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Gunsmithing Build vs buy

R

rdmega

Sergeant
Full Member
Minuteman
Mar 25, 2011
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utah
I have been shooting my Savage 10FP for a few years now, its in .308 and I have a Stockade Prarie Tactical so I like that style. I work for a distibutor and I can get very good deals on Savage stuff. Here is my question:

Would it be better to build a .260 using a) a stevens and rifle basix trigger and a custom barrel b) target action and custom barrel Or c) get the LRP model with the HS stock on it and jus shoot it. Prices total would be approx. a) $860 b) $875 c) $643.

Thanks for the responses, now off to work!
 
Re: Build vs buy

If you can get an LRP and HS for $643, then its a no brainer!
 
Re: Build vs buy

I just wasnt sure if those barrels shoot as well as a custom for only $200 more, but yes that model has the HS precision although it is a more sporter model than I would like, I believe all the HS stocks are at least pillar bedded?
 
Re: Build vs buy

I have no beef whatsoever with Savage barrels, but for $100-200 extra, I'd definitely get a sweet aftermarket custom barrel.
 
Re: Build vs buy

what direction you should take your savage depends on what you want to accomplish with it. you didnt say.
 
Re: Build vs buy

MALLARD Good point I didnt, I am just looking for something for a little better wind and elevation than my .308 but I am not ready to take it to a magnum yet. I am going to have a .338 eventually so this will bridge the gap but allow me to shoot more than a .300 win mag or 7mm wsm that I considered.

Just target shooting, but eventually I want to try some competitions, I like the idea of F-class.
 
Re: Build vs buy

247,

I decided a long time ago to never sell a gun again unless it doesn't perform! I cant let the new one be lonely in the safe.
 
Re: Build vs buy

I'd suggest you look into what kind of a deal your company can give you on a factory Savage 12 Long Range Precision .260 Rem.
 
Re: Build vs buy

That is one of the options mentioned and discussed. The one with the HS stock on it.
 
Re: Build vs buy

Maybe I should just buy a .260 barrel and then buy a long action for 7mm wsm or similar....

I like having a .308 but I have a DPMS SASS on the way.
 
Re: Build vs buy

Really? I honestly did not know this about the barrels. I thought that is why Savage barrels were a little rough and most people speak highly of Kriegers....
 
Re: Build vs buy

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: rdmega</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Really? I honestly did not know this about the barrels. I thought that is why Savage barrels were a little rough and most people speak highly of Kriegers.... </div></div>

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Krieger faq</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Q: Why is there some confusion that we might do button rifling?

A: In 1999, another barrel company was started under our roof, Criterion Barrels, that manufactures button rifled barrels for the O.E.M. market. These barrels are not directly for sale to the general public by Krieger Barrels OR Criterion Barrels, and depending on what you are looking for, are available through distributors such as Fulton Armory, The Civilian Marksmanship Program, etc.. Recently there have been some magazine articles written regarding this company which has caused some confusion. Be assured that when you order a Krieger Barrel, you are getting a single-point cut-rifled Krieger Barrel.

If you are a distributor looking to purchase Criterion barrels in quantity, please call the Criterion Barrels line directly at 262-628-8749 and we can direct to to the person that you would need to speak with.</div></div>

<span style="font-weight: bold">There is a major difference between button rifled for OEM and cut rifled for custom builds. The quality and price are going to be higher for the cut rifled custom barrel</span>
 
Re: Build vs buy

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Griffin Armament</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: rdmega</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Really? I honestly did not know this about the barrels. I thought that is why Savage barrels were a little rough and most people speak highly of Kriegers.... </div></div>

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Krieger faq</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Q: Why is there some confusion that we might do button rifling?

A: In 1999, another barrel company was started under our roof, Criterion Barrels, that manufactures button rifled barrels for the O.E.M. market. These barrels are not directly for sale to the general public by Krieger Barrels OR Criterion Barrels, and depending on what you are looking for, are available through distributors such as Fulton Armory, The Civilian Marksmanship Program, etc.. Recently there have been some magazine articles written regarding this company which has caused some confusion. Be assured that when you order a Krieger Barrel, you are getting a single-point cut-rifled Krieger Barrel.

If you are a distributor looking to purchase Criterion barrels in quantity, please call the Criterion Barrels line directly at 262-628-8749 and we can direct to to the person that you would need to speak with.</div></div>

<span style="font-weight: bold">There is a major difference between button rifled for OEM and cut rifled for custom builds. The quality and price are going to be higher for the cut rifled custom barrel</span> </div></div>

That seems more like it. I would think that the accuracy gained in going from a factory heavy barrel to a custom barrel would be noticeable, add to that the move from .260 to .308 and it might be worth it vs a new gun.
 
Re: Build vs buy

the .260s are known for burning up barrels , some guys say the accuracy only lasts for 1200 rounds vs the 308 which accuracy is reguarded to last for thousands of rounds.

for long range shooting and f-class, the 308 can not compete with the 260 , the 260 has a higher velocity and bc, it simply outflies the 308. But the 6.5 burns up barrels. Competitions are hard on guns. Stuff to think about, a 308 gun will last longer then a .260

as for options A,B, and C i wouldnt know. I dont know much about savage target actions , if they are trued up versions of a standard savage action then i would roll with that and upgrade the trigger/stock later if that is something you want to do.

another thing to think about is the cost , shooting 308 ammo is cheaper then 6.5mm , those bullets are pretty expensive. Your not going to find any dirt cheap plinking ammo for a 260 , but , considering how 6.5mm's burn up barrels, i dont think that is something you want to do in the first place.

basically , if it was me , and you wanted to aviod buying a new barrel again , the 308 is the way to go. If you want performance , the 260 is the choice. But i cant comment on sae target actions , wish i could. Maybe ill think about getting one.
 
Re: Build vs buy

The OEM buttoned barrel gets "straightened" at Savage. <IE it wasn't even straight till they bent it that way.

The Krieger Cut rifled barrels are triple cryoed, lapped after drilling and after cutting rifling, and all have to be something like concentric and straight within ~.003-.005" end to end. They are then put on centers and OD ground within .0005" concentric bore to OD.

Basically these steps allow:

quality barrels to be made every time without tons of scrap

render lapping later unnecessary

minimize accuracy robbing barrel whip (barrel is straight and material thickness on all sides of the bore is extremely consistent)
 
Re: Build vs buy

Mallard, while the 260 does burn barrels alot faster than a 308 most are getting 2k plus out of warm to hot loads with a 260. Now if you are talking 6.5-284, 1200 could be close. Barrels are consumable like bullets, powder and brass. It comes down to how much performance you want with your choice. Like all things higher performance means higher maintenance.
 
Re: Build vs buy

A note about Fclass: there are 2 divisions, FTR, which is 223/308 only, and Fopen, which is everything else under 35 cal. If you want to compete in Fopen past 600 yards - a 260 won't be "great". You'll be against 6.5-284, 284, 7WSM etc etc...all with superior ballistics than 260.

My opinion is to stick with FTR with 308 until you want to play with a hotrod.

I am tryin to walk a fine line here about barrels...

Custom quality barrels are great, but Savage barrels are usually better than the shooter. For someone experienced, who is serious about the hobby/sport, a Krieger/Bartlein/etc is a good investment - but those folks winning or running up would probably still win or at least come damn close with a factory barrel. The difference is usually NOT night and day - and takes a great shooter to even shoot the difference.
 
Re: Build vs buy

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: turbo54</div><div class="ubbcode-body">A note about Fclass: there are 2 divisions, FTR, which is 223/308 only, and Fopen, which is everything else under 35 cal. If you want to compete in Fopen past 600 yards - a 260 won't be "great". You'll be against 6.5-284, 284, 7WSM etc etc...all with superior ballistics than 260.

My opinion is to stick with FTR with 308 until you want to play with a hotrod.

I am tryin to walk a fine line here about barrels...

Custom quality barrels are great, but Savage barrels are usually better than the shooter. For someone experienced, who is serious about the hobby/sport, a Krieger/Bartlein/etc is a good investment - but those folks winning or running up would probably still win or at least come damn close with a factory barrel. The difference is usually NOT night and day - and takes a great shooter to even shoot the difference. </div></div>

+1

If you can swing it, go with a custom cut rifled barrel. It's worth the extra couple hundred dollars. You won't regret it when bullets are stacked on top of each other.

There is a reason why most top shooters use custom barrels.
 
Re: Build vs buy

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Rthur</div><div class="ubbcode-body"> Barrels are consumable like bullets, powder and brass. It comes down to how much performance you want with your choice. Like all things higher performance means higher maintenance.</div></div>

This is really a solid way to look at this !

At some point, in any sport, the cost vs value falls away and your paying 300% more for 1% of gain.

Take a look at your needs and wants, then take a look at your budget.

Another good test, if you cant stand to run out back and light a $100 bill on fire, then maybe this isnt for you. It can be hard
 
Re: Build vs buy

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Rprecision</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Rthur</div><div class="ubbcode-body"> Barrels are consumable like bullets, powder and brass. It comes down to how much performance you want with your choice. Like all things higher performance means higher maintenance.</div></div>

This is really a solid way to look at this !

At some point, in any sport, the cost vs value falls away and your paying 300% more for 1% of gain.

Take a look at your needs and wants, then take a look at your budget.

Another good test, if you cant stand to run out back and light a $100 bill on fire, then maybe this isnt for you. It can be hard </div></div>

Well, if my hobby was burning money I wouldn't mind doing that. Seeing as I get no entertainment from burning money I would rather burn a barrel. If I keep the .308, which I probably will cause IMO more guns is better, then I dont mind the .260 burning up barrels faster. I expect that but if its only going to yeild me 2000 rounds then I may just want to consider a magnum to bridge the gap between .308 and the lapua I plan to get soon. The only added expenditure would be the muzzle brake at that point cause I want one on a magnum.

Am I thinking correct on this? I like the idea of less recoil and powder burn with .260 plus forming brass from .308 though.... Too many calibers, I should plan on both!
 
Re: Build vs buy

I agree with all that has been said except the 260 burning barrels.
I have one customer that is at 2100 and is still sub 1/4 moa. And mine is not far behind in the round count. Both of these guns are loaded HOT, VERY HOT! It could be that both are using Obermyer 5rs. But with a 260 like the 308 most of the powder burns in the case. This keeps the sand (unburnt powder) blasting of the barrel to a minimum. Sorry but thats my 2 cents.
 
Re: Build vs buy

Buy the LRP,
spend the difference on ammo, a headpsace gauge and the tools to change your barrel...
shoot the hell out of it.....
buy nice barrel later...
change barrel...
repeat..
 
Re: Build vs buy

I shoot a 260 in tactical matches and it has a very desirable barrel life. You'll get 2400 rounds before your barrel starts to lose velocity and accuracy. Go with a quality cut rifled barrel manufacturer and you won't be sorry. I run a 8.5 twist with excellent results.

Get a gunsmith to cut you a chamber with a .088 - .098 freebore with a .298 neck and you won't run into neck clearance issues with Lapua brass, Rem or Norma. Run 139 Scenars .015 off the lands (to start) with H4831SC or H4350 powder and you'll be very pleased with it's accuracy and performance. The reason for the freebore clearance I mentioned is that it's the longest length you'll run your bullets (139 Scenars/142 SMK)to fit in the AICS mag box if you ever decide to modify your stock to run that type of DMB system.

There are over 20+ guys at Nor Cal that run a 260 and all of them have excellent success with the set up that I mentioned above.

If your gunsmith doesn't have the reamer I suggested, give Stephen @ Surgeon Rifles a call or Marc Soulie @ http://www.spartanrifles.com he's got that reamer I mentioned and his rifles shoot bugholes. You won't be disappointed with their work.
 
Re: Build vs buy

Good info and an interesting variety of opinions. Make sure to post some pics of your build after you have finished with it. Good luck.
 
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