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NRA Highpower match rifles

S

stork23raz

Private
Full Member
Minuteman
Feb 14, 2010
25
2
38
east Tennessee
I am joining a local gun club. I have been regulary talking to the Coach of their Highpower team. He teaches the newbies how to shoot highpower and get them team ready. I asked him whats some opinions on what rifle i need to get. He recommended RRA, Fulton Armory, Armalite, DPMS,or if i wanted to get a lower then just to get White Oak upper.

I was really considering complete RRA or the white oak path. The DPMS upper can be ordered from midway for less. I am not sure since it is chambered for 223 and the rra and WOA are chambered in 223 wylde. I know that most everyone now uses mostly wylde chambers. The white oaks are very popular for their precision. I will probaly be shooting 75s. What path do you all recommend?
How is the trigger on the DPMS? i know the RRA is gettn good reviews. If i do white oak path I figured id just order a a2 lower and get a giessele.
the white oak has 1 in7 and wylde, how would that tcompare to the RRA 1 in 8 with wyldechamber or the dpms 1in 8 ?
I am a a complete newby to highpower, but id get the right setup on the first time around.
 
Re: NRA Highpower match rifles

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: stork23raz</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I am joining a local gun club. I have been regulary talking to the Coach of their Highpower team. He teaches the newbies how to shoot highpower and get them team ready. I asked him whats some opinions on what rifle i need to get. He recommended RRA, Fulton Armory, Armalite, DPMS,or if i wanted to get a lower then just to get White Oak upper.

I was really considering complete RRA or the white oak path. The DPMS upper can be ordered from midway for less. I am not sure since it is chambered for 223 and the rra and WOA are chambered in 223 wylde. I know that most everyone now uses mostly wylde chambers. The white oaks are very popular for their precision. I will probaly be shooting 75s. What path do you all recommend?
How is the trigger on the DPMS? i know the RRA is gettn good reviews. If i do white oak path I figured id just order a a2 lower and get a giessele.
the white oak has 1 in7 and wylde, how would that tcompare to the RRA 1 in 8 with wyldechamber or the dpms 1in 8 ?
I am a a complete newby to highpower, but id get the right setup on the first time around. </div></div>
i hate the dpms triggers with a passion....for precision use i go with JP single stage all day...for hard work use, and carbine school use i go with giessele ssa, and the E trigger
 
Re: NRA Highpower match rifles

I ran a RRA NM stock rifle my first season. I shot some good scores and was happy with how it performed. I dry fired the trigger so much that it lost it's second stage.

For the second season I shot the same lower and upgraded to a Geissele (sp.) trigger and a White Oak upper.

The trigger made the biggest difference and the upper helped a little as well. You can still clean the 600 yd target with a RRA, but the white oak for me has held just a little tighter.

Good luck. It is a great sport.
 
Re: NRA Highpower match rifles

My vote goes to the White Oak and giessele trigger.

Eventually you're gonna want to shoot heavier bullets at 600 & 1000. That 1:7 is gonna be handy.
 
Re: NRA Highpower match rifles

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: kraigWY</div><div class="ubbcode-body">My vote goes to the White Oak and giessele trigger.

Eventually you're gonna want to shoot heavier bullets at 600 & 1000. That 1:7 is gonna be handy. </div></div>

What he said.

If you are thinking of the White Oak, there is about a 12 week wait. At least there was for mine. Ordered in early June, still not here. WOP said the Krieger barrels were slow in coming. I'm gonna have to call Jack Kreiger and tell him to get off his ass.
 
Re: NRA Highpower match rifles

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: benchmstr</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: stork23raz</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I am joining a local gun club. I have been regulary talking to the Coach of their Highpower team. He teaches the newbies how to shoot highpower and get them team ready. I asked him whats some opinions on what rifle i need to get. He recommended RRA, Fulton Armory, Armalite, DPMS,or if i wanted to get a lower then just to get White Oak upper.

I was really considering complete RRA or the white oak path. The DPMS upper can be ordered from midway for less. I am not sure since it is chambered for 223 and the rra and WOA are chambered in 223 wylde. I know that most everyone now uses mostly wylde chambers. The white oaks are very popular for their precision. I will probaly be shooting 75s. What path do you all recommend?
How is the trigger on the DPMS? i know the RRA is gettn good reviews. If i do white oak path I figured id just order a a2 lower and get a giessele.
the white oak has 1 in7 and wylde, how would that tcompare to the RRA 1 in 8 with wyldechamber or the dpms 1in 8 ?
I am a a complete newby to highpower, but id get the right setup on the first time around. </div></div>
i hate the dpms triggers with a passion....for precision use i go with JP single stage all day...for hard work use, and carbine school use i go with giessele ssa, and the E trigger</div></div>
needs to be adouble stage. single stage would be to heavy. minium is 4.5 pound trigger pull
 
Re: NRA Highpower match rifles

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: _9H</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Go to usrifleteams.com, the national match forum, and read all the pinned threads. </div></div>

+1

I just dumped a load of cash as I got into HP last year. I went the RRA lower and WOA route. The double pinned rear sight is a nice add. I also added the Geissele and lead wedge for the buttstock. An alternative to the Geissele is to have Jon at WOA do a trigger job on your existing 2-stage trigger. I think he charges only $30 or so.
 
Re: NRA Highpower match rifles

I am in the same situation as the op. I was wondering if there is any difference between an Armalite and RRA lower, or just go with the best price point. I am planning on installing a Geissele trigger in the lower I get an am looking at the WOA upper.

Hope I didn't hijack this thread, didn't want to start a new thread on the same subject.

Thanks.
 
Re: NRA Highpower match rifles

The single biggest problem going with the WOA upper, RRA lower, and Giessele trigger is this - when you don't shoot well, you won't be able to blame it on your equipment.
 
Re: NRA Highpower match rifles

Either barrel twist(7 or 8) will work forne for the bullets you'll most likely be shooting in HP matches - 75-80 grainers. If you want to buy a factory rifle for HP, the RRA is the only one I'd recommend. The rifles are typically good enough to take you to Distinguished Rifleman status and High Master classification if you work hard enough at it. They are a good option if you want to pick up a rifle off the shelf and start shooting and not lay out a ton of cash. If you have the money to spend, you may as well go with the WOA upper and the Geissele trigger - it's what you'll end up with anyway if you stick with the sport. The pinned rear sight is worth the extra $, IMHO. Buy any quality stripped lower, LPK and A2 stock you want and slap it all together with your Geissele trigger. You will have a rifle capable of shooting as well as the best SR shooters in the world. Now, you'll just have to earn how to use it!

Also, Frank White at Compass Lake Engineering makes a SR upper that is in the same class as the WOA offering. It is generally regarded just as highly and will shoot just as well.

Welcome to the sport and good luck!

Erik
 
Re: NRA Highpower match rifles

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: lennyo3034</div><div class="ubbcode-body">CMP service grade Garand. </div></div>\

Hilarious! Love it! You a funny guy!
 
Re: NRA Highpower match rifles

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Originally Posted By: lennyo3034
CMP service grade Garand.
\

Hilarious! Love it! You a funny guy!</div></div>

Look at Last years Presidents 100 and what the top guys won with before you laugh too loud.
 
Re: NRA Highpower match rifles

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: kraigWY</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Originally Posted By: lennyo3034
CMP service grade Garand.
\

Hilarious! Love it! You a funny guy!</div></div>

Look at Last years Presidents 100 and what the top guys won with before you laugh too loud.
</div></div>

Please explain. I watched the 2009 and 2010 P100 shootoffs in person and don't recall seeing anything other than AR's on the line. I appreciate the M1 and I know that some folks can shoot pretty well with one, but I have never personally seen one be competitive in HP matches where modern rifles are allowed.

And anyways, why would you want to screw around with 75-year old technology of the Garand when you can roll with the state-of-the-art 50-year old tech of the AR?
cool.gif
 
Re: NRA Highpower match rifles

I just started highpower myself, I just bought the Rock River NM and couldn't be happier. Today was actually South Dakota's NRA highpower state championship (I participated even though I'm from Nebraska) and I place 8th. The top shooter of the day was also shooting an out of the box rock river and there were several White oak rifles too. I'm not saying one is better than the other but the rock river will get the job done.

It's the Indian not the Arrow.
 
Re: NRA Highpower match rifles

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: _9H</div><div class="ubbcode-body"> you won't be able to blame it on your equipment. </div></div>

I blame society.
 
Re: NRA Highpower match rifles

They key differences between the WOA/WOP setup and the stock RRA upper are as follows:

- Front sight A-Frame - windage adjustable on the WOA, not on the RRA. Your zero on the RRA will often be well off of MZ. On the WOA, you set your rear sight to MZ, then adjust the front site windage to zero the rifle. John actually does this before it leaves his place, but you may want to tweak it a little when you get it. Normally a few clicks left or right will do it, so you can leave the front sight windage alone until you re-barrel.

- Rear sight - The RRA NM rear sight is good, but the precision cut windage and elevation mechanisms in the WOA are much better. The windage screw is a true 1/4 or 1/2 MOA screw, and its fit to the rear leaf is quite precise. Having put my WOA/WOP rear sights on mag mounted dial indicators as part of their twice a year checkup, I can tell you that John's sights track very well. Even the 13 year old one. The pins are a worthwhile upgrade. No reason NOT to spend the few extra $$ for this and have a more stable sight. Not even an option on the RRA BTW.

- Chamber - the RRA chamber will be cut close to no-go, meaning about .005" over minimum headspace. John's are cut in the .001" to .0015" range over minimum, a true match dimension headspace chamber.

- Chambering/contouring/crowning of the barrel - I KNOW who did the work and final inspection of the barrel before it goes out the door at WOA/WOP. Even though I know several RRA employees on sight, I can't say the same for their product.

With the $$ being so similar between the two, it makes no logical sense to pick the RRA. As far as the other brands go that are in a similar price range, there is a reason why my comments are limited to the two brands above. I prefer to be positive about answering the question.
 
Re: NRA Highpower match rifles

I was planning on gettn a RRA a2 lower, but depending on prices. is there a big difference in the RRA a2 lower vs DPMS A2 lower? In theory they should be the same, but I am not sure which has better machining.
 
Re: NRA Highpower match rifles

The shooters at our club use the RRA National Match rifle with excellent scores. Remember that as a new shooter to high power, your rifle is going to outperform you for a while. If you hunt around you should be able to come up with a new RRA NM for $900 to $950. See if your club can buy it for you from RRA.
 
Re: NRA Highpower match rifles

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Saber Cat</div><div class="ubbcode-body">The shooters at our club use the RRA National Match rifle with excellent scores. Remember that as a new shooter to high power, your rifle is going to outperform you for a while. If you hunt around you should be able to come up with a new RRA NM for $900 to $950. See if your club can buy it for you from RRA. </div></div>

I have already order my WOA upper, still got about 11 weeks to go
cry.gif
I am trying to decide on a lower. I was leaning toward RRA but was condiering DPMS, either one will end up with a Geissele trigger.
 
Re: NRA Highpower match rifles

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Erud</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: kraigWY</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Originally Posted By: lennyo3034
CMP service grade Garand.
\

Hilarious! Love it! You a funny guy!</div></div>

Look at Last years Presidents 100 and what the top guys won with before you laugh too loud.
</div></div>


Please explain. I watched the 2009 and 2010 P100 shootoffs in person and don't recall seeing anything other than AR's on the line. I appreciate the M1 and I know that some folks can shoot pretty well with one, but I have never personally seen one be competitive in HP matches where modern rifles are allowed.

And anyways, why would you want to screw around with 75-year old technology of the Garand when you can roll with the state-of-the-art 50-year old tech of the AR?
cool.gif
</div></div>

Yeah, Kraig, what the heck are you talking about? You saying that someone with a CMP Garand made the shoot off? I doubt it. Just looked at the scores (I havent shot CMP week since 09...only NRA weeks or Canada nowadays) and I dont think any of the top 20 are garand shooters. I know of one garand to make the 100, that was Steve last year, but it wasnt some CMP off the rack job.

Tell ya what, bring your CMP racker, I'll bring my match rifle, and lets see how competitive that ol Garand is.
wink.gif


OP, do yourself a favor and get over to NM forum and do what 9h said to do, read all the old threads. You will get the info that you need and you wont be steered down some crazy path....unless you dont want to be competitive, then by all means, shoot a Garand. They are fun, thats for sure, but its like racing a Model T against a current NASCAR stock car or a Formula one car.....good luck!

John
 
Re: NRA Highpower match rifles

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: stork23raz</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I was planning on gettn a RRA a2 lower, but depending on prices. is there a big difference in the RRA a2 lower vs DPMS A2 lower? In theory they should be the same, but I am not sure which has better machining. </div></div>

When I was getting started, I went to a lot of matches simply to observe and ask questions. I worked the pits just to get the experience of working the pits and to get the opportunity to ask questions. Some of the shooters said "a lower is a lower. It doesn't matter which one".

By far, the most popular lower at my range is the RRA, so I went with what everyone else was shooting. The price difference wasn't enough to really matter.

My RRA lower matches up perfectly with my WOA uppper. No wiggle what-so-ever. No need for any wedge. Solid.

I do not have any experience with DPMS.

FWIW...I would not get too caught up in the price of the gun. The gun is the least of your "relative" expense considering how much powder, primers, brass and bullets you will be going through.
 
Re: NRA Highpower match rifles

I emailed RRA to ask about there NM triggers and the pound. Randy Hansen wrote back and said "The first stage is just that take up, it is not really measured in poundage, the 2nd stage will be approx 4.5 – 5.0 lbs."
The giessele service rifle trigger says 1st stage is 3.2-5lb 2nd 0.5-1.5lb.
I have heard very good reviews on the RRA trigger. everyone says the Giesseles are the best, forgive my ignorance,but why would RRA make a 4.5-5 pound break. I have yet to shoot a high power match but i understood the idea as to be have the first stage to make weight then a the second stage for a light clean break.
 
Re: NRA Highpower match rifles

Mr Hansen is mistaken.
 
Re: NRA Highpower match rifles

I asked if the RRA part number in catalog AR0940B (A2 Lower with 2 stage trigger) if it was the same trigger in the NM rifles except it was not chromed.
He said it was and i asked about the trigger poundaged for each stage.
I originally was gonna go with the giessele but I was leaning lately toward just ordering a RRA lower with the NM 2 stage trigger. now im confused.
 
Re: NRA Highpower match rifles

The RRA NM's are good triggers and great for the money. I have had around a dozen of them and while some have been a little better than others, all are good enough for HP competition. As a new HP shooter, chances are you won't really notice much difference or at least wouldn't benefit much from it. The geiselle is definitely a better trigger, but if you want to save some money, have no reservations about starting with a RRA. In a year or three when you decide to upgrade, just stick the RRA trigger in your second-favorite AR.

Erik
 
Re: NRA Highpower match rifles

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Erud</div><div class="ubbcode-body">The RRA NM's are good triggers and great for the money. I have had around a dozen of them and while some have been a little better than others, all are good enough for HP competition. As a new HP shooter, chances are you won't really notice much difference or at least wouldn't benefit much from it. The geiselle is definitely a better trigger, but if you want to save some money, have no reservations about starting with a RRA. In a year or three when you decide to upgrade, just stick the RRA trigger in your second-favorite AR.

Erik </div></div>

Thanks!!!!
 
Re: NRA Highpower match rifles

A few comments below.

1. Regarding triggers. I have a RRA NM that I use in my AR15 Hi-Power NM rifle and I have a Geissele that I use in my AR15 3-Gun rifle. Both work really well, I love them both! As far as feel goes, they are both about the same in my opinion. But, I would bet on the Geissele for better long term performance and useful life. I agree with others comments, that for the money the RRA NM trigger is a good buy. If funds are tight, I would recommend the RRA NM without a second thought. If funds are available, go with the Geissele.

2. Anyone looking for a really nice, lightly used, well cared for, WOA upper...I have some info available. Drop me a PM for details.

3. Regarding shooting NRA High Power Rifle matches. I highly recommend this sport to anyone interested who has the opportunity. It's a good way to get your feet wet in long range shooting, build some confidence in what you can do (or not do
cry.gif
), and learn a little about the little details that go into making accurate long range shots. It's also a relatively inexpensive way to get into long range shooting, before spending several thousand dollars on a more specialized custom long range rifle (outside of NRA High Power Rifle).

Best of luck and good shooting to all
cool.gif
!
 
Re: NRA Highpower match rifles

The White Oak upper is excellent. I have one, but it was custom built around a Satern barrel. Definitely get the SR microsight. It's worth the extra money.

Take a look at Creedmoor Sports. They are selling Gene Clark Uppers, which are excellent. http://www.creedmoorsports.com/shop/Gene_Clark_A2_Upper_Receiver.html

Get the Geissele trigger. I've tried many and like the Geissele the best for high power competition.
 
Re: NRA Highpower match rifles

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Sunstroke 338</div><div class="ubbcode-body">The White Oak upper is excellent. I have one, but it was custom built around a Satern barrel. Definitely get the SR microsight. It's worth the extra money.

Take a look at Creedmoor Sports. They are selling Gene Clark Uppers, which are excellent. http://www.creedmoorsports.com/shop/Gene_Clark_A2_Upper_Receiver.html

Get the Geissele trigger. I've tried many and like the Geissele the best for high power competition. </div></div>

I have already decided on my upper. WOA still got about 11 weeks before its supposed to ship.
 
Re: NRA Highpower match rifles

I stand corrected, a Garand didn't win, but did place in the Presidents Hundred.

http://forums.thecmp.org/showthread.php?t=22846

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Steve Hardin. He made the cut shooting a 7.62 M1 with a score of 289-2X.</div></div>

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Bob Steketee was shooting his M1 and shot a 289-8. I believe it was his 3rd. P 100 and second in 2 years. His M1 is chambered in 30-06. He was not shooting the M1 last year. He also shot a 483-6 in the NTI with the Garand and took High Senior.</div></div>

The gun can do it, like everything else, its all about the shooter.

It's easier with a AR, I'll admit, (although I got my DRB with M1A).

I'd recommend a new shooter go the AR route, but if you want to "man up" then take the Garand or M14/M1A.
 
Re: NRA Highpower match rifles

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Sunstroke 338</div><div class="ubbcode-body"> Definitely get the SR microsight. It's worth the extra money. </div></div>

Wayne has a no returns policy. It does not work for everybody. I suggest you hold off on the order and try someone else's before committing the $140 to this device.
 
Re: NRA Highpower match rifles

Don't forget Compass Lake!!!

Frank made me a kickass 1-7.75 Krieger that is a tack driver I can clean the 200 (Not standing so much but the rapid fires No problem) & 300 easy and I'm using a stock BUSHMASTER competition lower it comes with the lead in the but stock and while their are better triggers mine is working just fine.

I'm 99% sure the RRA has a Wylde chamber too. I have one in 1-8 twist scoped that has a 3" 600 yard group with 69 smk's NO the wind was not blowing...

Yeah, it's always about the shooter Most decent Ar's can get the job done.
 
Re: NRA Highpower match rifles

When I got into service rifle I went with a WOA upper. NO regrets at all and that was with the Wilson barrel.

The only thing that I would have changed is to build a flat top upper and use a match prepped 600yd capable carry handle sight.

During load development for 600yd loads I would have loved to use a scope without resorting to a carry handle mounted to the a2 upper.
 
Re: NRA Highpower match rifles

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: stork23raz</div><div class="ubbcode-body">about what poundage of each stage does the RRA have from your alls experience? </div></div>

It varies from trigger to trigger. Also, many of them won't lift the required 4.5 lb weight without modification.

No need to guess whether or not the RRA has a Wylde chamber - it is listed right on their web site -

http://rockriverarms.com/index.cfm?fuseaction=category.display&category_id=226

The reamer dimensions are only part of the picture. How the barrel work is done is more important than the reamer specs, assuming the reamer specs are appropriate for the intended application.

As far as cleaning the 200 yard target, one would hope a match grade rifle with match grade ammo could hold 3 MOA, what it takes to clean the 200, regardless of maker.

On the subject of Bushy match triggers, we had SEVEN of them go back to Bushmaster in one trip from one of our local club's club gun stash after very little use (under 1k rounds). The second stage tends to go away on them. Since Bushy's acquisition by Cerberus Capital Management a few years ago, NO-ONE has seen any deals on their rifles, so there is really no argument in favor of buying one - inferior float tube, inferior rear sight, inferior trigger, and higher price compared to the RRA should one be inclined to buy a complete rifle.
 
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