scope that is a pita to shoot @ 1k.
You should easily be able to hit that at 500 yds. under non-strenuous conditions, i.e. a lot of wind or mirage. Move it out in 100 then 50 yd. increments until you can't see to hit it consistently.
What round are you shooting?
Itbird,
On a 2'x2' steel plate you will probably be limited by the cartridge(caliber specifically) that you choose. When the round goes sub-sonic it likes to wander off it's intended path a ways. but, will still hit a large enough target if not totally disrupted. Meaning you and your rifle may hold MOA out to where the bullet goes sub-sonic, then through the trans-sonic stage it may only hold 3-4 MOA. Which at 900 yds equates to 9" turning into 27-36". More if you go farther out. This takes an almost completely windless environment to experience. Because you still have to call that when you are up against it. I have a couple of very clear 10x scopes that I have used to a mile and beyond on larger targets. Clear desert air helps, and altitude. I've also got a "lesser expensive" 24x scope that is a pita to shoot @ 1k.
You should easily be able to hit that at 500 yds. under non-strenuous conditions, i.e. a lot of wind or mirage. Move it out in 100 then 50 yd. increments until you can't see to hit it consistently.
What round are you shooting?
Re: max effective range for leupold 12X fixed scope?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: lt1bird</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I have .308 federal gold metal match 168GR
I am trying to find a range here in Ma that is longer that 200 yards...</div></div>
You should have no problem hitting that at that range. You can probably field bore sight your rifle with that plate at that range.
When you do get a chance, that round, at standard temps will go sub-sonic just after 900 yds. (930?). In warmer temps or higher altitudes it will go a lot farther.
-good luck
You try looking into this group? Associations, and being part of one, always help in the gun world:
http://www.massrifle.com/
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: lt1bird</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I have .308 federal gold metal match 168GR
I am trying to find a range here in Ma that is longer that 200 yards...</div></div>
You should have no problem hitting that at that range. You can probably field bore sight your rifle with that plate at that range.
When you do get a chance, that round, at standard temps will go sub-sonic just after 900 yds. (930?). In warmer temps or higher altitudes it will go a lot farther.
-good luck
You try looking into this group? Associations, and being part of one, always help in the gun world:
http://www.massrifle.com/
Re: max effective range for leupold 12X fixed scope?
Nominally, the unaided healthy eye can resolve objects down to about 1MOA in angular size. At 100yd, that's technically, precisely 1.047" and at 1000yd, that's a bit more than 10". So the 24" object should be resolvable with the naked eye out to a distance of at least 2000yd.
But taking a look at an F Class target at 1000yd, I'd say we really would need to use a more reasonable LR resolution of about 4MOA of angular distance for the naked eye, and start my magnification minimum value at around 4X.
At the other end, I find that 16-18X is about the reasonable maximum when mirage is running strong, and have been able, on the relatively rare occasions of unusually clear conditions, been able to put 24X to full use, where low magnification image acquisition is more important.
When shooting beyond 300yd, wind reading ability becomes as crucial as visual acuity, and beyond 600yd, it becomes the dominant factor. Your optics will serve you best if they can provide clear images of the wind's effects on distant terrain features, like leaves and grass, so clarity is at least as important as magnification. That's what you pay the bigger bucks for.
I like a 6-24X42 for stationary applications, and could make good use of a 4-16X42 for more portable ones.
Greg
Nominally, the unaided healthy eye can resolve objects down to about 1MOA in angular size. At 100yd, that's technically, precisely 1.047" and at 1000yd, that's a bit more than 10". So the 24" object should be resolvable with the naked eye out to a distance of at least 2000yd.
But taking a look at an F Class target at 1000yd, I'd say we really would need to use a more reasonable LR resolution of about 4MOA of angular distance for the naked eye, and start my magnification minimum value at around 4X.
At the other end, I find that 16-18X is about the reasonable maximum when mirage is running strong, and have been able, on the relatively rare occasions of unusually clear conditions, been able to put 24X to full use, where low magnification image acquisition is more important.
When shooting beyond 300yd, wind reading ability becomes as crucial as visual acuity, and beyond 600yd, it becomes the dominant factor. Your optics will serve you best if they can provide clear images of the wind's effects on distant terrain features, like leaves and grass, so clarity is at least as important as magnification. That's what you pay the bigger bucks for.
I like a 6-24X42 for stationary applications, and could make good use of a 4-16X42 for more portable ones.
Greg
Re: max effective range for leupold 12X fixed scope?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: lt1bird</div><div class="ubbcode-body">If I can find a long range near me I can actually play with longer shots....thanks for the info!
</div></div>
i run a 10x fixed and have hitting 12" plate past 1k. 12x will do anything a .308 needs and then some.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: lt1bird</div><div class="ubbcode-body">If I can find a long range near me I can actually play with longer shots....thanks for the info!
</div></div>
i run a 10x fixed and have hitting 12" plate past 1k. 12x will do anything a .308 needs and then some.
Re: max effective range for leupold 12X fixed scope?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: dgunn</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
i run a 10x fixed and have hitting 12" plate past 1k. 12x will do anything a .308 needs and then some. </div></div>
Are you using an adjustable objective on that fixed 10x?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: dgunn</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
i run a 10x fixed and have hitting 12" plate past 1k. 12x will do anything a .308 needs and then some. </div></div>
Are you using an adjustable objective on that fixed 10x?
Re: max effective range for leupold 12X fixed scope?
(i know you ment this for the other Guy but) yes, mine does have ojective lens on the front end.....From what ive read it really does not do much....I have not shot with this scope yet so I cannot tell yet....They say the diffrence from infinity to 50 yard setting is only about a few inches at 600 yards or so....Is that true? Whats the proper way to use the objective?
(i know you ment this for the other Guy but) yes, mine does have ojective lens on the front end.....From what ive read it really does not do much....I have not shot with this scope yet so I cannot tell yet....They say the diffrence from infinity to 50 yard setting is only about a few inches at 600 yards or so....Is that true? Whats the proper way to use the objective?
Re: max effective range for leupold 12X fixed scope?
It1bird,
The proper way to use that ring is to set it at the range you intend to shoot. Then focus, using the AO, on the target as clear as you can. Look at the target and just barely move your head in a circle. If you see the crosshair move then adjust at the front of the scope to where it doesn't. Adjust focus ring again until target and reticle is clear again and crosshairs no longer move.
What you are doing, and what the front ring controls, is parallax. In short when you are focused on the target it allows the scope to have the crosshairs focused within the scope to see them perfectly. It puts the crosshairs in alignment with the focusing process to keep them zeroed (focused) at the range you intend to shoot. Working out parallax of a scope can sometimes be a pain but it's good practice in itself, aside from shooting, to work on.
It1bird,
The proper way to use that ring is to set it at the range you intend to shoot. Then focus, using the AO, on the target as clear as you can. Look at the target and just barely move your head in a circle. If you see the crosshair move then adjust at the front of the scope to where it doesn't. Adjust focus ring again until target and reticle is clear again and crosshairs no longer move.
What you are doing, and what the front ring controls, is parallax. In short when you are focused on the target it allows the scope to have the crosshairs focused within the scope to see them perfectly. It puts the crosshairs in alignment with the focusing process to keep them zeroed (focused) at the range you intend to shoot. Working out parallax of a scope can sometimes be a pain but it's good practice in itself, aside from shooting, to work on.
Re: max effective range for leupold 12X fixed scope?
Quick scan and don't think that anyone else said this. You should figure about 1x per 100 that you are shooting.
Meaning a 10x should get you to 1000.
As said above, you own eyes will determine some, but that will get you close.
Chad
Quick scan and don't think that anyone else said this. You should figure about 1x per 100 that you are shooting.
Meaning a 10x should get you to 1000.
As said above, you own eyes will determine some, but that will get you close.
Chad
Re: max effective range for leupold 12X fixed scope?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: XLIV</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: dgunn</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
i run a 10x fixed and have hitting 12" plate past 1k. 12x will do anything a .308 needs and then some. </div></div>
Are you using an adjustable objective on that fixed 10x? </div></div>
yes, ergo 44mm
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: XLIV</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: dgunn</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
i run a 10x fixed and have hitting 12" plate past 1k. 12x will do anything a .308 needs and then some. </div></div>
Are you using an adjustable objective on that fixed 10x? </div></div>
yes, ergo 44mm
