DeLane Development Group Rimfire Ventures
- Thread starter RAVAGE88
- Start date
I appreciate the tons of feedback about preferred magazine capacity, and I'm not too surprised about the responses. I won't give too much away at this point, but I'll say now that I'm definitely doing a legit 10 round. I'm focused on modularizing a few things and I believe everyone will be pleased.
As I've worked through this, I've noted a few interesting things and I'm pretty excited about the path to the new magazines. So, another question; given what's been available, what has worked the best for you guys? Where do you see the greater challenges related to feeding (based on how you use your rifles)?
As I mentioned recently, a lot is happening in parallel to try and make everything available around the same timeframe. I'll continue to keep everyone posted and believe I can speak to timelines very soon.
MB
As I've worked through this, I've noted a few interesting things and I'm pretty excited about the path to the new magazines. So, another question; given what's been available, what has worked the best for you guys? Where do you see the greater challenges related to feeding (based on how you use your rifles)?
As I mentioned recently, a lot is happening in parallel to try and make everything available around the same timeframe. I'll continue to keep everyone posted and believe I can speak to timelines very soon.
MB
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90% of the positional shooting issues arise when a magazine block is not used and a magazine is your barricade block. Pressure on it will cause a failure. I'm not sure if there is a way to make one so rigid in place it wont induce a failure when it pushed against a bag.
The addition of adjustable mag latches and catches will remove the improper magazine height. I know you have already lead into this being a must.
A magazine that works in a plethora of bottom metals, adjustable mag catch & reliable feeding. You will have achieved 95% of the issues. I have found the XYLO Chassis to have the TIGHTEST Magazine well of them all. I have a few Vudoo Mags that will not fit. Just to tight. The OG Metal magazines and RimX mags fit on the money with little to no play at all.
The addition of adjustable mag latches and catches will remove the improper magazine height. I know you have already lead into this being a must.
A magazine that works in a plethora of bottom metals, adjustable mag catch & reliable feeding. You will have achieved 95% of the issues. I have found the XYLO Chassis to have the TIGHTEST Magazine well of them all. I have a few Vudoo Mags that will not fit. Just to tight. The OG Metal magazines and RimX mags fit on the money with little to no play at all.
Mike, I’ve noticed so many mag issues are from the variances in chassis tolerances. My match Vudoo hasn’t changed but once I settled on a Foundation with the Vudoo BM early last year I've never had an issue again.
I think somehow eliminating that tolerance would be a huge help. Something like the CZ where the mag fits into the action regardless of chassis. Easier said than done but that lockup feeds excellent.
Your own BM or a sleeve that drops into the AICS chassis with a slightly smaller mag perhaps?
It’s a shame Vudoo’s BM isn’t a standard Badger inlet because that locks in their mags like nothing else and nothing to come loose during a match.
I think somehow eliminating that tolerance would be a huge help. Something like the CZ where the mag fits into the action regardless of chassis. Easier said than done but that lockup feeds excellent.
Your own BM or a sleeve that drops into the AICS chassis with a slightly smaller mag perhaps?
It’s a shame Vudoo’s BM isn’t a standard Badger inlet because that locks in their mags like nothing else and nothing to come loose during a match.
My response may be a little weird, but it's a data point: I have zero gripes about my 10-round polymer and 15-round aluminum mags in my gen-1 V22 mounted in MPA BA Comp chassis (with adjustable mag latch).
Once the adjustable latch was in place and I learned to load the mags correctly, feeding issues disappeared. I have no had a feed malfunction in literally years, shooting ~1000-1500 rounds per year, with maybe 1/3-1/2 of that in timed events.
What works best: Follower button that lets me easily load all those slippery rounds in summer heat.
It's hard for me to conceive of a .22 I like and trust as much as mine but, Mike, if you come up with a new design, I'm in.
EDIT: regarding misfeeds if a magazine is pushed into a prop: maybe - almost certainly - my lack of problems with this is a result of just keeping the mag clear. I use a "schmedium" Game Changer attached to a gamer plate (Area 419) which helps a lot with that... also, I'm old and slower than cold molasses.
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Modularizing a few things? As in a modular magazine!? The ability to change a mag from a 10rd to 12-15(whatever) with a modular add-on would be awesome. There are lots of magazine extensions out there, but I've yet to see a mag thats designed for it. I'd love to be able to use a follower button with an extended magazine.
Great info, Dude, and you hit every key point that I have in the project ORD.
I'm doing my DBM again as the original inlet along with the same DBM in what I'm calling my M5x inlet. The DDG M5x DBM will fit all M5 stocks.
I'm having to throttle back the excitement so I don't share more than I should too soon....
MB
I make a Chassis with an adjustable magwell to adjust how tight the magazine fits for this very issue.
Thought that might be it with the MO Location. I have seen T. Wyman's & talk to C. Brown regularly.
#1 is the issue of magwell fitment being tied to bottom metal/chassis not the action itself.
#2 issue is the rocking of the mag. Designs with the spring location reversed back to front may address this.
#3 slant-stack loading is better than vertical stack loading, if feeding is otherwise equal.
#2 issue is the rocking of the mag. Designs with the spring location reversed back to front may address this.
#3 slant-stack loading is better than vertical stack loading, if feeding is otherwise equal.
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Good info, Dude.
#1. Not a consideration for me.
#2. 100% agree and I've addressed excess movement.
#3. Although I don't agree that the angled stack is "better" than the vertical stack, I incorporated an angled stack into the new line of magazines.
MB
I have previously used my Vudoo for squirrel hunting. A 5 round magazine would be nice!
Hey MB! It's exciting to see the engagement and development being set forth. This is much needed for our community. Ill take a stab at some input from what I've seen.
Chassis's magwells are all over the place. To incorporate adjustments in a mag for these tolerances may work for one chassis but not a bottom metal / other chassis. I think a better approach to this will be to design a mag specific to certain bottom metals or popular competition chassis. Work out confirmation with the manufacture thier tolerance and if proposed changes can happen. I know these will increase sku count and products, but I see no other approach IMO to accommodate a Universal fitment mag without compromise in fitment or ability to drop the mag freely
A lot of the issues I've seen and personally delt with jamming a round into the back of the chamber are due to competition use on barricades, support gear pushing up against the mag dipping it downward. When bolt faces arnt cleaned, allowing extractors to allow the cartridge to slip in the control round feed, the failure rate increases. While majority of the malfunctions are user induced, its nearly inevitable in a competition setting.
With that stated, another approach will be a way for the user to add spacers/adjustments to the mag to accommodate the tolerances themselves with thier chassis. If we have a way to adjust the mag fitment for side to side play as well as forward and back, IMO this will help mitigate some of these issues. E.G.: While MDT incorporated delrin bushings, I'm finding its still not enough to tighten up side to side or dipping of the mag. Some assistance in a feedramp can help with this... also if whom ever built the barrel actually did a radius or chamfer on the chamber opening..
Mag feed lips need to be out of metal, wear in both the injection molding and use of the mag will eventually cause rounds to nose up.
Like others mentioned..... I personally don't want a mag thats near 1lb. Nylon also helps with durability on dropping mags in the housing also.
When Vudoo was proposed to release their mag, I saw they patent the design of the mag to have a slant body to help with keeping the mag off shooting bags and barricades. Is their a way to incorporate this or is that design going to be stagnant?
Chassis's magwells are all over the place. To incorporate adjustments in a mag for these tolerances may work for one chassis but not a bottom metal / other chassis. I think a better approach to this will be to design a mag specific to certain bottom metals or popular competition chassis. Work out confirmation with the manufacture thier tolerance and if proposed changes can happen. I know these will increase sku count and products, but I see no other approach IMO to accommodate a Universal fitment mag without compromise in fitment or ability to drop the mag freely
A lot of the issues I've seen and personally delt with jamming a round into the back of the chamber are due to competition use on barricades, support gear pushing up against the mag dipping it downward. When bolt faces arnt cleaned, allowing extractors to allow the cartridge to slip in the control round feed, the failure rate increases. While majority of the malfunctions are user induced, its nearly inevitable in a competition setting.
With that stated, another approach will be a way for the user to add spacers/adjustments to the mag to accommodate the tolerances themselves with thier chassis. If we have a way to adjust the mag fitment for side to side play as well as forward and back, IMO this will help mitigate some of these issues. E.G.: While MDT incorporated delrin bushings, I'm finding its still not enough to tighten up side to side or dipping of the mag. Some assistance in a feedramp can help with this... also if whom ever built the barrel actually did a radius or chamfer on the chamber opening..
Mag feed lips need to be out of metal, wear in both the injection molding and use of the mag will eventually cause rounds to nose up.
Like others mentioned..... I personally don't want a mag thats near 1lb. Nylon also helps with durability on dropping mags in the housing also.
When Vudoo was proposed to release their mag, I saw they patent the design of the mag to have a slant body to help with keeping the mag off shooting bags and barricades. Is their a way to incorporate this or is that design going to be stagnant?
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