See title. Would have probably had an Anzio by now but my understanding is they lost their FFL for numerous violations. Is anyone else making a comparable mag-fed or single-shot 20mm Vulcan rifle that can be purchased in the USA?
With Anzio essentially defunct, is anyone else making 20mm or larger modern rifles available in the U.S.?
- Thread starter Conqueror
- Start date
@ELR researcher may know, he’s played with vulcan based wildcats I think. Perhaps he can point you to a receiver and chassis that would work.
1. I know of no company that is producing such a rifle for civilian purchase.
2. If you wanted to get one built - in a caliber legal in your state - I'd contact Warner Tool. They are working with a customer on a rifle chambered in a round based on the 20mm Vulcan casing.
Thanks for that. Someone on Reddit said they are still in contact with Anzio but idk if I would give them $15k given the history.
Sorry, notwithstanding the post title, I totally forgot about Anzio.
I remember Mike Remo to be a pretty personable guy. I'd hear what he has to say for himself.
As far as Anzio's FFL being current, ask for their FFL #. You can then check ATF Online (https://fflezcheck.atf.gov/FFLEzCheck/) to confirm it is current.
Go from there re Anzio.
Did you contact Warner?
I remember Mike Remo to be a pretty personable guy. I'd hear what he has to say for himself.
As far as Anzio's FFL being current, ask for their FFL #. You can then check ATF Online (https://fflezcheck.atf.gov/FFLEzCheck/) to confirm it is current.
Go from there re Anzio.
Did you contact Warner?
Anzio no longer makes any guns or parts. He is planning on moving to Europe. He made just 119 guns total. I have serial number 27 and serial number 45. One is a single shot the other is mag fed. Any parts are easily made, except for the receiver. They use a modified ar15 trigger group.
I am always actively looking for parts or complete guns. They very seldom come up for sale and have gone way up in price.
I am always actively looking for parts or complete guns. They very seldom come up for sale and have gone way up in price.
LMK if you ever see one. Otherwise I’ll be reaching out to Warner at some point. The 14.9 they are working on is a big round but it’s shortened from true 20 Vulcan.
1. "I would hold out for a anzio." - your #8 post says they are not producing, so seems no option.
2. Conqueror - what 14.9?
3. "...14.9? Caliber, now you are extremely limited on where to get ammunition or components." Ammunition is non-existent, whatever WTC is working on its a wildcat. So, unless there is some company out there "commercializing" that chambering, its all a matter of "building your own" ammo.
3. "Plenty of 20mm Vulcan components available, along with reloading dies." - ah, TBD. Kind of depends on what the cartridge actually is. Brass is not an immediate issue - they already have a quantity of that (bought it from me). And WTC will very likely be providing the dies, which will not be 20mm Vulcan of course. Primers, other than 50 cal - which I understand they are not using - are TBD. CDVS is "out of stock" for percussion and they not going electric, last I heard. In any case, primer consistency (as in works properly for their setup and is available in same lot) is very TBD. Powder has been the problem from day one - while various surplus powders may go in and out of availability, getting enough that in same lot and actually meet the owners needs, that is a whole 'nother matter. This NOT a project for the faint of heart. Bottom line, "plenty of" is not in the same neighborhood with reality.
Holding out for an anzio, means waiting for one to come up for sale. It's rare, but they do once in a while.
14.9 makes no sense at all..why not just 20mm Vulcan? Make a receiver and put a surplus barrel on it.
And yes, there is plenty of brass, bullets and powder available for the 20mm Vulcan. Primers are available, but pricey. 50cal inserts are available. I have some ammo with the 50cal inserts and all has worked great.
I have bought a lot of my supplies from shady Grady, he has a ton of stuff for the 20mm.
Currently I have almost 900rds of loaded 20mm Vulcan rds, all percussion primed, and enough components to make at least 200 more rds.
20mm Vulcan is definitely what I would want for the caliber, not some odd ball .
Unclear to me that they are building a 14.9 - unless they have an old stash of GSG bullets, or Gerard would make them some. If 20mm Vulcan meet the customer's need, they would be headed that way - and they are not. SG has electric primers (not what this customer wants). Customer already has brass. The bullets, other than GSGs, will be custom - unless the customer changes his mind late on and goes .50 cal. Only thing SG can offer is powder - several SKUs. Unclear that what he is offering will work in this customer's applcation. It comes down to what is in the minds eye of the customer, his experiences to date, and the realities of the supply side. Lets stop conjecturing and see what comes out of this project. Conqueror now knows a competent rifle source (WTC)...recall its his thread.
You missed my point, 14.9 is the caliber they are building. I'm just saying that doesn't make any sense. Why build an oddball, then you will need to custom make everything for it. 20mm Vulcan components are still readily available. If anzio would have made them in a custom off ball caliber, he wouldn't have sold any. To each his own I guess.
@ELR researcher idk which client of Warner’s you were referring to earlier, but they are/were also publically building custom actions and maybe other components for a group out west that were doing a 14.9mm wildcat based on 20mm and using a very long custom Flatline bullet.
@Burpfire I think you misunderstood me, I’d be talking to Warner about building a 20mm gun, not trying to buy someone else’s wildcat project.
@Burpfire I think you misunderstood me, I’d be talking to Warner about building a 20mm gun, not trying to buy someone else’s wildcat project.
The party I'm referring to is not "out west" but they do have a custom action from a very well-respected action manufacturer.
When in doubt, call. So, I called Mike Remo (Anzio Ironworks) and he shared a few things.
- He is in the process of selling off inventory. He still has for sale (thru a third-party FFL), twenty .50 cal rifles (not 20/50s) and 9 component sets for 20s. The latter can be assembled for sale thru a third-party FFL.
- He also has match grade bullets (see pic). “The match 20 projectiles weigh in at 4.2 ounces (about 1840 grs) and are shooting ½ to ¾ moa. We sell them for $20 each.”
- He also has the machine code (G-code) for the various parts. There is some possibility that the design and code may be sold and these rifles reborn.
- Call (727-895-2019) or email him ([email protected]) to pursue any of the above.
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This lady (Rei) has been showing some 20mm based ELR stuff on her social media.
Appears to be an Anzio rifle and bullet per the images above. I know it’s a niche market but $20/ea for bullets is bananas.
Mike confirmed on 2/20/25 that he made 136 units, I have #0109 and just upgraded the bolt handle, see pics. There is a 20mm Rifle group on FB for owners and enthusiasts: https://www.facebook.com/share/g/15XJ3WPs2G/ where you may find someone willing to sell parts or an entire unit and I believe some folks there make parts too.
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I have 2 of the Anzios, about 600rds of his “match” bullets. The rifles are very niche, good talking piece and fun to watch when people shoot them. Both of mine are suppressed. For anyone to actually be able to shoot under an 1” with those “match” grade bullets was probably only shoot 1 bullet. The bullets for the 20 don’t ride on the barrel lands & grooves, only the driving band does. And considering the driving band is only pressed on to touch the case mouth, I’d be hard pressed to see any accuracy there from them.
I’ve loaded my own, have a tad over 800 cases, about 400 of the blue practice rounds. My dies are C-H, they are well made, gigantic and the press is ungodly. The biggest caveat is going to be primers. Every now and then they pop up, not cheap, but I think they fall off a truck.
On the 14.9, the company I know that was wanting to build one was Cadex, and ultimate precision with Chase Stroud was gonna make the ammo. Lathe turned bullets, 50cal primers, surplus brass was available but primer was boxer(whichever had the 2 holes). But the issue was Cadex couldn’t import DD being a Canada company. But they talked about 12.7, and you just have a barrel spun for 14.9.
Overall Mike Remo is fun to hang out with, rifles are a huge talking piece on the range, ammo is kinda available in the amounts most people actually want to shoot this thing.
I’ve loaded my own, have a tad over 800 cases, about 400 of the blue practice rounds. My dies are C-H, they are well made, gigantic and the press is ungodly. The biggest caveat is going to be primers. Every now and then they pop up, not cheap, but I think they fall off a truck.
On the 14.9, the company I know that was wanting to build one was Cadex, and ultimate precision with Chase Stroud was gonna make the ammo. Lathe turned bullets, 50cal primers, surplus brass was available but primer was boxer(whichever had the 2 holes). But the issue was Cadex couldn’t import DD being a Canada company. But they talked about 12.7, and you just have a barrel spun for 14.9.
Overall Mike Remo is fun to hang out with, rifles are a huge talking piece on the range, ammo is kinda available in the amounts most people actually want to shoot this thing.
I have him building me one. I’ve never seen primers, lmk if you find any for sale that you aren’t buying yourself. I took delivery of a good number of M55A3 projos last week and gonna acquire brass soon.
Do you crimp your bullets or just glue them in to save case mouth life? The factory ammo has a wicked crimp into that bullet groove.
Do you crimp your bullets or just glue them in to save case mouth life? The factory ammo has a wicked crimp into that bullet groove.
2-hole are Berden, not boxer. You want boxer for reloading.
Brass cases, bushed and primed with 50 BMG primers (boxer) are available - https://cdvs.us/product/20mm-vulcan-percussion-primed-with-50-cal-primer-brass-case-price-each/ Note that 50 BMG primers may not be sufficient for proper ignition depending on the powder and charge (weight).
Alternative bullet source, here - https://www.accuratebulletcompany.com/product-page/accurate-bullet-company-20-mm-solid
Cases do not come crimped, they get crimped during the loading process. The brass you buy will not have crimps. See https://cdvs.us/product-category/large-bore/20mm/components-20mm/ Suggest you try the 50 BMG bushed and primed cases, same link. Then reload with 50 BMG primers - work up loads from there. Simply stated, excellent, match-quality, 50 BMG primers are available (https://tenxaccuracy.com/imports.html), 20/30mm Vulcan percussion primers will likely be very difficult to source for best accuracy (same lot, mil-spec, not match). IMHO, otherwise you are headed up hill. Good luck.
Ya I get those 2 primers mixed up. I tried a few of the 50bushed and didn’t have much success and on 2 of them it was downright scary. Hang fire like 3secs later. That wasn’t fun in a 20mm pushing a 1650gr projectile at 2900fps. So I didn’t pursue that type of primer.
Pls tell us more about that hang fire - light primer strike, brand and age of primers? Anzio action - if so, what did Anzio say?
I was using some CCI primers that I use in reloading 50bmg. Current batch fired fine in every 50bmg I loaded for the range.
Bushing brass, 869 powder that Mike loaded up here at the shop that were coming undone. So I pulled several rounds, split the powder and reloaded.. Blue practice bullet. Anzio #112 with the good barrel (long story), pulled the trigger, nothing, then boom about 3secs later. Knicked the end of the suppressor so we just pulled the other rounds. Mike said we might need to put some pistol powder on the bottom and some cotton filler. So that ended that idea of using 50 primers.
I’m not sure you understood me. I was asking if you crimp the bullets into the case mouth after loading to replicate the factory crimp on 20 Vulcan ammo. I have read of at least one person doing so with a pipe cutter using a rounded wheel.
Re the bushed cases from CDVS, can’t say $20/case is thrilling. Will consider bushing the brass I have if it comes to that, I have a decent supply.
I was not
I was fixing the rounds that heads were falling off, it was only 869
Unclear why what you described ended with you stopping using the known-good CCIs. Unless the primer was destroyed or blew out and lost in the process, what did it look like - light strike? Sure sounds like an ignition problem unrelated to using the CCIs.
Well those CCi’s did fine in Barrett, hand loaded ammo.
They looked like normal strikes in the Anzio, after ignition, but with the 2 hang fires which I’m assuming cause we didn’t add either some black powder or pistol powder with some cotton weird stuff I decided not to fire anymore. That and the ammo loaded by Mike was having issues at the case mouth being to swollen from the bullet driving band contacting the mouth causing a flare.
None the less I will not pursue the 50bmg primer idea.
What, specifically, did Mike attribute the hang fires to? If known-good primers and no shallow primer strikes, very hard to understand that it took anything more than an instant for the flame to reach the powder. Did the recoil seem "normal". Sorry to belabor the point but can you get any RWS primers to try? The consistency of mil boxer primers, even within the same lot, would be a major concern for me - if I was looking for more than just going bang.
Mike stated that the 50 primers don’t have the ignition to light the powder fast enough. Hence why it is recommended adding black powder or pistol and a wad to help ignition.
No light strikes on the m36a2 primers. No failure to ignite in M36a2 primers.
We had an issue with large pistol magnum primers. Was loading 500s&w, when I didn’t have large pistol magnum primers, during covid, I tried large pistol primers. Every time the pistol was help up pointing in the air, then fired at a target in front, it would ignite. But the 2nd round without “resetting” the powder directly on the primer, would have a delayed ignition. It was a very repeatable issue. Point up, then aim, pull trigger, BANG. Leave the pistol horizontally, pull trigger……..BANG. So we stopped loading those primers. Then large pistol magnum primers came available. Literally the exact same load, every bullet works no matter how we tried to manipulate the powder.
That was basically the same issue with 50 primers. Never an issue with m36a2 primers. I’ve loaded and shot over 350rds in the 20mm. Only those 50 primers were ever an issue.
In all honesty I think we’ve chronied maybe 10rds, was around 60fps. I would imagine the super glue seal had some of that to do with it. And MOA….well let’s just say if we could hit the 12” plate at 350yds the intended target would be a cake walk.
The intended purpose of this rifle was shear energy and diameter on target. We needed big holes. Intended target is really, REALLY big and not favorable shooting conditions or platform.
