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Who’s the SH Air Gunners???

That is bad ass!!
I've lately been seriously looking at air rifles. I have gravitated toward the PCP but am still undecided which direction to go.
I'll likely shoot more grasshoppers off the fence than anything but also want to able to kill varmints or hunt squirrels.
Are your numbers correct...the 25 shoots a little faster even with heavier slugs?
How much does that set up weigh? Balanced? Able to shoot off hand easily?
My numbers on Velocity are correct as my FX Radar gives me. The groups and speed go hand in hand for me. I have a speed range I want to be in and I want the best groups possible out to distance. I will tune on the rifle until this is achieved. It might cost me 500 slugs to figure it out but when its 1 hole at the end of the day its worth it.

I will guess my complete setup at sub 12lb and balanced at the trigger guard. It will set in the palm of your hand for not supported shooting. I will ring a 12" plate at 200y 10/10 freehand.

That is where the .22 Cal is balanced. It has a fully loaded 28 round mag in it with 34 grain slugs.

The PCP Rabbit hole is expensive, but very fun.
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I was talking with one of the top airgun tuners in the US close to 20 years ago. He did a lot of testing on the bent and damaged skirts. He found that they did not make a difference in accuracy. The air would push it out to fill the barrel. He said if they were bent a lot, that would make a difference.
Another great place to get pellets from is the Pellet shop. They will make sure to ship out the same day.
 
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Returned the jsb. Reordered the same from Airguns of Utah. Those came today and were excellent condition
 
I visited Mike N of Thomas Air Rifle fame and while I was there he put my regulator up to 2500 psi, put in a heavier hammer, and stronger hammer spring. Initially that brought my velocity up to 875 fps using the 42gr slugs whereas before it was going 750 or so fps. It shot better at 840 fps so we left it there.

So I stretched the distance out more. Here's my post from AGN.


That nearly life size Buffalo belongs to a family we know that is into black powder long range rifles, like Sharps and other falling block action guns of that era. They'd set this target out at 1000Y to shoot at it. As far as I know they haven't shot at it in 15 years.

Last time this target was used myself and some friends had the Buff set at 1800 yards. We were hitting it with my modern long range rifle and laying on top of the roof of John's shop. Talk about being hard to see any hits, or hear any hits, just an occasional miss in the dirt way out there. It wasn't until we went to see what happened that we saw we had peppered the Buff all over the place. I think I hit it with the cold bore shot but we'll never know for sure.

That Buff is heavy, around 150 lbs, and 2 pieces bolted together. It's 1/4" mild steel so we can't shoot at it with anything that'll poke holes in it because a high powered rifle would do that at 422Y. Not too time consuming erecting it so that gave us time to shoot at it yesterday.

It was fairly windy, I guess around 4-8 mph from right to left and pretty much full value.
Reflecting back a few weeks ago I found it much easier to see where we missed in the cinders when I was shooting at the rocks at 391Y way up on the hill because those rocks are in a bare spot making it easy to see where the dust is kicked up by the projectile.
In contrast because its grassy around the Buff it took a while to make out where the misses would land in the dirt, we finally saw some dust from a miss a foot off the nose. Wow, 5-6 feet of drift so I dialed 4 mils of right windage, but once I had that figured out we heard our first ding! I now was getting some hits on the steel. Though as you can see on the lower left side of the Buff that's where they were landing with an occasional puff of dust below the Buff that we saw. At this point we only assumed I was hitting low because the hits were so hard to see.

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I put .8 mil more elevation into the scope and I was hitting more consistently. We couldn't see the hits in the black at first but I was watching when I saw a hit in the white, then another. You can see where most of them landed just left and high of the white. Then when the wind died down some hits off to the right.
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This is John shooting SURELY. Look at the angle of the scope compared to the angle of the barrel. The March Genesis 4-40x52 has external elevation and windage adjustment kind of like the old Unertl scopes which tilts the scope body.

It wasn't until we drove the sidebyside down to the Buff before we saw exactly where we were hitting as well as some of the marks in the dirt.

Fun first try though!

Afterwards Randy and John shot their 22rf's and hit the Buff. Randy hit the white on the 2nd shot! Next week I'll try my 22rf.
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Cool beans! But please clear this up for me. What was the range at which you were hitting the buff with the pcp? Was it 421 yards?
 
Cool beans! But please clear this up for me. What was the range at which you were hitting the buff with the pcp? Was it 421 yards?

Yes 421Y.

I tried 563Y a few weeks later on a 2'x3' plate and something was giving me problems. I think the slugs became unstable because I didn't even hit it. I gave up after 30 or so shots. Being only 65 fpe = 42gr/840 fps its certainly getting tapped out by then.

Odd that it does okay at 421Y but 142 yards later any precision there was has gone??
 
Yes 421Y.

I tried 563Y a few weeks later on a 2'x3' plate and something was giving me problems. I think the slugs became unstable because I didn't even hit it. I gave up after 30 or so shots. Being only 65 fpe = 42gr/840 fps its certainly getting tapped out by then.

Odd that it does okay at 421Y but 142 yards later any precision there was has gone??
Trajectory must be dropping like a stone by 563. You might have to angle the target upward or lay it flat on the ground! (lol)
 
Yes 421Y.

I tried 563Y a few weeks later on a 2'x3' plate and something was giving me problems. I think the slugs became unstable because I didn't even hit it. I gave up after 30 or so shots. Being only 65 fpe = 42gr/840 fps its certainly getting tapped out by then.

Odd that it does okay at 421Y but 142 yards later any precision there was has gone??

Trajectory must be dropping like a stone by 563. You might have to angle the target upward or lay it flat on the ground! (lol)

I have noticed this with some lower powered air guns and using normal pellets. Normal pellets are not slugs and not bullets, have the aerodynamics of a brick. I think when it gets to X distance, and that distance can vary with pellet and power things go to hell.

I have a 500 fps air rifle and it will do fine to 40 yards, hitting a playing card 10 out of 10. But at 50 yards I can't score a hit. Putting a fresh sheet of large cardboard up to try to see where everything is going and they are all over the place. Really weard.
 
Trajectory must be dropping like a stone by 563. You might have to angle the target upward or lay it flat on the ground! (lol)

The plate was angled leaning back a bit because I had it against a fence post I had driven in the ground.

Just the difference in drop of an ES of 10 fps/830 to 840 fps/ is 53" at 563Y. But the impacts in the dirt that I saw were way more than that.
I saw low hits at 421Y too but not unreasonably low.

I've seen videos of guys with pcp's shooting slugs that were acceptable at longer distances like this but one can never tell if info was fake news or not.
One guy states he's gotten ES as low as 1 fps for a number of shots which seems to be true when looking at his videos. Also his pcp's are nearly twice as powerful as mine and BC's much higher.

I'm just farting around to see how it goes with my guns for the fun of it.
 
I have noticed this with some lower powered air guns and using normal pellets. Normal pellets are not slugs and not bullets, have the aerodynamics of a brick. I think when it gets to X distance, and that distance can vary with pellet and power things go to hell.

I have a 500 fps air rifle and it will do fine to 40 yards, hitting a playing card 10 out of 10. But at 50 yards I can't score a hit. Putting a fresh sheet of large cardboard up to try to see where everything is going and they are all over the place. Really weard.

I see this sometimes with my 6fpe pcp using flat nosed pellets but when I use JSB 8.44 dome's it does pretty well farther out considering how low the power is. One time messing around years ago I hit a 3" spinner at 100Y four times in a row until the wind changed slightly.
With the same rifle just a couple weeks ago I was hitting a 3/4" spinner at 50Y a lot but the wind was only 0-2 mph.

This is that rifle on the top, a Steyr LGB1 .177 cal Biathlon trainer. The one on the bottom is a Steyr ProX semiauto 22 cal at 30 fpe. As far as my most fun guns these are my favorite plinkers that I use on small steel I put on saw horses to knock off. They are acceptably precise as well.
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Get a set of small bore targets, you know the sheep, chicken, turkey, ram, pig. Set them at the same distances for rimfire. Really helps you read the wind like nothing else will.

They make airgun specific targets like that a tick smaller if you don't have the distance.
 
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Question for you guys,

My Benjamin marauder .22 has developed a leak in only a few months of use. Purchased a captain Oring kit for it but wondering what lube I should use on the orings or other parts of the gun.

I haven’t checked where it leaks yet but will likely replace all orings I can while apart.

Was thinking of just using Mobil 1. But unsure what the best to use would be
 
Also, if it is the Field and Target model with the regulator and leaking from the vent hole in the bottom, it is likely the o-ring in the regulator. That is where mine failed and started leaking shortly after purchase.
Thank you. I haven’t looked into it yet. Plan to watch a few videos on taking apart. Is this a part you can just pop the stock off and test?
 
While we're on the subject of leaks, I gotta say for those of you who are still using piston guns, stay away from the gas pistons and stay with spring pistons. My .30 caliber Hatsan Carnivore has had to be replaced 3x already due to the gas piston leaking and being totally worthless. Fortunately it's not an expensive gun. I knew these gas pistons were too good to be true, but I deluded myself into thinking otherwise. If this doesn't give me the incentive to get back into the PCP world then I don't know what will.
 
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Green circle should be filled with glue. I just drilled it out so I knew when I reinstalled it, it was right back where it was. You will probably have to heat it as the plug is plastic and glued in. Red circle is the vent.View attachment 8076297
O-ring should be seated like shown. Mine came of the piston and it leaked through the vent hole. You should not have to remove the snap ring but if you do, be careful. The piston has an o-ring and when you pull it out, your washer stack will go everywhere. Well, mine did anyway.
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If your rifle is only leaking down to roughly 1200 psi, I would say it was the regulator o-ring. If it will leak empty, something upstream like the gauge or fill port.
Leaked to 500 PSI before stopping. From full fill in a couple weeks
 
If the rifle is relatively new, isn't that a warranty thing? I've found Benjamin's Customer Service very accommodating.
 
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While we're on the subject of leaks, I gotta say for those of you who are still using piston guns, stay away from the gas pistons and stay with spring pistons. My .30 caliber Hatsan Carnivore has had to be replaced 3x already due to the gas piston leaking and being totally worthless. Fortunately it's not an expensive gun. I knew these gas pistons were too good to be true, but I deluded myself into thinking otherwise. If this doesn't give me the incentive to get back into the PCP world then I don't know what will.
Wow, a 30 cal spring gun? Seems that's pushing the bounds of that kind of powerplant, No? I had a 25 cal Crow Magnum once and it had a 65# cocking force. It was a beast to cock and kicked like a mule (in reverse) ! I can't imagine something needing more air.
 
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Welcome to airguns - they all eventually leak :ROFLMAO:

I don't think I have an airgun in my inventory that doesn't have a leak at this point...
 
Wow, a 30 cal spring gun? Seems that's pushing the bounds of that kind of powerplant, No? I had a 25 cal Crow Magnum once and it had a 65# cocking force. It was a beast! I can't imagine something needing more air.

No clue what the cocking effort was when it actually worked, but took both hands to cock and definitely not a fun gun to shoot all day. Plus, I hate heavy long guns and this bastard weighs almost 10 pounds without a scope. I honestly bought the gun for the novelty aspect of it being a .30 cal and all so no real loss for me at least. Hopefully others who may suffer a loss will read this and give a second thought to trying the world of gas pistons.
 
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They'll want the whole rifle back. In my case, I talked them into sending a new regulator. I have no clue what part they actually sent but it wasn't the right one. These things are pretty simple to work on which adds to the Marauder's charm.
I get it. Fortunately my (FT) Marauder hasn't leaked at all and it shoots well enough at 80 shots a fill where I never felt the need to mess with it. I do have a new Akela that begs some tweaking though. ( Mainly need to cut down the hammer spring I think). It's on my list of things to get too. FWIW, I do like my Benjamin's despite owning more expensive PCP's. I have yet to own one that disappointed.
 

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I know it would be covered under warranty but likely have to send it back. I’m pretty handy with firearms just haven’t played with airguns til this year. So I’m starting from scratch in this.

Also I know they all tend to leak at some point. So I’d rather just learn now as I’ll likely be doing this again in the future

I’m just looking for pointers as to where to start and make sure I don’t have to tear apart right away again. These things I’m sure are loaded with Orings. I think the fx kits have like 60+ orings in them
 
I had a very bad experience with a Marauder out of the custom shop. It was sent back three times because they didn't fix the leak.

When I got it back the 3rd time the stock was broke and the cover for the fill port was just tossed in the box and was the wrong size.

The air rifle was sent back the fourth time and I got a refund.

They tried to say that the shipper broke the stock but the box was not damaged on the outside.

I was given a refund. I don't think that I will ever buy another Benjamin/Crosman product again.

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I had a very bad experience with a Marauder out of the custom shop. It was sent back three times because they didn't fix the leak.

When I got it back the 3rd time the stock was broke and the cover for the fill port was just tossed in the box and was the wrong size.

The air rifle was sent back the fourth time and I got a refund.

They tried to say that the shipper broke the stock but the box was not damaged on the outside.

I was given a refund. I don't think that I will ever buy another Benjamin/Crosman product again.

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IMHO they are the Ruger of the air gun world. I bought a Mrod way back when they first came out. If you have been playing with these things you likely remember the barrel issues on the early guns. I don't have another.

When I feel the need to shoot something along these lines I shoot a Gauntlet. Everything the Mrod should have been.
 
I recently bought a FWB P8X to shoot at our club. I mounted a RD and it shoots good. I will never win shooting off hand though.
 
I have had those O rings go flat over time. Replaced with ones from the hardware store that were a touch fatter but same diameter. Plumbers silicone grease is what you need. A little bit goes a LONG ways. you can also get it in a tube as a silicone oil. I lube my slugs and some hard to reach o rings with it.
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While we're on the subject of leaks, I gotta say for those of you who are still using piston guns, stay away from the gas pistons and stay with spring pistons. My .30 caliber Hatsan Carnivore has had to be replaced 3x already due to the gas piston leaking and being totally worthless. Fortunately it's not an expensive gun. I knew these gas pistons were too good to be true, but I deluded myself into thinking otherwise. If this doesn't give me the incentive to get back into the PCP world then I don't know what will.

What was the precision capability of it?

I had a Beeman Crow Magnum in 20 cal for a while about 15 years ago. The best it'd shoot was .6" at 30Y but most groups were around 1". The vibration would cause the action screw to loosen which was annoying. It was hard to cock and the recoil impulse was annoying. Pretty gun though and well made.

The only springer I have left is a youth model in case a kid comes by. Even though I was raised with nice Diana springers and eventually bought a TX200 they just don't turn my crank anymore.

I have a FWB601 which is a single pump Olympic air rifle. It replaced the FWB300 I had. I prefer the 601 even though the 300 is recoil-less. Nice to never have to fill a gun with compressed air yet not have a springers odd recoil impulse.

My Uragan King in 25 cal gets almost 100 shots per fill which is really convenient if I want to shoot a bunch and I can hit steel 300 yards away using slugs if I want.
A friend had a Uragan in .177 and it would get 300 shots on a fill. Ha, if a King was at 12 fpe in .177 it'd probably get 600 shots per fill which is crazy if you think about it.

Once I got a 300 bar compressor I shot my pcp's more. 20 years ago I only had sub 20 fpe pcp's so a 200 BARfill would last for 3 months. Not so nowadays when using the more powerful 50-60 fpe pcp's my 300BAR tanks only last a week or two.

It wouldn't hold air anymore so I rebuilt my FX Royale last week after buying it new 10 years ago. It wasn't as hard as I anticipated it would be. This was the first full rebuild I've done because I'm not very mechanically minded and if I can do it anyone can.

But generally I enjoy pcp's more in spite of their downsides.
 
I got into Air guns like most. I got a couple break barrel guns that disappointed me. I hunt Rock Chucks and Fox squirrels almost exclusively. I shoot a lot of chucks. I don't have a place to fill a bottle close. I didn't want to buy a compressor. So I got the best spring gun, I got an Air Arms TX200 22 cal. It has a Vortex Diamondback Tac 6-24x50 FFP scope on it. BKL triple strap rings. This set up stays sighted in all the time. is 100% reliable.

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I got into Air guns like most. I got a couple break barrel guns that disappointed me. I hunt Rock Chucks and Fox squirrels almost exclusively. I shoot a lot of chucks. I don't have a place to fill a bottle close. I didn't want to buy a compressor. So I got the best spring gun, I got an Air Arms TX200 22 cal. It has a Vortex Diamondback Tac 6-24x50 FFP scope on it. BKL triple strap rings. This set up stays sighted in all the time. is 100% reliable.

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Just curious what pellet are you using and what is the muzzle velocity? What is the average distance for bagging the rock chucks?
 
Here is my FX Crown MK2 .22cal, 700mm barrel shooting 25.5g Zan slugs at 915fps. It’s in a saber tactical chassis with a few other accessories. This is my second air rifle and they are a blast. It’s unreal how consistent they are. Below is a 20rd target at 50yds I shot months ago. Hardly any wind that day but it just keeps laying them in there. Look at that ES/dev 👌🏼
 

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The only "good" springer I have is an RWS 48, and it shoots very well........off a rest. That thing has to weigh more then a Garand. There is no way I can hold it still, I just don't have the strength to do it in my left side. I really like the "steps" in the "bear trap" this allows me to cock it part way, let it catch on one of the steps, I think there are three steps, then get another grip to finish cocking.

Best shooting springer I have, and it would be a great deal of fun if it was just not so darn heavy and so hard to cock.
 
It is simply a trigger shoe replacement. I bought the first one for my Impact and really liked it. So when I knew the Panthera was on the way I ordered another one. It gives you an indexing point for consistency if you leave the screw in the center. In the colder winter months I have really enjoyed that part. The wider shoe just feels better for my finger as well.

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My setup since starting this thread. Hands down worth it over a pump
4500 PSI
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So why do you prefer the tank to a 4500 psi pump? I've considered one myself but in truth my $275 pump is working great . I can see a bit of convenience at fill time but I'm thinking the tank still needs to be filled and inspected regularly. Interested in your thoughts.
 
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I have 2 tanks that I use for range/ match use. When shooting a PRS RimFire Match or NRL22 match I dont have the ability to carry my pump with me to each stage. I have to carry a tank. 1 tank will get me through 15+ stage topping off my 300cc tank. I will also get me 8-10 stages topping off my 580cc tank. I am figuring 12 shots per stage. I use my compressor at home to top off my tanks or I have the gun shop at the range top them off before heading home. I also use the compressor when I travel to shoot matches as i'm able to top off my bottles my self to keep me from running out of air and not being able to finish a match.
 
So why do you prefer the tank to a 4500 psi pump? I've considered one myself but in truth my $275 pump is working great . I can see a bit of convenience at fill time but I'm thinking the tank still needs to be filled and inspected regularly. Interested in your thoughts.
Its easy and simple to fill. I’m a firefighter. So the tank works out better for me. We’ll leave it at that 😁
 
The pump will take time to fill and depending on how low you shoot your gun you will spend more time filling than shooting. The tanks make it easy to just top off and keep going. I have a larger 60min tank I leave in my truck while I am out hunting or shooting. Then I have a 45 min tank that fits in my hiking pack. Really easy to top the gun off with the EdGun Ezfill and wastes no air.

That and the tanks can be had for cheap, just look on ebay and if you look hard enough you can find new tanks for under $100.
 
That and the tanks can be had for cheap, just look on ebay and if you look hard enough you can find new tanks for under $100.
Woogie, not necessarily aimed at your recommendation

I’m sure people are aware but, in the fire service at least, the life span on these tanks used is 15 years. They are then decommissioned.

If you find one about to end it’s service life you can get them hydro tested if you are concerned about the integrity of the tank.

After 15 years I’m not sure they’ll test them without more in depth life extension tests.

I don’t think a store that fills them will fill them if not up to date on hydro testing which is 5 years from the test

Just fyi for those looking on eBay or what not. Many on there are decommissioned tanks. One left with some service life, even just enough to get tested, is worth more than a tank past 15 year date. Which if you don’t plan to fill yourself may be entirely worthless

If you fill expired tanks yourself then it’s at your own risk if not tested. Not sure about transportation of expired tanks for air guns. Would assume that follows the same hydro regulations but not positive.
 
Thanks for the perspective. As a backyard shooter, I never really thought about a situation where I'd need more than one refill of the 80-120 shots /fill I get out of my main rifles. I can see the value there for sure. That said, if I do end up breaking down and buying a tank, it will be within the 15 year nark AND DOT certified. As a Mechanical engineer, I have no desire to take chances with old / out of spec/uncertified tanks of any kind when talking 4500 psi. I don't see myself filling them with my $300 Chinese pump either. Near as i can see, my initial investment will need to be north of $400 and maybe closer to $600 .
 
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Thanks for the perspective. As a backyard shooter, I never really thought about a situation where I'd need more than one refill of the 80-120 shots /fill I get out of my main rifles. I can see the value there for sure. That said, if I do end up breaking down and buying a tank, it will be within the 15 year nark AND DOT certified. As a Mechanical engineer, I have no desire to take chances with old / out of spec/uncertified tanks of any kind when talking 4500 psi. I don't see myself filling them with my $300 Chinese pump either. Near as i can see, my initial investment will need to be north of $400 and maybe closer to $600 .
My marauder .22 is 80 shots and my .25 armada is about 25 shots per fill. So for those a tank is handy

If you buy a carbon tank and want a setup like I have above talk to local fire department. Many leave the valves on the tanks when they throw out. Steal one off there and it will save the $ on the tank. If you can fill with this setup. A fire department can. Not sure what stores use
 
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Thanks for the perspective. As a backyard shooter, I never really thought about a situation where I'd need more than one refill of the 80-120 shots /fill I get out of my main rifles. I can see the value there for sure. That said, if I do end up breaking down and buying a tank, it will be within the 15 year nark AND DOT certified. As a Mechanical engineer, I have no desire to take chances with old / out of spec/uncertified tanks of any kind when talking 4500 psi. I don't see myself filling them with my $300 Chinese pump either. Near as i can see, my initial investment will need to be north of $400 and maybe closer to $600 .
I will highly recommend a Joe Brancanto *Top Gun Air Gun* for a tank setup. then add the Ed Gun fill trigger to save on some air. Its a buy once cry once kind of thing, well for 15 years anyways!!


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